Antiyonder writes...

I'm going to work on a review for The Spectacular Spider-Man episodes 1 and 2 later today. I'll probably review them in the same style I review the comics, but I have been working on some paragraph styled reviews on tv.com. So I thought I'd present some for some episodes of Gargoyles and the Kim Possible episode Big Bother and see what you think of how I do:

1. This is for the Gargoyles Series as a whole:

"A show worth watching, and owning. The current comics from Slave Labor Graphics is equally worth buying.

I probably couldn't do the series justice in my review, but I'll certainly try.

Like many, I enjoy the show for it's appealing characters and interesting stories. The show demonstrates originality in coming up with rarely used ideas or putting a spin on established cliches.

An example would be the episode "Future Tense". The episode at surface appears to be a copout as the events were a dream. When infact it serves to foreshadow future episode/comic story elements.

The show is also well balanced. While I do have a share of favorite adult cartoons, Gargoyles manages to be adult/mature without relying on adult content nonstop. It's serious without being depressing.

Here's hoping the comic will continue for a long time."

2. Possessions (This review of course predated #6 being released):
"Didn't expect to see an immediate follow up on Puck teaching Alexander the use of his powers. It was also fun to see the return of Coldstone and crew. Coldstone's appearance in the Himalayas will be explained in #6 of the Gargoyles comic series.

What helped to make the soul transfer interesting was the choice to keep Broadway, Angela and Brooklyn's voice the same. That decision payed off even more since Brooklyn's behavior was puzzling.

As far as the forshadowing goes, I'm embarassed to admit I didn't see the pairing between Broadway and Angela coming. I thought she would end up with Brooklyn."

3. The Journey:
The episode could have done without the opening monologue as it can't hold a candle to the "Previously On Gargoyles" segment.

It's easy to see the differences between this and the rest of the season. One being that this is the only episode to deal with Xanatos' amoral nature (that he can't be trusted completely). This episode also brought up more of the Gargoyles continuity than the remaining episodes.

Seeing Vinnie make peace with Goliath was a nice little twist. Still where the episode fails, the comic improves.

4. Kim Possible - Big Bother:
"I saw it on Disney Channel.com, and made sure to record it during it's premiere. Recently my stepsister had a baby last summer, she's really adorable. So, I can really understand the Stoppable's feelings towards Hana. Right up there with Alexander Xanatos, as one of the best animated babies introduced.

Favorite moments include Ron's attempt at taking care of a sack of flour and sugar, Ron breaking the news to Yori concerning him and Kim and of course the end of the episode."

So, are my paragraph reviews ok, good or needs more work?

Todd Jensen writes...

The only episodes of the original series that you never did rambles for were the final two parts of "Hunter's Moon". I don't know if you'll ever be able to do them or not, but I thought I'd give you my own ramble on both.

PART TWO: One of my favorite segments of this episode was the opening in Renaissance Florence, with Demona stealing the Medici Tablet and being pursued by a Hunter in a Leonardo da Vinci-style flying machine. (Though the Hunter does come out looking a little dense when he's cursing about having lost her, while Demona's only a few yards away from him, climbing out of the river. No wonder she's got that smirk on her face.)

Matt's reference to Nokkar at the press conference was also a lot of fun.

Elisa's scene with Jason outside the warehouse was great. It captured their feelings for each other effectively, with the added ironic twist that Elisa doesn't know that Jason was the Hunter who attacked Angela the night before, and Jason doesn't know that Elisa's friend was the gargoyle he'd almost killed the night before. (It reminds me now of the early stages of Buffy and Riley's relationship in Season Four of "Buffy", where Buffy doesn't know that Riley's part of the Initiative, Riley doesn't know that Buffy's a Slayer, and each sees the other as a civilian who needs to be kept out of the way when there's vampire-hunting going on. Though I think - and I hope you won't mind my saying this - that Joss Whedon topped you by having Buffy and Riley finding out about each others' secret lives simultaneously.)

The drama continues in the scene at Elisa's apartment later, when she and Jason almost kiss, followed by her admission (with Goliath listening) that there's someone else in her life, but a relationship with him would be impossible. The devastated response on Goliath's face is great, and moving. (No wonder he goes so berserk on the Hunters' airship shortly afterwards!)

Brooklyn and Lexington's uneasy response towards Goliath's destructiveness (including the scene where they're descending the clock tower steps with him near the end) is also well-handled.

And, of course, the build-up to the moment where Robyn opens fire on the clock tower.... It's a pity I can no longer remember what my initial response to that was.

PART THREE: You've heard this before, but I still think that the opening scene, with Demona killing Charles Canmore in front of his children, feels almost like a twisted version of the young Bruce Wayne seeing his parents' murder. (The difference is that Thomas and Martha Wayne were genuine innocent victims, while Charles Canmore brought about his own death through his pursuit of a pointless feud.)

I remember being curious over where the new Hunters had come from, since the original Hunters of "City of Stone" (except for Macbeth) were long since dead. The revelation that their surname was "Canmore" explained a lot - except that we never found out in "Hunter's Moon" how the hunt resumed, and why it revolved around Demona this time (since Duncan and Canmore's use of the Hunter's alias centered on their feud with Macbeth instead). I hope that the comic book will last long enough to answer that question in full.

The new Hunters stand out from the old ones; instead of scheming tyrants straight out of one of Shakespeare's history plays (as Duncan and Canmore were), they're more misguided. Their Shakespearean analogy (to me) is Hamlet, who also sets out to avenge his father's death, and in the process of his revenge inadvertently brings about more tragedy (the deaths of over half the cast, and Fortinbras being able to take over Denmark without a fight - and since the main thing we know about Fortinbras was that he invaded Poland over a worthless piece of land simply because his uncle wouldn't let him invade Denmark, he doesn't hold much promise as a wise and restrained ruler). The Canmores have nobler qualities than their forebears; Jason is capable of genuine feelings towards Elisa (and a change of heart at the end), in particular. They aren't the straightforward villains that the original Hunters were - which makes their conflict with Goliath's clan all the more tragic.

But they're still dangerous - especially since they blow up the clock tower in attempting to get rid of the gargoyles, which results at least in Captain Chavez getting a broken leg. Despite their having a similar modus operandi to Batman, this is another obvious difference between them; I can't imagine Batman blowing up a police station in Gotham City in an attempt to get rid of the Joker - and then, after discovering that the Joker got away, pretending that he (the Joker) blew up the police station. I've discussed Jon's behavior in framing the gargoyles for the destruction while aware of the truth about them, but Jason and Robyn don't come off much better. They've endangered and harmed their fellow humans in the course of their hunt - and instead of taking responsibility for it, blame it on the gargoyles. (To be fair to them, they do it in order to help flush the clan out rather than to evade arrest for their actions, but it's still far from honorable behavior.)

Which brings me to a side-point about the Hunters. The obvious reason why we see them as villains is that we know the truth about the gargoyles - that they're not all like Demona, and the Hunters are wrongfully persecuting an entire species for the crimes of a single member (and a member who's out of favor with her own former clan, at that). But even if the gargoyles were the demonic monsters that the Canmores believed them to be, the Hunters are still pursuing them out of a senseless vendetta, rather than to protect the public from them - and probably do more to endanger the public than the gargoyles could have done on their own. Their reasons for gargoyle-hunting are not noble ones. And while they're aware of Demona's plans to wipe out humanity, they seem to be after her more because of her past actions against her family, than because of her schemes to commit genocide.

Goliath's blaming the Hunters for Elisa going over the dam, when he's more to blame, is one of the most chilling moments of the series, and a further sign of how much the feud is warping him. Fortunately, Elisa's return snaps him out of it in time - though too late to save Jon Canmore from taking the steps that will transform him into Castaway. (His cry of "What have I done - what have *they* done?" is another chilling moment, especially to those who've seen "City of Stone Part One".)

And with Elisa saved, Goliath now shows us the best that he's capable of, in how he foils Demona's scheme. Since she's about to carry out her plan at the point that the human world has learned about the existence of gargoyles at last - and most of them are clearly hostile and howling for blood - Goliath's thwarting Demona is a truly heroic act; he's willing to endanger himself and his entire kind (not only from Demona's virus, but also from potential Quarryman-style movements to follow) in order to preserve the humans, even though most of the humans aren't likely to show any gratitude at this point.

The final scenes (following Xanatos's rescue of the gargoyles) make a fine wrap-up to the season. Elisa talking to Jason in the hospital (including the mention of Demona and Jon out hunting each other - a great way to resolve that issue if there wouldn't be a third season). Xanatos assuring Elisa that the feud with the clan is over (of course, we know now that he's still scheming - and his current scheme could lead to a clash with the clan anyway). The actions of the other gargoyles as they settle into their new (or old) home - and finally Goliath and Elisa speaking to each other atop the highest tower, and the kiss. A great ending.

Anonymous writes...

Greg,

For the sake of brevity I will suspend sentence structure, condense context, and be as melodramatic as possible for full effect; I know testimonies have come your way in the past, but I also hope that such sincere ramblings from a fan to a creator never become tiresome.

I am a 24 year old female grad student who was raised in a closet of reality, in a single-minded religion, and without a good idea of my surroundings beyond that which I was taught to observe. At the age of eleven I saw the Gargoyles premiere.

Now whether it was a direct parallel to things already unspoken or a new and subtle influence on things to come, I can positively link what is now a lifetime of serious learning to the series that you sought to create with its multi-layered story, dynamic characters, and more verisimilitude than any other cartoon series I have ever encountered. From then until now I have studied (both on my own and in institutions of higher learning) comparative history, religion, mythology, literature, philosophy, art, and government. I have written a personal mission statement of tolerance, equality, and compassion for everything with a nervous system, and have maintained a wicked sense of humor and laissez-faire attitude that would make Xanatos proud. I seek to be a scholar, a trickster, and a strong, modern woman. Elisa, I should note, is a personal hero and I am OBSESSED with Gothic architecture.

I do not claim you and your efforts are the ultimate, godly force in my life, but I want to declare the power of such themes on a young girl, and want to thank you for not believing children incapable of understanding.

My question is: does this give you satisfaction?

Because I want it to.

-Valerie

Todd Jensen writes...

A comment, rather than a question. One of my fondest memories from the days when "Gargoyles" was on the air was, after seeing "City of Stone" and "Avalon", reading up all that I could find about the historical Macbeth, and Constantine's murder of Kenneth II. I already knew some things about early medieval Scotland (enough to know that Gruoch was the name of the real Lady Macbeth, that Macbeth overthrew Duncan in battle in actual history, and about his stepson Lulach), but after seeing those episodes, I learned even more.

Now, after Bad Guys #1 and Gargoyles #7, I've experienced once again that feeling. I've looked up whatever I could find about thylacines, and Gathelus and Scota, after reading the issues that they appeared in. Now I know even more than ever that "Gargoyles" is back. Thanks, Greg.

david writes...

hi greg,i have not read all the questions,but peerhaps the first french who write here!!!
so first of all ,i'm not going to be original,but i wanted to say that all you have done,with this series is amazing .In france the series disapear since 1999 ,and i 'm still a big fan .since march i got all the episodes and how fun it is to see my heroes back .eight years happen and my vision of the series have not changed,i' m now more able to see the detail ,the important details,that i could not see when i was young.that mean for me ,that gargoyles is more an adult series ,the psikology of all the characters are perfest an so deeply worked.i do not remember seing this on any other series.I see the episodes one on one ,and after seing one reading for the first time your rambles.I think it was so fun to see how you create the show ,,your first thoughts,our what would you prefer.and so on .i wwanted to react for all of us ,but it would have bored you (64 e mail ,i think it's a bit hard)
at list i see the evolution in my perception of the series,my favorite character was brooklynn first time i saw the serie,then broadway ,i found him strong an funny.and now at 20,it is hudson i really like,his attitude ,his experience ,his warrior skills,his swords and in the price he is so good ,his dialogue with wanatos on immortality are for me one of the best moment of the series.meanwhile my favorite episodes is shadow of the past ,this is a killing one !!!!the story the animation ,all is nearly perfect ,keith david voice as goliath is wonderful,the atmosfere of hate and shadow is so great ,so spooky and so referated(i' m not sure it exists in english)to the past.I also like long way to mourning ,you know,hudson stuff,a good story ,and the fact hudson trick demona at the end with the sun .
During the multiple revision of the serie ,i discver lot of details ,you could not see when you see the episodes just one ,the last was owen when they received john carter at castle wyvern ,he hide his stony hand in the pockets of his smoking ,i had never figured before ,but what would a man say when you saw a stony arm .and i noticed a lot of scene like this.
i want to add a word on the comics,just as the serie ,great works ,we rally found what made the series a success.i have the hope that the comics will have a long life.
To end this ,i want just add a question,after all we are here to ask question!!i just want to know if you had infos about gargoyles in france for the future,not an original question i know!!!
and are you going one day to make a gathering in paris ? perhaps ,i always wanted to go at one ,but you know ,to young and it cost a lot for going ,but one day i'll come
so greg sorry for all i have written ,but i wnated to write for so long you know!!!!!!good luck for the future ,and long live to the comics (my principal hope)

K9 the First writes...

"""Vaevictis Asmadi writes...
This is just a comment to K9...

I think you are thinking of some Amazonian Native Americans. The Mayans and other people in Mesoamerica certainly wore clothes pre-contact."""

AH! Yes. Okay. Sorry, I wasn't quite sure about that. I'm more knowledgible of the eastern and North American primatives, the Central and South American areas/tribes/What-have-yous tend to blend together for me.

Ice Tyrant writes...

Hey. I got into gargoyles a few months ago when one night during summer break I was staying up late like always and noticed it on. Thought "Oh hey, Maybe I should watch that" so I set it on DVR. I'm a sophmore now, so I forgot just about everything (except for lexingtons name and Goliath it seems...) from back when I was a kid. Great show. Oh yes, and thank you. Thanks to you, and this site, I started reading macbet. Now I'm reading Beowulf (not sure if you've read that.) I owe my uhh... making reading more important to me, to you, so thanks. I'm still watching the series (Or I will start back on it I hope when I get my channels back.) and I haven't read the comics, though from what I hear they are good. Don't really have a question I guess. Just wanted to say thanks. Oh, Uhh...

1. Do you have any future plans for Nokkar in the current gargoyles series (Not 2198. Might be obvious...>_>)?

Moe writes...

Hi Greg, i just wanted to say that i love your responses to some of these questions..lol. Short and sweet, it just cracks me up. Anyway, great job with the comics, I think they're awesome, and hopefully the rest of the cartoon series will be released as well. Good luck with spectacular spider-man, i'm looking forward to your creativity, p.s. and don't bog yourself down with answering too many questions as you seem really irritated by it lol :)

Antiyonder writes...

Since it was brought back up, I too am sorry about your cat. Had a few cats we've had to say goodbye to ourselves.

dph writes...

I do not know if you realize this or not, but you have done "This day in Gargoyles' Universe History" for over 6 months now. Thank you for doing this for us, the fans.

Antiyonder writes...

Something that came to mind a while back. You mentioned in your rambling of The Mirror:
That the original dialogue from Demona was "You serve him, you can serve me". That was changed due to fear that "him" would be mistaken for Satan.

Kind of funny considering your ramble on "Her Brother's Keeper":

"Derek thinks Elisa thinks Xanatos is the "Prince of Darkness". "He practically is!" she responds. <SIGH> Tricksters are always being confused with Satan."

"But that was more irony. It's not the demonic-looking gargoyles who are being compared to Satan. It's the handsome, rich Bruce Wayne-esque playboy. I guess the goatee helps."

Makes his membership (666 members) in The Illuminati all the more fitting.

Charisma82 writes...

Tuesday, June 25, 2007: Day 5 of Gathering of the Gargoyles

I guess there really isn't a day 5, and that's probably when everyone is getting home, but still… Here's the last day of my journaling from a non-gathering point of view.

Kay and I didn't wake up until 10:00am the next morning because we were wiped out from Disneyland the day before. We packed and left the hotel around 11:00am to go next door to IHOP for the 3rd time in the three days (IHOP, day 3… it's kind of a joke around here now). We were going to meet my grandparents and my aunt and her family there, and since they called and told us they had a table already, we knew we'd be in and out of there quick. When we went inside, they were nowhere to be found. What had happened is that they went to the other IHOP on that street (for some strange reason, the IHOP people decided to put two IHOPs on the same street, literally 4 blocks from each other). We drove to the other IHOP and had breakfast there (so I guess we went to IHOP 4 times all together on the trip). When we finished breakfast, my family drove to the parking structure and went on the tram again to get into the Disneyland Park while the rest of our party walked (they had a parking pass for their car somewhere else and we didn't).

We went to California Adventure on this day. And again, there was a problem with the ticket I had to get into the park (the whole name thing was off… it was annoying). What made it worse than the day before with the other Disney employee, was that the lady was even more perturbed at us than the one before. Usually, Disney employees are the nicest people ever, but the two that we got that ushered us in each day at the ticket booth needed to remember where they worked. Enough on that. We met up with the rest of our party at a shop at the front of the park after we rented a locker to stuff our extra stuff in. We went to Soaring Over California, and seeing that the line was over an hour, we got fast passes. We went by the Grizzly Peak River Run thing and it was over an hour to wait in line (not surprising because it was REALLY hot and muggy outside), so we kept on going. We finally decided to go watch the Bug's Life 3D show, which is cute, and then after that we headed over to Tower of Terror, which only my family got on because no one else wanted to lose their breakfast or were too scared to get on it. After that ride (which is one of my favorites at that park) my cousin and Tyson wanted to get on the Grizzly Peak Rapid Ride, and so we stood in line for over an hour to get on it. That had to be the longest hour of the whole day… no the whole trip. I was not in the best of moods waiting for that ride, especially because the last time I'd gotten on the ride, I'd been soaked and uncomfortable for the rest of the trip. So, I made my dad get me a poncho that I would sit on so my backside wouldn't get wet. I didn't care if the top half of me was wet, but the bottom half of me was going to stay dry. The ride was fun and I didn't get too wet like others in our group, so I was happy. When that ride was over we had a half hour to kill before we could use our fast passes (which are a blessing… I need to shake the hand of the guy who came up with the idea of fast passes and tell him he deserves the biggest raise in Disneyland history…) so we went through the tortilla and sourdough bread factories. I like these because they are a nice little break from the crowd and you get to learn stuff too. Once we were done in there, we used the fast passes to get on Soaring Over California. Just about everyone who has gone on that ride have had only nice things to say about it. It is a very cool ride. We've seen people cry once they get off of it. How did you like that ride?

After this ride, my aunt and her family said their goodbyes to us. They left the park to go visit a friend of my aunt's for the next day. My grandparents and my family ate dinner (I had a sourdough bread bowl from the bread factory and everyone else had Mexican food). When we finished there, my family and I rode the Mulholland Madness roller coaster. My grandparents left after that to go do whatever they wanted and then they left the park. My mom, Kay, and I got on the Boomerang ride and then my whole family got on California Screamin'. That ride is awesome. We headed back over to Tower of Terror because my mom wanted to ride it again, but the line was too long, so we went to my favorite place ever which is called the Disney Animation Studio. This place is my favorite place in both parks combined, hands down. I LOVE IT!!! Have you ever been in there? If not, you're missing out. We didn't get to go to any of the rooms to do anything because my parents wanted to leave soon, so we sat in the main room, listening to music from Disney movies while drawings of the movies were shown all over the round room. After this, we did some shopping (ran into my grandparents 2 other times) and then left the park around 9:30pm. When we got home around 12:30am, everyone went to bed as soon as we walked in the door.

So, that's the whole thing and I am now finished with the journals. I hope you and all the other Gargoyles fans had a great time at the gathering. Though I didn't get to go (hopefully one day I will), I did have a great time at Disneyland.

Thank you for your time and all that you do.

-Charisma82

Charisma82 writes...

Monday, June 25, 2007: Day 4 of Gathering of the Gargoyles

Again, from a non-gathering view point… Kay and I woke up in our hotel around 8:00am. Kay takes forever to get ready, so she started right away in the bathroom while I dozed off and on into dream world and then back into reality. Once it hit around 8:30am I decided to get up for real. I turned on the TV to have some background noise and started getting ready. We planned to leave around 9:00am to 9:30am for IHOP, which was next door to where we were staying. I was glad that we left around 9:30am because I wasn't feeling so great while getting ready. When we walked into the IHOP I said "IHOP, day two," because we'd eaten at one the day before for dinner. Kay and I split something, me ending up with a pancake and her with eggs, hash browns, bacon, and sausage. I would've claimed more, but my stomach was still not up to eating much.

From IHOP we went to Disneyland. We were mad when we found out that Kay forgot the Disneyland CD in the hotel room so that we couldn't listen to it while we parked and all of that good stuff. We had to take a detour from where we usually go in to park in the parking structure because the regular way was blocked off, and so that took a bit more time. We finally made it in the parking structure and parked in the Goofy section. We took the tram to the front gate (I love riding the tram… it's really the first ride of the day at Disneyland, if you don't count the escalator). I had some trouble getting into the park because of the ticket I had. It was very annoying, especially because the Disney Cast Member wasn't very nice about it. What happened was that my ticket had a different name on it than mine because we'd let a friend borrow the ticket on a previous Disneyland trip and her name was on the ticket, but it was still our ticket (the ticket was good for up to 3 days at Disneyland and only one day had been used on it). They were asking me for ID and all that stuff, but I didn't even have that on me because I'd left it in the car. It was stressful for some people in my group who don't handle stress too well. Anyways, we finally got that taken care of and I was allowed into the park.

We had some time to kill before we met up with the rest of our party so we rented a locker to put extra stuff in, and headed for the board on Main Street that tells how long lines are. The Matterhorn was the shortest line with a 35-minute wait, so we went to that. After that ride we got on Thunder Mountain and then the Mark Twain boat that goes along the Rivers of America. Once that was over, we met up with my grandparents, aunt, cousin, and my aunt's boyfriend (who I will call Tyson, because I don's want to keep saying 'My aunt's boyfriend' the whole time). My aunt and her family wanted to ride on the Pirate Ship that goes on the Rivers of America, and since we'd already done that, we shopped while we waited for them (mainly shopped for trading pins, because I am REALLY into that). When they got off, we went to stand in line for Pirates of the Caribbean. We waited in the wheelchair line, since my aunt came in one due to health reasons. We ended up waiting there for an hour. My cousin (who is 13) told us that they'd never had to wait in a wheelchair line before. It was weird. After that ride, we went an Indiana Jones through the wheelchair line, which was fun because we got to ride on elevators and stuff to get to the ride. Once that ride was over, my grandparents left the park to go somewhere else. My aunt's family and ours went back to the Matterhorn, which was a big deal because my cousin had never been on a roller coaster ride before. They terrify her. She had to be bribed to get on it. She was promised $20.00 if she rode on it. It was funny because I sat in the car in front of her and heard her scream the whole time. That was the only roller coaster she got on all day (though she was bribed with $30.00 and a new sweatshirt of her choice if she got on Space Mountain… she still turned it down). After that ride, we went on the new Finding Nemo ride and waited over an hour in the wheelchair line, once again. The submarine was very stuffy and didn't have much air in it. It was a cute ride and is one of those you go on once to say you've been on it. After that, my aunt, mom, Kay, and I got on Space Mountain (my favorite ride of them all) through the wheelchair line. That was interesting. Everything was downhill and my mom, pushing my aunt, lost control of the wheelchair several times, almost ramming her into the wall. What was fun was when we got to the ride. All four of us got into our cars, which were not on the track, and then the cars were moved onto the track with us in them. I'd never done that before. I was bummed that the rockin' music from Red Hot Chili Peppers wasn't in the ride any longer. They'd had their music in there for about a month or two back around springtime. When the ride was over, it was VERY funny watching my mom push my aunt back up the ramps we'd taken to get there for the wheelchair people. It was SO funny because she was dizzy from the ride and she was swerving my aunt everywhere and almost hitting other people who were in the hallway. I won't forget it easily.

After that ride, my aunt and Tyson left the park for their hotel, and our family and my cousin had dinner at my favorite restaurant, Pizza Port. I love their spaghetti. Then we went on Buzz Lightyear Astro Blasters where I rode alone and got to use both guns to fire with. After that, we went to Main Street to get stuff out of our locker (catching the end of the fireworks show in the process) and then watched the 50 magical years show with Steve Martin and Donald Duck as the hosts. We'd seen it at least 5 times before, so it was just something to kill time with. Once that was over, we met up with my grandparents and Tyson, who'd come back to the park for the evening. It was dark by now and we left to go see Fantasmic, but ended up getting the times screwed up and missed it. My grandparents went their separate way from us and the rest of us got on the Haunted Mansion. It was probably the shortest line all day. After that, we realized that there would be another Fantasmic show at 11:30pm, so we stayed for that. I love the Fantasmic show. It's great. When it was over, we looked in a few shops and then left the park, parting ways with my cousin and Tyson. We got back to the hotel after midnight and were wiped out. Kay took a shower and I plopped down on my bed and was asleep very soon.

Well, one more day after this and the journals will all be over. Until then…

Thank you for your time and all that you do.

-Charisma82

Charisma82 writes...

Sunday, June 24, 2007: Day Three of Gathering of the Gargoyles

Here's the 3rd day of my non-Gathering weekend. Okay… Let me remember… I woke up around 8:40am to get ready for church. I wasn't feeling good, and after being up for about 10 minutes, I decided to lie down for a while and hope that I would get better. I ended up getting to church late because of this. My mom stayed behind with me and she drove us there (It's about 10 minutes away from where I live) because when I'm sick I hate driving. I started feeling better during church services. After church ended, there was a potluck going on and I stayed with my sister (Kay) for it while my parents took one of the cars back home. I ended up sitting at a table with Kay, Fizz, D.C., Peaches (whom I have spoken of before), Sprite, CameraBoy, Cliff, and a new person whose name escapes me at the moment. Everyone was there except Morgana who was up at her family's cabin for the weekend. We all had a fun time talking about different stuff, but mostly about camp. We are all going up to a camp up in the mountains, about 10 miles from Yosemite, this next week. Everyone goes up once a year and has a great time. I haven't been in about 2 or 3 years, so I'm excited. We talked about past pranks pulled on all the cabins and all the stupid stuff people do up there.

After we were done with lunch, Kay and I took her car back home where we sat around and watched TV or did stuff on the computer. I worked on Word of the Day (a sort of contest thing that I help with) and sent it out to everyone who participates in it. Around 4:00pm we started packing up stuff for our trip to Disneyland. We left near 5:00pm. As usual, I took the middle seat and Kay took the very back seat in our Suburban while my dad drove and my mom watched movies on her DVD player in the passenger's seat. I quickly set up my seat so I could lie down and then I fell asleep.

It usually takes about 3 hours to get to Disneyland from where we live, which was how long it took this time. It was dark by the time we got to the hotel. We ended up staying in a hotel we'd never stayed in before called the Radisson. Dad went in while we waited for what seemed like forever in the car. I didn't mind so much because the hotel was playing Disney music outside and I was listening to that. I rolled down my window to hear the music better and after I did, some lady sat down on a bench not 3 feet away from my window, and started smoking. I might not have been so mad about it if she hadn't noticed my window open, but she was staring at our car which was right in front of her. Okay, if you're going to smoke, don't do it next to an open window, just out of courtesy. My dad came out of the hotel and motioned for me to come in too. I asked what was going on and he said that because we had two rooms (one for my parents and one for Kay and I) I had to sign some papers. So I waited by the counter for forever while they typed a lot of stuff and had my dad sign papers, and then they said that they didn't need me after all. They had a lot of pictures in their lobby of different Disney movies, which was cool to see. After that, we went back to the car, parked it, grabbed all our luggage/pillows/blankets/electronics, found the elevator, went up to the 3rd floor (my mom hates elevators and she's never happy when we aren't on the 1st floor), found our rooms, and finally emptied our arms full of stuff. Kay and I like to get drinks and snacks from the machines when we visit motels/hotels, so we grabbed the ice bucket, got some cash from my mom, and headed out looking for the vending machines. We found a drink machine next to the ice machine, which didn't have a great selection on it. It cost Kay $2.00 for a drink. We hopped on the elevator and took it to the 1st floor, looking for snacks, and found a mini store. I bought a lemonade (for less than $2.00, so I got the better deal) and some ice cream, and Kay bought something to snack on too (I don't remember what). We were lucky 'cause they were about to close the store.

When we got back to our room, we ate our snacks while we flipped through the channels on the TV. There weren't many channels and ended up on the Disney channel (coincidence?) where some Hillary Duff movie was on. Believe me, nothing else was on. After that ended, Kay tried to go to sleep while I surfed around for another movie. I found a movie that had just started with Vince Vaughn and Jennifer Lopez in it. I didn't catch the name of the movie, but it was about Jennifer's character going into the minds of people who are in comas, trying to get them to tell her stuff. Vince's character is a police officer that captures a serial killer who goes into a coma. Jennifer has to go into his mind to find out where a woman is whom he captured. It was interesting. And what was funny is that the boy who plays the serial killer in his mind was also the boy in the Hillary Duff movie that had been on earlier. I need to look up the name of that movie 'cause it'll bug me if I don't know the name of it. After the movie ended, I listened to some Fallout Boy and then went to sleep around 1:30am.

So that was Sunday. I'll get to Monday and Tuesday as soon as I can. Lots of Disneyland stuff going on those days…

Thank you for your time and all that you do.

-Charisma82

TiniTinyTony writes...

*** BJ's and Jess's Weekend Wedding Bonanza sans The Gathering 2007 ***

- Friday, June 22, 2007

I went to sleep early the night before so that I could meet up with all the groomsmen and the groom at 9am to go clay pigeon shooting. I was supposed to meet my friend Dan at his house in Danville and follow him to the shooting range. Well he was very late getting ready and by the time we reached the range, they were done shooting. I was pretty pissed, but I didn't let it get me down. We still had golf to do later that day, and I didn't want to go into that sport angry, especially at the low level of experience that I am in the first place.

So we all went to BJ's house, and then took two cars to get something to eat at KFC/Taco Bell, grabbed some golf balls at Wal-Mart, and then proceeded to the golf course called Turbot Hills. We had a 1:15 tee time. It was only $19 to play and it was a pretty nice course. I had borrowed an old set of golf clubs from BJ's dad, Bill, a few days before so I didn't have to spend $4 to rent a set. We got three carts, two guys per cart, drank beers and played scrimmage style where everyone plays from where the best ball was hit to. I only lost 3 balls that day which I thought was pretty good. I got a few good shots over all throughout the day, but the best part was just hanging with friends, drinking beers, and driving the golf cart.

Once we were done with 9 holes, we headed back to BJ's house to get ready for the wedding rehearsal at 5:30pm. It was going well until BJ lost it. It took him about 10 minutes to calm down and regain composure and we proceeded to practice. I assured him that it was normal to get emotional and not to worry about it.

Once we got that out of the way, we were treated to dinner. It was a good time and everyone was enjoying my antics. We then proceeded to this dive bar to have a few drinks and then headed home around 10:30pm to get plenty of sleep for the big day tomorrow.

*** BJ's and Jess's Weekend Wedding Bonanza sans The Gathering 2007 ***

- Saturday, June 23, 2007

BJ wanted all the groomsmen to meet at his house at 9am to hang out and watch movies. I got up at 7am and arrived at his place around 9:15am. I was the first one there. We proceeded to Sheetz and got some breakfast biscuits or Shbizcuits or something bizarre like that. We went back to BJ's and hung out. We didn't end up watching movies, but we ended up cruising the internet for a bit and then played bocce outside once the other groomsmen showed up. Before long it was time to head to the church and get dressed in our tuxes.

It was 1pm and we left for the church where we had put our tuxes the night before so it was convenient for Saturday. Once we got dressed, it was Adam "Wags" Wagner and mine job to light the candles on the altar. We did a great job of course, and then we proceeded with the other groomsmen, to escort the other ladies into the church to their seats. That was probably the most fun part, for me, for no apparent reason. Once it was 3:00pm, it was time to begin. All of us lined up in front of the church with the priest, and the bridesmaids entered while music played. Then Jess came in with a huge smile on her face, as her dad brought her up to the altar. After only 20 minutes it was over, and BJ and Jess were now husband and wife.

We waited outside and blew bubbles at them. I miss the old days when you could throw rice. That was always fun. After that it was time to take pictures back inside the church. We did this for 40 minutes until the limos came at 4pm.

The limos took us to the reception where more pictures were taken. I believe it wasn't until 7pm until we finally entered the reception and sat down to eat. The picture taking seemed to take longer than usual, and I'm sure the guests were upset, but I wasn't complaining, but made jokes and had a great time.

The best man and the father of the bride gave their speeches; we toasted, and began to eat some really delicious food - steaks cooked right on this huge grill in front of us. There was plenty of wine to drink for the reception was at the Spyglass Winery, and there was a half keg of Yeugling Lager, a local favorite in Pennsylvania. Not a lot of people were on the dance floor, but I was out there having a good time. I didn't bring a date, so I danced with Jess's friends and her cousins. They were all very beautiful young women and very nice to talk to and dance with.

But like all good things, this wonderful event had come to an end. I danced the last dance of the night with BJ's mom, Susie. She is a really great lady and I consider her my second mom. Once the DJ started packing up, she was nice enough to give me a ride back to my car at the church. I got home around 11:15pm that night and I was beat. I passed out around midnight, but not before setting my alarm.

*** BJ's and Jess's Weekend Wedding Bonanza sans The Gathering 2007 ***

- Sunday, June 24, 2007

I had my alarm set for 10am. I got up around 9:30am. There was a post wedding celebration at Jess's parent's house at noon where my presence was requested.

I got to their house around 11:54am, and was the first groomsman there. BJ and Jess weren't there yet, but thankfully showed up 5 minutes later.

We had all the left over food from the wedding to eat, which was probably more delicious the next day. We played washers and horseshoes outside, while drinking beers and bullshitting, talking about how well the wedding went and how much fun everyone had.

People didn't stay very long, but I helped clean up and left around 4pm. I took the rest of the day to relax after the crazy and fun weekend that I just experienced.

Great job to all the groomsmen who helped make the weekend so memorable. Congratulations to BJ and Jess, whom I love and respect with all my heart.

Hopefully, next year I'll get to experience The Gathering experience in Chicago.

Lloyd Frisone writes...

I asked a question previously but forgot to include my email. lfrisone@comcast.net

Charisma82 writes...

Saturday, June 23, 2007: Day Two of Gathering of the Gargoyles

After I was done typing up my journal for yesterday around 1:30am in the morning, I ended up staying up until about 4:30am watching stuff on You Tube. I also did some reading of Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire. I've read all the books before, but since the 7th and final Harry Potter book is coming out in a few weeks, I thought I'd better refresh my mind by reading all the books over again. I also want to remember what happened in the 5th book because the 5th movie is coming out soon too. I don't want to sound like I'm a big Harry Potter fan, because I'm not the biggest Harry Potter fan out there, I just like the story. Have you read any of them? Anyways, I went to bed around 4:30am and didn't wake up until 11:00am, which I'm shocked I got away with. My mom usually makes sure my sister and I are awake by 10:00am at the latest. After I woke up, my sister and I got ready to go back down to the church building to help decorate the high school room with a couple other people. Since it's the summer time and people are doing a lot of stuff, only 2 other people showed up to help. So all together it was my sister (Kay), D.C., Fizz, (all nicknames in case they have a problem with me putting their names on here) and me. First, we played a couple rounds of ping-pong (play before work… it's out of order, I know…) to get ready for ping-pong at camp next week and then we went to work on the high school room. I'm not in the high school class, and neither is D.C., so we didn't really know what needed to be done in there. First we had to take down all the old stuff in the room. Then we called up a guy that teaches in there to get some ideas, and since they weren't solid ideas and just some thrown out there suggestions, I decided to go with the theme of going down the path of righteousness or going down the path that rocks (the path that rocks, being the one that shouldn't be chosen… I'll explain). We used Kronk from the Disney movie The Emperor's New Groove (Kronk is my favorite good guy Disney character ever) and used his shoulder angel and devil's line "He wants to lead you down the path of righteousness… I want to lead you down the path that rocks…" We had to enlarge a picture of Kronk on a light projector on a wall, which took forever, and then we had to outline him again in marker. Then we had to make speaking bubbles for them to talk. It took up a lot of time, and we still didn't get it all finished. Half of it is done, but we'll have to finish the rest next week.

Everyone was hungry and since I hadn't eaten anything all day, I was ready to choose a place and go there… except that no one could agree on anything. Around 4:30pm we finally left in my car, me driving of course, and headed to Subway in the mall. I will say that I advertised the Gathering of the Gargoyles while at Subway by telling my group that it was going on this weekend. D.C. has seen gargoyles and knew what I was talking about, and Kay, being my sister, knew about it too, but Fizz needed some informing about it. After eating (I had a BLT… I think it's funny when you ask for a BLT and they still want to know if you want lettuce and tomato on the thing…) we went into Borders, which is part of the mall, and I ended up running into someone I went to high school with. She was really nice and told me we should get together and do something next week, yet the problem is that I don't know where I put her phone number… Kay, D.C., and Fizz took off into the mall while I was talking with the girl and I had to call Kay to find out where they went. They ended up wasting money on a claw machine, gave up, and used the rest of their change buying candy. Fizz had to go home, so we left the mall and I dropped her off. Kay, D.C., and I didn't want to go home just yet so I spoke up and said we should go to Cold Stone (It's funny how that's the name of that gargoyle in Gargoyles) because I love their ice cream. We went there and I bought a Peanut Butter Cup Perfection… oh, that's living (I LOVE peanut butter). I couldn't finish it and had to throw half of it away. After that we went to Best Buy, which is right behind the Cold Stone. We played some video games and browsed the DVD isles. After that, we went to Game Stop, which is across the street from Best Buy. The same video game we'd been playing at Best Buy was also at Game Stop, so we played it again just for kicks. We left there and D.C. got the call from home that he had to go home. We drove to the other side of town to drop him off and were invited to see either Dream Girls or Epic Movie with him and his sister, but Kay called our house and our dad said we needed to get back home to get packed for Disneyland (we're leaving Sunday to go down there).

We left D.C. and Peaches (his sister) and got home around 7:00pm. Mom and Dad weren't around so we started watching the movie the Pacifier (which wasn't that great). Our parents finally got home after being at Walmart buying stuff for our trip to Disneyland and California Adventure. My dad sat down to watch the end of the movie with us while my mom printed out pictures from Kay's 16th birthday party 3 weeks ago. My mom needed to clear her camera of pictures so she can take some when we go to Disneyland. My mom gave up on the picture printing thing and told my sister to continue it, but Kay ended up getting me to do it while she took her shower. I ate an apple and listened to music on the Cinemagic channel. They were playing music from the soundtrack of Braveheart. Once Kay was done in the shower, she took over printing pictures and I went to my room to check up on my e-mails online. I wrote back to my cousin who lives in Colorado and then checked up on stuff in ASKGREG. After that, I wrote this. So now that I'm caught up, I'm going to sign off. I probably won't get any more journals in until the middle of the week, seeing as we're leaving for Disneyland today (it's just past midnight) and won't get back home until either Tuesday or Wednesday. Now, I'm going to blow dry my hair and then get to bed so I'll be good and awake for church in the morning.

Thank you for your time and all that you do.

-Charisma82

Charisma82 writes...

Hey! Wow, has it already been a year since the last Gathering? It feels like just a while ago. Sadly, just like last year, I was not able to make it to the Gathering of the Gargoyles. I'm not as crushed over it as I was last year, or the year before that, or the year before that… but still, I figure that I will get to one of them one of these days, so keep having them, and I'll hopefully turn up some day. I didn't do a pre-gathering journal yesterday because nothing really happened yesterday. So here it goes for the first day of the Gathering of the Gargoyles (from the point of view of someone not being there)…

Friday, June 22, 2007: The First Day of Gathering of the Gargoyles

Today started way too early for me. All of my days for the past 4 weeks have started too early for me. I signed up for a summer class and was fool enough to sign up for a class that started at 7:00am. I've been waking up a little bit before 6:00am every morning because the school is in a different town and I have to drive a while to get there. I am definitely not a morning person. I'm used to going to sleep late and waking up late. I've been forcing myself to go to bed at midnight so I can be awake enough for the class every morning. But fortunately for me, today was my last day, so I no longer have to wake up so early. Actually, besides waking up early, I really liked the class. It was an English class that dealt with a lot of literature, which I enjoyed. We read a lot of short stories, poems, and a few plays in the class. The teacher even showed us the play "A Midsummer Night's Dream" on video that was made back in the 30's. I really liked it and was able to keep up with the names, mainly because of watching Gargoyles for as long as I have been. Since today was the last day, we had a final. We had to write a paper in class about 1, 2, or 3 different pieces of literature we'd read in class and connect them together to make a common point. I chose the poem entitled "The Ruined Maid" by Thomas Hardy and the play entitled "Overtones" by Alice Gerstenberg and talked about how moving up in social class isn't what makes a person happy, which I proved with the two pieces of literature that I chose. There was more to it, but I'm not going to get into all of that here. We were supposed to write out the paper by hand in MLA format in ink. I decided to write it out in pencil first so I wouldn't make mistakes on my final copy. Because I did this, I took up the entire 2 hours, continuously writing. My hand felt like it was going to fall off once I was done. Though it took me a lot longer to write the paper twice, I was glad I did. I didn't have any mess ups on the final draft. I was very fortunate that my paper was only 6 pages long, because that's all the paper I had on me. I couldn't afford to make mistakes.

After I finished there, I headed home (and got to hear Fuel's song "Hemorrhage" which I rocked out to). I got home just as my mom and sister went off to work. I got on the computer to do my usual rounds of checking up on e-mail and looking at my usual websites (including, of course, ASK GREG). After that, I sat around the house for a while before I became tired and knew I had to get a nap in if I wanted to last the rest of the day. I slept for about 3 hours and got up around 4:30pm to 5:00pm.

Around 6:00pm, my family (my parents and younger sister) and I took off for Family Fun Night at our church. Before we got there, we stopped by Carl's Jr. for some dinner. I didn't eat much since I wasn't feeling that great. We got to the church building a bit before 7:00pm and were the first ones there. After waiting for about 20 minutes, we had more people show up. We played cards and ping-pong. I've decided that I need to start playing ping-pong every day until next week when I go up to camp. I say this because one of the main sports up at camp is ping-pong and I found out how much practice I need when playing it tonight. I think the most fun game with ping-pong is Around the World in which a bunch of people line up around the table and take turns hitting the ball back and forth. It's not as easy as it sounds or looks. After ping-pong, about six of us decided to play hide-and-seek walky-talkies (which is basically hide-and-seek with a set of walky-talkies in the mix). That was fun. It's not so easy when the entire building is pitch black dark and you can't turn lights on. I have the best hiding spot in a closet under a set of stairs that no one ever wants to look in because there is so much junk in there and it is very dark. I was really mad when one of the younger girls decided to hide with me then decided not to because she was afraid of the dark, and then told everyone where I was once she herself was found. Now that my hiding spot has been blown, I have to find some other great hiding spot. Anyways, we ended up leaving there around 9:45pm.

When we got home, Dad really wanted to watch the baseball game that had the Colorado Rockies in it because he grew up in Colorado. He was sad when they lost at the very end of the game (sorry if I ruined that for anyone… I hope I didn't). My mom and I played Mancala (a game played with flattened marbles and a wooden board…I don't know how else to describe it) while we watched some show on the top 10 funniest women ever. It wasn't that great of a show, but there was nothing else on that the family could agree upon to watch (my mom, sister, and I wanted to watch Pirate Master, a show we got hooked on at the beginning of summer break, but my dad put his foot down and said no). My parents went to bed around 11:30pm and my sister and I stayed up to watch the AFI's top 100 movies in the past 100 years that we'd recorded on Tivo earlier in the week. It was good. We didn't know about half the movies in the countdown, but were excited to see the ones we did know. It finally ended around 1:30am. My sister went to bed, and now I'm in my room typing this.

So all in all, this was actually a busy day compared to the past couple of weeks around here. I wish I could say that I watched Gargoyles so it would seem that I'm keeping the spirit of Gargoyles alive during the Gathering of the Gargoyles (since I'm not there), but I'm too tired to start watching one of them. I'd probably fall asleep while my eyes burned trying to keep awake. Maybe tomorrow I'll do some Gargoyle watching…

Thank you for your time and all that you do.

-Charisma82

Justin writes...

Dear Greg,
I have been meaning to write you this comment for a very long time. It seems that the longer things go on, the more my life parallels things you presented on Gargoyles. Not everything mind you, haha, but somethings certainly strike a new chord than when I watched the show at 13.

To start this off, on Sept. 28th, 2005 my mother passed away. It was hard but my sisters and I got through it. Eventually around the holidays, both my sisters left for verying educational pursuits while I was tasked with taking care of our home. This officially happened in January 2006. I thought I could handle it but all of a sudden the sheer realization that I was all alone in my childhood home ( save our 2 cats and a dog) became too much to bare.

Eventually I started feeling like I was losing myself. Well this went on for a few weeks then a month or so like this and then early february, our heat went out. I had no job then and I couldn't afford the bill. It just so happened this was the coldest time of the winter that this occured.

Anyway, my little sister was attending Indiana University at the time, got wind of the situation and arranged to get me out of there, to stay the night with a family friend. I had known this family for years and I didn't want to burden them. Nor did I want to abandon my pets to the cold. So in an insane headspace I told my sister no. That I was not leaving.

Long story short I left my house that night and stayed a few days with the friends mentioned above. Here is the kicker... this is the only Gargoyles reference I have made so far but I hope if I illustrated the story well enough you see the similarities already..

When I got to my friend's home they set me up on the couch and gave me free reign over the TV. I turned to Toon Disney knowing Gargoyles would be on soon, and you know what episode was running that night? HAHA, you guessed it, Enter Macbeth.

My little sister convinced me it was suicide to stay at my home, and I ended staying with family friends that were truly more like extended family. Hudson's line struck a deep chord.. "Where we can be together and safe" It wasn't my house I was protecting, althought I thought so.. I was protecting what I felt was all I had left. Eerily similar.

In any event, I felt I would pass that along. I won't be able to attend Pigeon Forge but now I live in Chicago, so I hope to see you next year!

Peace, Love, and Empathy,

Justin M. Lindley

Cedric Calles writes...

Hello Greg. I read the last post and this indeed is my real name if curious " Cedric franklin kaili Calles " Proud Scott/Irish man. When I was younen I enjoyed watching your "Gargoyles" very much. I was fasinated of medievil times. Where times of honor, glory, and magic lived in those mystical ages. Atlass when I saw the last episode and the unfortunate fate awaited for Goliath and his clan. I was bloody mad at the end and later cried. Hours passed and I began to think, the cartoon era was changing and were losing their ways. A New Era of twisted cartoons that contained stories of no moral, ideas, or reasoning to the common sense and violence to the extreme beyond of comprehision, strange ideas of doing wrong was right, and the idea of its ok to be stupid or do stupid things as a normal daily life, was born. Which comes to my question...

Do you believe it was the right call for " Gargoyles " to end as it was to be saved from the New Era of Corruption, keeping its Orgin?

My final question, why did you not make a book out of it? To open a world of their world to ours.

Kaylle writes...

Way back in October 2005, the day they released the cover art for the second DVD set, I watched a bunch of episodes instead of doing my homework and typed up my musings on them (mostly on Hunter's Moon and the Goliath/Elisa relationship) in my livejournal. Today I'm *still* trying to avoid my homework, and the queue is open again, so I thought I'd dig up those old musings and get your opinion on them (I may have posted something like this in the CR once as well; my apologies if you happened to catch it there). So here they are. I wrote:

"At the end of HM3, Elisa and Goliath finally get some "resolution" to their relationship. The infamous kiss it took us (and them) 65 episodes to get to. I hate to call it resolution at all because it doesn't really resolve anything; their relationship is still in a pretty uncertain place and kissing hardly changes that. But it's the first time they both admit what's going on between them and do something, however small, about it. And it provided some small measure of satisfaction for the fans, who were just beginning to realize that was all we were going to get. I remember being so hopeful, so excited, 13 years old, watching in awe as finally, *finally* the two of them "got together." I hadn't realized it was the season finale, although really it was pretty obvious (I didn't know cartoon shows *had* season finales). And I certainly hadn't realized it was, for all intents and purposes, the end." [Of course, I know now what I didn't know in October 2005-- it wasn't the end! We have a comic book!]

"But I digress. Anyway, I noticed two things today. First, in HM1, during the scene on the subway: after he dispatches the muggers, Elisa goes to Goliath, lays her head down on his chest, and says, "Nobody messes with my best friend." I always thought that was kind of a dangerous thing to say in public, although sweet. But I noticed today the way that Goliath reacts to it. Maybe I never noticed before, or maybe I just don't remember, but he reaches to touch her hair and then stops himself, grimaces, and pulls away. It happens so quickly it's easy to miss it. But something about that aborted gesture of affection really intrigues me.

"Did he stop because he thought she wouldn't appreciate the sentiment? Haven't we seen him touch her that way before? It's hard to remember because the two of them get so very few explicitly affectionate moments. There aren't a lot of episodes that deal with them. (The most obvious is The Mirror, but that was so long before this that it's hard to use it as an indication of their relationship now. Although there is that moment, while Demona and Puck are spying on them via the mirror, when Elisa sort of nuzzles her face into Goliath's shoulder. I'd love to know what the conversation was that led her to do *that*...) Their relationship is very clear to the viewer, but it's also very understated. Any romantic moments like that are part of some larger scene, some larger conversation, etc. (I was half-convinced, when I was a kid, that it was because Disney didn't want to deal with the xenophilia aspect. Now I can see that it's in character for them to act that way; both of them know what's going on but they can't admit it, can't act on it because they're certain there's no future in it. But when you're 12-13 years old you miss some of the subtler points <g>.) So, while I can think of romantic moments between Goliath and Demona, MacBeth and Gruoch, etc, Goliath and Elisa are much more subtle than that.

"So then I went picking through episodes looking for Goliath/Elisa moments. (Aren't they cute in Eye of the Beholder, dancing in their Halloween 'costumes'? Even the trio notices. "They should have Halloween more often.") As early as Awakenings 5, we see Elisa take his face in her hands. The closest embrace I can find is in Heritage, after Elisa's disappearance. They both look pretty happy to see each other there, and she doesn't show any reluctance to touch him or be held by him.

"So anyway, it could be because he thinks she won't appreciate the gesture. She has shied away from discussing their relationship in the past. Or it could be because they're in a train full of people (although, again, she's pretty much given them away to everyone on the train already).

"Or it could be because he doesn't want to let himself touch her? Because letting himself caress her hair (the gargoyle equivalent of a kiss, even if Elisa doesn't necessarily know that) means pretending, if only for a moment, that they have a relationship? And because he can't stand doing that to himself over and over again? Something to think about, anyway.

"The other thing that I noticed was that, although Goliath saw Elisa kiss Jason and heard what she said about her feelings, she doesn't know that. As far as she knows, nothing between them has changed since HM1. Obviously they're both happy to see each other after Jason rescues her (although Goliath is probably "happier" than Elisa is; at least, she didn't think he was dead). But nothing has happened, to her knowledge, to bring things between them to a head. So why does she finally decide to admit her feelings to him? Her dialogue doesn't really tell us anything, either. He says, "So... Things have come full circle," and Elisa replies, "Somehow, they always do. You know how I feel about you, right?" She brings it up apropos of nothing. (He doesn't seem startled by it, either. Why is that? I sure as heck was!)

"Is it her relationship with Jason? The realization that, even when presented with someone human who seems to be everything she's looking for (at least at first), she still wants Goliath? When offered the normal life she thinks she wants, she still chooses Goliath and the clan, and all the uncertainty and upheaval they imply. Is that it? Of course, they've had a traumatic couple of days, and that could be a reason all by itself."

At that point I decided that I'd spent way too much time analyzing things and that I really ought to be doing work, so I stopped. But I'm still intrigued by it all. I guess if I had to distill it down into a few questions, they would be:

1) Is there a reason for Goliath's gesture (or lack thereof) on the train, or am I thinking too hard/paying too much attention to tiny details?

2) Does Elisa know that touching hair is the gargoyle equivalent of a kiss? (Maybe not in so many words, since I doubt the gargoyles think of it in terms of how their gestures of affection are equivalent to human gestures, but does she realize the sort of underlying meaning of a touch like that?) And if so, how does she know? Just from observation and intuition? Did someone tell her?

3) Why does Elisa finally speak up at the end of HM3? What changes her mind about keeping quiet?

Thanks for listening to me ramble on a bit, and for taking the time to answer our questions. It's only out of love that we analyze every aspect of things :)

Antiyonder writes...

Most of us have been talking about the yet to be released Volume of Gargoyles, whether it's in the comment room or submitting in the Ask A Question. I do agree that that the Disney blaming has gone overboard at times (I'm guilty of it as well). I can't speak for everyone of course, but I'm going to do my best to describe why we tend to blame the company so to speak (I know you don't mean any offense). Since, you have more business experience than some of us, your POV would be helpful.

1. Again part of the reason why we aren't seeing anymore DVDs are lack of purchases from the previous sets. Yes part of it is due to lack of sales, but also lack of advertising. It's not just DVDs, but with say network television (Not just with Disney). Aside from quality there are many reasons a show would turn up with low ratings, like:

- Lack of commericals, hence the viewer doesn't know it exist.
- The show is aired so much that the viewer gets tired of it, or so little they don't have a chance to draw in fans. Odd thing about that is that a particular program is aired constantly when it only has 13/26 episodes, yet when/if it has 65-78 episode, then it's not aired so often. Should be the other way around.
- The show is aired in a timeslot that most people don't watch.

It just seems like the higher ups don't really understand their audience, or they do but don't want to take responsibility. After all, admiting to a mistake is viewed by some to be a sign of shame and humiliation rather than being responsible.

1a. Also, with the comics, I heard sales lowered for #3. That's due of course to lack of a consistant release. My question is if Disney will acknowledge that lower sales are due to delaying approval, or will they assume that the comic itself is the problem. You can count on us hardcore (in my case semi-hardcore) fans to stick with it to the end, but as has been said in the comment room newcomers or casual buyers are going to be put off by the delays if it keeps up. Regardless, I'm trusting that the situation should improve.

2. Then there's the concept of money. It seems like the higher ups in the business never heard of the saying "You have to spend money to make money". It just seems like with any product (DVD, Comics, etc) they expect to make a fortune by investing a few cents (not literaly mind you).

2a. I know that companies like Disney are in the business to make money and I repsect that. The problem is it seems their ambition is more of an obsession. For instance, I know that you're sure as heck not doing all of this work for free, but for you the money isn't a one-tracked mind thing. Same could be said of folks like Bruce Timm, Paul Dini, Tom Defalco, Peter David, Steve Loter, Mark McCorkie, Bob Schooley.

I really hope this came across as a constructive complaint, rather than a mindless hatefilled rant. After all, I'm not always good at using the right words, to voice my opinion.

Gerin writes...

Hi again Greg,

not a question really, but I recently read an older post of yours where you explain your negative opinion about "Return of the Jedi" and the confrontation between Luke and the emperor in particular. Since you sometimes ask your fans to ramble too, here's why I think this is one of the best standoffs in the history of movies:

THE EMPEROR:
High class villain. Fragile, feeble, understated. Gives definition to "sinister", implies awesome aura.
And witty! Usually, when Good Guy (James Bond, Superman, Elisa) is at the mercy of Bad Guy (Blofeld, Lex Luthor, Demona), isn't Bad Guy all outspoken and arrogant, but alas, Good Guy always has wittier deliveries, better puns etc.?
Whatever Luke throws at him, Palpatine's got the retorts. "Your arrogance is your weakness", says Luke. Any other villain would now start throwing around threats, acting all superior, unwillingly confirming the statement. Not Palpatine. He's even kind of agreeing by saying "The trust in your friends is yours." And Luke is speechless.

THE DARK SIDE EXPLAINED:
For two and a half movies, we've been lectured constantly on how fear and anger lead to the dark side. Morale, good and evil, yadda-yadda. Always play nice. Yeah, as if it matters. Power is power, right?
Suddenly, it does matters and the concept becomes tangible: Vader threatens Luke's sister, and boy does Luke get mad. And powerful! No finesse anymore, just sheer rage. It's filmmaking at its best! Listen to the choir. Watch how this outlashing is not strung out to minutes. It's a matter of seconds, the point is made.

FORCE LIGHTNING:
Eventually, Luke spares Vader. Luke states: "I'm a jedi.", again no threats from the emperor, just acknowledges the fact: "As you wish, jedi." And then, he tells Luke how puny he is. And shows him.
Unfortunately, the climax that these force lightings represent don't come across anymore because they have become common through the videogames, not to say Ep. II and III where they are used without abandon.

No intent to argue. Just my ramble, really. :-)

Chip Coffin writes...

I figured I'd better separate this into two posts. I just wanted to tell you that I appreciate your comments to Vaevictus Asmadi about the creation of Gargoyles. I personally am a Creationist (Intelligent Design Theorist to be PC *Chuckles*) And I find that very few people actually respect my beliefs and I am very surprised and grateful that you are. I of course know that I'm vastly outnumbered in the fandom, and I know that you are not a creationist, but it means a lot to me that there is someone in Hollywood who acknowledges that there are creationists in their fandoms and haven't writen any "Travel to the Time of The Dinosaurs" stories (Mind you I believe in Dinosaurs, I just don't buy the 65 million years, We creationists call them Dragons)

Gargoyles have wings, and thus were made on day 5, (Putting them before humans on day 6, and thus they are still the first race even to us creationists) Once again, I thank you for respecting my beliefs.

Rock On-Chip

Shadow Wing writes...

Hi Greg, I'm back again.

I've been doing my best to spread the word about Gargoyles - I've told people about the comics, the DVDs, and the Gathering - I've even managed to bring a couple more people into the fandom by loaning them the DVDs - they were hooked from Awakenings.

Since December, I've managed to get the first two issues of the comic - would have gotten the third today, but I couldn't make it to my comic store. Hoping to get it Friday.

I loved the first two issues - and the fact that I already knew the story in them did absolutely nothing to reduce the pleasure I derived from them. I may or may not go into a more detailed review after I get the third ish.

Anyhow, I've spent the past three months watching my DVDs (the Toon Disney airing keeps moving to less and less convenient time slots, and on some level, I wonder if they're TRYING to get bad ratings for it), and have come up with a few questions/comments - but I don't want anything to be dropped from Ask Greg, so they won't be submitted now.

I'm trying like mad to make it to The Gathering this year - Pigeon Forge is the closest it's ever been, and I don't know how long before it comes close enough for me to attend again (limited budget, can't afford air fare). If I can make it, I hope to see you there.