A Station Eight Fan Web Site
Does Toon Disney show "outfoxed" or "Upgrade"?
As far as I know. But I don't get Toon Disney at my house.
I was just wondering where is the notre dame clan's rookery located, the cathedral basement or is there a rookery already dug underneeth the church.
It doesn't exist yet. Won't exist for almost two centuries.
Dear Mr. Weisman
You said in a ramble that you went to Stanford University. I wanted to know, what kind of high school grades are needed to get accepted. I looked at many internet sites, but couldn't find anything.
Thanks for your time.
Well, I had an A- average way back in 1980 when I applied. But obviously that was over twenty years ago. I can't possibly be the best source of information on this subject.
As noted yesterday, I'm as big a geek -- if not bigger -- than anyone in the room.
So now, for no particular reason, I've put together a countdown of the GREATEST BUFFYVERSE characters from Seasons One & Two.
I thought about doing Season Two separately, as if it stood alone, but that felt artificial. (Like the rest of this feels natural? Yeah, right.) Think of the Buffyverse as an eight year horse race. You're not sure which nag is going to go the distance... But cumulatively, you begin to discover things.
So here's the top 30 characters of the Buffyverse for Seasons One & Two combined. In reverse order...
#30 - The Judge. Medieval demon raised by Spike & Dru to burn the humanity out of, well, humans. Killed by a rocket launcher. (Previous Rank: Did not appear in first season.)
#29 - Mr. Norman Pfister, a.k.a. Worm Guy. One of the assassins hired by Spike to kill Buffy. Could transform his whole body into worms. Stomped by Xander & Cordy. (Previous Rank: Did not appear in first season.)
#28 - Dalton. A relatively brainy vampire flunky, who appeared in a couple of episodes working for Spike & Dru. Burned by the Judge. (Previous Rank: Did not appear in first season.)
#27 - Luke. Still a fairly memorable first opponent for Buffy even a year later. (PR: #14. Okay, he's memorable, but not that memorable, falling 13 rankings with no where to go but down.)
#26 - Harmony Kendall - Made another humorous appearance. (PR: Honorable Mention.)
#25 - Hank Summers. Still, if barely, a part of his daughter's life. (PR: Honorable Mention.)
#24 - Willy. The weasley guy who runs the demon-bar hangout and plays both sides of the fence. (PR: Did not appear in first season.)
#23 - Amy. Back as a full-fledged witch. (PR: Honorable Mention.)
#22 - Ethan Rayne. Giles old chaos-worshipping "friend". (PR: Did not appear in first season.)
#21 - Uncle Enyos, a.k.a. Gypsy Man. Jenny Calendar's vengeance-seeking Gypsy uncle. Killed by Angel. (PR: Did not appear in first season.)
#20 - Jesse. (PR: #13. Drops seven rankings, and counting, as he's been totally forgotten.)
#19 - Jonathan (variously spelled Johnathan and Jonathon, a.k.a. Student and/or Hostage Kid and/or Freshman (which he later turns out not to be, unless he skips a couple grades by the time Buffy graduates). Jonathan with something like 6 appearances but VERY little screen time in each really makes an adorable impression, thus it's not surprising that he winds up playing an increasingly larger role with every year. (PR: Did not appear in first season.)
#18 - Whistler. The demon, played by the always interesting Max Perlich, who helped redeem Angel from the gutter. This guy interested me a LOT, but never (as I recall) returned. I always wondered if Doyle was a reworking of Whistler when they couldn't get Perlich to be a regular on Angel. (PR: Did not appear in first season.)
#17 - Kendra the Vampire Slayer. Came and went. But before you know how interesting Faith can be, she was very cool. (PR: Did not appear in first season.)
#16 - Principal Bob Flutie. (PR: #9. Drops 7 places and being still dead, likely to keep heading south.)
#15 - Darla. Appears in a wonderful flashback, where she sires Angel. (PR: #11. Only drops 4 ranks, and is likely to make a comeback, because death plays much more fast and loose with Darla than with Principal Flutie.)
#14 - The Annointed One. Spike just overwhelmed this guy (and then flambéd him). I suppose it was also a liability to have an eternally youthful child in an ongoing series. It won't take long before a growth spurt changes the kids looks significantly. (PR: #10. Another four rank drop and falling.)
#13 - The Master. Influence still being felt... (PR: #8. Down five rankings.)
#12 - Oz. Becomes Willow's guy after a slow burn. And gets to be a Werewolf to boot. (PR: Did not appear in first season.)
#11 - Jenny Calender, a.k.a. Janna the Gypsy spy. Becomes SO important that Angel has to snap her neck, breaking Giles heart -- and falling into a Buffy/Angel trap that is common to most TV dramas (except Gargoyles) which states that no relationship really has long term potential. (PR: #15. Actually moves up 4 rankings, while most are moving down.)
#10 - Principal Snyder. (PR: #12. Also moving up a bit.)
#9 - Spike, a.k.a. William the Bloody. Enters the list in the top ten.
#8 - Drusilla. This surprised me a bit. Would not have guessed that Dru would beat out Spike. But in their first season, she's actually a tad more important. His villainy culminates in hers. (Of course, both are overshadowed by Angelus) (PR: Did not appear in first season.)
#7 - Joyce Summers. (PR: #7. Holding her spot.)
#6 - Angel, a.k.a. Angelus. Really starts to come into his own here, but missed a couple episodes and Cordy had a headstart from season one. (PR: #6)
#5 - Cordelia Chase. And Cordy also begins to truly come into her own in this season. Evolving out of her funny but one-note stereotype from Season One and beginning a relationship with Xander that I was sorry never got to be played again in Angel (even historically). (PR: #5)
#4 - Willow Rosenberg. Xander's headstart kept him ahead in a season where they had a much more neck-and-neck pointscore. (PR: #4)
#3 - Xander Harris. (PR: #3)
#2 - Rupert Giles. Still a bit surprised how he continues to rank above X&W. (PR: #2)
#1 - Buffy Summers. (PR: #1)
Honorable mention goes to the following (for making one or two memorable appearances):
Catherine . Okay, normally, I'm not going to honorably mention someone in consecutive seasons, but that great scene where Oz is watching the Cheerleading trophy follow him with his eyes, is priceless continuity.
Absalom. Vampire working for the Annointed One trying to raise the Master. The last champion of the Season One storyline. Buffy burns him.
Nurse Greenliegh. Eaten by fishboys. Probably gets extra juice because I like actress Conchatta Ferrell in just about anything.
Ted Buchanon - Psycho Robot Serial Killer. Lots of evil fun. Trashed by Buffy.
Devon - Dopey lead singer of Oz's band.
Inca Mummy Girl, a.k.a. Empada. Poor kid. She just fell apart on us.
Larry. School bully who turns out to be a sensitive gay guy.
Lyle Gorch - Cowboy vampire, barely smarter than his brother.
Chanterelle - Goofy vampire wannabe.
Detective Bob & Detective Stein - Each appeared twice. Bob was Snyder's cop. The one who helped Snyder cover up the macabre doings at the school. Stein was Buffy's vague nemesis. The one who questioned her about Ted's "death" and suspected her of Kendra's. Both are interesting and feel more important than they wind up being.
The Mayor. Doesn't appear at all. But Snyder's both scared of him and desperate to impress him.
And that's it. But Season Three just came in the mail today. It'll obviously take me some time to watch it. But eventually, I'll be continuing this pointless exercise...
Aren't you glad?
Ok who knows what happened, i always tape gargoyles at 11:00 god knows how long ive been trying to get season 2 on tape, everytime i seem to tape it ,something goes wrong and i have to start over now the one time im finally doing ood, havent missed one episode and the poop heads change the time !! i wasnt home that day when it was taping i come home re-wind it and theres some stupid talk dog thats in school, and what makes even more stupid no one knows it a dog. Why was the time changed?, and why did they just skip a lot of the episodes?, and for the most part when are they gonna fix it ?. I doubt that you know the answers to these I don't think they have to tell you that they wanna change the time, so I guess I'll write Toon Disney a letter. But if you do know the answers get back to me ( even know it will be to late by then, owell)
danke for taking your time to read this
Gargoyle Forever !!!
Yeah, I don't know. And by now, I'm sure the sitch has changed again. How'd it work out with that letter?
My son is almost six years old and loves Gargoyles, he stayed up late one night and caught wind of it, that was all it took, a true fan and myself. I tape it everynight 11-midnight, now it's only on 11:30- Midnight. We will be very sad if they take it off the air. My son would like to know if there was ever any toys made from Gargoyles, he despertly would like all the characters.
Once upon a time, both Applause (pvc figures) and Kenner (action figures) made toys. (And a few other random licensees were out there too.)
To find them now, you'd have to check out something like e-bay OR bring you're son to the GATHERING where there are always toys available at the auction! The Gathering is VERY kid friendly. I know because I've taken my kids too. It's been nearly two years, so I'm guessing your son is now almost eight. Mine are 7 and almost 10. I hope both of you are still fans.
Yes, that's right, I'm as big a geek -- if not bigger -- than anyone in the room.
I bought the 1st and 2nd Seasons of BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER on DVD. And I've been watching the episodes. Or studying them actually.
So now, for no particular reason, I've put together a countdown of the GREATEST BUFFYVERSE characters from Season One.
(WHY, you ask? Because it amuses me and appeals to my geeky mind. <Yeesh, what a dopey question.>)
Now, this is a truly subjective (if not pointless) exercise that I've tried to reduce to an objective task. I've awarded points per episode to each character based on a number of criteria. Then I totalled up the points for each character for the season. In case of a tie, I made a subjective call.
I tried NOT to make the point totals reflect what happened with characters in subsequent seasons. This is a countdown reflecting Season One only. Though I won't deny the fact that if a character reappeared later in the series, it probably meant that said character was memorable to the creators (and the viewers) in his or her original appearance(s). So I allowed some bias to filter in. But I tried to be strong.
Most of the results aren't particularly shocking, but a few things surprised me a bit.
Originally, I was just doing this for myself. But I figured, what the heck, might as well share my obssessive behaviour with you poor victims.
So here's the top 15 characters of the Buffyverse for Season One in reverse order...
#15 - Jenny Calender. In season one, she's merely the computer teacher/techno-pagan. But she already seems to have some interest in Giles.
#14 - Luke. The vampire who was the surrogate for the Master's "Harvest" during the 2-part pilot. An impressive first foe, who'd be topped many times over. But he set the bar well. He received the same point total as Jenny, and long-term she's MUCH more important, but in the first season, I think Luke's role was much more crucial.
#13 - Jesse. Jesse was Xander's best friend, who became a vampire in the pilot and was accidentally staked. Jesse would have been more important if anyone had EVER mentioned him again -- even in episode three. It strikes me as a very un-Joss like thing that Jesse completely faded from memory... INSTANTLY.
#12 - Principal Snyder. The new and harsh replacement principal makes an immediate impression.
#11 - Darla. The vampire who served the Master and was revealed as Angel's sire. Jealous, vulnerable, greedy and sweet all rolled into one. She was staked in her third appearance, but it's not surprising she came back both in flashbacks and in ANGEL.
#10 - The Annointed One. Also known as Colin and/or the Boy. This guy was built up to be VERY important in Season One, though he wound up not being important at all.
#9 - Principal Bob Flutie. The conflicted original principal of Sunnydale High. For obvious reasons, adjusted to be MOST sympathetic just before he was eaten by the quartet of Hyena-Avatars.
#8 - The Master. The main recurring villain for Season One. Staked at the end of the season, though his influence would continue into Season Two and beyond. (FYI, one of the DVD extras revealed that his real name was Heinrich Joseph Nest.)
#7 - Joyce Summers. Buffy's mom.
#6 - Angel. Made a pretty big impression in relatively few appearances. Obviously.
#5 - Cordelia Chase.
#4 - Willow Rosenberg.
#3 - Xander Harris. This surprised me. I would have thought that Willow and Xander would have been neck and neck -- impossible to declare as anything but a tie. But at least in Season One, Xander really got more screen time and a much bigger overall role in the series.
#2 - Rupert Giles. This surprised me a bit too, as I would have guessed that Xander & Willow would have both scored ahead of Giles. But nope. Not when you break it down.
#1 - Buffy Summers. Duh.
Honorable mention goes to the following (for making one or two memorable appearances):
Catherine & Amy, mother & daughter witches. Amy obviously will become more important, but Catherine's end, forever imprisoned in the cheerleading trophy, was too cool.
Dr. Gregory. Buffy's biology teacher. Made two appearances before being killed by the She-Mantis. Was the only teacher who believed in Buffy.
The She-Mantis. A fun villain.
Harmony Kendall. Only made two brief appearances, but she stood out enough as one of Cordelia's "Cordettes" that she would wind up being brought back again and again. A certain comic timing, probably.
Hank Summers. Buffy's dad.
Joy. The Senior Cheerleader.
Sid. The human trapped in the body of a ventriloquist's dummy.
That's it. I'll have Season Two shortly. I bet you can't wait.
Why couldn't the Magus make a counter spell for the frozen gargoyles?
The Magus was not great at INVENTING spells. Just at performing them.
If you were on Avalon would you see the Southern Cross?
I haven't given it any thought. What do all of you think?
1.Were you going to introduce more "International Heroes" in Pendragon?
2.What exactly is the purpose of all these heroes?
1. Not per se, but it happens. I had an overall plan for the "International Heroes" however, and Pendragon had a role in that plan.
2. Not going to reveal that yet.
Hello Greg I was just wondering where can I buy the gargoyles DVD?
In stores (or on the internet), later this year.
As soon as I saw the title, I instantly thought of the connection between this legendary figure and our gargs. It's fitting that Max's description of the Golem resonates with Goliath.
Actually, when I saw this, I had not realized that there really was a Rabbi Loew, and that legends had connected him with the Golem. You learn something new from GARGOYLES every time.
I liked a lot of the animation and character work in this episode. Especially the shots of the gargs climbing and gliding. They were very well done.
Brode interested me mostly because of his look (and Clancy Brown's voice). He's given some nice facial expressions and character moments. I don't think he's on a level with Xanatos, but he does seem a bit more competent (sp?) than Dracon--that boy's biggest chance to shine came only at the very beginning of DEADLY FORCE when he knocked down Bruno. Otherwise, Dracon seems to avoid direct confrontations, whereas Brode is far more hands on. And, as has been said, he can think more in the long-term.
Max Loew--another budding hero our travelers meet. Unlike Nick, Max seems to have some belief in ancient legends, and though he is reluctant at first (and voices his doubts) it takes very little prodding from Janus or anyone else for Max to do what must be done. I really like some of his and Janus' exchanges. In terms of character, my favorite is Janus telling Max, "YOU are the Chosen One," with Max responding, "Which doesn't leave me any choice." In terms of comedy, I like Max's "What if it doesn't like me?" to which Janus can't help but smile.
I really wish more could have been done with Janus. He seems like such an interesting character (heck, he seemed even less taken aback by the gargoyles than Max--and even that boy took the whole thing in stride).
I loved the flashback of Prague 400 years ago. That moment where the old man falls down, and then we pan up to see the shadow of the Attacker beating him...that was one of the most chilling moments in this show. Of course, it's undercut by the same old man appearing in relatively good condition later, but still.... And the ceremony of the Golem's Awakening was breathtaking. I loved the scenery with all the candles, and seeing Loew through the Golem's POV. And I pretty much fell in love with the Hebrew incantations. Of course, the rest of the scene has some very anime moments. Not just the pink hair on the woman with the baby, but also some of the facial expressions of the Attackers seem straight out of "Speed Racer" or something. It's somewhat distracting, but not terribly so.
I like how Act 2 begins only with the striking of a match. A nice moment.
Now, for Renard. I was mildly surprised to see Vogel with him, but I didn't think it a real discrepancy. It wasn't too great a stretch of the imagination to think that Renard had forgiven him. What did surprise me was their being in the company of Brode. That, and Renard's "reveal" (hidden in shadows at first before coming into the light) lent a sinsiter nature to his appearance here. One of my friends, who had never seen the show before, had caught a glimpse of this and assumed "the old man" to be the main bad guy or something close. For my own part, I was instantly intrigued. Why would Renard have this dark aura about him?
I knew Goliath would try to get in touch with him, they are friends after all, and was surprised at how curt Renard was with G. I like how Goliath's mouth hangs open for an instant after being rebuffed, and then he broods away.
This episode was the first time I realized Renard had an illness. I had thought before that he was just very old, but with this...it adds even more bitterness to his situation (more than if it had been just a natural aging) and makes his fall more believable. When Renard does become the Golem, he has a very telling moment, where after crowing, "I can walk," he touches the cheek of his human body and quietly murmurs, "I can feel again." That got to me--that he was robbed not only of movement, but of feeling as well. Of course, he abuses his new-found power (and now I finally know the name on the tombstone he knocked over, and as for the car Greg, it is a bit battered, but whole enough for Renard's smashing it to crush in the top and windshield). Still, he seemed to degenerate rather quickly for me. I found his turning back towards the light, so to speak, more natural. But I KNEW that at some point, Renard-Golem would say "It's not my fault"--that just had to be there to show how much he betrayed his ideals. While I may have found his turnaround rather jarring originally, in later viewings, especially this last one, I notice how much Robert Culp is able to do with his voice. He actually portrays the doubt, frustration, fear, everything. His acting goes a long way towards making Renard's changes work. Still, a little more "breathing space" might have helped.
One thing I really thought about just this last time--Renard orders Vogel to guard his human body. Even there, Renard has doubts about being in the Golem.
And I also like Goliath's line about "Giving up all you believe in--for a piece of CLAY!"
For his own part, Vogel seems to have thrown himself even more into the role of "yes-man" than usual (probably to make up for his earlier betrayal). He only comes out of it once when he chastises Goliath (he's got guts, that one).
I had figured that Goliath and the others would have tried to get in contact with Renard or someone to get home eventually, but when Goliath decided to stay the course and finish out going where Avalon sent them to go...I was almost cynically expecting that. Yet, I was not really disappointed--it made sense for everything and everyone up to this point. So I sat back and tried to stop worrying about when they'd get home.
Misc. stuff: When Goliath gets hit by Brode, it's with a stun gun--that looks very much like his regular bullet gun.
One of Brode's goons is the thug from the park in DEADLY FORCE. And the driver of the car that nearly runs into the Golem looks like the guy who tried to buy a gun from Glasses in the same episode, except the guy here has black hair (a second cousin, maybe?).
While on the subject of cars--the guy above was on the left side of the car, driving the right side of the road, whereas Brode was on the right side of the car, driving on the left side of the road. Which is the right one in Prague?
Anyway, while it's not on my "top ten list," I do think this is a pretty cool episode. Of course, only now, after reading your ramble, Greg, do I actually realize the importance of it in regards to the focus of the World Tour. Very nice that.
Unfortunately, I don't remember my ramble. It's been too long. And I'm not too clear on how one drives in Prague either. So I'm feeling a bit useless.
But I did like reading your ramble...
About Nokkar was he by any chance inspired by the Green Lantern Corp which had members stationed all over the galaxy like the N'kai Sentinels?
Well, God knows I've read a lot of Green Lantern comics and even worked on a few at DC. So I can't deny the possibility that the GL Corps was an unconscious influence.
But, no, we did not model the N'kai on the Lanterns. The N'Kai are not interstellar policemen, they are soldiers in an army at war. Nokkar was inspired by largely apocryphal stories of Japanese soldiers on deserted tropical islands cut off from communication who continued to fight World War II long after 1945.
Who is your fav. Gargoyle?
I love them all like children.
I'm not sure if you'll consider this a valid question or not... but, I have been a long time fan, and I am interested in putting together a video collection of the gargoyles cartoons. How many episodes were put out on video? Do you have any suggestions on web sites (not ebay), where one might find new/used copies? I'm sure you've had quite a few requests for this information, and you can tell me to bugger off if you'd like. I appreciate your time, Thanks! :) firstname.lastname@example.org
I'm not going to tell you to bugger off, but since you guessed (correctly) that I received multiple requests for this info, why not check the archives and save yourself the TWO YEAR WAIT.
Anyway, the entire first season was released on video, though I have no idea -- beyond ebay -- how you'd track down those tapes at this point.
And I wouldn't bother as the entire first season will be released on DVD by the end of this year (2004). If that release sells well enough, you can be sure they'll release season two as well.
Hi there, I just wanted to say Gargoyles is my second favorite TV show of all time... and also, at the top of the Ask Greg page it says "Quesions answered archive"
I thought you might want to changed that to "Questions Answered Archie" ;) Just wanted to point that out, thanks.
Gorebash is currently reworking the entire site, so it's probably a moot point. But I'll let him know about the typo. Thanks.
Hi Greg, I just have one question to ask. Do you think there will ever be a chance of Gargoyles being put back on the air. It should be b/c from what I've seen and heared, there are millions of fans out there.Well,gotta go. Re-runs of Gargoyles is showing in a couple of minutes and I don't want to miss out.
See the archives, attend the Gathering and buy the DVD. That's the best I can offer at this point.
Does Toon Disney show the episodes "Outfoxed" or "Upgrade"?
As far as I know.
The funny thing is that I was watching "Golem" this morning, as part of my little custom of rewatching my "Gargoyles" tapes each summer. Which means that it's still fresh in my memory as I'm writing this ramble-reply.
I will confess that I don't have as many observations to make about this episode (beyond the fact that I quite enjoyed it). I'm not much of an expert on the Golem legend (beyond the overall concept) - Airwalker did a splendid job of analyzing the use of the Golem legend in his comments at the comment board - so I can only give some general remarks here.
Brod struck me as more akin to Dracon than to Xanatos, truth to tell (partly because Brod was an open criminal, which Dracon was but Xanatos wasn't). I hadn't even noticed the parallel between the Golem about to kill Brod and Goliath about to kill Xanatos in "Awakening Part One", until you mentioned it.
I hadn't realized the parallel between Elisa and Max, either - though I did pick up on the parallel between the gargoyles and the Golem pretty quickly.
One of my favorite little bits: Bronx nudging himself against Janus, who then scratches Bronx behind the ears.
I liked the development of Renard, including his and Goliath's reversal of roles from "Outfoxed" - and I picked up at once on the significance of his "It's not my fault" line. I was one of those who thought that his change of heart came a little too quickly, but you provide a good explanation for how Goliath convinced him so quickly.
I was quite impressed, by the way, with the dedication that Max Loew showed in firmly speaking to Renard-in-the-Golem's-body, as well as with the Golem when it's about to drop Brod into the pit.
I was also pleased to see that Goliath caught on to the significance of the Avalon World Tour at the end of this episode (definitely making it into a turning point). Obviously, he'd have to catch on soon in order to keep from looking slow.
Not much to say, I'll admit; I do have more comments, though, for "Sanctuary", which is coming up next.
I always thought of Goliath as more the tortoise than the hare in the brains department.
Ramble on Golem.
A great episode this.
On the climbing. I've got to say, my favorite Gargoyle shots are of them climbing. It best shows off how animalistic they are and how beautiful they are. It really drives home the "they aren't human" issue. They're creatures of instinct.
And, BTW, when Angela and Bronx are climbing up the tower, that's a great butt shot on Elisa. Gotta say. Elisa rocks. Strong woman that never gives up, protects her friends, has a sense of humor, and has a great butt.
If she's based off of anybody you know, mind introducing me? :)
Onto the rest of the ramble.
Max and Elisa parallel on that huge issue. They're the heroes beside the heroes. The difference is that Elisa started out that way. It's who she is. Considering who her parents are, it might even be an instinctive trait to her.
Max? Max isn't so lucky as to have Elisa's upbringing. He's probably had to learn that lesson that there are some things that are too powerful for him to overcome. So, he has to overcome that fear just to go into his destiny.
Elisa's learned quite the opposite lesson. Even within the series, she's learned that, even though there's always somebody bigger and stronger than she is, that doesn't really matter.
Renard gone mad. Oh come on, like you wouldn't destroy a few things if you got that kind of power. It's like a new toy. You play with it until you're through.
But, when Renard was through with the euphoria of the new toy, he was left with the cost. And, that was a great face shot of the Golem when Renard realized that he had become something. It also made sense that it was Goliath's words that finally got through.
He might, logically, have known that Elisa and Max were right, but he considered Goliath to be an equal. They both share that daily struggle of integrity. And, it's here where Goliath really repayed Renard for his lesson in Outfoxed, and reminded him of the daily struggle that is integrity.
The final fight sequence was something that struck me. 4 different heroes, 4 different styles. Max, the Golem, Goliath, and Elisa. Each very effective.
The first time I saw this, I saw the golem as a robot and Max as the mind behind it. Telling it what to do and, like a good little drone, it does it. Essentially making Max the mind. But, that scene with Brode over the big pit, last time I saw it, changed my mind. Instead of the golem's mind, the golem has it's own mind even if it is a primitive one, Max is the golem's heart.
If there were future episodes with the golem, I could see Max going through efforts to keep the golem from becoming like the monsters that he fights.
Can't wait for the ramble on "The Hound of Ulster"
Elisa's based on Salli Richardson. She's in the upcoming movie, ANACONDA 2.
Totally agree with your heart/mind assessment, by the way.
Just wanted to let everyone know that Gorebash, Todd & I will be re-opening the Question Submission function for the month of August 2004.
Gore is working on revising the whole site. We're not 100% sure that the new version will be ready by then, but either way, you'll be able to submit questions and rambles from August 1st to August 31st.
I'm going to ask (and pray) that people NOT post frivolously. I'm still over two years behind on answering questions. Try and do your homework just a bit before posting a question. Check the Archives or at least the FAQ. Heck, it wouldn't hurt to pre-post your question at the Station 8 Comment Room. Give your fellow fans a chance to direct you to the answer, before you post it for me. Keep in mind that it will take me a LONG time to get to your questions, so if you can get them answered another way, it'll be MUCH FASTER for all concerned.
But with that caveat in mind, I'm very pleased to be reopening the site to you, if only for one month. In particular, I'm anxious to get as many GATHERING 2004 DIARIES as possible. Seriously, we have close to 200 people attending this year, and my goal is to get at least 100 diaries posted at ASK GREG as an historical record. So please, that's one kind of post that I'm really looking forward to. So don't hesitate.
Crikey, wouldn't have found that 'posting' page if you hadn't taken me straight through. I can answer some of those questions!
ANonymous - WOuld you laugh or smile much when your whole family has been slaughtered and you know you could have prevented it? It's called Guilt, mate, it's the same thing that makes Demona so insane. Mind you, GOliath HAS got a lovely smile when it shows up, I'm sure you're not the only one wishing it showed up more often.
Demona was given her name in City of Stone, the four-parter 1/3 of the way through the three years.
Since Awakening was set in 994, a squiz at the history books will show that the Vikings were out on world conquest around this time, they were attacking every country they could get to. Basically, Greg & Co were kind of taking one viewpoint of a historical event, like HOgan's Heroes focusing on POW camps during WW2.
I'm guessing that all those extra characters in the age list are actually in your stories, hmm GReg? You know how to keep us thinking, that's for sure, mixing up two rather different topics.
Hey, have a great night everyone.
I think that ALL the characters on the age list actually appeared in episodes, with very few exceptions. You may not be familiar with all of their names, however.
OK, this page is a great idea, and I'm glad I finally found it.
I've been trying to work out how GOliath's loincloth is tied. All the others (except Hudson,who has trousers) have their loincloths just over front & back, nothing going underneath to keep things secure. ANd I just can't make a single piece of cloth fold around the way Goliath's seems to be. I'm sure it has be only one piece, because that's the way Scots did most of their clothes.
I'm going to have to spend a lot more time on this place and see if anyone else has come up with my theory on gargoyle sex etc, based largely on what they wear, or rather how. ANd figure out who all those characters are in the age list, I've seen all the episodes now but half of them I can't recall hearing of. What Othello & whatshername in Legion? COldstone's mate doesn't have a name, they're characters in something of Shakespeare.
There is, of course, a part of the loincloth that goes "underneath". Trust me, Goliath et al are not just out there blowing in the wind. It is still one piece, it just folds over the belt with space cut out for the tail in back.
Othello is the name we use to refer to Coldstone before he became Coldstone. The actual character doesn't have a name. It's just a reference.
Desdemona is the name we use to refer to Coldfire before she became Coldfire. The actual character doesn't have a name. It's just a reference, though we did use the Desdemona name in the credits for actress C.C.H. Pounder.
Iago is the name we use to refer to Coldsteel before he became Coldsteel. The actual character doesn't have a name. It's just a reference, though we did use the Iago name in the credits for actor Xander Berkeley.
Hi there, Greg. First off, kudos to you. Great work on everything you've done. The only question I really have (the rest will be answered when you get to do your spinoffs ;-) ) is this:
Do you get irked by all the incessant Gargoyle questions rather than questions about other projects you have worked on?
Or, in Layman's Terms, do you ever want to yell out randomly: "It's over! Get a life!"?
I don't actually. If anything, I sometimes want to yell at myself: "It's over, get a life!" But the truth is, it's not over as long as the fans keep it alive. And I very much appreciate that.
The fans and in particular the Gatherings have kept things alive long enough for me to FINALLY convince Disney to release the first season on DVD. After that, it's back in the hands of the fandom. If the DVD sells well enough there WILL BE MORE. If all of those sell through the ROOF, then the series will be back in some way, shape or form, even with original material.
Hopefully this has not been asked/answered before..Can't find it in the archives.
Why were the vikings attacking Castle Wyvern? Because they could? Or some other reason?
Just a side comment...until a few days ago, I had never known that Fang actually asks Goliath "How many gargoyles does it take to screw in a lightbulb?"!! Have I missed a lot!
1In that Buzz Lightyear episode that your wrote whatever happened to the robot clone XR?
2Why exactly was that episode so similar to "Reckoning"?
1. X-Treme and the other Clone Rangers (Zzub, Feara and Blister) are, to the best of my knowledge, still at large.
2. Some of it is semi-coincidental. The producers and story editor of Buzz wanted certain things in the story that were similar to Reckoning. Given that, I emphasized a few bits as an in-joke for Garg fans. Hope you don't mind.
Just one question about Hunter's Moon 2.
Matt mention to Jon "Carter" that Aliens were Eastern Island.
Did Jon believe him or not?
BTW, WVRN, very cleaver.
I doubt Jon took him seriously. Now if someone had told Jon Carter about aliens on Mars, that's a different story... ;)
I was reading some of your answers and was reminded about how Broadway was originally female. I am an overweight female, and the thought that a overweight female gargoyle wouldn't have bothered me in particular. I think it is all in the way the character is. Broadway knows he is big, and his self esteem is pretty good, considering the jabs his rookery brothers make. He is smarter then he looks too. Naive, but so were the rest of the clan, it's a learning process. New time, new people, new culture, new ideas. I love Broadway, think he is a great character, but I hope one day they can come out with an overweight, young, smart female. Most overweight females are all the Miss Potts type. Mother hens, grandmothers, etc. I like the way Broadway is and acts, and I wouldn't want that to change, but I still want to see a similar female character one day, human, gargoyles, whatever. I know a some people blow things out of proportion when a female actress puts on a fat suit, like Courtney Cox in Friends. If your going to make the character humourous, it should be tasteful, not hurtful. Someone for people to look up to, not a joke, most characters should be. Look what they do to mentally retard people, Adam Sandler still does it, and it's still funny to a large amount of the public. (Not me.) Maybe it's just me about the whole thing, I am overweight, but I am secure in my look. I think the ones who bash the overweight characters are the people are unsecure with themselves. But there's my ramble. What do you think?
I basically agree with everything you've written here. And, as I think I've admitted before, I'll blame our original decision (to change Coco into Broadway) on a combination of cowardice and commercial interests. We were doing a show that was designed to appeal to a wide audience on many levels. But fundamentally (i.e. economically), we still needed to hit our main target audience of Boys 6-11. We felt -- and I'm not defending our decision, just revealing it -- that that particular audience could enjoy and appreciate a tough male warrior garg that was (at least at the beginning) both overweight and fairly obsessed with food. We felt that the same character as a female would come across as (a) less interesting to that target audience and (b) likely to bring negative attention to the series.
The conventional wisdom, for example, at toy companies is that female action figures don't sell as well as male action figures. Kenner would not have been interested in Coco -- as they were not interested in Angela. But they were interested in Broadway.
Another conventional wisdom is that no good deed goes unpunished. We felt that if our one heroic female was overweight, we would not be praised for it, but attacked -- perhaps even called misogynistic, which I hope no one thinks our series is.
We justified all this creatively with the notion that the Gargs situation was more tragic when the only female left alive was the enemy Demona. But adding a female gargoyle to the cast was a huge priority for me for Season Two. Granted, Angela is quite svelte, but that made sense given who her biological parents were.
My hope, over time, was to introduce the audience to a whole bunch of individual gargoyles and gargoyle beasts -- in both genders and of all shapes and sizes.
Hi Greg. I read in the archives that the first three episodes of Team Atlantis is going to be released on video/DVD. Are any of these episodes the one that featured Demona?
No. And it wasn't exactly the first three episodes. It was a movie sort of cobbled together from what would have been three of the first episodes. But there's a framing sequence that tries to make it play as one piece.
I think the finished product gives you a sense of how cool the series might have been, but doesn't work that well as a stand-alone movie.
"The Last", the episode featuring Demona and Fiona Canmore, the Hunter, wasn't far enough along to be viable as a choice for the DVD.
However, if you're curious to know more about that episode: ATTEND THE GATHERING. That's the only place where you can hear the original voice recording of the episode, featuring Marina Sirtis as Demona and Sheen Easton as the Hunter.
This is about Demona and MacBeth. Let's say Demona's wing's or tail were injured. Would Macbeth still feel the pain even though he dosen't have them or would he not feel it at all. If he di where??
Good question. If the pain extended (for example) from wing down into the shoulder, he'd certainly feel it. Otherwise, I guess it would be very distant -- like phantom pain, maybe.
Why don't we see Goliath laugh or smile more often? Is he too serious or too sad or is there another reason?
Well, he's not a laugh a minute kind of guy. And I think the fact that he doesn't laugh, tell jokes or even smile all that often makes the times when he does stand out. Have more value.
But also, in general, I would like to loosen G up a bit. Hopefully, someday, I'll get the chance.
I, too, thought the animation was rather problematic (a lot of repetition and stiff movements and expressions). The image-continuity suffered as well--when we first see the sonar tag, it's attached directly to the skin, but later it becomes a collar. Also, instead of the usual pole for steering and propelling the skiff, Goliath is now using an actual oar (of course, this is balanced by the fact that there is something rather ludicrous to traversing a mile-deep loch with a 7-ft pole). Finally, Angela did have a rather poorly done awakening sequence (although I swear that later airings seem to have cleaned it up slightly).
And yes, I noticed the similarities between the beginings of this and HERITAGE (there were subtle differences, but the overall resemblence is pretty big).
Despite all this, I still find myself comfortably watching this episode. Perhaps this has a lot to do with Tim Curry as Sevarius. He's just so fun!! And he has a tendency to get all the best lines. In addition to the ones you've mentioned, Greg (particualaly the "...finger down my throat" one), I'd like to add two more:
"Well, this shouldn't take long. I'm sure Big Daddy misses his Nessie-wessy." (Just the way Tim says that last part is great).
"'Monster Love!' How touching."
Whatever else you can say about the guy, he loves his work.
Anyway, from beginning to end...
Elisa's line about the water being too clean still works for me (I mean, there isn't any garbage floating on top of it). And the initial bump with the sub was good, too. I like Angela's pose when she puts here finger in the water after the group goes ashore (I don't know why, I just do), and her mention of trying again to find Manhattan really spoke to me (I had just started to wonder along with her).
I knew Elisa would try to contact home and let them know what was going on, but I felt like screaming my throat into a bloody mess when I saw the message saying "Tape full." Talk about frustrating. Pointless note--the first time I saw this (i.e., before KINGDOM aired), I was goofishly pleased that Brooklyn was singled out as someone to get word to. Just my pride for my fav character coming out I suppose.
The sequence with the boat (and the cameo by Margot and Brendan) is pretty fun. I like Elisa's calm, smug confidence that the whole thing is fake--and how, while she's obliviously comparing the situation to theme parks, the gargoyles notice the creature heading right toward them with somewhat horrified looks dawning on their faces.
It was several viewings before I noticed that Goliath had seen Angela's sillhouette (sp?) under water and tried to swim toward it before being blocked by Big Daddy.
The Goon Squad Leader/Head of Security finally gets a name. And we find out that Sevarius is at work in the loch. He has a rather interesting introduction here. Almost like a Bond villain, what with being heard only as a voice first, then seen as a sillohouette (sp?), then just a shot of him from the neck down, and FINALLY his face. Though, for those of us who followed the show religiously from the beginning, there was no mystery as to who this guy was (not with Tim Curry doing the voice). But I wonder what the effect would have been on a casual viewer for whom this was the first episode (something I may come back to later...).
Severius seems very...enamoured with Angela. The way he...handles her hair is very...interesting.
Angela's interaction with Nessie makes much more sense, and is much more palatable (sp?) with the knowledge that Nessie is familiar with gargoyles. Without it (the knowledge), it's alright, but seems a little like Snow White with all the animals of the forest just eating out of her hand. Thus, Sevarius' line is all the more hilarious (and even a bit cathartic).
While the gargoyles sleep, Elisa manages to find and tail the Goon Squad (typical detective). It was weird to see the Female Goon without her helmet on. Just a random observation.
I actually rather like Sevarius and Angela's conversation. Angela's calling Sevarius "the only monster here" may have been blatantly pointing out the theme, but I still like it.
And now we have actual confirmation that Goliath is Angela's biological father. Personally, I think that revelation is more for Angela's sake than the audience (or at least those who saw AVALON PART TWO). It must be weird, hearing about this great hero all your life, then meeting him, then being allowed to go adventuring with him, and then finally learning that you are his child! With her somewhat human viewpoint, that must have had Angela's mind reeling for a little bit.
One thing that really impressed me in later viewings. An almost casual throw-away line as Sevarius leaves Bruno to guard the base. He gives Bruno the gun with the implied order to kill Goliath if he "becomes too rambunctious," but he preceeded this with "It would be a shame to lose a gargoyle." There may have been a bit of sarcasm there, but I feel like the line kind of shows the scientist in Sevarius--the man fascinated by unique species.
I noticed the awkwardness of Bruno's "All right" line. Actually, that whole sequence was problematic. It took me several viewings before I realized what went on there.
For being an enemy, Bruno was pretty helpful in the mini-sub. Then again, if you're faced with an armed woman (you don't know the gun's not loaded) and a beast that could give Cujo a run for its money, you might be helpful, too!
I'm surprised the mini-sub didn't take any damage when it scraped along the side of the main sub.
One note: I never actually thought that Nessie was Big Daddy's daughter. I don't know how, but I kind of figured they were mates. Still, maybe a different name for the male would have worked better. Alpha, maybe? Or how about, Nester? NO! No, definitely not that....
It's a bit disconcerting when you see the goon at the controls for the tasers, and then, after Sevarius gives the order, seeing the doctor's hands on the controls. I do think Sevarius is the kind of guy who would try to do this sort of thing personally, but I think a scene of him pushing the Goon out of the chair and taking his place would have helped.
A good animation bit--the electricity of the taser reflected in Angela's mask as she looks on horrified.
And the monsters destroy the sub. It took me a while before I realized that those Goons probably all died. I really like that little revelation. Adds another dimension to what happened there. I also like how Sevarius vanished, and Bruno speaks of him as having "more lives than an alley cat." Nice little ominous bit that.
Actually, one thing I thought of a while back was how much Sevarius fits into the stereotypical, Saturdy morning Archnemesis role. I mean, he's seen in command of henchmen, he does the standard "telling of plans" with Angela, Goliath yells his name in anger when G recognizes his voice, he has the best lines, he vanishes at the moment of probable death, and a hero/henchman (in this case the latter) states that he will be back. I wonder if the casual viewer for whom this was the first episode would conclude that Sevarius was the main antagonist for the heroes. Of course, there is the mention of "Mr. Xanatos." You've got to admire a man whose very name warrants a musical sting.
All in all, while it certainly isn't the best episode, I find it a pleasant enough one.
I tend to agree with everything you've stated. Tim was just so good, it was easy to let him carry the episode, even though -- up to this point -- he had been the scientist/flunky. He had never been an episodic villain in his own right.
isn't there some way to make gargoyles big again
When did they get small?
(I feel an ancient Steve Martin joke coming on...)
Hello Mr. Weisman,
I am writing in relation to a thought I had about Gargoyle culture and society after taking a Anthropolgy class this summer. The earliest human civilzations such as the Maya and the Egyptians built large buildings and monuments out of stone.
1. Did gargoyles ever built any kind of stone buildings or sheltors besides their rookeries by excavating caves?
2.If gargoyles did in some form hue stone to make a monument. Would it have possibly have been for there unique god which you have alluded to before?
2. Early weapon making among humans began with one of man's earlies ancestors Australopithecus. Like chimpanzes today they used tools to get food. They used stones to break open roots. The techinques of more advanced tools like arrow heads and flint knives did not begin until the next human ancestor arrived called Homo erectus. Did gargoyles ever develope any kind of weapon making or use of objects such as rocks to better inable themselves with technology in order to survive in harsh enviornmental conditions?
1. Rarely. They required less protection from the elements, which is one of the major motivators to inventing "shelter".
2. No. There animistic/monotheistic faith required no monuments, as the gods/God was everywhere in everything.
Second 2. Again, generally not necessary. Gargoyles were, until humans invented tools, at the top of the food chain.
Sadly,Even though Ive watched almost every episode I keep forgeting.Who was Goliath's second in command after Demonia?I mean I eventually find it oout hten I forget it.
Goliath had no official second-in-command between the massacre and the episode "Upgrade". (One could argue that Hudson acted as his second in an unofficial capacity.) In Upgrade, Goliath chose Brooklyn as his second.
I've noticed that a number of questions have been answered "I'm not saying" and such. My question is: If Gargoyles has little to no chance of coming back (that's the feeling I got from the archives) then why all the secrecy?
Because, slim though it may feel at times, I believe deep-down that at some point in some medium, I will get a chance to do the series again -- or at least stories set in the "Gargoyles Universe".
My thoughts on "Monsters":
I agree with you on the animation issue (although I never noticed the parallels with "Heritage" prior to your mentioning of them), but I will admit that I thought the episode a rather fun one (if not one of the greats). Part of it, I suppose, is my fondness for British settings. (In fact, I visited Loch Ness with my parents briefly as a boy, back when we lived in Britain; didn't see anything unusual in its waters, though).
I did find it appropriate that the gargoyles would encounter the Loch Ness Monster at some point. After all, the gargoyles are Scottish "monsters" - and who's the most famous monster in all of Scotland? Made the same amount of sense as Macbeth getting in earlier, and for a similar reason.
Alas for Brendan and Margot! They run into the gargoyles even while they're on vacation! (Come to think of it, Margot also pops up briefly in Paris in "Sanctuary").
Got to agree with you over Sevarius's over-the-top performance; always a lot of fun to hear.
Count me as another one of the people who mistook Nessie for Big Daddy's daughter (partly because of the Goliath-Angela parallel).
I definitely recalled Matt's answering machine scene: either the guy doesn't clear out his phone very often, or he gets a lot of calls. At least Goliath and Elisa finally get a message home via Renard in the very next episode.
Sevarius's speculations over the Loch Ness clan (more accurate than he thought, after all) certainly become even more interesting in the aftermath of the Clans Contest (and like you, I can't help but wonder now where the local gargoyles were during this episode). We also definitely find out that Angela is Goliath's daughter (although I doubt that that surprised anybody in the audience).
I wonder if that ruined castle over Sevarius's headquarters was based on the real-life Castle Urquhart, at Loch Ness. (Probably is).
And, as you pointed out, that marked the end of the Xanatos Goon Squad, except for Bruno (and I don't recall ever seeing him again, either, after this episode); although I'll admit that I never realized that they were dead at the time. If I had, no doubt it would have impacted me much the way that the destruction of the Grimorum Arcanorum did in "Avalon" - the startlement at seeing another familiar element that had been in the series from the beginning suddenly gone. (Was the blonde female member among the casualties? She was the only member besides Bruno that really came out as much of an individual, to me).
At any rate, thanks for the latest ramble, Greg.
The castle is definitely based on Urquhart. (That's assuming that it flat out isn't Urquhart.)
I have more plans for Bruno.
"Sure," you say, "I'd love to come to the Gathering, but..."
There are always reasons, I suppose. Some good, some not so good, some very good.
I'd still like you to come. Even now. With less than a month left, I'd like to see you make the effort and show. It's a great year for it, what with the Disney folks there shooting footage for the DVD. Heck, don't we want them to see how strong our fanbase is?
The Gatherings have been the lifeblood of this fandom. Why are we getting DVDs this year. Because of the annual Gathering. Just that simple.
And, yes, I am talking to you. And you in the back there too, trying to sneak out.
But let's say you just CAN'T make it this year. This happened. Or that happened. You just can't. You ask me to understand, by saying, "What else can I do?"
Here are a few things...
1. Buy a supporting membership. It's much less expensive than a trip to Montreal. It helps support the convention. And you're entered for a free t-shirt.
2. Heck, just ORDER THE T-SHIRT. It's also much less expensive than the trip. And you get a T-shirt.
3. Order a pin or the Phoenix Gate Anthology.
4. At least go to the website and check these things out:
5. Start planning now to attend G2005 in Las Vegas. Start saving. Show your true support for the series and the fandom.
Same plan: Get up early, sell pre-reg. Same flaw in plan. Once again, Greg showed up at nine. Once again, I begged for another hour. Once again, I went back to bed. Once again, Lynati and Greg came back.
Only this time I just threw them the forms and let them get on with it. Mara and I did get down there and spell them eventually. Lots of people showed up to register and just to hang out. That filled the day until the Auction.
Lynati and I traded footwear about then, so she got to wear my nice comfy jungle boots and I got to wear her really cool, but pinchy as all get out, gargoyle feet.
I spent way too much money at the auction, but I had fun doing it and it's for charity right? Mr. Andy is quite the auctioneer and I hope he'll consider reprising the role next year.
At the auction we finally figured out who Carol was. Yay! Unfortunately, she was leaving before Closing Ceremonies, so we couldn't really hang out much. Boo!
We went back and sold more pre-reg until CC. The end of a con is always bittersweet at best, so my impressions of Closing are kind of vague. The awards for Art Show were given out. Mara won "Most Nauseatingly Cute" for her picture of Chibi-Demona.
And then it was over. Another Gathering come and gone. We went and sold more pre-reg, operating from what was the registration table, since the dealer's room was closed. Siryn came through, almost in tears at having lost a $200 set of markers. (She did find them eventually)
After the dust settled, we were supposed to have a staff meeting. We went back to the sushi place, with like twelve people, which made the service slower, and talked idly about the con. Not much got done.
We decided to go for mini-golf after sushi. Following that, we decided somebody needed to grab Greg and bring him along. We needed to make yet another quick stop by K-Mart, but we figured that wouldn't be a problem.
Needless to say, by the time we got back to the hotel, everyone who'd talked about mini-golf was gone. Oh well.
Eventually, we ended up in the con suite swapping stories. I really wish Greg had come in ten minutes sooner when Hudson and Revel were telling medical stories, instead of when he did, which was the "stupid things I did while drunk" segment of the evening, but what can you do?
As the evening wore on, we migrated out to the volleyball court for "Story Time with Un'ca Hudson." Basically, an extended version of Hudson's Rant-fest from the night before.
All too soon, it came time for us to depart. (We had to leave at like 3 a.m. to make it back to New York to make our plane. Stupid discount tickets) We'd already promised GXB a ride back too, so we loaded the car with all our bags, and gods know how many T-shirts that Sarah told us we had to take at the last minute. (Apparently, they brought them down in a U-haul, and we had to get them back to New York in the convertible. A little warning would have been nice)
The trip back was wild. I blinked and lost time on four separate occasions. The first two were okay. The third one I unblinked and there was a state trooper behind us. He gave us a warning and let us go. I still don't know what for. The fourth one I found out we'd taken a detour into Pennsylvania. Philadelphia, to be precise.
I woke Mara up, semi-panicking, demanding that she navigate. (For me, being in another state from where you need to be is a panic situation. I'm not used to this hit five states and a district of Columbia in one day thing)
Mara: "Calm down. How do you know where we are?"
Me: "We just drove by the First Union Center! It looks exactly like it does on TV!" (I realize this means nothing to the non-basketball fan) "Trust me."
Eventually, we did make it back to New York, only to discover we'd lost my backpack somewhere. This made me unhappy. Plus, returning the rental car was an adventure and a half, and getting on the plane with no tickets and Mara's cat Anna was tricky.
But Hudson and Lynati found my bag, and eventually returned it, and the giant plush armadillo I bought in the DFW airport cheered me up some.
And that, as they say, is that.
Random quote for this year: "The fandom is so full of Sluggites that all you have to do to start a conversation is yell "My world is a crotch!" and see who responds."
The real question is will I get to your rambles on G2003 before the G2005 con.
I love reading these rambles. It's like everyone has their own narrative, and they overlap at times, but it's great to fill in the mental blanks to see what else was going on.
We were supposed to get up early, head down to the dealer's room, and sell pre-registration for G2K3. Again, any plan that includes the words "get up early"...
Around nine, Lynati came and pounded on our door. I begged for an hour to shower, shave, etc. (Sometimes I just need to feel pretty) Only my feet carried me back to bed instead of to the shower... So, around ten, Greg *and* Lynati came and pounded on the door. Feeling bad about oversleeping, I wanted to tear down to the dealers room and start selling pre-reg immediately. Everybody else thought we should get brunch first. And I've got the only car... In retrospect, I probably should have just gone out and picked up some McD's or something. Hindsight is 60/20. We ended up at some buffet place, which was better then the previous day's IHOP, but still overpriced. (But what did I expect in a tourist town?)
So, we ate. And then we came back, and set up in the dealers room. Demona May gave us a receipt book, and drew a fancy sign for us, as well as a stack of calendars she had made. Thanks DM. Greg and Mara and I rotated at the table for a couple of hours, (I spent my off time bumming around the art room) until it was time for the radio play.
Radio Play was the Demona episode from the aborted Team Atlantis series. It was quite good, (the guys playing Mole and Vinnie, whose names escape me right now, were especially hilarious) and a fun glimpse of what might have been.
Afterwards, Greg produced yet another surprise, a tape of the actual voice recording of the episode in question. He popped it in the deck... And nothing happened. Somehow, the stereo didn't like the tape. So Greg asked if anybody had a boombox or a tapedeck or something. To which I replied, "Well, we could all go out to my car..." (Laughter from the crowd) Greg told them "Don't laugh, it might come to that." (More laughter) It didn't. A boombox was procured, and the episode played. I almost enjoyed the Radio Play more then the actual tape. Maybe because the tape didn't have Greg narrating to give us visuals with the audio.
Interesting things learned from the radio play. One, there were gargoyles on Atlantis. Two, the Praying Gargoyle is an Atlantean artifact. Three, the PG regenerates over time.
After that, we went back and did the pre-reg thing again, until the banquet. We got there late, and so we couldn't get a seat on the higher level where Greg was. And then the hotel staff, who'd been so great about so many other things, wouldn't let us push tables together to make more room. Apparently it was a fire hazard or some such thing.
The food was burgers and dogs, with a side of mac and cheese. Free, and therefore better then a kick in the head, as my grandmother is wont to say. We finished pretty fast, and I would have liked to stick around for Greg's Q & A, but consensus was that we wouldn't be able to hear or ask questions from down where we were, so we split. Hudson needed a hand moving the chairs in the Opening Ceremonies room, so we went and helped with that instead.
And then it was time to get ready for Cos Play. The major question of course, being whether Lynati would finish her costume on time.
While Mara was getting dressed, I hung out in the hall with Winterwolf, who wanted to know if I remembered any of Edwin the conjurer's lines from Baldur's Gate II. (Of course) Jen popped out of her room and asked if I had a black hair tie, (of course) and then I retreated to get dressed as well.
It wasn't the most authentic Xanatos costume, but it worked, and opportunities to wear that purple coat are rare, so I went with it. Mara made a stunning Fox, if I do say so myself.
Other costumes> Jen makes a freakily good Xanatos. I mean, really, it's scary. If we can ever get Jonathan Frakes to a Gathering, she has to do it again. Spacebabie will never again be mistaken for jailbait, and will probably have to fight off the propositions with a stick next year. Anthony "Gambit/Archangel/Dracon" Zucconi was a scary Elisa. Dreamie was a very purrlicious kitty. Edwin never summoned any creatures like that for me. And there were lots of other cool costumes belonging to people whose names I unfortunately don't know. But they were cool.
And then there was Lynati... Lynati was literally working on her costume up until the moment Mara threw her out of the room to go to Cosplay. She'd told me about it in the months leading up to the con, but the descriptions didn't do it justice. Once again, I am awed.
Oh, and Mara and I won best skit for our Eye of Greg thing.
Mara: (As Fox) Look David, I'm wearing your engagement present. The Eye of Greg Weisman.
Me: (As Xanatos) That's... great honey. But, won't that turn you into a sarcastic genius who's unable to give a straight answer to anything?
Mara: ... Maybe... All things are true.
So the winners were announced, group pictures were taken, and then we took Lynati upstairs to show her to the desk crew who wanted to see the costumes. (Did I mention the hotel staff was really great?)
Which leads to one of my favorite anecdotes from this con...
A little set-up. Across the hall and down a ways from our room there was a family of the mundanest mundanes ever. White, middle-class, 2.5 kids, dad's probably a CPA or something. I would love to know what they thought was going on that weekend. Anyway, we seemed to be (Eric Cartman voice) warping their fragile little minds.
They gave me the fish-eye as I hurried by in my purple coat and the little girl says: "Daddy, I'm scared. There was a girl with green hair walking around earlier." (Which I assume was Ayami. Seemed like a pretty non-threatening shade of pastel green to me)
And he says: "Just keep moving honey." As in, don't stop before we get to our room or the freaks will get us.
So, after the masquerade, we're taking Lynati back to her room after stopping by the front desk, and I spot the same little girl, with the door cracked just wide enough to put her head through, peeking out into the hall. And she gets a look at Lynati, and her eyes get about the size of Lexington's, and then she SLAM!s the door shut. I did not see any of those people for the rest of the weekend.
So we let Lyn get changed, and head back downstairs. Zaius and Greg Guler are talking about Minnesota, and Hudson is trying to organize a Weisman/Guler deathmatch with the dart guns. Both agreed, but sadly, Greg vs. Greg did not happen. Greg Guler disappeared, and after that there didn't seem to be much point in dragging Greg W. out from where he was comfy.
GXB showed up about then with Spacebabie in tow. She couldn't stay for the next day of the con (:( ) but she wanted to pre-reg for next year. So we headed back to our room once again, and got that taken care of. And then we hung out for a while. It is really hard to maintain eye contact with Spacebabie while she's dressed like that.
So, after twenty minutes of that, we drifted back to downstairs *again*, and found out that Greg vs. Greg was cancelled. But people were still really enthralled with the idea of Nerf mayhem, so Hudson and Chris decided to set up a tourney. We assembled as many of the weapons as we could, and commandeered half of the OC room. While the Quake players sketched out a layout, I made yet another trip back to our room, to change into my trenchcoat, vampire emoticon shirt, and skull and bones headscarf.
Nerf War is mucho fun. Everyone, I think, had a really good time, and everyone was a really great sport about it. Every match, after the first one, ended with a headshot rather then needing the judges to count hits. I ended up paired against GXB in the first round. Heh. Staff fight.
We're getting ready, and Hudson tells us to take off our coats, 'cause we'll trip on them. We declined.
So we take our places, and Chris says to lose the coats, 'cause we'll trip on them. Hudson says "No, they wanna have the Matrix fight." And then he set some rules for our fight. 1. No slowing time. 2. No warping space. 3. No flying through the air sideways in slow motion. 4. Hits on the coat count as hits.
And we fought. It's really quite a rush. Maybe even better then paintball, because the range is closer and thus the threats are more immediate.
I won. Barely. I finished Greg with a headshot a few seconds after his dart came so close that I felt the wind on my ear.
Hudson defeated Chris in a much anticipated match that did not lack for excitement.
Which meant I drew Hudson in the next round...
I thought I had no chance of winning. But I had to at least try. So I ditched the coat for greater mobility, and then my shirt, to draw on the power of Demona. That brought things to a halt for a bit as everyone who'd never seen my tattoo had to get a look. Spaz Kitty transferred allegiance from Hudson to me for the rest of the fight. But Chris' "Dude, is that permanent?" had to be the best response.
It was awesome. I'd studied Hudson's fighting style in his previous match with Chris, and tried to imitate it as much as possible. Which lead to a stalemate with both of us dual-wielding dart pistols behind cover just out of range from each other. Hudson, trying to get me to break cover says "You know I ****ed your mom, right?" I wait for him to make a move, and then pop up myself, yelling "Daddieeeeeeeeeee!" in a high-pitched tone of voice.
That pretty much set the tone for the match. Lots of misdirection and trickery. I managed to stay ahead of Hudson's fire with body control and a lot of luck, while Hudson opted for Jedi-like deflection with his own gun.
We fired every dart out of every gun in the entire room, until we were left with nothing but the ultimate last ditch weapon, the spring-launched Styrofoam glider, donated by Tony Z, which killed you if it hit anywhere. I got to it, dodged Hudson's last few darts, and then we strafed the length of the room, before I headshot him when he changed direction.
I beat Hudson! W00-h00!
After that totally unexpected result, I had thoughts about winning the whole thing. Unfortunately, I was eliminated in the next round by Sgt. Goliath. That match was kind of weird. Multiple witnesses corroborate that two of our darts hit each other in mid-air, nearly rebounding back on us, and I head shot him, but the dart was in the air when his hit my forehead with a mighty smack, leaving a mark that was visible for ten minutes after.
Eventually, the tournament finished, and almost everyone who wanted to try their hand got to, except for that one really tall guy. Sorry dude. But take heart that next year Nerf War will be an official event.
After we got kicked out at 2 a.m., I went briefly back to the room, but finding Mara to be sound asleep, I went and hung out with Hudson and Co. outside for awhile. I think I finally left around four, and then I accidentally woke Mara up, and we ended up talking until sunrise on...
But weren't we using a microphone for the Q&A -- and frankly, don't I have the loudest speaking voice in Christendom?
Friday we were supposed to get up early and go with Hudson over to WalMart and buy more of those nifty guns. Can you spot the flaw in this plan? It's those three little words: "get up early." I don't like mornings as a general rule, and after a long day like the previous one... Nothing short of kicking in the door and throwing a bucket of water on me would have gotten me moving before noon.
So we finally get dressed, and head downstairs, picking up our badges and GXB in the process. Hudson turned up with many more guns, (but still not enough to go around) and told us they'd bought out the WalMart. After checking out the dealer's room and hanging Mara's stuff in the art room, hunger called, so the five of us, myself, Mara, Lynati, Revel, and GXB all climbed into the car and went in search of food.
Revel directed us to an IHOP where he'd been shortly before, with another group. The food was standard IHOP, passable but over-priced. We'd passed a Big K on the way, so we stopped and bought a bunch of stuff, including those huge blue Nerf guns we carried for pretty much the rest of the con.
So we returned, and after, I swear, something on the order of an hour trying to get the Nerf guns out of the packaging, we went our separate ways to get ready for opening ceremonies. Lynati went off to work on her wings some more, and we agreed to meet GXB back at our room in about an hour. This was a mistake on my part. One, it left us with very little time to do much of a final polish on our presentation, (which was only finished Monday before the con) and me with far too much time to freak out about the presentation. I've been terrified of public speaking for as long as I can remember, and this was no exception. How would we be received? Would I freak and babble nonsense? How would OtherCon go over? Ad infinitum. So I just laid on the bed and went quietly insane while Mara made fun of me in the guise of cheering me up. ;)
Then I channeled my freaking out into trying (futilely) to iron my vampire shirt. (The big, poofy, black thing with the ruffled front and cuffs I was wearing at opening ceremonies) A hopeless task, (and pointless, since the whole thing was hidden under my coat anyway) but it passed the time. Passed it too well in fact, since then I started panicking about being late. (Yes, it takes me twice as long as Mara to get ready to go anywhere)
So Greg B. shows up, and we have a mini-review of the presentation, before heading downstairs. We thought there might be seats reserved for us, but (thankfully) didn't want to take the chance. There weren't, so we got some about 2/3s of the way to the back of the room. Surprisingly, there was still a good view from there.
So, Siryn talks for a while. Poor girl. (Heh. Girl. I think she's a couple years older then me) Anyway, she talks, and the stress of the last year is just visible. My heart goes out to her. (My head, meanwhile, is still busy freaking out, so I have only a vague impression of what she actually said) Sapphire read a poem about the fandom, which Mara summed up by paraphrasing Stitch. "We're large. And broken. But still good. Yeah, still good."
And then it was our turn...
Our place toward the back made for a long walk up to where Si was standing, and I think we milked it a little. It was one of those moments I wish I could watch from the outside, to see the audience reaction. The three of us, GXB, Mara, and me, all in black from head to toe, including our trenchcoats, Mara and I carrying our Nerf dartguns at port arms, flanking Greg. The people who know us probably weren't phased, but I wonder what all those con virgins were thinking. I did catch the phrase, "only in New York" from somebody.
And so we pimped the con. We talked. And we talked. And we talked some more. I talked entirely too much. I got punchy and started threatening the audience with my dart gun. Talked about the hotel, location, rates, dates, etc.
(It has been pointed out to me by various people, that some of the things we said were somewhat derogatory to some of the previous staffs. I apologize for that. It was never out intent)
And we talked some more. We introduced the "Name the con" contest, and the mascot, Madison, or Maddie for short.
And then we introduced Death. The Other Mascot. He caused a bit of a stir. (Mara drew up these really great, really *big* pics of the mascots, and we showed them off)
And then we dropped the bomb, so to speak: OtherCon. Which took like half the presentation, introducing it and then answering some questions about it.
And then finally, we were done, and we got to sit back down.
And then Greg (W) got up to talk. He did a hand count, and the number of con virgins was unbelievable. Like, a third of the room. Amazing. He also had considerably bigger bombs to drop.
First up, Toon Disney gave us a bunch of free shirts, and hats, almost completely gratis. Reading a one paragraph Toon Disney advert was a tiny price to pay for all our bounty.
And then, the bunkerbuster: Gargs on DVD. In 2003. With Greg's commentary. Life is good.
Then he did the "litany" presentations, the ones we know so well we can recite along with Greg. And, as a bonus, there was a promo narrated by Jonathan Frakes, which I'd never seen before. Frakes described Gargoyles as "The next generation of Disney animation." Which I thought sounded really appropriate and cool for about ten seconds before I realized it's also a terrible pun.
And then, he showed the Bad Guys leica reel. Which totally freaked me out, because he forgot to do the "don't film this" disclaimer, and there were at least two people in the audience with digital camcorders...
And then we left, minus GXB, plus Lynati and Revel, to search for dinner. This is harder then it sounds. As so many people have already pointed out: What was with all those pancake houses?!? Are pancakes like, the state dish of Virginia or something?
We were really surprised to find a sushi place. So surprised, in fact, that to confirm that this was not a mirage created by our sleep-starved brains, we had to stop and consume large amounts of raw fish, rice, soy sauce, and wasabi.
The food was good but the service was slow, and we had to make another run to K-Mart for some things we forgot the first time, so we got back later then we intended.
We managed to make at least part of Hudson's Rantfest. Hudson had a really nifty-sounding announcement about starting an art archive that works like the fic archive does. It sounded pretty cool and I hope it happens.
After that, he just kind of rambled. Even if you're totally untechnical, like I am, just the way Hudson tells the story makes it funny.
That broke up just in time to make it to Rocky. Kind of a smaller audience then I'd expected, but people were probably tired by that point. And after that, we dragged ourselves to bed.
What was with all the pancake houses? Of course, I love pancakes. And I'll tell you a year later in NYC, that night after Coney Island, I would have killed for an open IHOP or Dennys.
Got up, entirely too early, and started calling rental places. Maybe we should have gone with Rent-A-Wreck. (Next time, national chain) Don't rent from New York Rental. So, we rent a Chrysler Seebring convertible, which has a few dings in it. Or rather, in the dim light of the parking garage, it looked like a few dings. Out in full sunlight, it was a different story altogether.
It also had a tape deck. Ordinarily, I would love that. I love cassettes, and hate CDs. Ninety percent of my music collection is cassettes. But, I didn't think anybody still rented cars with tape decks, so we brought CDs for traveling music. Oops.
(Side note to all you car owners: Do you feel like you have a bond with your car? I mean, to the point where it's like a pet or something? That it knows you and you know it, and you compliment each other? Just curious)
And we're off. Six hundred miles by map through unfamiliar territory with an unbonded vehicle. What could go wrong? Oh, and our main route, I-95, apparently has a bad rep about road rage. I felt right at home.
So we drove. From New York, though New Jersey, (Where we stopped for lunch and bought 64 oz mugs for the rest of the trip. Oh, and the pseudo-leather thing that's supposed to cover the top when it's down blew off somewhere on the Jersey Turnpike. Recovery was not an option) Delaware, Maryland, Washington D.C., back into Maryland, (where we got royally lost), and finally into Virginia, to pick up Lynati at Dulles airport.
So, happy reunion there, car reloaded, (for such a big car, the Seebring has *no* trunk space) and we're off again... Back to Maryland, for Chinese dinner, and so Lyn can do laundry and pick up her wings.
On the way back from dinner, it starts *pouring*. Now, I've never driven a convertible before, and we drove all the way up to this point with the top down, (The source of the sunburn Mara and especially I was sporting the whole con) *and* I'm a spaz. So we can't figure out how to lock the convertible closed. So the roof's leaking, and most of it's dripping right on the door panel where the window controls are... And *something* happens, and my window goes down and STAYS down.
This, in a word, sucks.
Much swearing and meddling with a pair of needle-nosed pliers fails to fix the problem, but fortunately for us, that was the last rain of the trip. (It did eventually fix itself, kind of) Fortified by a newly-bought Pat Benetar tape, we set off again, through the wilds of Virginia, completing a "four hour" road trip in two and a half hours.
Some general observations before I go on:
1. Eastern states have no idea how to build highways. Of every place we went, only Pennsylvania seemed to get it right. In Texas, highways actually go *through* places. None of this "here's an exit, some undetermined distance down which there *might* be a town" stuff. Virginia was particularly bad about this. Back home, on the side of the highway, there're fast food places, 24-hour diners, roadside attractions, evil small-town cops with radar guns, and, most importantly, *gas stations.* In Virginia, the side of the highway is... trees. Nothing but trees for miles. On the sides and in the median. Trees, and big "No Stopping" signs.
2. Toll roads are EVIL. It's a tax on people's ability to move freely. Just the idea makes me feel oogy.
3. "Speed limit enforced by aircraft." WTH does that mean? If you go too fast, they chase you with choppers? If so, then, (A) What were all those VA state patrol cars we passed for?, and (B) Why didn't they come after me?
Back to the ramble...
So, we finally get to Williamsburg, and, after a stop at 7-11, find our way into the hotel. It's like, 1 a.m. by this time. We get inside, and run into WinterWolf and Dreamie, Kyt, and some other people hanging out in the lobby. Wolfie showed us his rental, (his Seebring was in much better condition then ours) and we unloaded all our junk. During that lengthy process, Jen, Patrick, and Kathy arrived. More roadtrip survivors! Mara gave Jen her art gift, and the elevator opened to reveal Gregs W. & B., and a woman I later realized was Carol.
(I wish we'd figured that out sooner. We really didn't get to hang out with her, except a little after the auction, and by then it was too late to have much of a staff meeting)
Eventually, after most of the other people decamped for a late dinner at Denny's, we ran into Hudson, who showed off the first of many nifty black dart guns to be found at a nearby WalMart.
We just sort of hung out for a couple of hours, talking of projects, and cons, and the fandom in general. Unable to interest anyone else in food, I was forced to eat the leftover pizza from Jersey. Such hardship. ;)
And then suddenly it was like 4 a.m. Ack! Bedtime.
Now it's all starting to come back to me...
So Bishansky wasn't in the car with you? Cuz that would explain a lot. ;) (Sorry, Greg, couldn't resist.)
Hey Greg, whats up?
The other night I was watching Gargoyles on Toon Disny as I usually do and reading Wizard:the Coics Magizine as I usually do. I was reading an article on the 80s Nostolga Boom currently happening In comics. Thats when my wee little mind put two and two together and asked my self, why not a gargoyles Comic? I investigated a bit and discovered that Marvel had allready published 11 issues of an illfated comic series based on Gargoyles. And A few questions arose.
*Dose this comic take place in the same continuity as the show?In other words is it Canon?
*Did you, Greg, wright it?
*Were there any second printings or Trade Paperback collections of this series? If not, will there ever be?
*And finally, if you could never get Gargoyles or a related show back on the air, would you take the rest of the story into comics?
Greg I think you did a great Job with the show and it is easily my favorite dramatic animated show.
ps. In a totally un related question, will the show every get released in its entirety on video or DVD?
*It isn't canon, though they tried (with a little kibbitzing from me) to be as consistent as possible.
*I did not write what was published, though I was scheduled to take over the writing chores on the book, just before it was cancelled. I even wrote an issue that was never published.
*I don't think there were. I never saw them. I doubt Marvel is contemplating that.
*I'd love to if someone was interested in paying Disney for the license to publish it.
*The first season is coming out on DVD THIS YEAR. Whether or not the rest comes out will depend on the sales of the first DVD.
will there be more episodes past the goliath cronicals?
I hope so.
After reading a few posts in the archives concerning
whether a gargoyle's weight changes during stone sleep, I
thought about it, and I figure they stay the same weight.
For example, in the very first episode Goliath hauls five
stone gargoyles from the Viking camp to the top of the
castle. Yeah, Goliath's strong, but could he carry a ton
of uneven weight several miles, then up several flights of
stairs, then do it four more times without getting winded?
Maybe I should ask you, so
1. How strong was Goliath? Could he lift a ton? Maybe
A better example of a stone gargoyle's weight is Broadway
turning to stone midair. Seems more plausible for a 350
pound statue to survive such a fall than a 1500 pound
statue. But enough speculation.
2. Do gargoyles stay the same weight when in stone, or do
they gain weight?
3. This has probably been asked before but... do gargoyles
change to stone through their whole bodies, or do they just
have a stone shell?
Thanks for your time. You really show some dedication by
doing this. I hope it pays off. I still can't wait to see
what happens next.
1. I'm not good with numbers.
2. I don't see how they could gain weight -- laws of conservation of mass and all.
3. They change throughout into a stone-like organic substance.
what is gregs e mail? i was wondering if maybe someday i could write a novel with the gargoyles but with another character to go into the plot.
I'm afraid I don't give out my e-mail, I think for obvious reasons.
You are welcome to write whatever you want as long as it's (a) not for profit and (b) you don't expect me to read it.
This isn't a question, but I read some discussion on the terrorist attacks of 9/11 here. It might interest you to know that in City of Stone Part 1, in its current airings on Toon Disney, have both sentences where the word "terrorist" is used cut.
The original lines:
Goliath: I'll never be like this terrorist.
Luna: We were not talking about this terrorist.
The edited lines go:
Goliath: I'll never be like this.
Luna: We were not talking about this.
Wow. They didn't just cut lines, they changed them. I wonder how? Did they bring Keith and Kath in to re-record? Did they use sound alikes? Did they cut and paste words from somewhere else? A lot of effort.
I wonder if they're still airing the adjusted version on Toon Disney & Jetix.
Did events such as Sevarius creating the mutates take place all around the globe instead of just in New York?
In what cartoon was demoan named if there was one
We saw her get named in "City of Stone, Part Three".
Took the kids to see Spider-Man 2 yesterday.
The murder of all those doctors seemed gratuitous to me. Trashing them, sure, but why did the arms (particularly at this early stage) feel the need to kill. I know, I know, self-defense. But in a movie like this, where otherwise I thought it was more-or-less okay to bring my kids, I thought it was really unnecessary.
The death of Otto's wife didn't bother me. Except that it became gratuitous as nothing at all was done with it. Her entire character became gratuitous. And I like Donna Murphy.
I've already talked about my whole Kirsten Dunst would make the perfect Gwen Stacy but is unconvincing as Mary Jane Watson thing. Nothing in this movie convinced me otherwise, despite the "Go get 'em, Tiger" line at the end. I guess you just have to get used to the idea that they've combined these two characters into one and chosen MJ's name.
Peter's objection to dating MJ, because it could put her at risk seems a little preposterous given how much risk she's been put in over these two movies even though they haven't been dating. I don't mind this, I just wish that someone, specifically MJ in their last scene together would have pointed that out.
The theme of this movie is "LET'S REVEAL MY SECRET IDENTITY TO AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE". At the end of the previous film, it was beyond clear that MJ had figured out that Peter was Spider-Man. This is somewhat successfully slid by in this film. But by the end of the second film, the list of people who have seen Spidey's face is nearly endless:
The New Green Goblin
About thirty-seven people on the train
and let's face it, even Aunt May seemed to be strongly implying that she had figured it out.
A little bothered by the way some of Peter's late-arrivals were staged.
Did he really lose THAT much time delivering Pizza.
But more importantly, it seems clear that being Spider-Man aside, he just flat out didn't leave enough time to get to MJ's show in the first place. Face it, he lost his mo-ped but arrived in the bad-guys car. And it took less than a minute to capture them. And he was still late. This bugged me because he was blaming Spidey for screwing up his life, when clearly if he had left for the play in a timely fashion, he would have arrived on time (and missed the crime completely).
I didn't quite know what to make of the whole thing with the landlord's daughter. Kept expecting her to see Peter with MJ in the last scene and turn into a super-villain or something. She was sweet. Didn't catch the character's name, though it's a very similar character to the character that same actress plays on Joan of Arcadia.
Everyone seems wowed by Molina's performance and by Doc Ock, especially as compared to the last film's Green Goblin. I have no objections to either Molina or Doc, but I don't get the raves. Green Goblin's motivations made a lot more sense to me than Ock's. Sure the arm effects were cool. But the whole AI thing effecting his brain seemed forced. And frankly, a bit unnecessary.
From all of the above, I'm sure it must seem like I didn't like the movie. But in fact I did. I even liked how nearly everybody now knows Parker's secret. How did it help any of those people to not know?