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I have a rather...odd question.
I've read that fairies seem to have a problem with the words "thank you". 1. Do you think that's true in the Gargoyle's universe, in the case of say, Puck? If the Gargoyle's world considers him a fairy and not, like, a hobgoblin, maybe he's considered both, I don't know. 2. Would this be something they've grown out of, dismissing it as a human eccentricity or would it still irk them enough to go berserk on the poor well-meaning human? I've always made the half-joke that that's why Puck likes to mess with people. He gives them what they ask for but in a way that makes sure they never make the mistake of thanking him for it.
1. I've seen no indication of that.
A few questions about the Third Race.
1. Did they take anything with them to Avalon, or did they mostly just drop whatever it was that they were doing?
2. Did they take technology with them? Electronics. I mean, I'm sure magic compensates for most actual work they would have to do, but that doesn't mean that a few wouldn't like to take their Game Boy or something with them when they go home. No batteries on Avalon, I'm sure, but they might be able to make it work.
3. Would Oberon ALLOW them to bring technology onto Avalon, or does he consider it foreign magic?
4. I'm guessing that those who were married to humans at the time weren't allowed to bring their spouses along, were there a lot of broken homes made that year? You would think Oberon would make concessions about those things but then Avalon might see a spike in mortal inhabitants.
5. That brings me to another question; Would Oberon see a marriage between one of his race and a mortal as anything of significance? Anyways, I am glad you're still doing this, thank you! ^_^
1. Stuff isn't a big issue for a magical race.
2. Again, I'm not sure that's necessary. But if it pleases you...
3. He doesn't consider technology to be magic - much to his chagrin at times.
4. Oberon isn't big on concessions. But I'm not going to confirm or deny this one. Feels spoilery.
5. It would depend on a lot of factors.
1. Are members of the third race physically stronger than humans or gargoyles?
2. Can members of the third race increase their physical strength by casting spells?
1. Not necessarily. Depends on their form.
Can halflings with a Gargoyle and a Third Race parent have children with humans - or human/Third Race halflings with Gargoyles?
With or without the aid of magic or advanced science?
Did the Hunters ever interacted with any of the Children of Oberon? If so, what's their opnion about them?
SPOILER REQUEST. NO COMMENT.
I would like to make a few questions about The Children of Oberon's weakness: Iron.
1) Why they are vunerable to it to begin with?
2) Is iron COMPLETLY inmune to their magic, or only highly resistent to it?
3) If so, how much iron composition other substances (like Steel) would need to be at least resistent to their magic?
4) If a Children of Oberon turn itself into a creature stronger than an average Gargoyle, would he/she be able to break a iron chain with it's bare hands?
5) If the Children of Oberon can't affect iron with magic, how did Oberon managed to do things like levitating Xanatos' laser-gun, shockwave several robotic gargoyles and melt a lamppost with his bare hands?
1. Maybe because most iron comes from outer space? (Honestly, I don't know. They just are. Like Mon-El's vulnerable to lead.)
2. Iron is immune, but if you can pick up a pair of wood tongs with your magic, you can use the tongs to pick up the iron rod. (Or something like that.)
3. Any iron in an alloy adds resistance, but if you're looking for a numerical value, you've asked the wrong guy.
5. Depends what they are made of. And also look at the answer to question two. A mighty wind is a mighty wind and can blow anything out of it's path. If Oberon can create a wind, it blows.
I noticed in another series of children's books called The Sisters Grimm that the author, Michael Buckley, also had Puck as a main character, only he has the form of a 12 year old and seems to have the mindset of one. He also has a pair of pink insect wings (despite still being a shape-shifter) that he isn't ashamed of at all.
He's written in a way that makes me believe he could have been your version of Puck at a younger age, though he is considered in that series to be the literal child of Oberon and Titania (Oberon's children, haha).
What's more is that King Oberon and Queen Titania live in Manhatten, New York City. I can't help but wonder if there's some of the Gargoyle show's influence at work here.
1. Were you aware of this series and its similarities?
2. Did you ever exchange words with Michael Buckley?
3. Do you think it's possible he watched your show, Gargoyles, or more likely that it was a coincidence?
3. I have no idea.
Your rendition of Puck really rekindled an interest of fairy lore in me, especially since I love tricksters and their amoral personalities that make them so complex. I love how you never know if they'll do something 'good' or 'bad' to someone else simply on a whim, and you portrayed that so well.
I read a previous answer of yours to someone else that said you didn't want to label Puck, Oberon, and Titania as 'faeries' because of the pejorative connotations that the word has. I realize and empathize with you about how fairies are often thought of as nothing more than pretty little girls with butterfly wings or something to that effect, who wave magic wands to grant wishes and always do good. Makes me sick.
1. Is that why you didn't have Puck, Oberon and Titania portrayed with fairy wings despite their status in their original play?
2. If so, why bother to have Puck fly around at all, let alone with fairy dust trailing behind him?
There's a show I recently learned of called Durarara!! in which a Dullahan (technically a sort of fairy) comes to Tokyo to find her missing head, taking the form of a black-wearing motorcyclist and transferring her headless horse's spirit into a pitch black motobike. To hide the fact she has no head, she wears a full helmet and tries to blend in with the city, acting as a transporter and courier for gangs and info brokers, forcing fans to reconsider their initial mental image of a typical fairy.
I think if you had recognized that Puck and the others were Fae, it just might have saved the Fae's tainted, modern day reputation, considering how well-known and admired the Gargoyles show is. However, I understand respect the choices you made, and it was pretty much obvious who they were in the long run.
1. "Despite"? Most of the versions I've seen are wingless.
2. Uh... it looked cool?
I don't recall saying no to the words "faery", "fairy" or "fae" because of perjorative connotations. I think the point I was making is that Oberon and Titania were "larger" than that. The Children of Oberon include those creatures traditionally associated with the "fae" but also various pantheons, etc.
1. If a Child of Oberon were to be imprisoned in a cell, box, room, or cage of iron, what effect might it have on them (if they can even be contained in one)?
2. Would that depend on the length of time they were imprisoned in such a cell?
3. Could they die from it, or only be weakened by it?
4.Does it physically pain them?
1. Guess we'll have to wait and see.
2. See above.
3. See above.
4. See above.
Hi first time questioner, long time fan so here we gp
1)Does Titania still have feelings for Renard?
2)When Oberon sent all of the third race into the human world to learn humailty, what he was he doing for that time. Was he in the human world aswell?
3)Oberon said that they golaith could have killed him with the iron bell. If he had died what would have become of his children?(so to speak)
1. Feelings, yes. Romantic feelings - not much.
3. They'd probably become Titania's Children for the short term. Beyond that, I'm not to big on hypotheticals.
Can Oberon's children eat food containing iron, such as meat or spinach?
Let's not get carried away.
What I don't get is that if Oberan commanded them (his children) toï»¿ not interfere in human affairs why are so many of them interested in carving out their own little dominion across Earth? That just never really clicked in my head...
The "don't interfere" doctrine came LONG after they carved out their dominions, as you put it. It's relatively recent. (Just over a thousand years ago.)
I've got a Third Race question I've been mulling over. Now obviously a lot of the Children are drawn from the gods and supernatural beings of various world mythologies. But since you established that many of them have adapted mortal identities over the centuries, particularly during the 1001 year exile from Avalon, did any of them take mortal identities we might recognise from conventional history books?
Any of them? Sure.
I don't quite understand the Gathering; was it a family reunion meant to last a few centuries before letting all the Children go back to the real world, a chance forï»¿ everyone to worship their Lord, or did everyone have to go back to Avalon and stay forever?
Initially, it was a return for a reassessment. The result of that is yet to come.
I have a question for you about the half-mortal, half-Third Race hybrids. I know that the Children of Oberon cannot use their magic directly on iron. But can half-mortal hybrids use Third Race magic to directly affect iron?
No. Unless they're using mortal magic.
You say that Titania as Anastasia, like Puck as Owen, is completely human. Does that mean Fox being half Fae was planned choice? Does conceiving a half Fae child requiring choosing to only appear human rather than be human for a change?
Fair question. It's worth discussing. But I don't have a hard, fast answer now.
I just re-read The Moorchild by Eloise McGraw. It's a book I mentioned in a much earlier question to you, one about a changeling girl who is half human and half fae, and the weirdness and difficulty she has fitting in with either because she is different from both species. (It's even set in medieval Scotland.) It prompted me to ask you how different or similar, emotionally and psychologically, the Third Race are to humans, because the depiction in this book is of quite inhuman fae who really can't relate to humans. You have consistently answered that the Third Race are quite similar to humans, emotionally and psychologically -- that the main difference is that of great power without great responsibility, of never growing old or having to work, and of being able to look however they want on a whim. You've even said that a human could imagine what it is like to be such a being by imagining what life for one of us would be like with those benefits.
Reading The Moorchild again got me to wondering about what it is like growing up as a hybrid (in a family of non-hybrids), or as a non-hybrid changeling raised by another species, in the Gargoyles universe. The personality differences don't seem nearly as pronounced between humans and Third Race as they are between humans and fae in The Moorchild, so it seems like fewer problems should arise, although physically there seems to be quite a lot of difference between mortals and the Children even when they look human. Clearly a half-mortal child like Fox can grow up without ever figuring it out, or learning magic. But did she ever feel different from the mortal children around her? Did other humans notice anything different about her? Or was there nothing really out of the ordinary, no noticeable outward signs of her magical heritage?
And what about Morgan le Fay, who according to what you have revealed is a purely Third Race changeling. Was it strange for her to grow up among humans? I assume she looked human, but did she feel human, or did she feel different from those around her? Did she seem unusual to her human parents and siblings, or did they never really notice anything out of the ordinary, personality-wise or physically? Did she just seem like a regular human being to them?
As for Nimue, well, she can't have helped but notice she was different, not having the same nearly-effortless magical abilities and shapechanging that the Third Race have. That and not being made of pure magic, along with whatever that entails.
I imagine a slightly different dynamic for the Avalon Clan, since there was no human society around them and they actually outnumbered their foster parents 11-to-1, but I'm sure that was at least somewhat weird, especially for the humans.
I guess if the question is: "Did they feel different?" then the answer is a resounding "YES!". Because, I'm pretty sure I'm not a magical hybrid and I felt different. Doesn't everyone?
alright greg! we know oberon had two halfling sons, but he also had a son and a daughter with titania. who are they?
are they at the gathering?
can they leave like there parents can?
and what magic are they capable of together and/or separate?
please accept this fans should really know.
I don't accept that I have ANY obligation to reveal my future plans. I only EVER do it on a whim, and the last sentence of your post doesn't exactly inspire whimsy. More like... teeth-grinding.
Thanks for clarifying the feudal society of the Third Race.
Given this feudal arrangement, where does that put the Weird sisters? They are the Norns of the Norse, but also the Greek and Roman Fates, Furies, and Graces. Does that mean they're part of the Aesir? Or part of the Greek gods?
They're part of nearly every pantheon, in a sense. But really they're not part of any. They report directly to Oberon.
I have a question about Anubis.
Anubis is a death god, is strongly connected to death, and apparently has power over death (whether or not he chooses to use that power). But is he able to use magic that is not connected to death? Is he limited to only using and reversing the effects of "death magic," or can he mostly do anything he wants, magically speaking?
He's still one of the Children. Power isn't infinite, as we've seen. But he has options.
From watching The Gathering and other episodes with the Children of Oberon in it, and from your reveals on s8, it appears to me that the Third Race have a feudal-like system, with Oberon as the high king (more or less), and others as his subjects or vassals. I think you have said that there are various "subsets," such as the Aesir and the Egyptian gods.
Do these "subsets" or "pantheons" have any political or social reality in Third Race society? What I mean is, are they just convenient catagories for mortals to refer to this or that Child of Oberon as belonging to a mythological category, or are they actual groups who associate(d) with one another as such, who have something political, social, or cultural in common with one another?
Yes, it's a FEUDAL system. Odin reports to Oberon, but the Aesir report to Odin. And etc.
1. Do the Third Race as a whole view Oberon as their most powerful member, or do they follow him for other reasons (royal bloodline, his overthrowing of Mab, etc.) Are there any who might stand a chance of overthrowing him, or would even want to?
2. Is Oberon regarded as a tyrant by his subjects? Obviously neither Puck nor Banshee wanted to go to the Gathering, but what is more general opinion of Oberon's rule?
3. Several of the Third Race are venerated as gods by mortals (such as Anubis and Odin), while Oberon himself, so far as I'm aware, has never been the object of a major religion. Is he at all irritaded by this, or would he even care?
1. Probably all of the above.
2. Nah, I think generally most are loyal to him and believe he's ruled relatively wisely. Although, "relatively" may be the key word, as their previous ruler was Mab.
I've looked all over the archives and I did not find an answer to this. Once, somebody asked you why Anansi chose to be so big and ungainly, presumably since this form gave him trouble when fighting the gargoyles in "Mark of the Panther." You answered: << He ate a lot and gloried in it, I guess. And changing may not be as easy as you make it sound.>> Reading that, I realized that it has never been established explicitly whether shapeshifting is something that all of the Third Race can do. Anansi himself does shapeshift later, but only after getting stabbed. If it was very easy for him to change into a tiny form and run away, I would expect him to do that once pleading and offering bribes didn't work, instead of sitting there and getting stabbed.
Here's the original question: http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=3095
So are all of the Third Race able to shapeshift, or just some or most of them?
Are all of them able to assume mortal forms (like Owen), or can just some or most of them do this?
And are they all equally good/skilled/versatile at shapeshifting?
1. I don't want to make blanket statements, but most can.
The question in the last queue about whether Fox and David can vote after getting out of prison, and my own thoughts about the Third Race and Oberon's Law against interfering with mortals, has led me to this question: What does the Law of Oberon prevent and what does it allow, in terms of Oberon's Children participating in human politics? Do Anastasia Renard and Owen Burnett have U.S. citizenship, or if not could they get it if they wanted it? Can they vote? Can they get any more politically active than voting? (Leaving aside whether they actually want to do any of these things.)
My I-won't-be-held-to-this answer for the moment is that as long as they are living AS humans, they can PARTICIPATE in human affairs. They can eat lunch with other humans. They can see movies made by humans. They can conduct business with humans, and so, it follows, they can vote as humans vote... as long as they're not using magic to alter things.
I still don't have time to write out my thoughts about Bad Guys, let alone watch and read the Gargoyles medieval flashbacks marathon like I planned. They'll probably have to wait until graduation and winter break. But I still have so many other questions I want to ask you about Gargoyles!
I wonder often about the Third Race in the Gargoyles universe. You have revealed a lot of information about the gargoyles, since obviously they are the focus of the whole series, and less about the Third Race. I wonder how similar to or different from mortals they are, psychologically. The Third Race include the gods of various polytheistic religions, and at least in Greek, Norse, and Egyptian myths, gods are depicted as having pretty human psychology, and the same emotions as human beings. They are also depicted as having cultures very similar to their worshippers. Of course, myths were created by mortals and "few things are accurate." The Third Race also includes beings like the Fair Folk and/or the Fae. In fiction that I have read about Faerie folk, they aren't often depicted as psychologically similar to human beings. For example, in the book "The Moorchild", the Faeries (called Moorfolk) seem quite different from human beings. They raise their children communally, and also seem to entirely lack the emotions of love and hate. They don't even seem to form any emotional ties to one another, perhaps not even what humans would necessarily call friendship. The book convincingly and successfully depicts beings that are, in some ways, very alien from human beings. Other depictions (like in the table-top role-playing game Exalted) make the Fair Folk even more alien.
In the Gargoyles show and comics, gargoyles clearly have a similar psychology to humans: although they have some differences which make them more than just humans with wings, they're pretty similar to us in most ways. They obviously feel love and hate, for example, and although their family relations are structured differently, it seems pretty clear that they love and care about their children, parents, and siblings. I think in a past response you said that none of the races in the Gargoyles Universe are designed to be all that alien, not even the actual aliens, and that it should be possible to relate to all of them with some effort. So far, as individuals, the depictions of the Third Race make them seem more like the gods of myth, not necessarily following human moral ideas and sometimes being whimsical, but having a mostly human-like psychology. But except for the glimpses of the relationship between Titania and Oberon, and Titania's relationship to her human family (when however she was mostly in a human body, presumably full of human hormones and neurotransmitters) there wasn't a lot of interaction between the Third Race in the show, and obviously their society wasn't the focus.
So the main questions in my mind about this subject are these:
1. Do the Children of Oberon have the same emotional range as human beings, including emotions such as love, hate, shame, compassion, gratitude, jealousy, indignation, etc.?
2. How much detail of their long lives do they remember? Do they generally have better memory than humans, or is their memory only about as good as a human's? Does someone as old as Oberon have only a fuzzy recollection of things that happened 3000 or so years ago, or does he remember 3000 years ago (such as the events of Midsummer Night's Dream) as clearly as he remembers 30 years ago? Humans (and presumably gargoyles) have limited neurons in the brain for forming memories and synapses, and synapses that are not used regularly are trimmed away to make "room" for more useful connections, leading to loss of memories and skills that are less frequently used. But since Children of Oberon are made of pure magic, I don't think they even have neurons.
3. In their long lives, do the Third Race tend to get bored any more or less often than mortals do, or about as often?
2. Better memories for quantity, not necessarily more accurate.
3. If you're talking about frequency, I guess it's about the same -- except that they don't have to WORK for a living, so they have less they NEED to do, which may lead to increased boredom.
I have another question about the New Olympians, halflings, and the Law of Oberon (related to what Random Fan asked about the Law). In the Gathering, Oberon showed that his law is applied and interpreted differently for different halflings. Fox is too human because she has grown up with a mortal life, so the Law applies to her as to a mortal. But Titania has permission to interfere in Alex's life, perhaps because he is newborn and has not yet grown up to be human, but has the potential to be or become something else.
How does Oberon interpret and enforce his law in relation to the New Olympians? Are (or were, before the Gathering) the Third Race permitted to interfere in the lives of New Olympian halflings, or does Oberon view them as mortal and therefore not open to (unsolicited) interference?
The New Olympians ARE mortal.
On the subject of halflings, I have been wondering for a long while how halflings that are part human and part animal (like the New Olympians) are born. My understanding from the archives is that a member of the Third Race can only breed with a mortal by assuming a truly mortal, flesh-and-blood body of the same species as the mortal they want to breed with. If this is correct, how does a mortal, with a Child of Oberon in a truly mortal body of the same species, end up with a child which does not look like the parents? For example, if a human and a Child of Oberon in a completely human body, like Anastasia, had children, how would the children look like anything except normal human beings? Or if a Child of Oberon took on a mortal horse form and mated with a mortal horse, wouldn't the offspring all look like normal horses? For example, how were the first centaurs, or the first minotaurs, born?
Fair questions... maybe they're second generation... since Fox clearly has magical power...
Or maybe you're putting to DEFINING a limit on the Children, given that their powers and abilities are all about loopholes half the time.
It seems the more I read the archives (now that I've discoverd them)the more questions I have. The one that plagues me now is about an answer you gave in response to whether Halflings have to adhere to the no medeling rule.
The rule is magically enforced. Oberon doesn't need to know about you to enforce it. You don't need to know about Oberon to have it enforced. But -- as we've seen -- loopholes abound. The trickier you are the easier it is to find loopholes. Bloodline -- or blood purity, so to speak -- has nothing to do with it.
My qustion then is how doesthe rule affect Halfling human relations? Because I havent heard anything about New Olimpus breaking the rules by becomeing part of the U.N, or An older Alex being a big wig in the 2198 spin off. What are a Halflings limits?
What is the question exactly?
How does joining the U.N. magically interfere with anything?
I have a few questions for you about the Third Race and language. Since the TV show never depicted non-English languages for technical reasons, and Avalon apparently translates in some way when it sends visitors to the mortal world, I do not assume that what sounds like English is necessarily English.
1. What language(s) do the Children of Oberon speak amongst themselves on Avalon? Do they speak a language (or languages) of their own there, or do they speak only human languages?
2. Do the Third Race have any languages of their own?
3. Did the Third Race ever have any languages of their own?
Thank you once again for answering fan questions!
1. All of the above.
Hey, I've been following Ask Greg on and off since 2001. This is only my second post. Just wanted to say I appreciate you sustaining the fanbase.
1) Were halflings like Merlin or The New Olympians invited to go to Oberon's Gathering? I would think that Oberon's determination in attempting to bring Alex meant that The Gathering would not be limited to "full" fae. But I could be wrong. What's the truth, Greg?
1. Case-by-case. (But in general the New Olympians were not included.) Merlin wasn't there either.
What was Oberon's purpose for The Gathering?
It was planned 1001 years ago... to reunite the Children after their banishment.
Has Macbeth had any contact with or even know if the Third Race exist?
Yes and yes.
The Egyptian term "netjer", which a previous commentor says can be translated as "god" actually means "watcher". There is more to this story...
...and you're hiding it from me?
In the past, some posters here have implied that only iron can kill a member of the Third Race. This has never really been confirmed. Yet, when once asked if there were casualties in the war between Mab and Oberon, you said "yes, any war has casualties." If some of the Children of Mab did kill each other in that war, I find it hard to believe they used iron weapons!
So, is iron the only thing that can kill a member of the Third Race?
Hello Mr. Weisman,
I have read through the FAQ and archives and could not find an answer to why the Third Race is called the Children of Oberon or the Children of Mab. Why are they called these things? Is it to show they follow that leader or is it something more? And what would happen to a member of the Third Race who called themselves a Child of Mab while Oberon ruled? Thank you for any consideration you give this question.
It seems fairly straightforward to me, so I think you may be overthinking it. Oberon's the leader -- and a very paternalistic one at that -- so his "people" are referred to as the Children of Oberon (which is NOT to say that he is their literal parent). Before him, Mab was the leader, and they were referred to as the Children of Mab. It doesn't seem likely after so much time that anyone would still mistakenly refer to the Children of Oberon as the Children of Mab, so if it happened, it would probably be a political statement of some kind, and Oberon would deal with that depending on the situation.
Can Oberon's Children breed with Gargoyles?
About the Third Race: You've said that a Child of Oberon can recover from anything, as long as they aren't killed. When Oberon was very nearly killed with the iron harpoon, he recovered in just a matter of minutes, which was quite remarkable. But he's Oberon, he's much more powerful than most of his vassals.
When Anansi was stabbed with the spear and "bled" of some of his magical energy, he appeared to die but escaped by becoming much smaller. How long did it take Anansi to heal or recover? Minutes? Hours? Days? Weeks? I'm not asking for an exact number, of course.
I'm glad you're not asking for an exact number, because my response is "a while". It took a while for him to recover. I hope that's inexact enough.
In your opinion who do you think is more powerful: the Weird Sisters or Puck? I ask because I've noticed that they're the only ones of Oberon's Children who consistantly fight or aid the Gargoyles and I was curious what would happen if they ever came into conflict.
Also Oberon forbid his Children from harming or interfering with humans, did he forbid his Children from fighting amongst themselves? Again I ask cause I wonder why Grandmother didn't fight Raven herself.
Finally, why does Oberon even care what he or his race do to mankind? It's a little suprising that a being so powerful could have compasion for such 'mere mortals'.
I guess I'd guess that the Sisters are more powerful, since at the very least there are three of them. But of course Puck's a trickster, and really the question seems a bit pointless.
Oberon did not forbid the Children from fighting among themselves. But Grandmother wasn't fighting for herself, but for the island. Plus, there's some question as to whether she could have beaten Raven in a straight-up head to head fight. Especially since fighting is clearly NOT her way.
I'm way more powerful than my dogs and cat, but I have a lot of compassion for them, and certainly wouldn't want anyone to harm them.
I have a question regarding child rearing among the fae or Oberon's Children as they call themselves. Human children are generally raised by their biological parents while Gargoyle children are raised by the whole clan. How do the fae raise their young?
There's a lot of cultural inconsistency there, but generally I'd say parents raise children.
While I was looking in the GargWiki for information about the Olympians, I saw that you wanted to know the Ancient Egyptian name for the Egyptian pantheon.
The word which can be translated as "god" is _netcher_ or _netjer_, feminine _netcheret_ or _netjeret_, plural _netcheru_ or _netjeru_. TCH and TJ are just ways to spell the CH sound at the beginning and end of English "church," without confusing it with the German or Greek CH. As with every Ancient Egyptian word, the vowels were never written down, so the vowels in netjer and netjeru are speculatively added to make N-TJ-R and N-TJ-R-W pronounceable.
Netjeru refers to all the deities, including large numbers of minor deities who are servants to the greater deities, and who are often referred to in English as "demons" or "spirits." Netjeru sometimes also include other beings: deified mortals, the _akhu_ or souls of the dead, and divine beings like Ammut and Apophis that were not worshipped. Netjeru can also include the _bau_, which are "manifestations or emanations" send forth from a deity.
I do not know if netjer was also used to refer to gods of other religions, but I'm guessing it was.
What I have told you comes from Richard Wilkinson's "The Complete Gods and Goddesses of Ancient Egypt." In my non-expert opinion this is one of the best books on Egyptian Mythology that I have seen for the non-specialist.
Wow, that's seriously helpful, both the info and the reference book. I'm definitely buying that book! Thanks.
I have a questions about the original Olympians in the Gargoyles universe. I hope you aren't sick of my curiosity about the Third Race, but the links to mythology are my favorite parts of Gargoyles, since I've always loved mythology.
I was looking in the Archives about the New Olympians, and I found two entries that interested me. In 2000, concerning the New Olympians and their ancestors, when asked about those ancestors who were worshipped as gods, you wrote:
"They weren't actually immortal."
Later in 2001, you wrote:
"The ancestors were the "gods and monsters" of legend. Many of whom were known as the Olympian Gods of Ancient Greek and Roman mythology.
Most of them were of the Children."
I'm sure I am misinterpreting your responses, but I find these two seem contradictory. The 2001 response indicates most of them were "of the Children" but the 2000 response seems to me to mean that most of them were not Children of Mab.
1. With regards to the original 12 Olympians, were most of the 12 Olympians Children of Mab, or just some of them? Or were most of the original 12 Olympians hybrids?
Just some of them.
Thank you for taking questions again!
I have been waiting a while to continue this conversation about the Third Race. Honestly I have so many questions that I've been waiting to ask for the longest time, but I have generally held back so I wouldn't flood the queue.
A while ago, I asked you <<"Are Children of Oberon vulnerable to steel, since it contains iron?">>
<<"I think pure iron is what they're MOST vulnerable, but who wants to take chances?">>
I think it makes sense that they're _most_ vulnerable to pure iron (wrought iron). However, it doesn't make sense to me that steel has no effect _at all_, yet this appears to be the case, judging from the ineffective-ness of Hudson's sword in The Gathering, and that spear in Mark of the Panther. Steel is stronger than wrought iron and holds a sharper edge, but chemically there is very little difference between steel and pure iron.
I did some research, and steel (including ancient steel and most modern steel) is 98%-99.5% elemental iron -- almost as pure as wrought iron. Cast iron is actually less pure than steel, it contains less elemental iron. Modern stainless steel is even less pure than cast iron.
It also turns out that all of what is marketed as "wrought iron" today is actually steel.
1. I have a question. Children of Oberon can be seriously harmed by being cut or stabbed with pure iron, but does it harm them just to touch it? Was Puck harmed (even just getting a rash or a minor burn) by having those chains on all night (in the Mirror)? They were touching his skin, but he didn't seem physically uncomfortable, just annoyed at Demona.
I don't think it causes hives, but I suppose it varies from individual to individual.
I reread one of your old postings where you state that fans sometimes call Oberon's Children fey, yet you do not really use this term because you need to do more research on what it means. Fey is one of the ways of saying fairy in french (fairy is a french word) with different ways of it being spelled such as fey, fae, or fairy. You have also stated that Oberon's children were sometimes called Dark Elves yet according to Elves, Wights, and Trolls by Kveldulf Gundarsson, Dark Elves were actually the dead in old Scandinavian religion. We know less about the light elves who were a type of god. However modern mythologists often confuse them with Dwarves (Swart Alfs). Alfs is what the scandinavians called elves before the word was anglecized by the english.
"Swart" means "black". So Swart Alfs would be Dark Elves... so...?
And in any case, I think my point about the fey was that it was NOT my term of choice. It didn't cover ALL that Oberon's Children were.
I've been thinking about the Gathering of the Third Race, and its effect on the various pantheons of the Gargoyles Universe. Once when asked about the afterlife and the Underworlds run by the gods, you wrote:
"My gut reaction, based on Dante as much as anything, is that people go where their souls truly want to go. Since it's voluntary, though not necessarily consciously so, there's no conflict with Oberon's edict."
I find this response interesting, since it allows those religious beliefs to all be true and (fairly) accurate, at the same time.
You've also told us that during the Gathering, the Children of Oberon (with a few exceptions like Puck and Titania) will be mostly confined to Avalon and will have to stay there until the Gathering ends. This raises two questions in my mind.
In various mythologies, the afterlife/underworld is populated by gods who judge and watch over the dead. The Greek myths mention Elysion, Tartaros, and the Kingdom of Hades, and Egyptian mythology mentions the Duat. The Aztec gods have several different afterlife options, such as Mictlan. In your previous response you said that dead mortals can still go to afterlives/underworlds controlled by the Third Race if they give some unconscious assent. But what happened to these afterlife places (or whatever you want to call them) after the Gathering started?
1. Are the Children of Oberon completely forbidden to visit in these underworlds/afterlife places during the Gathering?
2. During the Gathering, are the Children of Oberon completely forbidden to visit Earth or interact with the mortals there?
1. I'm sure Oberon doesn't want his "officers" shirking their responsibilities. Some considerations have probably been made.
2. Largely, yes.
1. I've been wondering about the subject of families for a while.
Humans usually form nuclear families, or extended families, around biological kinship -- biological parents and children, and maybe grandparents, aunts, or uncles. Children generally grow up with their biological siblings, raised by their biological parents, or maybe a grandparent. If adopted, they generally form nuclear families as though they were biological. Many human societies have legal polygamy, while others value monogamy.
Gargoyles usually raise their offspring communally, one entire generation of parents raising a whole rookery generation as a set of siblings. Biological relationships are not important, and each individual has many parents and siblings. Siblings are only those who are the same age. For both species, it appears (except in dysfunctional families) that parents and children tend to bond closely, and individuals bond more or less closely with their siblings. Among gargoyles, mates are usually rookery siblings, they mate for life, and are almost always monogamous.
So far we have not learned anything about Third Race families, and I don't know whether you've thought much yet about how they raise their offspring. But I'm curious to see what you're willing to share about how Third Race parents, offspring, and siblings usually define their relationships to each other, how or whether they emotionally bond, what their (typical) concept of a family is. Does a member of the Third Race only have their two biological parents, or more than two parents, or less than two? Who usually raises them? Do they value monogamy, or is it acceptable/legal for them to have multiple marriages at once (not all partners are marriages)? I'm not looking for individual answers, but just an idea of what is typical or common or average for the Third Race.
2. Short question: Humans kiss and gargoyles stroke each other's head/hair/horns. What is the Third Race equivalent to these behaviors? (I'm guessing that since the Third Race can be humanoid or giant spiders or else have the heads of jackals, etc., that kissing isn't practical.)
1. I'm mostly not going to answer this now, but expect variety.
2. Kissing works often. But there are other options, I'm sure.
Now i noticed and a may be wrong but Titania seemed less effected by iron as did puck then Oberon himself. I was wondering if maybe this was because they are less Allergic to it being his children, and is Titania just less effected in general?
They're not LITERALLY his children. And I'm not sure why you say they were less effected?
Wow, I had no idea Bad Guys was already out. It's been a busy month. But I got a lot of thinking time since I've been on medical leave and I came up with these little gems.
1. OK, in the case of Owen/Puck you've said that Owen is fully human and can't do magic unless he's Puck (as far as I know anyway) and that rule applies to all Faeries. However, Fox is the offspring of Titania as a human and Reynard but she and her son are able to cast spells. I've read a few things about the differences between human and faerie magic but the only times we've seen magic in humans is through an object of some sort i.e. the Grimoire, the Eye of Odin, the Pheonix Gate ect. So what kind of magic do Fox and Alex (and presumely Merlin) use? If human why don't they need an object; if Fairy how?
2. I'm a HUGE fan of Midsummer's Night Dream but there is one thing that has irritaed me even when I was 10 years old. You switched the roles of Titania and Oberon. In the play Oberon was the consort though he was King of the Elves, Titania was the Queen of Fairies. What made you switch their roles?
3. I know you'll hate this question but is Mab plotting the destruction of Titania and Oberon or is she just gonna destroy us all outright?
Thanks for the answers!
1. Mortal sorcery doesn't enter into it. Owen is a mortal construct, able to do no magic except transform into Puck. Fox is half-human/half Child of Oberon. Alex is 3/4 human, 1/4 Child. Merlin is half and half. What isn't clear about this?
2. I've read and seen Midsummer easily 100 times. In what way did I switch their roles? Are you sure you're not allowing your interpretation of the play to influence your interpretation of what we did on the show?
3. I don't hate the question, but I have no intention of answering it at this time.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Tony Dracon steals hi-tech weapon prototypes from Xanatos Enterprises. Elisa is put on the case and confronts Dracon, who later orders Glasses to sell a few of the weapons on the street. Broadway rushes off to see the movie Showdown again and then goes to Elisa's loft for a bite to eat. He accidentally shoots her with her own gun and rushes her to Manhattan General Hospital. He does not return to the castle.
At the behest of Fox, the cybots are reprogrammed by Preston Vogel to sabotage Fortress-2. Goliath and Renard join forces to defeat them and save the ship. In the end, Vogel has a change of heart and assists. Early that morning, Fox confronts Renard, informing her father of her pregnancy. Owen learns from Xanatos that Fox is pregnant and begins making preparations for a possible attack from the Children of Oberon.
I have a few more questions I'm wondering about the Children of Oberon. I'm trying not to ask too many at one time.
1. a. The Children of Oberon are shapeshifters, able to appear any way they want, right? So I'm wondering, why did Odin always have one eye in "Eye of the Storm" (before he got it back) in all forms? The obvious/immediate answer is that in the myths he's one-eyed, so he had to be one-eyed in the show, but what is the reason for that in the Gargoyles Universe? After giving an eye to Mimir, was Odin unable to change shape into a form with two (or more) eyes, or did he just chose not to (that we saw)?
b. In the myths of some cultures (like the Norse) gods can lose body parts, but in some other cultures the myths say gods can't be permanently injured. Is it possible for Children of Oberon to permanently lose body parts (um, until they find them again and reattach them like Odin did), or be injured seriously enough to leave permanent scars? I've gotten the impression they are not flesh and blood -- even when Oberon was stabbed with the iron harpoon, he didn't bleed.
2. a. In the past when asked if the Third Race need food you answered "Yes, depending on their chosen form."
When a Child of Oberon is not in a truly mortal form, does he or she need food? (By "truly mortal form" I mean a mortal flesh-and-blood body like Owen, not just a shape that looks like a human or gargoyle.)
b. When a Child of Oberon is not in a truly mortal form, does he or she need to breathe?
3. When a Child of Oberon takes on a completely mortal body and mates with a mortal of the appropriate species, the offspring is a "halfling." But what happens if two Children of Oberon both take mortal forms of the same species, and then have kids together? What would their offspring be?
And thank you again for answering our questions! It's really great to have this website.
1a. The exchange itself created a mystic restriction.
1b. Rules that cannot be broken can be bent, but they can't be broken. But they can be bent. But not broken. (Get the idea.)
2a. Yes, but I'm not defining what food is for them.
2b. Yes, but I'm not defining what they breathe.
Yay the queue is open! I'm happy you're taking questions again. (and I'm of course excited to get #6, which I'll be ordering asap). I hope you don't mind questions unrelated to reviewing the comic... those Children of Oberon always make me so curious.
1. a. So Ragnarok already occured in the Gargoyles Universe. When did it happen? (If you don't want to give a year or decade, can you please say what century it happened in?)
b. Did any of the gods survive Ragnarok, other than Odin? If some did, who?
2. You've also told us that the war between the Titans and Olympians was a real event in the Gargoyles Universe. What happened to the defeated Titans afterwards? (I don't want to assume it is the same as the myths, or to ask more specifically for fear it would be an idea)
3. When was Oberon born? (If you don't want to give the year or decade, please say what century?)
1a. Yes, it occured, but no I'm not going to hint at a date (even a century) at this time.
1b. Yes, a few others did. But I'm not revealing who at this time. (Though the myths themselves are a good hint.)
2. I'm not answering this at this time.