Comment Room Archive : Gargoyles : Station Eight

Though I'd hate to have the loss of a major character VA, it does happen. But all is not lost. Look at Talespin for instance. The voice actors used for Jungle Book had long since passed away, and yet, they found a cast that sounded VERY CLOSE to the original Baloo, Louie, and Shere Khan. Not to mention all the sequels of classic Disney movies, they find actors with similar voices. Though a voice like Keith David is as distinct as Tim Curry or James Earl Jones, I am sure there is some man out there with a voice matching his. Mel Blanc, Jeff Bennett, (among countless other VAs) impersonate other voices very well.
Siren - [Click my name for Hunter's Moon Trailer!]
posted @ Sun, Oct 29, 2006 9:58:01 pm EST from 65.33.46.247

Harvester of Eyes> This is what happens when I type a really long post. I meant to say "Phil Hartman's character on 'NewsRadio'", but I ended up forgetting the latter part. His "Simpsons" characters were removed without explanation and I do agree that it would be very tough to have Troy McClure continue on with a new voice. Phil's performance really makes that character and since he was a secondary role, his loss does not raise too many questions in the series.
Demonskrye
posted @ Sun, Oct 29, 2006 2:47:03 pm EST from 209.6.214.28

Demonaksrye: I wouldn't say that Phil Hartman's characters were written out, per se, at least not in the sense that Maude Flanders was. They just quietly stopped using them, which I didn't have a problem with, since Hartman's voice is so unique.

I think as far as certain characters on Gargoyles are concerned, we've seen from "The Journey" that they could pull off replacements. Of course, for Castaway, it looked to me like there was the added boon that he'd want to speak in a false accent in order to further conceal his identity. Goliath certainly didn't seem to recognize his voice. But I think as far as others are concerned, a lot of the actors (in particular the voices of the Manhattan Clan) set the bar way too high. I find it very hard to imagine anyone but Keith David as the voice of Goliath, simply because his voice is so unique. This is one of the reasons I've had a very hard time getting into the new Batman cartoon. I think Kevin Conroy set a similar impossible standard in his portrayal of Batman.

As far as other characters are concerned, I think the only other replacement (were she replaced) that I'd have trouble adjusting to would be Marina Sirtis. And possibly Jonathon Frakes.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"All of a sudden, seems I can barely face myself, no face to lose." -Ian Anderson
posted @ Sun, Oct 29, 2006 1:39:53 pm EST from 69.175.67.68

Yeah, but there are some characters (Goliath, Hudson, Lex, etc.) that just wouldn't be the same if their VA was to be replaced, for whatever reason.

The new VA would just be too... off.

Cause let's face it, NO ONE could play those characters like Keith, Ed, and Thom could.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Sun, Oct 29, 2006 12:38:55 pm EST from 209.239.132.200

Well, how much would it differ from artist replacement? On the other hand, animation varied throughout the series, but voice actors were all the same. Now the art has changed again, and some people like it a lot and some people don't.
But I have the feeling that a voice change for a character would seem more major than a change in drawing or inking style.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Sun, Oct 29, 2006 12:00:36 pm EST from 209.162.56.94

Voice Actor Replacement> This is a good question, and a tough one as well. I'm not entirely sure I have an answer to it. On the one hand, there's the feeling that the voice actor is an integral part of that character. We tend to identify characters with their voice actors more than the numerous writers, character designers, storyboard artists, animators, inkers, cel painters, and other people who are equally crucial in bringing that character to life. When an actor in a live action TV shows passes away, the action taken depends on the show and character. If the actor played a rather minor role or the show was just getting started, the character may be recast. But in many cases where the show is well established or the character is a major one, major changes or a complete end to production are the norm. No one has been cast to play Lenny Briscoe since Jerry Orbach passed away, though it essentially meant that "Law and Order: Trial By Jury" was over before it started. Phil Hartman's character was written out of the series when the actor's untimely death occured. And even though voice actress Maggie Roswell only left "The Simpsons", not this mortal plane, her character Maude Flanders suffered death by cannon propelled t-shirt.

On the other hand though, is the question of art and story. The argument for removing a character when an actor passes away is that casting a new actor in the role would be devaluing the deceased actor's contribution and performance by saying another person could do just as well. But you have to wonder, would this actor who contributed his or her talent to the creation of both the character and the entire show really be happier with the character dying, moving away forever, or just disappearing from the show if the story didn't really call for that? We can't ask any voice actors, unfortunately (unless someone knows of a voice actor who sudden developed accute chronic larangitis and could no longer perform). It's an especially tricky point for "Gargoyles". Of course I never want anything to happen to Ed Asner (because he's an awesome person aside from being a great voice actor) and I doubt I'd want to hear anyone else playing Hudson. But on the other hand, Greg likely has a decade or two's worth of stories left for the old soldier and I'd hate to see them go untold. Replacement seems to be a more popular option in animation, partly because voice actors are considered to be such good mimics (though it's only one of their talents). Fairly or not, some of the people in charge believe that they can find a suitable sound alike to fill the bill when a voice actor leaves for whatever reason. And after all, if cartoons with his characters had ceased to be made when Mel Blanc died, we'd never have any new Looney Tunes cartoons. (I'll leave it to you to decide if this is a good or bad thing, or if my example is really the best one possible, since Mel Blanc was actively coaching his son on how to do the voices he had popularized.)

Of course, the point is kind of moot now that new "Gargoyles" stories come to us in comic book form. We can hear the voices just the way we want to and cast whomever we wish in the new parts. I think "Goliath Chronicles" prooves that, should Greg ever be unexpectedly picked up by Nokkar to go battle the Space-Spawn in a distant galaxy with no internet access, we probably don't want anyone else telling "Gargoyles" stories. But with anyone else....it's just too hard to say. I'd be curious to see what other people think.
Demonskrye
posted @ Sun, Oct 29, 2006 11:12:59 am EST from 209.6.214.28

Greetings,

Recently, on one online community I'm part of, I commented on someone's fanart of the show "Avatar: The Last Airbender", which had a render of one of the principal cast characters that had been given voice by the late actor Mako (he also did the voice of Aku in "Samurai Jack").

When I made the side comment that I hoped they could find a suitable replacement for his voice in the next season of the Avatar series, the artist replied that they would rather his character be written out (either as a flashback, or die off in a heroic fashion) since it would not be proper to have someone replace Mako's character.

This made me think a bit. If it were "Gargoyles" -- which either was still in production, or about to be revived as a new series -- and one of the voice actors for one of the primary characters had died, would any of the fans feel the same way as this person? Should they not replace the character's original voice with a new actor (even with the caveat that the new actor could do the voice nearly-exactly like the original), or should the character be "written out/killed off" just so it maintains the integrity and memory of the original actor's performance?

Granted, Gargoyles has lost one of it's more poigniant voices -- the voice of Jeffrey Robbins, the blind author -- but, say it was a more primary voice actor in this case? Like Mariana Sirtis, or Jonathan Frakes, or even John Rys-Davis or Jeff Bennett?

I'm curious as to what everyone else thinks about this?

Maintain and Check Six.
Stephen Sobotka Jr
Please Read at this link *click it* . . . Can You Help?
posted @ Sun, Oct 29, 2006 7:57:29 am EST from 71.99.178.232

Does anyone have any updated info on Season Two part Two? Also, please check out my site!!! I have screenshots galore!
Alex - [sun_shine_girl2003 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 10:00:26 pm EDT from 72.82.191.5

Just trying something new here since I just signed up to be a SMC salesGarg.

If anyone out wants to help me out, E-mail me.
Matt Fews - [matthew412003 at yahoo dot ca]
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 8:57:21 pm EDT from 69.156.168.222

The gfw has summaries for nearly all episodes.

According to the gfw, both "The Hound of Ulster" and "Bushido" are waiting for summaries from Renee, "Ill Met by Moonlight" is waiting for a summary from HOE, and Posession has nobody at present to doing its summary. (Sorry, I don't care about summaries for the tgc episodes.) I already wrote 2 summaries for the gfw myself, and the last one I did was painfull - I never thought I would get through.

Anybody seen Vash lately?
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 6:02:06 pm EDT from 71.29.247.83

Yeah, I've been spending a lot of time over at GargWiki. Reading info, expanding on it, putting in new entries.

Until the next comic comes out or Greg reveal's something in Aske Greg or here, there isn't much to talk about.

I've also noticed that lately a lot of the old timers seem to be posting here less and newer fans are posting more. Theres nothing really wrong with that, but it could explain why the Room isn't as busy as it used to be. Just a thought.
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 2:47:25 pm EDT from 70.253.190.198

Wingless> What new site? The Gargs wiki page that Greg B. gave us the link to earlier?
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 2:41:31 pm EDT from 209.239.132.196

Could it be everyone is busy looking at that new website? hmm?
Wingless
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 1:52:25 pm EDT from 74.105.128.170

*gets the paddles ready, charges them up, and yells "Ready, and clear!" every few seconds while trying to bring new life into this room.* :P

I haven't been to the Gargs Fan Website in a while, but last time I was there, it was starting to look dead. This is starting to worry me, that maybe the fanbase is not what it used to be. Dead time in this room, dead time on the GFW... *shudders*

Or am I just being paranoid?
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 1:46:29 pm EDT from 209.239.132.196

Sorry for the double post but WOW. I never expected this CR to be this dead.
Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]
Remember the old Gargoyles comics!
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 12:30:52 pm EDT from 69.54.209.127

Vaevictis Asmadi: <The other issue, which I discovered in the Wiki, is that Terry Chung will land on New Olympus while trying to sail around the world. Doesn't that imply that the island is in the Atlantic or Pacific Oceans?>

Not really. There is a little canal in Egypt that Terry could have used to speed that round the world trip.
Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]
Remember the old Gargoyles comics!
posted @ Sat, Oct 28, 2006 12:28:52 pm EDT from 69.54.209.127

One touch that I really like about the Gargoyles Wiki (if I can comment on it when I'm one of the contributors - but this is about the parts that I didn't contribute, so I can be objective about it) is its illustration of the entries on Shakespeare and Caesar Augustus with actual pictures of them (the portrait of Shakespeare from the First Folio, and a famous statue of Augustus).
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 7:15:46 pm EDT from 4.244.211.142

I think the Gargoyle page should make a mention of chameleon genes in the biology section.

There is a real-world example of a "chameleon gene" or more likely, several genes. There is some plant in Hawai`i that varies enormously in what the plants look like, depending on the environment their seeds land in. They can look like vines, woody shrubs, herbs, or trees, with a huge variety of shape and size for leaves, stems, roots, and flowers. They look like totally different, unrelated species. But all of them are the same species and can interbreed.
I wish I could contribute more than this, but I learned about it on a nature show years ago and can't remember the name of the plant.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 5:41:33 pm EDT from 209.162.56.94

I visited the Gargs Wiki page and may I just say that I am really loving it so far. :)
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 12:50:34 pm EDT from 209.239.132.12

I know the general idea of New Olympus is that regardless of where it is, it is not discovered because of the cloaking shield thingy. But that shield cannot prevent people from washing up on the shores in boats, shipwrecks, etc. Which is why the extremely heavily-populated Mediterranean does not seem a possible choice to me.

The other issue, which I discovered in the Wiki, is that Terry Chung will land on New Olympus while trying to sail around the world. Doesn't that imply that the island is in the Atlantic or Pacific Oceans? I think the Atlantic is the most likely place.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 12:44:12 pm EDT from 209.162.56.94

I've never done the Wiki thing before, but I am now. I'm learning a lot by looking at the edit pages of things people have already done. I'm guessing that info in bold is information that Greg has given us but we havn't actually seen in the series yet? How do you add pictures?
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 12:03:22 pm EDT from 70.245.243.52

Much love for the Garg Wiki! ... Except that those link colours still burn the retinas. ;) At least you can change the default colours if you register an account.

Matt-- That's the beauty of Wikis... anyone can edit them if they see missing information. ;)
Kythera of Anevern - [kythera (at) gmail dot com]
I do not suffer fools, gladly or otherwise.
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 10:58:16 am EDT from 76.168.61.199

I agree that the Mediterranean seems a bit small, but Greg has said that it's residents come from all around the Mediterranean Rim areas (Greece, Egypt, etc.). And how would they get to the Pacific Ocean anyway? I mean maybe the Atlantic or the Indian Ocean (reminds me of Dinotopia), but the Pacific seems too distant.
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 7:24:41 am EDT from 70.245.247.74

Jurgan: "Lighten up!"
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"All of a sudden, seems I can barely face myself, no face to lose." -Ian Anderson
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 6:37:21 am EDT from 69.175.67.68

Hey there,

This weekend I'll be at the Mo-Kan Comics Conspiracy Convention in Kansas City. If you're around, please stop by, introduce or reintroduce yoursef, and say hi!!!
Greg Weisman
Attending NINE conventions a year annually since 2006...
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 2:24:33 am EDT from 68.183.95.134

personally, I don't like the idea of New Olympus being the Mediterranean Sea for one big reason: it's such a small area. Having a small undiscovered island in the Mediterranean Sea that somehow managed to be avoided after all the centuries, World War 1, and World 2 seems improbable. I'm more inclined to place New Olympus in the Pacific Ocean, simply because there's plenty of space for the island to hide, as opposed to hiding the island in Mediterranean Sea.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Fri, Oct 27, 2006 12:29:12 am EDT from 71.29.247.83

Harvester: I didn't mean to make my reply sound hostile, which is why I replied to myself. I just wanted to make clear that I don't actually believe the sensationalist stuff in that movie, fun and/or amusing though it may be (disaster movies aren't my thing).

That Wiki looks great! Clearly unfinished, but still very nice. Obviously already very spoilerish, but most of that stuff has already been spoiled for me...
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 11:57:03 pm EDT from 209.162.56.94

HoE: All right, I'll bite: What did the arsonist say to the prostitute?
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 10:44:21 pm EDT from 69.242.207.112

I have a feeling, but it's not my place to say.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"Good... bad... I'm the guy with the gun." -The legendary Bruce Campbell
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 9:17:54 pm EDT from 69.175.67.68

He's gone beyond New Olympian... so to speak.
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 8:59:17 pm EDT from 70.253.188.144

BISHANSKY - Is anything wrong? The "Don't expect to see much of me" part does sound ominous.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 8:45:57 pm EDT from 4.244.18.248

Greg B (or anyone else involved in GargoylesWiki)> On Nokkar's page you could add that Greg has said he is "of the N'Kai". Whether that is his species or some sort of title or affiliation remains to be seen.

Just thought I'd add that. Great site! Good work!
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 8:45:20 pm EDT from 70.253.188.144

Wow. This thing has really progressed. My compliments to everyone who worked on it.

Vaevictus: Um, I wasn't accusing anyone of anything. My advice to you would be to remember what the arsonist said to the prostitute. A philosophy I do my best to live and breathe by.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"Good... bad... I'm the guy with the gun." -The legendary Bruce Campbell
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 7:16:44 pm EDT from 69.175.67.68

Just popping in briefly. Don't expect to see much of me for the foreseeable future.

Just a little something me and a few other people have been working on.

So, a few people and I have been working on a little project for the fun of it. A Gargoyles Wiki. Not quite done yet, and hopefully the comic will keep coming out, so it will never be done. But so far, so good. It was JEB's idea, Todd provided most of the content. Taina most of the images, and Kythera gave us our cool logo.

And hey, this week is the show's twelfth anniversary, so when's a better time to unveil this.

http://gargoyles.dracandros.com/

And now, I'm off.
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Brave words for a man who hides his face behind a hood." - Goliath, "The Journey"
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 7:00:59 pm EDT from 68.202.44.89

This probably sounds unimaginative, but perhaps there was one or more Children of Oberon residing in the Tryangle who occasionally messed with ships and planes. In that case, all the strange things attributed to the Tryangle would stop happening after the Gathering.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 6:54:33 pm EDT from 209.162.56.94

I once recently thought of the possibility of New Olympus being in the Bermuda Triangle, but after thinking over it a little more, I doubt that that could be the case. Taurus and Boreas mention at the end of the "New Olympians" episode that Elisa was the first human to visit their island in two thousand years, so the New Olympians can't be behind any other unexplained disappearances in the last couple of millennia. (As a side note, Greg Weisman mentioned recently at "Ask Greg" that he actually hasn't come up with any plans involving the Bermuda Triangle for the Gargoyles Universe, because his big ideas for it were part of his work on "Rain of the Ghosts".)
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 6:27:13 pm EDT from 4.244.18.175

Sorry for the double post. I'm really bad with this, I'm so used to being able to edit my posts.

I've seen previews of the Day After Tomorrow, and the move exaggerated climate change to such an extreme degree that it made it look totally rediculous. I was being fecetious when I used the word "Fimbul". I really wasn't referring to a scenario where the entire world flash freezes solid in 30 seconds, only to be completely drowned in a mega tsunami with continent-wide hurricanes, or covered by glaciers. That's really crazy stuff, just to make an entertaining disaster movie, I'm not gullible enough to believe it. I only believe the things that are backed by good science and agreed upon by a large number of scientists. So yeah, I wasn't talking about the silly stuff in that movie. I'm not gullible like that.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 1:01:47 pm EDT from 209.162.56.94

Hey Harvester, please be fair. I have NEVER put any stock into the crazy movie Day After Tomorrow. I put stock in actual science, not Hollywood. Please don't accuse me of acutally believing that nutso movie. I haven't even watched it.

Yeesh.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 11:44:12 am EDT from 209.162.56.94

It's not a globus, but if a map suffices: Here's the link to the GFW resource for the Avalon world tour and the stops (at least those that could be placed).
Guandalug la'Fay - [guandalug at gargoyles-fans dot org]
It has been said that the world is a strange place. This is not true. The world is a VERY strange place.
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 9:32:34 am EDT from 80.145.10.240

Todd> Not to mention the potential World Tour stops in Pukhan and Xanadu, both on mainland Asia.

KingCobra> Clearly Avalon exists on some other dimensional plane than Earth and wouldn't be on any map, but New Olympus is on Earth... somewhere. It is only shielded by it's cloaking device, but if the device was turned off it would be as visible on the planet's surface as any other small island.
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 8:39:47 am EDT from 70.246.142.226

Matt> "I have an old globe that was falling apart and years ago I did some serious repairs to it and then marked it with each World Tour location, except of course Avalon and New Olympus, couldn't figure out where to put those."

I don't think there even WOULD be anyplace on a globe to mark those areas. IMHO, Avalon and New Olympian are alternate dimensions from Earth and thus would not have shown up on a globe anyhow. I may be completely wrong on this, but I'm just tossing out a theory here.

Although I myself am now curious as to where they would be located on a globe if they'd actually existed.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 8:18:45 am EDT from 209.239.132.196

The Avalon World Tour never took them to mainland Asia, either (unless you count the as-yet-unpublished story that Greg Weisman wrote about them meeting Coldstone in the Himalayas). And, yep, they went to Central America but never to South America.

Greg was probably saving Antarctica for the "Pendragon" spin-off, anyway.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 8:09:32 am EDT from 4.244.212.168

I have an old globe that was falling apart and years ago I did some serious repairs to it and then marked it with each World Tour location, except of course Avalon and New Olympus, couldn't figure out where to put those. I would assume New Olympus is somewhere in the Mediterranean, but as I couldn't verify it, I just left it off the globe.
The globe really helps illustrate how some areas were clearly favored. Antartica and South America were never visited (unless you consider Easter Island as part of S. Amer., which I don't), and the British Isles were visited four times! Actually, Europe is visited a lot.
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 7:58:06 am EDT from 70.246.142.226

Vaevictus: Try not to put too stock in "The Day After Tomorrow." Wasn't that good a movie to start with.

Isn't there a world map at the fansite that shows where each location on the World Tour was? Put together by fans, yes, but it was based on where Avalon took them.

And where is this video that people keep talking about?
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"Good... bad... I'm the guy with the gun." -The legendary Bruce Campbell
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 6:53:19 am EDT from 69.175.67.68

Off-topic> Finally got a price range for that Lex tattoo I've been pining for.

$100 - $110.

It's pretty affordable as far as tattoos go. Though I don't yet have it, David referred to it as "an early Christmas present."

Anybody want to see it at the con, heh, feel free to come up and ask.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Oct 26, 2006 6:06:45 am EDT from 209.239.132.196

BTW I was being facetious, there. I think/hope the gulf stream thing is only a worst case scenario.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 11:07:25 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

Queen Florence Island is in Canada, period. Do not try to take it away from Canada as they said, in the ep, and Greg himself said, that it is in Canada. The Island is probably around the Queen Charlotte Islands, North of Vancouver ISland, Where the REAL Haida People come from.

The Haida People come from the Queen Charlotte Islands, and it makes sence that Greg Wasn't using those islands, but an Island he made up himself with a similar name.

It is a Canadian Island and that's where it'll stay.
Battle Beast - [Walt Disney World resort, Orlando Florida]
Disney World is soooo much fun!!!!!
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 11:02:52 pm EDT from 216.53.215.187

Oops, by which I mean the glaciers on Antarctica, not the continent itself.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 10:04:00 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

Harvester -- I seriously doubt it, what with global warming. They only place that might get Fimbul'ed is Europe, what with Antarctica melting and gumming up the Gulf Stream.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 10:01:29 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

Patrick, sorry my video broke your brain ;)
Siren - [Click my name for Hunter's Moon Trailer!]
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 8:58:40 pm EDT from 65.33.46.247

Patrick: The cold seemed to come all of a sudden. On my birthday (the last day of September), I was walking around the Maryland Rennaissance Festival with a short-sleeved shirt. Last Thursday it was up to 80 degrees. Now, it's freezing. And the south usually doesn't have a fall. That better not be indicative of anything that has Fimbul as a prefix, or I'm punching something. Several things, actually. Why hold back?
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"They say they gave me compensation. That's not what I'm chasing. I was a rich man before yesterday. Now all I have left is a cheque and a pickup truck. And I left my farm on the freeway." -Ian Anderson ("Crest of a Knave")
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 8:43:26 pm EDT from 69.175.67.68

Patrick? Why do I have this mental image of Servarius genetically merging his own body with Ariel? o_O.

Shara> I wonder what Tennessee summer weather feels like. Especially in the Smokies. Ah, well, guess we'll find out in a few months.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 6:36:54 pm EDT from 209.239.132.113

KingCobra_582 >yeah it gets purty hot out here in the summer. But this weather is wierd even for us. Around this time of the year it starts to cool down a bit and sometimes we get some rain. it keeps getting warmer its wierd.
Shara
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 4:36:34 pm EDT from 4.245.121.64

I dont think they will show the garg marathon anymore since it came out on dvd. I belive disney stops doing things like that with the cartoons when they go to dvd. Ducktales, rescue rangers, bonkers, talespin all thoughs cartoons is what I got the toondisney channel for and when they went to dvd they pulled them all from that channel and replaced it with flash animation garbage.
Shara
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 4:35:36 pm EDT from 4.245.121.64

I'm in Cleveland, Ohio. It's really not supposed to be winter already in the midwest. The weather is just weird this year.

Siren > That "Rocky Horror Meets The Little Mermaid" vid broke my brain.

240 days left until The Gathering 2007 in Pigeon Forge, Tennessee!
Patrick - [<-- The Gathering 2007]
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 11:08:14 am EDT from 66.72.203.217

Kaylle> Well, if I ever have a Gargs DVD party (and you're in Ohio, of course) I'll be sure to save you a chair. :)
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 7:41:19 am EDT from 209.239.132.82

Lol, I don't think anyone's proposing we actually plan the con now ;) It's just cool to know there are other fans in the area. I'm always happy to know I'm not the only one!
Kaylle
GargoylesDVD.com
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 1:59:16 am EDT from 66.31.44.143

Kaylle> It was the Gargoyles Friday Nights of Fright marathon. I also thought they would show it this year...and the year before. Oh well, maybe next year.
Warcrafter - [grafixfangamer1 at sbcglobal dot net]
Humans are such easy prey for a gargoyle!
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 1:27:11 am EDT from 69.231.229.211

Hey Kaylle, and King Cobra,
I live in Indiana, not too far from Columbus and all that. I'd help if I could
Justin - [justin dot lindley at gmail dot com]
Peace Love and Empathy
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 1:07:41 am EDT from 156.56.137.217

Kaylle> My finances are too strapped for running a con anyway.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 12:19:15 am EDT from 209.239.132.155

King Cobra> Cool. I live (well, my father does, anyway) in the Hilliard/Galloway area, about a mile east of West Jeff. If I ever get back in the state I'd be happy to help you set up a con, but I don't know if there are any other Ohio fans around who could help.
Kaylle
GargoylesDVD.com
posted @ Wed, Oct 25, 2006 12:12:33 am EDT from 66.31.44.143

Kaylle> I live relatively close to Columbus, approxamitely 20 mins driving time from there. My other and I live out in the sticks, near West Jefferson.

I remember that Halloween marathon. I remember how agitated I was at the cable company (My parents had missed a payment) for shutting ours off 10 minutes before the Marathon began.

If I knew how to run a con properly and could do so, I would try to set up one here. At least then, it would save on travel expenses. The 2006 con in L.A. was a nightmare, financially.

Fortunately, it's only a 6-8 hour drive from here to Pigeon Forge in 2007, and my tax return is gonna be paying for the trip. :-)
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 10:53:36 pm EDT from 209.239.132.155

KingCobra> Where in Ohio are you? I'm from Columbus originally, although I'm at college in Boston at the moment.

Re: Halloween> I seem to remember a Gargoyles marathon on ToonDisney one year to celebrate Halloween. I don't get the channel here, so I don't know if they're showing it this year, or even if I've imagined the whole thing. Does anyone remember that?
Kaylle
GargoylesDVD.com
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 10:44:02 pm EDT from 66.31.44.143

well in my area, its not too hot and not too cold so we can pretty much wear anything. My mom is not looking forward to halloween because I know my dad will probably dress up like Thor and lure unsespecting kids to our house for candy. It's so embarrasing....to my mom, I love it :)
Warcrafter - [grafixfangamer1 at sbcglobal dot net]
Humans are such easy prey for a gargoyle!
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 9:19:21 pm EDT from 69.231.229.211

Yeah, In Canada for 13 days prior to Halloween, Teletoon airs The Real Ghostbusters Cartoon, and have been for the last several years. I wish they'd air it all year long. It's better than some of the crap they air all year long. Some shows they air only have 13 episodes and they run them over and over every day! Considering TRG ran for years, there are tons of episodes they could air. And frank Welker is Slimer! Woo!
Wingless
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 9:05:50 pm EDT from 74.105.128.170

Shara> You're lucky. Ohio is extremely cold this year.

Never was a fan of Ghostbusters The Movie. Though I have fond, if largely faded, memories from my childhood of the 80s cartoon.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
Today I am 24.
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 8:35:19 pm EDT from 209.239.132.155

Battle Beast> Its normal. Just about every Halloween is pretty warm here. Warm enough to usually have to have lightweight to medium weight clothing. It felt a bit chilly to me this morning, but 14 years of living here has thinned my blood.
Siren - [Click my name for Hunter's Moon Trailer!]
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 7:41:12 pm EDT from 65.33.46.247

Hahah this is christmas at the beach weather in caifornia.

So im watching ghostbusters cause of october. They run it all month long etc. I was thinking about how the gargoyle dogs come to life and then I started thinking about gargoyles. If A gargoyle best statue came alive in reality that movie kind showed it realisticly sort of haha.
Shara
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 4:31:11 pm EDT from 4.245.121.22

We're not talking Alaska or the Yukon. It'd be much colder. QFI probably is in the Pacific Northwest, around Washington state. Since it's an island, it could belong to either country, but given that Grandmother mentioned Canada, I think we can assume it's that one.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 3:21:36 pm EDT from 153.9.92.48

Siren> Great Scott, is this florida October heat wave normal?!?!?

Queen Florance Island> If the island was in the US, Greg would have said "off the west coast of Alaska..."
Battle Beast - [Walt Disney World resort, Orlando Florida]
Disney World is soooo much fun!!!!!
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 9:36:15 am EDT from 66.90.26.18

Greg did make up the Island, but he also has said that it is a Canadian Island.

Jurgen> That is interesting. I have to disagree with one thing you said. I'm not even a gargoyle and I can tell what Clan a gargoyle belongs to by how it looks, and I'm not talking about dress. Each Clan has a variety of features, but is based on the same theme. For instance, the Ishimuran gargoyles generally have a front set of small horns on their brows and a larger set of horns behind that. They also tend to have a stranger variety of digits such as wings with extra ribbing or two toes. Mayan gargoyles have only very simple brow rigdes/horns, but tend to have some sort of crest behind the brow, as opposed to simple horns. The Scottish and English Clans are distinct as well, and I'm sure the New Olympian, Pukhan, Xanadu and Loch Ness have their own physical distinctiveness.

I'm reasonably confident that if you showed me a gargoyle without any of the cultural giveaways (clothing/jewelry) that I could tell which Clan the gargoyle came from. And if I can do it, so can a gargoyle.
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 8:27:50 am EDT from 70.246.135.178

Jurgan> Don't know if Queen Florence Island in the show is in Canada or the USA, Grandmother only says it's "off the west coast of Canada". However, there is no actual Queen Florence Island. I believe, and someone can correct me if I'm wrong, Greg Weisman named it after the street he grew up on.

As for Arizona, the school is fictional. You can see "Arizona at Flagstaff", or something close (I haven't seen that episode in a long time and don't feel like digging out my tapes to verify), on the university pool. There is no branch of the Univ of Arizona in Flagstaff that I'm aware of. Northern Arizona University is in Flagstaff, though.
Blaqthourne & Crimson Fury
Music selection: Radio OST
posted @ Tue, Oct 24, 2006 1:19:57 am EDT from 63.20.81.214

I think, after however many centuries with the clans dwindling, and spread so few and far between that interbreeding is rare, the surviving clans are probably getting as inbred as Florida panthers, and if they should start trading eggs or mating outside their clans. Gargoyles are more impervious to disease than humans, so non-diverse immune systems aren't as much of an issue. But enough inbreeding could start to result in double-recessive mutations, or even decreased fertility.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 11:56:05 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

We have to remember that skin color in humans isn't simply a genetic fluke. After all, we don't discriminate seriously based on hair color. Human skin color is passed down genetically, and as such it is cultural as well as biological. Blacks, Hispanics, Asians, and Whites all have different cultures, which has more to do with why there is prejudice between them than the simple fact of looking different.

I'd say skin color amongst gargoyles is analogous to hair or eye color amongst humans. If you want an analogy for human skin color, I think you should look at different clans. The only real difference is that a member of a foreign clan may not be immediately recognizable as such, while a black man is immediately recognizable as not being white. We've never seen multiple gargoyle clans interact, and I hope we do someday. Given how intensely territorial gargoyles are, I wouldn't be surprised to learn that they are very suspicious of those from other clans. I imagine that English and Scottish gargoyles may have clashed in the past. I bet that a mating between two clans would be frowned upon (yes, it's good for biodiversity, but culture can trump biology, as evidenced by the amount of inbreeding among the noble classes in the past). That sounds like a good creativity demon. Maybe two gargoyles from different clans who wish to mate would run off and start a new clan. Wolf packs work in a similar fashion. Such a breeding pattern improves diversity and speeds the propagation of the species. Hmm, this is turning interesting. Any thoughts?
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 11:30:16 pm EDT from 69.242.207.112

Yeah, as long as there's a natural explanation for how they look I'm not bothered. Unless it's a black-toothed human and the explanation is "I chew tobacco constantly and I've never seen a toothbrush in my life." Ewww.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 10:31:44 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

Sorry, Vaevictis, didn't mean to spell your name wrong :) And sorry for the double post.
Kaylle - [kaylle at ladyavalon dot com]
Kaylle
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 9:31:28 pm EDT from 66.31.44.143

Lol, Vaevictus, I don't think anyone thinks you're racist. I didn't take your comment that way, anyway. I agree, I'd probably find a black tongue unattractive on a human being. It'd take some getting used to, anyway. I'd be surprised by anything that isn't included in the general range of colors that are 'normal' for human beings. But like the others said, it's hard for us to know what colors are 'normal' for gargoyles, so we don't know how they'd react.

And to add to the list of things with black tongues, iirc giraffe tongues are black to protect them against sunburn. Although I suppose that isn't a factor for gargoyle tongues...
Kaylle - [kaylle at ladyavalon dot com]
Kaylle
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 9:30:51 pm EDT from 66.31.44.143

Hmm, Todd, you missed green (Lex), olive green (Iago), and blue (various dead guys).

Looking at the Avalon Clan (and suppose some of their ancestors had those colors) that adds teal, orange, grey, light green, and dark gold. (from http://lynativerse.artchicks.org/Screencaps/GargCaps.htm)

I really hope you guys aren't worried by my comment or anything, I don't want you to think bad of me. I'm not bothered by skin colors at all. But if I met a guy with black or blue *teeth* I think it would be gross. And glowing red eyes, too.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 8:45:53 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

Ack! Now I have you all worrying I'm racist or something! I think they're creepy because I don't view blue tongue and black teeth as natural colors. They certainly aren't natural colors for humans. That's why they look gross.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 8:34:00 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

Todd: Kind of makes me feel like reposting one of my rare creative moments, when I proposed that Demona might someday write a children's book called "Humans Are Like That."
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"Very wise, my young friend. They would shoot you down like a dog." -Demona ("Temptation")
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 7:57:25 pm EDT from 69.175.67.68

This conversation reminds me a little of a thought that I've had for some time - that gargoyles must find human color-based prejudice bewildering. After all, each of the different clans that we've seen in the series contains a wide variety of skin color for its members (except maybe the London clan, where the variation is based more on the forms of heraldic animals). Take the Wyvern clan: we've got lavender, brown, red, khaki, light blue, and aquamarine for skin colors. With such a variety within each clan, I can't help thinking that gargoyles must find the mere concept of "anyone with a different skin color than your own is an outsider to be shunned" as simply peculiar, even alien.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 7:48:16 pm EDT from 4.245.19.201

Clones> My problem with them, and mind I've only seen them in context of one episode, is simply they're clones of the Manhattan clan and were manipulated to be poor copies (ie, lower intelligence). If we so more of them, that might change. But I doubt another gargoyle would be put off based on their appearance.
Asatira
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 7:40:08 pm EDT from 68.119.87.178

Hmm, I suppose it could be within Gargoyle diversity to have blue or black tongues. That is a good point. They may well not be as creepy to other Gargoyles (except the ones who were unwilling tissue doners).
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 7:35:47 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

Vaevictus: Nah, the clones don't seem intelligent enough to be snobbish. and maybe Thailog never programmed them with the knowledge of proper flossing. ( ;

On a different note, I just watched "Reawakening," and I think it's ironic that Tom Wilson voiced both the robber and Matt (the latter of which was old friends with the shopkeeper). Unless I'm completely mistaken, but the robber sounded like Tom Wilson.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"Very wise, my young friend. They would shoot you down like a dog." -Demona ("Temptation")
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 7:31:48 pm EDT from 69.175.67.68

Gargoyles never seem one to judge other's by appearence, especially eachother. I am sure there are gargoyles who prefer bald or blonde, blue or green, or horned or no horns. Just like how humans prefer a certain look, but more often then not, still find love without having the "perfect looking" man/woman.
So I doubt their looks would bother them much. Birds often have black tongues. Chows and sharpeis have black and purple tongues. So such a thing IS natural in some species, and we haven't see every single clan, so who knows what they look like.
Siren - [Click my name for Hunter's Moon Trailer!]
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 7:26:57 pm EDT from 65.33.46.247

Does anybody else think the clones are creepy and gross, with their black teeth and blue mouths? Maybe they have blue blood, too; they'd have to in order to have blue tongues and mouths.
Do you think they might get more normal coloring as they age at a normal rate over the years? Because otherwise I can't see any normal Gargoyle woman wanting them, except Delilah. I don't think I would go for a human male who had black teeth and a blue tongue, even if he had an explanation for it (like being cloned and aged super-fast).
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 7:15:46 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

This has absolutely nothing to do with Gargoyles, but its fun to watch anyways...

Rocky Horror Meets The Little Mermaid
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srFEDF1mATI
Siren - [Click my name for Hunter's Moon Trailer!]
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 6:58:56 pm EDT from 65.33.46.247

"they went everywhere except to the US, didn't they?"

They did stop in Arizona, but no gargs there. Queen Florence Island is in Canada, right? I'm think it's pretty close to Washington state, but not quite over the border.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 5:28:49 pm EDT from 153.9.136.40

Yeah, Greg W. already said what the 10 clans are.
Vaevictis Asmadi
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 1:13:16 pm EDT from 69.81.211.193

Well, there were once Gargoyle Clans all over the world. I'm sure there were many in the Americas.

In 1996, however, the only Clans in the Americas were the Manhattan Clan and the Mayan Clan. So, Goliath and Co, did visit every Clan alive in the Americas.

However, later that year the Labyrinth Clan (beneath New York City) would be formed, and in 2198 the Liberty Clan would be formed on Queen Florence Island off the West coast of Canada.
Matt - [O'Fallon, Missouri, USA]
"Toilet out of order. Please use floor below." - Sign in public restroom stall.
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 10:04:24 am EDT from 70.246.155.135

Renee> Well, that would make for interesting story arcs in the comic, and introduce new characters.

Of course, none of this is up to me, but it's fun to speculate.

Think of it. There could be a "Chicago clan" or a "L.A. Clan" or even a "Vermont Clan". Etc., etc.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 10:02:19 am EDT from 209.239.132.61

King Cobra - I don't see why there couldn't be. I'm sitting here now wracking my poor brain through the episodes of the Avalon trips... they went everywhere except to the US, didn't they? Maybe the native US clans didn't need any help, eh? :P

Just my sleepy thoughts. :)
Renee
Sanity is just a delusion.
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 9:58:41 am EDT from 24.181.243.222

I was thinking about the Avalon Journey this morning, and it suddenly occured to me: Could there be other gargs clans in America? We'd never seen any on the show (at least not during that arc) but the possibilities keep haunting my brain.

Just b/c we didn't see them doesn't mean they weren't there.

Or should I have posted this on Ask Greg?
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 8:02:30 am EDT from 209.239.132.61

How fitting is this: The History Channel is running their series "Barbarians" from a few years ago on The History Channel Classroom at 6/5 am et/ct and the narrator for the episode on Vikings is Clancy Brown.
Tomorrow's is Goths. Wonder if he narrated all of them or just today's.
Blaqthourne & Crimson Fury
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 6:59:40 am EDT from 4.230.120.150

Greg Weisman in the top ten... Nice.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 2:41:15 am EDT from 69.242.207.112

well, today's the day . . that I expect to find out the release date for Gargoyles issue #2. Every week, on Monday, the slg website has been updating its production schedule, and right now, gargoyles issue #2 is at the top of the list to have its release date revealed.

*crosses fingers that slg announces gargoyles issue #2 gets released 11-15-2006*

Of course, I think there's something wrong with their website. Either slg knows something that the telephone company doesn't know about comic book stores in Conway, Arkansas or their website doesn't keep an accurate listing of their retailers.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Mon, Oct 23, 2006 2:00:19 am EDT from 71.29.247.83

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