A Station Eight Fan Web Site

Gargoyles

The Phoenix Gate

Comment Room

This Week's Comments

Post A Comment : Hide Images

Congratulations, Matt!
Greg Bishansky - [Sorrows to the Stones]

The Joan of Arc idea is one of two "creativity demons" I've had about Demona's centuries of wandering between 1057 and 1994.

In the other one, I imagined Demona initially delighted when the Black Death strikes Europe in the 14th century, thinking that that'll wipe out the humans. Then, to her disappointment, while it exacts a heavy toll on the population, it doesn't kill everyone; the humans survive, though in reduced numbers. Demona is disgusted - "It only wiped out about a third of them! Some great mortality!" - and decides that she can't count on the plague to do away with the human race on its own. Which implants the seed that will eventually grow into her "Hunter's Moon" scheme. (Since the earliest known step in that plot was her stealing the Medici Tablet in 1495, about a hundred and fifty years after the Black Death first swept through Europe, I think it's a feasible speculation.)

Todd Jensen
Hufflepuffs are really good finders

Autocorrect sucks. And for some reason, my phone wouldn't let me change it. Anyway, I meant Asner obviously.
Spen

Congrats Matt! I was planning to ask something that I hoped would drag you back in here. Maybe next week.

And happy birthday to Ed Asher!

Spen

Matt: Many happy returns! Wishing you and your husband nothing but the best. Are you planning to honeymoon?

Todd: The Puella Magi Madoka Magica franchise played a similar tact in its spinoff manga "Tart Magica," which follows up from the show's revelation in episode 11 that [SPOILER] many historical female figures, including Joan of Arc, Cleopatra, Himiko, and Anne Frank, also made Contracts with the alien entity Kyubey to become Magical Girls, and that their Wishes to attain that magic drastically affected the march of history. The manga follows Joan as a young Magical Girl, who - having no idea what an extraterrestrial is - assumes Kyubey is some kind of messenger from God. [/SPOILER]

Also, while it's almost over...a very happy birthday to the voice of our favorite television-watching Old Soldier! Ed Asner turned a ripe 88 today.

Masterdramon - [kmc12009 at mymail dot pomona dot edu]
"Only I can live forever." - Lord Voldemort

ALGERNON - Yes, I've suspected that Shakespeare gave Joan the negative slant he did because his fellow Englishmen were still sore at her for helping turn the tide of the Hundred Years' War against them - though unlike Shakespeare's depiction of Macbeth, that portrait didn't remain the familiar one. (It probably is responsible, though, for "Henry VI Part One" not being one of the more frequently-performed plays - that and it being one of the beginner works.)

I still couldn't resist that speculation, particularly since Greg Weisman once said that Demona might have been in France during the Joan of Arc period, though he wasn't sure on the details, and didn't even mention whether they crossed paths.

Todd Jensen
Hufflepuffs are really good finders

BRAINIAC> Why must you hurt me?
Algernon
I guard your death

Matt> Congrats from me as well.

Algernon> Knowing how to write for his audience is part and parcel of why he stands alone. In other words, there's no such thing...wait for it...as Billy Shakes' peer.

<grins evilly at the large amount of groaning>

Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!

MATT: Congrazt to yourself and the lucky groom, Matt!

TODD: An intriguing theory, I certainly wouldn't be surprised if Demona and Jeanne had crossed paths at some point. Though I suspect her depiction in Henry VI, Part I is another case of "Macbeth Syndrome". Billy Shakes was writing for a mainly English Protestant audience who might not have taken kindly to an overly sympathetic portrayal of a Catholic Saint and French War Hero.

Algernon
I guard your death

Congratulations, Matt! :D

Oh, and Ninth!

Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible, I hope it lasts" -- Willy Wonka

Congratulations Matt!
Matthew
Muscles fade and the mind dulls.But as long as the heart is willing, strength remains.

Congratulations, Matt!
Todd Jensen
Hufflepuffs are really good finders

Sorry for being a bit MIA lately.

I got married a few days ago!

Matt - [Saint Charles, Missouri, USA]
"For SCIENCE, which, as my associate Fang indicated, must move ever forward." - Sevarius

A few years ago (I forget the exact year, but it was around Christmas, and after the "Bad Guys" trade paperback came out), I wrote a play-by-play analysis of how each of Shakespeare's plays might fit into the Gargoyles Universe. It should be still in the comment room archives.

ALGERNON - My "creativity demon" about Joan of Arc in the Gargoyles Universe - which I think could be too controversial for an official "Gargoyles" story - was that Demona manipulated Joan into going to help the French, using what Joan mistook for heavenly voices; presumably, she found the English invasion of France detrimental to one of her plans, and wanted them driven out. (This was inspired by Shakespeare's take on Joan in "Henry VI Part One" as being a tool for demons from Hell - though they then abandon her, leading to her capture and burning at the stake. In this scenario, Demona would likewise abandon Joan, believing that the girl was no longer necessary for her.)

Your mention of Gilles de Rais reminded me of an old historical novel I read many years ago, "The Black Douglas", which blended Gilles (including some mentions of his having known Joan) with 15th century Scottish history (the Black Dinner - advisors to the young King of Scotland, jealous of the head of the Douglas family, manipulate the king into having the Douglas and his younger brother arrested on trumped-up charges of treason and executed). It influenced Tolkien's Warg scenes in "The Hobbit" and "The Lord of the Rings", incidentally, by his own admission (in one scene in the book, some of the characters have a clash with a pack of werewolves working for Gilles).

PAUL - Given Greg Weisman's statement that "Tamora, Queen of the Goths" would make a great name for a "Gargoyles" character, I wouldn't be surprised if he did have plans to adapt elements of "Titus Andronicus" someday - though, as you point out, much of the play's content would never make it past Standards and Practices.

Todd Jensen
Hufflepuffs are really good finders

The mutilation and cannibalism in "Titus Andronicus" would have been tough to put into a kid-friendly show like Gargoyles, although Bad Guys did manage to use some pretty kid-unfriendly things too. (Nothing as grotesque as mutilation or cannibalism, though.)

Then again, Titus Andronicus is also about how the cycle of revenge is destructive to everyone, which is a recurring theme in Gargoyles (especially in Hunter's Moon). There's probably room in the Gargoyles canon for a story about a Quarryman named Titus and a gargoyle named Tamora (or vice versa) if Greg wants to write such a story.

Paul - [nampahcfluap at yahoo dot com]

All Lucky Sevens!
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!

TODD> I actually did write a fanfic that touched indirectly on Joan's role in the Gargverse a while back, via her rather... colourful comrade in arms Gille de Rais.

I'd be curious to see where our thoughts converge/diverge?

Algernon
I guard your death

Some of Shakespeare's plays strike me as a challenge to work into "Gargoyles", unless through quotes or namesakes.

"The Tempest" I can see getting in easily, thanks to Prospero, Ariel, and Caliban, and Greg's indeed mentioned that he sees all three as still around in the present-day Gargoyles Universe. Others, such as the relatively little-known "Henry VI" plays which Shakespeare wrote at the start of his career, not so easily (though the first one includes Joan of Arc - in an astonishingly negative light - and I've had a speculation about her in the Gargoyles Universe, though one which might be too controversial to get into the series).

Todd Jensen
Hufflepuffs are really good finders

Given enough episodes (keep in mind, in some alternate universe the show is in its 24th season), I would say that virtually every Shakespeare play would have been used in some way by now.
Spen

Something something, plead the fifth.
Matthew
Muscles fade and the mind dulls.But as long as the heart is willing, strength remains.

Fourth.

SPEN - You're welcome. (It's not the first time I've seen that spelling error; Don Rosa also used "Prestor John" in one of his Scrooge McDuck stories, which had Scrooge, Donald, and Donald's nephews searching for Xanadu.)

Another modern legend that I think would fit well into "Gargoyles", and which I forgot to mention last week, is the "Curse of the Scottish Play"; given the role that Macbeth and the Weird Sisters have played in "Gargoyles", that superstition will have to surface at some point. (The "Weird Macbeth" idea would have fitted it.)

Todd Jensen
Hufflepuffs are really good finders

Third! Thanks for the correction, Todd.
Spen

2!
Paul - [nampahcfluap at yahoo dot com]

#1 with a bullet but still first over all!
Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]