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Phil writes...
Another little ramble.
The last page of the Gargoyles 2198 proposal is more about the business side of the show. You wrote that WB has DC and Marvel is piecing out its characters; Disney has nothing to compete, "but Gargoyles was designed to be that competition."
I've been thinking about that statement and it does seem odd to me that Gargoyles is one of the few properties that Disney isn't taking full advantage of. Their animated features have be released and re-released on video and it seems that every new release is followed relatively quickly by a direct-to-video sequel and/or an animated series. They're even giving the sequel treatment to classics like Lady and the Tramp and Cinderella.
I wonder what it is about Gargoyles that prevents Disney from giving it similar treatment.
Greg responds...
Well, you don't see Darkwing getting that treatment either.
There generally hasn't been as much support for believing in their tv properties.
Also, I think they still, STILL, don't quite no what to make of or do with Gargoyles.
Do I believe they are missing a bet? Absolutely. But the climate to change their minds hasn't surfaced yet.
Phil writes...
So here's a G2198 question relating to my prize:
The cover page says "CGI Series Proposal - 9/21/00". I assume you actually submitted it to the powers that be. What kind of response did you get? (Yes, No, Maybe, Needs more work, Not right now?)
Greg responds...
I never submitted it.
I was working with some guys to put a CGI presentation together by G2001. That never happened. And during the time we were working on it, it became clear to me that the time wasn't right at Disney.
In any event, the version you received would have gone through at least one more revision before being pitched. I would have cut stuff out of the proposal to simplify things for the execs. It wouldn't have changed the end product at all, but I've learned that less is more in a pitch. For starters, I'd have cut all the info on clans. That was written to clarify things for me. But it's extraneous information at this early stage.
Kelly L Creighton/Kya White Sapphire writes...
1. there is a big difference in the styles of gargs the animation and gargs the comic. notice that the animated gargs have solid hands and feet, with hardened toes and fingers, and in the comics they actually have CLAWS. i can attribute this to the fact that the comic version would be much harder to animate. so, ignoring the out-of-universe explination, which do you prefer, the animated style or the comic style?
my personal opinion- i prefer the animated style. maybe because it came first. maybe because it separates gargs from humans more. maybe because its easier to draw. *shrug*
2. we havent seen them, again because of the obvious irritation in trying to animate them, but do you imagien that theyre are striped and spotted gargoyles? (okay, before I corrected the typos that was stripped and spitted. lol)
Greg responds...
1. Prefer animated versions for obvious reasons. Nevertheless, it was little old me that encouraged the comic company (among other licensees) to do their own interpretations of the characters. What works in animation visually, doesn't necessarily make for the best, well, whatever. Plus you want to give artists a measure of freedom.
2. Not ruling it out.
Anonymous writes...
What legends inspired you to put a clan there?
Greg responds...
Korean legends related to me by Frank Paur.
The Souldier writes...
Was there a one-liner you wanted to have in Gargoyles, but it just wouldn't find it's way in? Something like getting Owen to say Jalapena.
Greg responds...
Not that I can think of off-hand.
Shan writes...
The "Lighthouse in the Sea of Time" episode just finished and I realized there might be an error in how Jeffrey Robbins' dog is portrayed. I did temp work for a while at the Braille Institute here in Los Angeles (about six weeks in three departments) and I seem to recall that you're not supposed to get friendly with/pet the dogs, and likewise guide dogs are trained not to do so with humans (at least outside of their owner). It distracts them from doing their duty. While Jeffrey's dog might have reacted favorably upon seeing Hudson the second time, the dog actually licking Hudson I believe is not correct. Do you know if any research was done into this aspect of the episode that could prove me wrong? It's been several years since I worked at the Braille Institute, though of course it's been a few years since the show too...
Greg responds...
There may have been research done. I can't recall. Or I may not have been aware in the first place. But by the time a script goes through board artists and animators etc, whatever research is done may not still be reflected in the visuals.
Having said that, I'm not trying to blame the artists or the writers. I'm not even sure IF we made a mistake. But if we did -- whoever made it, I'll take responsibility for it.
Kathy Lowe writes...
I really enjoyed the Gathering this year. Many thanks to you and the staff for getting all the guest panelists.
My husband is a rather shy type; he thought the following question during the production seminar, but didn't even tell me until several days after the Gathering.
What is the silliest idea you ever had, and what is the silliest idea you ever pitched?
Greg responds...
Pitched? I don't think I ever pitched anything that I didn't legitimately believe would make a good show.
Including a shot of Michael Eisner getting his rug yanked off by one of the "Quarks" in the pitch for that show, might have been the single STUPIDEST thing I ever pitched. (You'll notice we never did make "Quarks".)
As for silly ideas, I get a lot of those. There's this notion about a guy named Vinnie, who....
Lord Sloth writes...
Good evening Mr. Wiesman.
I've seen how the vidio version of Awakening cuts a lot of scenes that were on T.V., but I've also noticed that there were a few things added. Such as, a few very short scenes, like Goliath saying "godspeed" to the trio when they went for the disk (although, they cut more of the latter convorsation, and I don't know if Goliath WOULD say godspeed), I think there were some more small extras to. Some of the sound effects were enhanced as well (for better and for worse). SO, to get to my question. Do you know if the videos for the first season were made differn't from the TV version? Anything differnt, form deleted scenes, to extra scenes, ro better sound, to anything new at all, that would make it worthwhile to purchase or rent? And I'm sorry for wasting you time if you don't have a clue.
Thank you
Greg responds...
I can't tell you whether it's "worthwhile". They are simply different. Two different teams did the editing and the sound effects with two VERY different purposes in mind.
The series version, is in my mind, the true version. Though I was on the team that did the post-production on what became the Video version (though it was not originally created for video, but for a 35mm big screen preview at Walt DisneyWorld).
There is also yet a third version done by a third team (and I don't even KNOW who these people were) that was done for the syndicated movie version.
All might be interesting to view in comparison to each other. I certainly have copies of both of the first two versions. But I can't judge for you whether it's interesting enough to be worth your money.
Gabriel writes...
Hi Greg,
I was just watching "High Noon" and noticed that when Lex is plugged in to Coldstone (in Act 1),in the midst of all the computer language, the word "Othello" appears followed by other words I couldn't catch. Just out of curiosity, was this supposed to be some sort of inside joke or a referance to anything in particular? I know that's supposed to be his name, but I was just wanted to know the motivation behind it. Thanks.
Greg responds...
Yes, inside joke by the animators.
Blaise writes...
Hi again!
This question actually deals with the credits listing of the series (yeah, I know it seems I have too much time on my hands, but that's beside the point).
Two things about GARGOYLES' credits stood out. The first you already talked about--the writers recieving credit at the beginning of episodes during the first season. The second however I also found to be quite interesting--GARGOYLES actually gave a true cast list. Usually in these Disney shows, when the credits say, "With the Voice Talents of..." they just lump the actors' names together without telling who they played. GARGOYLES was the first Disney animated series I know of (BUZZ LIGHTYEAR did it later) that actually listed both the actors and the characters they played. This enabled me to (when I started taping the episodes and could hit pause) more fully discover just how diverse and talented this cast was. I could recognize names and see if a person played multiple roles, and I was quite pleased.
So...
1) Is there any story behind this, like there was for giving the writers' credit up front?
2) Whatever the case, I'm glad I could know who played who.
Thanks!
Greg responds...
I don't know if this would qualify as a story, but I liked how Batman the animated series listed who played who. It seemed to show more respect for the actors (and as I was a fan of Batman) more respect for the fans who might be VCRing the thing and want to know.
So we followed their lead. And I'm glad we did. I tried to talk SONY into doing that for Starship and/or Max Steel, but they weren't interested.
Lady Leto writes...
First of all, I just wanted to say that I love Gargoyles and would like to thank you for sharing your idea with us.
I was watching the episode; 'Vendetta' and I couldn't believe Vinnie. I am very curious to find know, how did you think of this character?
Thanks for your time.
Greg responds...
A combination of factors went into the creation of Vinnie.
In no particular order:
1) We asked Jeff Bennett to play the role of a dumb Gen-U-Tech security guard. He put on this great Vinnie Barbarino voice (from Welcome Back, Kotter). It was hilarious.
2) I had this idea to do an episode about the nameless schlub that the gargoyles had effected without ever knowing it.
3) Brynne Chandler had this idea about Goliath getting a pie in the face.
4) I had a separate idea about Wolf and Hakon teaming up to get vengeance on Goliath.
It all just came together. Strangely. The episode was supposed to be a comedic change of pace from the rest of the series. I don't think the animation supported the comedy very well. But it was the first episode I ever voice directed, so I'm fond of it.
DISAPPOINTING NEWS...
On Friday the 13th, July 2001, the staff and etc. of Disney's Team Atlantis was informed that the series was being scrapped. Being a freelance Voice Director, I wasn't at the meeting, but I've been told that the company is disappointed with the box office of the Atlantis film and have decided not to spend additional monies on a series.
(There may still be a direct to video sequel. That had not been decided as of Friday.)
So basically we're all unemployed and all the work that we did up to this point just gets tossed into a file cabinet. WHOOPIE!
On the plus side, as long as I continue to be involved with killed projects we will never lack for Radio Play materials at future Gatherings.
Jim R. writes...
1. In "Journey" you introduced John Castaway. Would he be involved in any way, in any of your spinoffs? The reason I ask is, I know he won't be alive in 2198. (Maybe his great grandson or some relative) But other than 2198 are you planning anything more with him?
2. Since I know you only worked on one episode of TGC, would you personally (should your spinoffs come back to TV) ignore what has taken place in the remaining episodes of the TGC seeing how you were not involved in their creation? Or were some of the TGC episodes ideas yours which you were planning before your contract ran out? I don't think some episodes can be completely ignored. However I hated that in TGC, they killed off the clones. What is your take on this?
3. By the way, since the Gathering 2001 is over, may I ask if there was any petitioning done to jumpstart Gargoyles and make it TV-borne again? If so, how'd it go?
Greg responds...
1. Yes.
2. I've answered this before too. My current thinking, which is not etched in stone, is to ignore what I don't consider canon. Enough time has passed and any new episodes would need to stand on their own two feet anyway. If anyone's confused about contradictions between TGC and the new stuff, they can check out the internet site that we will have to clarify all this stuff.
3. I didn't see any petitions. Feel like starting one? I'd focus on DVD's for now.
Incidentally, your post here should theoretically have been broken up into three posts, since your questions were on three separate topics. I haven't reminded people of that in a while. I ignored the rule breaking this time, but don't make a habit of it.
Lord Sloth writes...
Have you noticed, in "Metamorphesis", when Brooklen is in the ally trying to save Maggie, and a tranquilizer hits him, he shouts "Argk" or something, but it sounds quite a lot like "Fuck". I think there is an other instant in Gargoyles where this happens. So I was wondering if you or anyone else had noticed it and if there were any problems or conflects in releasing it.
Greg responds...
I have not noticed that. Neither did anyone else at Disney or it would have been corrected. Is it at all possible, my Lord, that you have a dirty mind?
Lord Sloth writes...
I was wondering, in making Gargoyles, was there some rule that you were not aloud to show someone getting getting fataly stabed? Though there is much use of swords, when someone dies, it is almost always from falling from high, or (in Broodway's case) being shot. I guess it would probably be too graphic, but could you give comfrimation?
Greg responds...
We could not show a stabbing on screen, no. Macbeth got stabbed, but not on camera. We did have a rule about not demonstrating imitatible behavior to children.
Lord Sloth writes...
Why does almost every episode of Gargoyles take place under a full moon? Does every big event just happen to happen every 28 days?
Greg responds...
No. That was artistic license. No other possible explanation.
Steven L. writes...
In general, did you enjoy telling stories that all ages could relate to, or were there times when you felt frustrated that you had a great idea for a more adult story or issue to explore, but couldn't due to the restraints of being a "children's show"? A bit of both?
Greg responds...
I loved what I was doing. I do occasionally have a dirty mind. But I'm happy to fill it with details left off screen. All the themes I wanted to address I could. I did. At least through the first 66. Down the road? Who knows?
Yttrium writes...
Why is the second season so long in comparison to the first and TGC seasons? What I mean is, could you not have you divide up the fifty-two episodes in the second and said they were several seasons, each the size of the first? It makes it sound like a short series when you say it only had two (or three) seasons to it.
---Ytt
Greg responds...
These were business decisions -- not emotional or "how it sounds" decisions.
Initially, Buena Vista only ordered thirteen because Gargoyles and "Action Friday" was an experiment.
Keep in mind that the first season's thirteen episodes represents thirteen weeks of airing the show once a week. That's enough to fill "one quarter" of the year. (52 weeks in a year divided by 4.)
For the second season, they decided that they wanted the series to air FIVE days a week. So multiply 13 weeks by five episodes/week and you get a total of 65 episodes. We had 13 made already. So subtract 13 from that 65 total and you get the second season order of 52.
The third season wasn't produced for syndication. It was aired on ABC's Saturday Morning. And for ABC, it was going to be a bit distinct. (Thus the Goliath Chronicles title and the little sermons Goliath gave at the head of each episode. Neither of which I cared for.) So they started over. Saturday is once a week, so they ordered 13 episodes to cover the 13 week quarter.
Now the obvious question is why 13 weeks? What's so magical about one quarter of the year? Why not 1/8 of the year or 1/2? I don't have a good answer for this, but at that time the conventional wisdom was that kids needed new material in the fall through Christmas. After that, stations could get away with airing reruns.
It's actually gotten worse since. Five-day-a-week series used to be 65 episode orders. Now they've dropped to like 39. It's not so much that conventional wisdom has changed -- rather the economics have gotten so bad, that 39 is the lowest number that networks and studios think they can get away with. Until recently it was forty. Eight weeks of five new episodes a week instead of the old 13 weeks. We did 40 Starship Troopers, for example. (More or less.) But Team Atlantis only ordered 39. There's NO rhyme or reason to that number that I can see other than the fact that it is one less than forty. Thus having mentally adjusted the audience to 40 down from 52 down from 65, they've now chipped one more episode off the total order.
It sucks.
What was your question?
Pyro X writes...
Greg;
1) Approximatly how many drafts of a script were made for each episode?
2) Who wrote most of the episodes?
3) who approved the episodes? Was it you, or you and Michael?
Greg responds...
1. Usually, two real drafts. Exceptions abounded I believe.
2. Lots o' folk. I don't have the list with me. But take a look at the credits.
3. Well, Michael was our only story editor the first season. And one of four the second. He approved all his episodes from his writers. I approved his work. Frank and Dennis and Bob looked on too. And one or more Disney execs had to give the final go ahead. But if you're asking who was ultimately responsible for the writing side of things, that would be me. Blame me for what you don't like, cuz nothing went through without my approval.
Todd Jensen writes...
When you first had Xanatos and Owen mention the Emir in "The Edge", did you know that he'd feature in an episode in a prominent role at that time? Did you when you got to their mention of him in "Double Jeopardy"?
Greg responds...
Edge - No.
DJ - I was beginning to suspect that everything would eventually be used.
Tony Scrima writes...
Hey Mr. Weisman,
I just have one question that I've been thinking about. I know you created Gargoyles back in 1991, but how come it was three years before the series was put on T.V.? Surely it didn't take three years to write, animate, voice record, and edit/censor the first thirteen episodes did it? So what happened? Why'd it take three years from the time you created the series to the time it was put on T.V.?
Greg responds...
We started creating the show in 1991. As a comedy-adventure. (Take a look at the "Original Development File" archive at ASK GREG.)
We failed to sell it to Michael Eisner. Then we tried again as an Action-Drama. We failed to sell it again.
We reworked the pitch and tried a third time. (The show didn't change this time, just the way we pitched it.) Third time was the charm. He bought off on it. And we went into production. But that process took about two years total. (We only got to meet with Eisner once every six months in those days.) That brings us to 1993. We then had ten months to produce the first thirteen episodes (on a sliding schedule). Which takes us to the fall of '94. Which is when we premeired.
(But what are you implying with the word "censor"?)
matt writes...
i have a question about the process of gargs turning to stone, i've noticed that they turn to stone differently at different times. sometimes they convert to stone all at once, sometimes they do this fast and sometimes they do it slowly, and sometimes they turn to stone from the ground up or from one direction to another. my question is, why do they turn to stone different ways? is it because of their mindset at dawn or is it just random? i've noticed that they turn to stone slowly from the ground up when they don't want to turn to stone, like when Goliath and Hudson were returning to Wyvern the night of the massacre, or when Goliath was told Elisa was shot, or when Broadway was caught in midair at dawn. in a way are they trying to to forstall the change to stone and this causes the change to happen in a different way? am i looking at this way too hard, i don't think i am, the stone changing process just seems slower and more "forced" when the gargs are in distress or don't want it to be dawn...
i think thats all i have to say...
Greg responds...
Well, the obvious real world answer is that we're using artistic license all over the damn place.
But in the garg universe, I think you've answered your own question. If they don't want to change, they can fight it for a few seconds. Slow the process a bit. But just a bit.
Demoness writes...
Were all the characters drawn to resemble, in some way, the actors/actresses that voiced them? Like Xanatos and Franks for example.
Greg responds...
No. Or at least largely no.
Xanatos was literally designed years before Jonathan Frakes was cast in the role.
Elisa's basic design didn't change much either, but we did send pictures of Salli Richardson to Mr. Takeuchi, the character designer who was working on her final model in Japan.
The human versions of Goliath, Hudson, Lex, Brooklyn and Broadway were influenced by the actors who played them. But only a bit. We had to stay faithful to the gargoyle base forms.
(handel)Luna Wyvern writes...
Why was Gargoyles canceled off the air?
Will it ever be on ever again?
Can I do something about this situation?
Greg responds...
Start by taking a look at the archives for a good answer.
At this point, I might suggest that the most pragmatic thing people could do is to petition Disney for a DVD release. Politely.
Anonymous writes...
Why is it that you couldn't afford to design the Avalon clan yet you could afford to design Raven's fake clan?
Greg responds...
Can't you see the difference?
Raven's "fake clan" had, what, like three members?
We didn't have the man-hours to design 36 separate gargoyles for Avalon. But we did design some members of the Avalon clan. Angela, Gabriel, Ophelia, Boudicca, at least.
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