Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "Hunter's Moon" yesterday (Sunday) on DVD - all three parts.

I've mentioned before spotting a lot of mentions of hunting, usually applied to humans going after gargoyles with hostile intent, and it struck me that this made it appropriate that the Hunters would be the gargoyles' adversaries in the finale. (Well, the Disney Afternoon finale/Season Two finale.)

And it struck me that the Hunters were the most dangerous opponents that the gargoyles faced in modern times, judging by results. They blew up the clock tower, destroying the gargoyles' home, and then exposed them to the public. The former was partly undone by the gargoyles getting their old home (the castle) back by the end of the episode, but not the latter - now the gargoyles are facing an alarmed public (even though they're safe at the end - for the moment). None of the gargoyles' other adversaries in modern times have been able to inflict that much damage on them. To top it, you'd have to go back to 994 and the Wyvern Massacre.

A few things that struck me this time around:

Goliath and Elisa are actually openly speaking to each other and even sharing a brief embrace on board the passenger train, just after foiling the robbery; fortunately, the passengers apparently didn't notice that.

Hudson greets the returning gargoyles as "lads" - then quickly adding in "And lassie, of course", for Angela. It reminded me of his use of just "lads" for the younger gargoyles in "Possession" that I mentioned in my post on it - apparently he's getting more adjusted now to Angela's presence in the clan.

The trio's clash with Demona in Part One seems the last "trio action" in the series; they're increasingly split up (or else acting with the rest of the clan present) after this.

Lexington and Brooklyn's shared uneasy glances when they return to the clock tower with Goliath near the end of Part Two seemed all the stronger when I realized "the audience knows that Robyn and Jon survived Goliath's fight with them, but Lex and Brooklyn don't - from their perspective, Goliath had apparently killed those two."

Jon Canmore's cry about the gargoyles when he's facing Jason at the end, "They killed dad!", struck me as a sign of how (even before shooting Jason) he was losing it; it was Demona who killed Charles Canmore, none of the Manhattan clan were even present at the event, and Jon was there so he knows it.

Broadway shows how much his attitude towards reading has changed since the start of "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time" when he's talking to Angela about how great the castle library is (and we'll see them there together in "The Journey").

This story really does seem like a good conclusion for the series in so many ways - the gargoyles are back in the castle again, their war with Xanatos is (seemingly) over, they'd defeated Demona's big scheme to wipe out humanity, Elisa finally admitted her feelings for Goliath and even kissed him. Except there's a big loose end with the gargoyles' existence being made public, and most of the New Yorkers aren't too happy about it. (Brooklyn's "And so it begins" remark does also support the feeling that the story could continue past this spot.) But it certainly makes a good season finale.

Oh, and I counted the number of "claw-mark transitions" in the entire two seasons during this review - 28 in all.

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "Future Tense" on DVD today. Things I noticed this time on it.

Bronx looks sad when Hudson's death is revealed; given the bond the two had showed throughout the series, I thought if both fitting and touching (even if it's not really Bronx).

Goliath tells Brooklyn "we thought our odyssey was fated". I thought "odyssey" an appropriate term, since Odysseus spent twenty years away from Ithaca, and Goliath supposedly spent forty years away from Manhattan - and since gargoyles age at half the speed of humans, twenty years for humans would translate to forty years for gargoyles. (I'll admit I'm reaching here - and it feels odd to be linking Goliath to Odysseus when I'd normally think of comparing a different "Gargoyles" character to Odysseus - a fellow Greek trickster....)

The Xanatos Program's intention of using the "World Wide Net" to download itself on every computer marks one of the extremely few occasions I can think of where the Internet was alluded to on "Gargoyles"; the only other example that comes to mind was Sevarius receiving his instructions for "kidnapping" Thailog via "electronic mail". (It also got mentioned in one of the Goliath Chronicles episodes, but that doesn't count.) The near-absence of the Internet from the series certainly makes it appear
technologically dated" from today's perspective.

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "The New Olympians" on DVD today.

Continuing the "hunting" theme in "Gargoyles" that I've paid closer attention to this time around, I noticed that Ekidne described the New Olympians' ancestors as "hunted". (I also spotted a New Olympian extra who looked a lot like traditional depictions of Artemis/Diana, the goddess of the hunt - though I think I'm reading too much into that.)

Goliath's words to Angela about how they cannot wage war on an entire city remind me of his words to Demona in "Awakening Part Five" of how he cannot wage war upon an entire world.

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "Mark of the Panther" on DVD today.

I've mentioned before how I've noticed a strong "hunting" motif running through "Gargoyles" during my reviewing it; this episode included more of that theme, though, for a change, it didn't involve humans going after gargoyles. Instead, it was the Panther Queen and, later, Fara Maku, hunting for Anansi, and then Tea and the poachers hunting panthers.

Elisa lists the body parts of panthers that poachers are after as skin, teeth, and claws. When Diane Maza tells the story of the Panther Queen shortly afterwards, her description of the Panther Queen stresses those same three attributes (well, fur rather than skin, but it's close enough), but now focusing on their beauty, rather than the monetary worth that motivated the poachers. (And when Anansi turns the Panther Queen into a human, the story stresses the Queen's loss of those same attributes.)

Goliath's explanation to Diane, when they're trapped in the pit, that he can only glide, not fly, echoed (for me) his explanation to Elisa on the ledge back in "Awakening Part Three". Like mother, like daughter....

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "The Hound of Ulster" yesterday, but I didn't have any new thoughts on it, so I skipped it over - and "Walkabout" today.

Things that struck me about "Walkabout" this time around:

I'd noticed this before, but Bronx growls at a kangaroo near the beginning. I wonder what he dislikes about them. (I also spotted a koala up in a tree - that I *hadn't* seen in past viewings.)

I was amused by Elisa's description of Dingo as "not one of the good guys" - since that could so easily be tweaked to "one of the bad guys". I don't know if you'd come up with the name for that spin-off at the time, of course.

Goliath at one point says "Aye, for now" - probably the one occasion where he says "Aye" - he usually leaves those Scottish-toned words to Hudson.

During the battle with the Matrix in the Dreamtime-world, Goliath imprisons it briefly within a dome that looks a lot like the domes it was producing in the waking world, and conjures up a shield with a sun-design upon it - a strange emblem for a gargoyle to bear.

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "M.I.A." today. One detail stood out to me this time; the human Londoners grouped in the background at the very end are the same ones we saw in Act I staring at the gargoyles in shock and alarm, when Leo and Una are confronting Goliath outside their shop. It made a pleasant touch, I thought, to see that those people have now recognized (judging from the way they were shown at the conclusion) that they didn't need to be scared of the gargoyles.

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "Monsters" on DVD today. (Appropriate timing, I thought, since November 30 is St. Andrew's Day, dedicated to the patron saint of Scotland - and on that day, I was watching Scottish gargoyles encountering Scotland's most famous monster.) A few fresh thoughts on it.

When Elisa describes herself to the man at the souvenir stall as "not really the adventuring type", I found myself thinking of her statement in "High Noon", "I'm no hero; I just do my job". Certainly, whatever her incliations, she's had plenty of adventures.

I wondered whether Elisa's remark about theme parks doing "robot Nessie-type" stunts five times a day was Disney poking a bit of fun at itself - we'd see something similar in "Bushido".

And when Elisa says at the end how some legends need to stay that way, she looks in Goliath's direction as she speaks, making me wonder if it was just the Loch Ness Monster she was talking about. Certainly Elisa's been zealous about preserving the gargoyles' secrecy - maybe too zealous, in light of "Revelations" and "Mark of the Panther".

Todd Jensen writes...

A postscript thought I had on "Shadows of the Past". Both it and "Future Tense" - the first and last episodes in the Avalon World Tour respectively - have Goliath being beset by terrifying magical illusions, but at last realizing that they're not real and confronting the person or people behind the illusion. I don't know if this was intentional or not, but I think it gives a great element of symmetry to the World Tour.

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched the "Avalon" triptych on DVD today. A few new observations.

The Magus's lyre in the "flashback on Avalon" scene looks a lot like Merlin's lyre in "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time". Obviously not the same one, but evidently both wizards share a common taste in musical instruments.

Princess Katharine and the Magus's telling Elisa "Little is known of the Sleeping King" struck me as all the more appropriate since in 995, nearly all the major works on King Arthur had yet to be written (Geoffrey of Monmouth's "History of the Kings of Britain", the oldest extant start-to-finish account of Arthur's life, wouldn't be written for over a hundred years). There were one or two, like Nennius's "Historia Brittonum", but that was about it.

A detail that I hadn't spotted before: a couple of gargoyle-like sculptures were "guarding" the bridge leading to Arthur's resting-place within the Hollow Hill.

King Arthur and Goliath have both used a mace while fighting Macbeth (Goliath did so in "Enter Macbeth") - one of a few points in common they share (others are awakening in the modern world from a long enchanted sleep, and having scheming illegitimate sons).

The Archmage's boast that he could destroy Goliath with "just a word" struck me as apt, since all the "enhanced Archmage"'s spells were one-word ones ("Vessel", "Revert", "Ice", etc.).

It's difficult not to smile at Elisa's "Souvenirs" question after Season One of "Young Justice". Fortunately, she was asking it in a lighthearted tone.

Anonymous writes...

This is less a question than a comment, since I know you won't give out spoilers. :)

I've noticed that a lot of writers, especially in TV shows, either can't or don't want to write established relationships - either the courtship is dragged out until the final episode, or the couple gets together mid-series only to fall into an endless cycle of break ups and make ups. And while Gargoyles is one of the few TV series that I think had legitimately good reasons both for the long courtship and for the breakup in the comics, which both made sense with the characters and were compatible with them having a long-term healthy relationship... I also really hope that this won't become a recurring phenomenon, and that their relationship will continue to progress, however slowly. While I know that no relationship lasts forever, if nothing else because no one lives forever, I really really hope that Elisa and Goliath will have many long years ahead of them to function as a healthy couple, and that we the audience will get to see at least some of it. *crosses fingers for Gargoyles coming back in some form*

Tyler writes...

Why are Goliath and his took brothers so much bigger than the next generation of gargoyles

Todd Jensen writes...

My thoughts on rewatching "Outfoxed".

Not much new to say about it, but I spotted two things. First, just after Goliath heads off in pursuit of Fortress-Two, we get a shot of it flying towards the Twin Towers. From a hindsight perspective, an unsettling moment.

I noticed, also (continuing my examination of the "monster/beast/creature" terminology used by humans towards gargoyles during this rewatch) that both Renard and Vogel call Goliath "creature". Renard, of course, soon recognizes that Goliath's a sentient being, capable of understanding him when he speaks about the importance of taking responsibility for your actions. I'm not so sure whether Vogel came to the same realization, though.

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "Vows" today. A few new things that came to me.

I was hesitant about mentioning this, in case it comes across as an idea, but - from the way Goliath addressed Demona as "my angel of the night" at Prince Malcolm's wedding, I wondered if this was the first time he'd called her that.

When Xanatos referred to his getting the old coin that was the foundation of his fortune as "ancient history", I thought, "well, medieval history, to be precise".

I wonder how Prince Malcolm and his court must have perceived the Norman Ambassador's departure - he rides off just before the wedding, not staying to see Princess Elena, whom he'd escorted to the castle, wedded (even though he'd presumably be the closest thing to a representative of her father there). At least it doesn't appear to have caused a diplomatic incident between Scotland and Normandy.

The Archmage addresses Demona as "you stupid beast", continuing the pattern of unfriendly humans using such terms for gargoyles, that I've been paying close attention to this time around.

Brooklyn is the one most vocal about going to Goliath's rescue at the end; I wonder if Demona's involvement and his feelings about her had a lot to do about that.

I still think it's a pity that the original ending got onto the DVD; I hope that the Disney + version uses the corrected ending. (That's the main thing I miss from my old "Gargoyles" tapes.)

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched my DVD of "Eye of the Beholder" today. I didn't find as much new to notice with this one, unfortunately, though I was delighted to note the moment where Xanatos placed his hand on Goliath's shoulder while pleading for his help at the castle - meaning that he had an opportunity (which he used, obviously) to plant that tracking device on him. I'm glad that the episode played fair with that.

Brooklyn's eyepatch as part of his pirate costume seems all the more appropriate after the ending of "Clan-Building".

Goliath echoes "Re-Awakening" when he speaks of Manhattan as "my castle, my city".

Todd Jensen writes...

New thoughts on "Re-Awakening", after my rewatch.

I don't know whether this was intentional or not, but when Goliath and Elisa were having their conversation about the shopkeeper and why he doesn't leave the neighborhood, I found myself thinking of "Othello"'s suggestion, in the flashback, of abandoning the castle and letting the Vikings have it, and Hudson's response. I don't know if you intended those moments to be thematically connected, but they did feel that way to me this time.

It still strikes me that the fact that the gargoyles' resolution to protect the city and its inhabitants comes at the end of the first season says a lot about how different "Gargoyles" was from most super-hero series; the gargoyles are able to have plenty of adventures and experiences - thirteen episodes' worth of them - before making that vow. The series was rooted in their being gargoyles - ancient "mythical" beings with their own culture and world-view - re-awakened in the modern world, trying to make sense of it - and often making mistakes in the course of their attempts - rather than just crime-fighters.

Todd Jensen writes...

Rewatched "Enter Macbeth" today.

I can't help womdering what must be going through Hudson's head as he watches a Donald Duck cartoon, thoughtfully stroking his beard. The spectacle of a duck grown to human size, wearing clothes and speaking (kind of) could be an even bigger argument for not believing everything you see on television than the revelation of the Pack's true nature.

U remember in your ramble on "Enter Macbeth", your daughter spotted what looked like the Mona Lisa in Macbeth's mansion. This time around, I noticed a portrait of a man apparently in 18th century attire, who reminded me of portraits I'd seen of Bonnie Prince Charlie.

The doors to Macbeth get it both coming and going; they first get broken down when Bronx escapes, and when he returns with Goliath, they demolish a second pair of doors. (Of course, it becomes academic after the whole mansion gets burned down.)

Lexington talks about getting the clock working again; I wonder if he ever succeeded before the Canmores blew the place up.

Todd Jensen writes...

I also rewatched "The Thrill of the Hunt" and "Temptation" today. Things I noted this time in "The Thrill of the Hunt".

1. Lexington, angered about the Pack's treachery, cries that they're like animals. I thought that appropriate, given the Pack's "animal names".

2. The Pack continue the "referring to the gargoyles as beasts" practice from "Awakening" and even speak of hunting them, such as Wolf's cry "Let the hunt begin!" - the talk about hunting them also made me think of the Hunters (though they wouldn't be introduced until Season Two, of course).

3. When Brooklyn and Broadway arrive at the end to tell Goliath and Lexington how they'd seen a report on the news about Fox and Wolf's arrest, they come gliding in from outside the castle - so apparently they weren't watching television with Hudson when they found out, but somewhere else. (I won't ask where, but this detail struck me for the first time.)

4. Dingo's cry of "Stone me!" upon seeing the photographs of Goliath felt like a particularly appropriate response to a gargoyle.

Todd Jensen writes...

To celebrate the 25th anniversary of "Gargoyles", I watched "Awakening" (all five episodes) on DVD yesterday, and thought I'd share a few things I hadn't noticed before (or hadn't noticed enough) that struck my fancy.

1. When Goliath sends the trio and Bronx to the rookery, Bronx looks ashamed of himself - in a way that reminds me of times when dogs I'd known looked guilty over something.

2. When Xanatos tells Owen "Make the offer now" at the ruins of Castle Wyvern, I suddenly wondered whom he bought Castle Wyvern from. I won't ask here - it's obviously a "No spoilers" answer - but I was struck by the fact that this was the first time I wondered that.

3. I spotted what looked like a "foliate head" (or "Green Man"-type head) carved over the archway the gargoyles are standing beneath when the Commandos showed up in the courtyard, and a couple of winged figures on one of the tapestries. (I'll have to check for other unusual and remarkable features of the castle in later episodes, as well.)

4. Many of the human characters repeatedly call the gargoyles "beasts", both in the medieval scenes and the modern (Princess Katharine's protest at allowing beasts in the dining hall, Mary calling the gargoyles beasts, Bruno asking "Where's the beast?" while pursuing Goliath and Elisa).

5. Goliath asks Elisa, when they first meet, "What were you doing in my castle?" Despite Xanatos having bought it, he clearly thinks of it as still his - as if laying pipe for the arc about the gargoyles having to leave the castle and Goliath resisting it.

Todd Jensen writes...

I also recently read the "Oral History of Gargoyles" online, and enjoyed it. My favorite part was when you mentioned how "Gargoyles" was initially inspired by "Adventures of the Gummi Bears", only instead of "cute, cuddly multi-colored bears" it would have "cute, cuddly multi-colored gargoyles". I know you were talking about the original comedy development take on the gargoyles, but I laughed aloud at the "cute, cuddly" part - they're definitely not the adjectives I'd use for describing Goliath. "Majestic", yes, "awe-inspiring", yes, but not "cute" or "cuddly".

Derek writes...

Am I missing anyone or adding someone incorrectly? So far Sevarius has the DNA of the following?

Goliath, Brooklyn, Angela, Broadway, Bronx, Lexington, Eliza, Hudson, Yama, Robyn Canmore, Dingo, Talon, Maggie, Fang, Claw, Wolf, Demona, Nessie, Deiliah (Mix)?

Rose writes...

Hi,

My last question was probably already ignored, but if not I apologize for it...after extensive digging through the archives I think it was answered.

But I’m pretty sure this was never addressed....You kind of seemed to suggest that Elisa fell for Goliath spiritually and physically earlier than he fell for her. How is it then that she never seemed to be jealous of Demona? At least she never showed herself to be. Like in vows...I know she didn’t know the details of what transpired there, but wasn’t she ever worried that Goliath May eventually succeed in bringing Demona to the light and reunite with his mate?

Or was her willful desire to avoid the topic of their romantic linking overpowering any other feelings of insecurity or jealousy she may have felt vis a vis Goliath? Or was her guarded nature so tight that these secret fears never showed on her?

I just wanted to also say thank you for bringing us a love story for the ages...I think Goliath and Elisa are the most heart wrenching couple to ever grace the world of fiction. Thinking about these two tears my heart up in the best way possible. Watching Elisa as a little girl made such a huge positive impact on the person I am today...I love her so much that I’m willing to relinquish the hold I wish I had on Goliath (if there’s a straight woman out there who wouldn’t melt all over this guy...I haven’t met her yet).

And I’m sure I’m not the only one. I think you may have saved hundreds, thousands of 90s young women from our lesser selves with this beautiful, positive role model. There hasn’t ever been another like her.

Rose writes...

Hi Greg,

I searched the archives a little and I did not see this answered specifically...(if I’m wrong please link me)

When in the tv series did Goliath realize he had feelings for Elisa? I know he was always gradually falling for her (unbeknownst to him for not) since he first met her...but what do you think?

I always imagined it was well before he realized the physical connection in the mirror...maybe by deadly force when he realized he might lose her and lost his mind about Dracon.

Thanks for this amazing show and for your answer!

Ricky writes...

1. So I get the qualities Thailog inherited from Goliath and Xanatos but what do you think he got from Sevarius? Sorry if this is obvious but I just don't see it, is that why he might hold Sevarius in less regard than he does his other "fathers"?
2. Do you think Thailog holds Brentwood in more regard because he joined him of his own free will? Will he grant him more responsibilities like Xanatos does with Owen or will he get someone else to fulfill that role?
3. What does Thailog think about immortality? On the one hand I could see him being like Xanatos on the other I could see him adopt Nightstone Unlimited as a pseudo clan and achieve immortality that way maybe both? Great villain by the way so much like Xanatos and Goliath and yet so different at the same time.

The_Jezio writes...

Hi Greg,

Thank you for your work and Gargoyles, it gave a mature 13-year old kid a great show to watch and escape with when his world around him was falling apart.

I wanted to ask you about Goliath and his character ARC. he's such a complex character who spends so much time in grief and, carrying burdens from his past balancing good and evil, broken hearts and forbidden romances, an evolution of "Clan" and family.

Season three opened all of these new possibilities with new clans popping up all over the world after Avalon, and so my Question is, What would it take for Goliath to get his happy ending? Was there ever a plan to really wrap up Gargoyles, because the universe really is so deep and expansive everyone could have gotten 10 episodes plus about their own struggles and triumphs.

I even got to read Brooklyn's Comic Arc from "Clan Building" by Greg Weisman, and had even more love for what could have been! Thank you for answering if you get the chance!

Selena writes...

Hi Greg. I just wanted to tell you that I loved your story on the Gargoyles, especially the story between Elisa and Goliah (I have always loved the story of Beauty and the Beast). Probably they are not the first nor the last to ask you this question, but I hope with all my heart that sooner or later the stories, even comic books, continue. You had so many ideas that I wanted to see them realized. I hope a day not far away will happen ...