I'm not sure whether New Olympians will explore Greek mythology at all, though, or if it will be entirely focused on modern-day negotiations with the humans. I like the idea of the Greek gods having half-human descendants in the modern world, but I'm not keen on the implication that the Gods themselves were all mortal and they're dead now. I really liked having the living Children of Oberon (such as Odin, Raven, Anubis, and Anansi) being alive in the modern world even though hardly anybody believs in them anymore. I like the idea that just because the old religions have been mostly wiped out, that the beings themselves haven't disappeared from the Earth.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 11:23:03 pm EST from 71.34.43.226

Spinoffs: Frankly, I'm happy with any of the below spinoffs becoming Canon one day. Along with the dozens of reasons mentioned below, each spinoff is really is incredibly appealing. My only hope is that Bad Guys will do so well that it'll convince SLG and Disney to make more spinoffs that won't just be mini-series.

Phil: Seriously? I'm tied for first? Man, looking back, I feel my guesses were relatively horrible (but hey, you did say that there's still a lot of points in the air!).
Phoenician - [<---My Kinda Useless Blog]
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 9:08:44 pm EST from 157.242.217.199

This is my Order

1.Timedancer: At first it didn't really interest me at all as not a fan of Time Traveling but thinking about it, Brooklyn travels will be interesting.

2. Gargoyles 2198: this also didn't really interest me but finding out new Characters including old ones like Brooklyn, Demona, Macbeth, Owen and Alex it would be a good read.

3. Dark Ages: It be interesting to read seeing the gargoyles younger days

4. Pendragon: Doesn't really excite me that much but I would still read it, IF IT COMES OUT.

5. The New Olympians: Not really interested in it at all wasn't a big fan of the Gargoyle Episode, I only seen it twice but I would still buy the comic book IF IT COMES OUT.
vicky82 - [vickyfanofwwe at aol dot com]
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 7:02:23 pm EST from 195.93.21.4

My thoughts on the remaining five spin-offs (now that "Bad Guys" is out):

PENDRAGON: This one appeals to me the most, since I'd always wanted to see what would happen to King Arthur and Griff on their quest for Merlin. (If it lasts long enough, I'd especially want a couple of flashbacks that would reveal what role gargoyles had in Arthurian Britain - the parts that didn't get into Malory, just as "City of Stone" showed the parts of Macbeth's life that didn't get into Shakespeare, or which, if they did get in, were heavily distorted.)

DARK AGES: We know how it's going to turn out, of course, but I still liked the medieval flashbacks, and would enjoy seeing more of these. (The issue that worries me the most is how Greg will be able to show us the gargoyles suffering from human prejudice for twenty-three years, without so alienating the readers that they stand up and cheer when the Captain and Demona finally decide to betray the castle. Apart from the fact that the betrayal backfires.)

GARGOYLES 2198: If Greg gets to make this one, I hope he can explore the issues of humans having to share their world with another intelligent race, and one with so many differences (both cultural and biological) that the regular solutions for race relations won't apply here. (Human minorities don't turn into stone in the daytime, for example.) I don't know how much room there'll be to explore it while the Earth is under Space-Spawn occupation, but I think that there could be a few good stories about that.

THE NEW OLYMPIANS: I like Greek mythology, and found the concept of the New Olympians appealing (though maybe not their one-note attitude of anti-human prejudice); this spin-off could also allow room to explore the human race having to deal with sharing their world with intelligent non-humans. (And, on the side, even though it probably won't be a major issue, I'd like to see what impact the New Olympians revealing themselves would have on the study of classical mythology!)

TIMEDANCER: I like time travel stories, especially ones exploring the historical past, and Brooklyn's a great character.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 6:25:22 pm EST from 4.244.212.180

Spin-Offs> I'm taking "Bad Guys" off the table, since we already have that (wow, it's cool typing that).

1. Gargoyles: 2198
2. Pendragon
3. Dark Ages
4. Timedancer
5. The New Olympians.

My criteria is mostly where I think we'll have the most interesting stories and characters. "Dark Ages" would rank a little higher if not for the fact that, it seems like a lot of the characters would be trapped in a box since we know where they end up. I'd love to see it, but I think it would work just as well as occasional flashbacks in "Gargoyles".

"2198" interests me the most, because it feels like a culmination. Honestly, I want to see this conflicted Demona, forced to work on the side of the angels, still wanting to destroy humanity, but fighting against the common foe. Her epiphany would most likely take place here, and I want to see where she ends up.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 5:32:31 pm EST from 75.56.245.4

Matt> Actually, the contest was about the issues scheduled for 2007, so it covered Gargoyles #3-7 and Bad Guys #1-2. I didn't participate, but I've been keeping tabs on the scores. So far, out of a possible 40 points, Purplegoldfish and Phoenician are tied with 4, but there are still a lot of points up in the air.
Phil - [p1anderson at go dot com]
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 4:51:47 pm EST from 70.236.218.142

My interest in the different spin-offs is partly based on how likely they are to show clans we haven't seen yet, or show more of the clans outside New York. I know that Timedancer will have the Xanadu Clan at some point, and Dark Ages will probably include Scone, while Pendragon might have something about the London Clan. New Olympians interests me because I love Greek Mythology, but we're not likely to see the NO Clan. 2198 is likely to have something about all the clans, but I find it less interesting than the others. Besides Bad Guys, I'd maybe order them:

Dark Ages
Timedancer
Pendragon
G: 2198
New Olympians
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 4:46:31 pm EST from 209.162.56.40

"The Rock" should be pretty interesting. Non-linear and all.

Didn't someone run a contest concerning guesses about the first seven issues?
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 4:37:56 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Sorry for the double post, but I wanted to mention that my comic shop sends out an e-mail every weekend confirming which issues are going to arrive the next week. I just got this week's message, and Gargoyles #7 "The Rock" is confirmed for Wednesday (at least by my local store, and they haven't been wrong, yet).
Phil - [p1anderson at go dot com]
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 4:22:43 pm EST from 70.236.218.142

I'd actually be very interested in "Dark Ages", but I'm intrigued by Greg's response in this post: http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=8765
He mentions being drawn to tell Dark Ages stories in prose, and based on his "Hyppolyta" ramble I think it would really work, and work well. He didn't use any names, but it was crystal clear who he was talking about throughout the piece.
Of course, the mechanics of distributing it and making it financially worthwhile for Greg is a big hurdle. Leaving comics as the most feasible option.
Phil - [p1anderson at go dot com]
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 4:18:54 pm EST from 70.236.218.142

King Cobra> We've had this conversation before in this Room. Many times. And my order probably changes a bit every time. Right now I'd say this is my order:

Dark Ages
Bad Guys
Timedancer
G: 2198
Pendragon
New Olympians

That isn't to say I wouldn't love to see New Olympians. And I'm sure I'd enjoy any of these spin-offs. Of course the funny thing is that this is he first time this conversation has come up since a spin-off has actually started (Bad Guys). So that affects my list considerably.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 4:09:00 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Matt> Don't get me wrong, I agree with everything your saying but I can see where people might be getting the wrong idea. That said I don't think them referring to each other as brother or sister really prove anything one way or the other. Taking a mate from among your rookery siblings is perfectly normal in gargoyle society.
Algernon
The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.- Terry Pratchett
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 3:55:06 pm EST from 86.41.203.231

Matt> So what's in your top three?

Spin-offs> I'm hoping to see Timedancer. It's going to be fun and interesting, watching Greg send a certain beaked Gargoyle all over time. It's unfortunate though we won't see ALL of his journeys, but I'm still psyched.

Plus the fact that the poor guy needs a mate already.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 2:28:49 pm EST from 75.60.190.3

Seriously, let's just stop even mentioning his name. Otherwise, it's only going to encourage him to post more shit.

Wingless: I'd also like to see Dark Ages. I think Greg could probably do a decent job of tackling "before" type stories. When they're done right, I like to see how characters develop into what we eventually see them as. I was also impressed with the promo I saw back in June.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
Seems to me the question George Michael should be asking himself is: does Andrew Ridgely know it's Christmas after all?
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 1:33:32 pm EST from 71.62.198.251

Happy Holidays everyone! It's getting close to the holidays for everyone to SPREAD THE WORD TO ALL GARGOYLES FANS about buying the DVD's of Gargoyles Season 1 and Season 2, Volume 1 during the holiday seasons to boost sales to get Gargoyles Season 2, Volume 2 released on DVD to complete the entire series including me.

Gargoyles Season 1 and Gargoyles Season 2, Volume 1 are available now on DVD to buy from
Amazon.com
fye.com
midtowncomics.com
buy.com
bestbuy.com
video.barnesandnoble.com
dvdempire.com
moviesunlimited.com
dvdplanet.com
target.com
borders.com
sonystyle.com
jr.com
overstock.com
ModernRock.com
BestPrices.com
Tower.com
hotmoviesale.com
thestore24.com
cduniverse.com
amazon.ca
bestbuy.ca

We need to boost the DVD sales of Gargoyles Season 1 and Season 2, Volume 1 to get Gargoyles Season 2, Volume 2 released on DVD to complete the entire series and we need to keep getting Disney's attention all over again for them to produce and release Gargoyles Season 2, Volume 2 on DVD!
Jonny Modlin - [mmodlin at optonline dot net]
Jonny Modlin
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 1:19:11 pm EST from 24.44.55.86

Vaevictis> I dunno about Pendragon. I LOVE Griff, but Pendragon has never excited me that much. I'd still enjoy it, but it isn't in my top three or anything.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 12:25:45 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Sebastian >> More like "If the fans are this obnoxious and stupid, they don't deserve any more DVDs."


Matt >> I'm another who really wants to see Dark Ages. I'm also eager for Pendragon, I really hope it gets published.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 12:15:38 pm EST from 209.162.56.40

you know what would make me laugh?

If Jonny Modlin somehow actually does help the release of Gargoyles Season 2 volume 2. I doubt it, but maybe they will get fed up deleting his emails and think: I think its worth the loss we will take to stop this kid.
Sebastian
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 11:40:41 am EST from 128.12.68.69

Of course they're sincere and emotional, they grew up in a paradisical utopia. :p

Anyway, I like Patrick's answers. ZOMBIES!! But seriously, some of those questions are ones we don't have answers for yet.


While we're at it, does anybody know if Greg has answered this one yet?
Will-o-the-wisps are related to the Third Race. Are they vulnerable to iron?
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 10:56:55 am EST from 209.162.56.40

Pretty much the reason I thought, at least, Angela and Gabriel were a couple when we first see them is they were very sincere and emotional, which contrasts with how a lot of us are. That, and we hadn't had the chance to really see much interaction between Gabriel and Ophelia other than the recovery during the battle, and I'll admit I didn't notice it the first time through. Also, I may have been drawing on Goliath and Demona's leader-second relationship, but Greg has since corrected the idea that the second isn't always the leader's mate (thankfully). A part of me wishes we could have seen more of Ophelia and Gabriel together, but that may be the romantic side of me.
Asatira
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 10:36:23 am EST from 24.197.64.31

Algernon> "...I can't help but wonder what the hell Lucas was thinking."

-He wasn't.

So, brothers and sisters don't hug each other? Friends don't hug each other? Only romantic interests get tearful goodbyes?
And if Gabriel and Angela were really that way, why would they keep calling each other "my brother" and "my sister"?
Gabriel and Ophelia have yet to really talk to each other on-screen, but Gabriel did assist her when she was wounded by Demona's laser cannon. And anyway, not seeing two characters interact on screen doesn't count for a lot, especially when they are minor supporting characters only seen in a handful of episodes.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 9:34:12 am EST from 24.207.163.239

Patrick> "She loves him the way Leia loved Luke", you know, every time I see the kiss in Empire I can't help but wonder what the hell Lucas was thinking.

Honestly though I'm not surprised that so many people got the wrong idea about Angela and Gabriel. between them constantly hanging around each other and the tearful goodbyes, I had pegged them for a couple myself. Heck, I don't think we've even seen Gabriel and Ophelia talk to each other.
Algernon
The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.- Terry Pratchett
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 9:17:58 am EST from 86.41.203.231

Yeah, I also would really love to see "Dark Ages". To me, seeing other ancient Scottish clans would be really cool. Learning more about the splitting of the Clan would be interesting. And I've always wanted to know more about life in a "full clan" with several beasts and gargs of all ages. Plus seeing Demona's second and Hyppolyta would be a lot of fun.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 9:08:45 am EST from 24.207.163.239

Answers:

1. Maybe.
2. Waking up earlys' going to mean one hell of a hangover.
3. No, Who is on first.
4. I just told you, Who is on first.
5. She loves him the way Leia loved Luke.
6. All except Humpty Dumpty.
7. ZOMBIES!!!

Hey, I didn't say they were *good* answers.

201 days left until The Gathering 2008 in Chicago, Illinois!
Patrick - [<-- The Gathering 2008]
"The coldest winter I ever spent was a summer in San Francisco." - Mark Twain
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 8:35:52 am EST from 76.241.137.12

I think I'm among the minority, but I'd love to see Dark Ages most among the spin off series. I'd like to get to know more about the roots of the clan.
Wingless
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 5:08:10 am EST from 99.245.254.123

Tony: If Dark Ages ever gets released, then there's good chance we'll see the Magus again. But in a Post-Avalon story?? Not a chance -- like it has been said before, life has consequences.
Phoenician - [<---My Kinda Useless Blog]
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Sun, Dec 9, 2007 4:44:16 am EST from 157.242.217.199

Tony> Are you asking for answers to your questions from those of us in here or are you asking if they are appropriate to ask Greg?
No matter, I'll do my best. I'm sure others will remember things I've forgotten.

1. Probably. I can think of a couple series where one or more episodes of him would fit in. Not sure what Greg's plans for him are, but the formation of the Order of the Guardian by 2198 suggests he has more stories for Tom.
2. Probably. I for one am not convinced he was awakened early. Just because Arthur and other characters seem to think he was doesn't mean they are right. Of course maybe he was, in which case, as always, everything has consequences. This is the Gargoyles Universe afterall.
3. Unknown, though fans have made many guesses.
4. Unknown, though fans have made many guesses.
5. Angela and Gabriel were never an item. Their relationship has always been strictly on a sibling and friend level. By the time we first see Gabriel and Angela in "Avalon, Part One", Gabriel is already romantically involved with Ophelia.
6. Unknown, but I would think yes since no mention is made otherwise. And Greg has certainly never said anything about it. I think they all survived.
7. I doubt it. Bringing back the Magus is extremely anticlimatic story-wise. I don't know Greg's plans, but I doubt they include reviving the Magus.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 9:56:20 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Gabriel is mated to Ophelia and has been since before Avalon Part One.

The Sleeping Hill is not the cause of Arthur's enchanted sleep, and it certainly has nothing to do with resurrection. Greg has no plans to bring back the Magus. As he explained, war has consequences.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 9:54:35 pm EST from 209.162.56.40

2. Yes.
5. No. They were not an item. Rookery siblings.
6. Yes.
7. The Magus is dead, dead, dead.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 9:48:22 pm EST from 75.56.245.4

5) Were Angela and Gabriel an "item"? I'm assuming even though they call each other brother and sister, none of them are related blood rise, correct?

6) Do all 36 Avalon Gargoyles survive the Archmage's assault?

7) Any chance the magic in the sleeping hill will one day revive Magus or is he dead and gone forever?
TiniTinyTony <The Gargoyles Pulse>
The Gargoyles Pulse - updated every Monday
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 9:43:44 pm EST from 70.15.84.29

Questions:

1) Will we see the adventures of Tom in any of the Gargoyles Spinoffs or main comic?
2) Will there be any repercussions for waking up King Arthur "early" and will we see those repercussions in the comics?
3) Who's face is represented on the front of the Avalon boats?
4) Who's face is represented at the watery gateway to Avalon, where Magus turned the Weird Sisters into owls?

Thanks.
Tony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I'll be the number two guy here in Scranton in six weeks. How? Name repetition, personality mirroring and never breaking off a handshake. I'm always thinking one step ahead. Like a... carpenter... that makes stairs.
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 9:21:01 pm EST from 70.15.84.29

Thanks Ffllow Canuck, Wingless!
Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 7:45:05 pm EST from 198.53.239.8

Vaevictis> "He does react differently. After she says Gabriel is his biological son is when he gets that horrified look on his face and starts telling them he can't go with them."

- No. The reason he gets a horrified look on his face and starts telling them he can't go with them because Angela is talking about bringing him to Avalon to meet her brothers and sisters (and in particular, Gabriel). Coldstone doesn't care much about the biological aspect of Gabriel, but feels very worried about potentially harming the Avalon Clan. This is why he looks at Angela later and laments that he had to trick them because he couldn't risk harming his children.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 2:53:34 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Antiyonder> I never saw it, and honestly, I have no plans to.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 1:37:26 pm EST from 75.56.245.4

Matt >> He does react differently. After she says Gabriel is his biological son is when he gets that horrified look on his face and starts telling them he can't go with them.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 1:27:34 pm EST from 209.162.56.40

Johnny Modlin seems to have shown his true colors in Ask Greg again - http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=10138 . I had hoped that possibly since he posted in here, he had figured out why asking that particular question again and again was wrong.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 1:20:42 pm EST from 98.20.213.94

Greg B> So what were your thoughts on Atlantis 2, considering that it was suppose to set the tone for Team Atlantis?
Antiyonder
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 1:19:30 pm EST from 71.115.218.238

Greg B> "The series would have probably been fun, but, if I had my preference, I would rather not see those characters in "Gargoyles"."

-I tend to agree. I'm not a fan of crossovers at all. If Greg ever makes "The Lost" canon, I hope he uses analogues.

Vaevictis> "I wonder why Coldstone reacts differently to news of having a son that to meeting his daughter, or the news that ALL the eggs survived. Biological is in quotes like he doesn't know what the word means."

- Coldstone is thrilled the clan's eggs survived. He is thrilled that all of HIS sons and daughters are alive. He understands what "biological" means, he simply doesn't understand why it is brought up. He CLEARLY sees all of "The Eggs" as his children, including Angela. He knows he is the biological father of one of them, apparently a son, but it isn't important at all to him. They are all his kids. He doesn't react differently to news of having a son versus meeting Angela, he reacts differently to Angela's emphasis on biological relationships.

"Apparently Matrix has absorbed Dingo's old armor because it isn't there anymore."

- I've thought the same thing actually. Something to ask greg about...

"Matrix looks silly listening to a boombox. Which turns out to be part of him. Apparently he can pick up radio waves."

- Maybe he is picking up radio waves or maybe he is simply playing the same song he heard in Sydney two months before. It wouldn't surprise me if he is mimicing both the boom box an the music...
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 12:11:02 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

I got my comics! They are great! Karine Charlebois' art is amazing, it looks just like the animated show. I already watched the Radio Play but of course it is much better with visuals. Of course, because I watched the Radio Play I get to hear Brentwood's hilarious lines in my head.

I laughed so hard at the Super-Garg pose!
The way the clan treat the clones is kind of sad.
Quincy and Xanatos interacting is amusing.
The bloody cover of #5 with the Disney logo on it is ironic/amusing/strange. I'm sure most people don't expect that from a Disney comic!

The art in #6 mostly looks really good, once I got used to the pencils, but Lexington and Brooklyn and some of the shots of Angela looked wrong.
I noticed that the pictures of Gabriel and Iago were copied directly from specific shots in the animated series. That's interesting, but it indicates that the artists are getting a hold of the episodes and paying attention to them. I do wonder if they are supplied with the character model sheets, though.

I'm surprised that Greg changed the Avalon situation so that the magic does not translate. I thought that was more probable than that every single person they met on the other Tour stops spoke English, and well.

I wonder why Coldstone reacts differently to news of having a son that to meeting his daughter, or the news that ALL the eggs survived. Biological is in quotes like he doesn't know what the word means.

And how do the Illuminati know about that World Tour stop? And what "seeds" were "sown" at that time? I think Coldsteel might be in the Illuminati. Or Xanatos downloaded Coldstone's memory when he captured him.

SPOILERS
I think the best Bad Guys line has to be "There'll be no more *inserting*!" I laughed so hard at that! XD Apparently Matrix has absorbed Dingo's old armor because it isn't there anymore. And I'm sure that his original power armor didn't involve any "inserting." Heh poor Dingo. And then Matrix refuses to attach to him anymore! But I think that that link, and the ability to feel pain (and emotions?) will be quite important for any character development of Matrix.

I wonder where that guy got a hold of thylacines. And I hope there are more wherever they came from! I like the idea of having them in the Gargoyles Universe, and they were drawn very well. They looked quite accurate to me. They can jump like *** and they've got teeth like *** ! I'm glad that Dingo had the sense not to hurt them. But what did Matrix put around their necks and muzzles? They left them tied up when Dingo flew away, so are they attached to the tree by abandoned nanobots? o.0

Dingo is obviously enjoying being a superhero, because he's using lots of cliches.

Matrix looks silly listening to a boombox. Which turns out to be part of him. Apparently he can pick up radio waves.

Yama has a katana, and he's polishing it. Heh.

No funny jokes from Fang, but he is drawn very well.

If we didn't already know the basic plot of Bad Guys, I'd be very concerned by that talk of tengu hunting.

Strange that Matrix can be disabled by an em pulse. And when he's wrapped around Dingo, he's effectively disabled as well. That's quite a weakness!
SPOILERS

More comments later.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 11:33:09 am EST from 209.162.56.40

ANTIYONDER> "Makes me wonder if Tad Stones could convince SLG to approve for a Team Atlantis comic. Or would Disney still feel the bad taste of box office bombing?"

Disney loves money. These comics are pretty much free money as far as they're concerned. They spend nothing, and they make money off the licensing fee. They wouldn't care. It's SLG who'd have to decide if it was worth their investment, and last I heard, "Gargoyles" is the only one that really worked. "Tron", seems to have disappeared. Same with "Wonderland".

I will admit, I thought "Atlantis" was a horrible movie. The series would have probably been fun, but, if I had my preference, I would rather not see those characters in "Gargoyles".
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 11:25:52 am EST from 75.56.245.4

Makes me wonder if Tad Stones could convince SLG to approve for a Team Atlantis comic. Or would Disney still feel the bad taste of box office bombing?
Antiyonder
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 10:44:54 am EST from 71.115.218.238

I agree that St. Columba's encounter with a water monster near Loch Ness (the encounter actually took place at the river Ness, connected to the loch, rather than at the loch itself) is the most likely reason for his inclusion in "This Day in the Gargoyles Universe". Though I would like to know how Greg Weisman found out what day of the year Columba was born in.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 7:19:54 am EST from 4.244.215.166

Battle Beast: I think Greg/the people involved with the project donated it. Maybe disney but I doubt it. Keep in mind that Some of the episodes for Team atlantis Story boarded, Some were voice recorded and a handful were animated and released as the direct to video spin off of the movie. The episode with Demona got as far as as the voice recording session(dry voices, no music or sound effects). As for the auction cost-we gathering folks are not a rich lot, it was in the high 100s-hard to remember all that long ago.

As for how far the project is along, you'd have to ask Vash. I only ever got to see act one partially done. and that was a year or 2 ago. Mind you, I haven't been able to afford to go to a gathering of late either-nor felt healthy enough to travel.
Wingless
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 4:04:18 am EST from 99.245.254.123

dph> Coincidence?

With Greg... probably not.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 3:12:30 am EST from 75.42.217.201

I have a relatively dumb question about This day in Gargoyles' Universe History.

Greg says:
December 7th...
521
Columba is born in County Donegal, Ireland.
Here's the article from Wikipedia about him: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columba . My question is why would Greg put this person's birth on the gargoyle calendar. The thing I found interesting was this: Vita Columbae. This is where the 1st supposed reference to the Loch Ness Monster is found.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Sat, Dec 8, 2007 3:09:06 am EST from 98.20.213.94

The earlier versions of the basilisk legend (back in Roman times) do make it a monstrous snake; the half-rooster half-serpent came along later. (Though I prefer that version myself.)
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 9:55:32 pm EST from 4.244.210.198

Algernon> Dracula huh? The thought of gargoyle vampires is kind of a scary.
What would be scarier would be a diclonious-gargoyle hybrid. That's my opinion though. BTW if you are wondering what a dicloni is, I'd be happy to explain ^_^

Vaevictis Asmadi> I know of some famous mythologocal serpents. Like The Lamia, Basilisk, Hydra (actually a hydra would be considered a dragon), Setmet, Quetzalcoatl, and that's it so far. What I find funny is that the basilisk in HP is all wrong. It's supost to be half-rooster and half-snake.
Estella - [eternalsailorsilvermoon at sailormoon dot org]
Watch out for flying reindeer!!! XP
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 9:39:43 pm EST from 75.169.15.217

I just gotta say that I preferred the Justice Guild, because it worked in the Green Lanntern childhood nostalgia angle, which was part of what made "Legends" one of my favourite JL epioses. New characters served the purpose of satire better, too, making it more universal, though I know that satire apparently wasn't the writers' primary adjective (hard to tell looking at only the epiosde).

But to use a counterexample, has anybody read the Sandman volume, "A Game of You"? A Superman reference was changed to an ersatz stand-in because DC didn't like how it reflected on the characters. Which was a little jarring, because the characters were so obviously them.

Nothing more to add, just getting it out there.

And yes, I am very excited for more comics.
Incisivis - [incisivis at hotmail dot com]
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality; even larks and katydids are supposed, by some, to dream"--Shirley Jackson
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 9:18:32 pm EST from 216.36.154.204

That date is obviously a typo, since comics ship on Wednesdays. But yes, I think it's safe to say that next Wednesday is the day.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 9:01:45 pm EST from 75.56.245.4

Matt - <So... "The Rock" in less than a week... everyone excited?> Monday afternoon, when it is confirmed that is arriving Wednesday, that's when I will be excited. However, I'm more concerned about Bad Guys issue #2. SLG put out its list of new releases for January and Bad Guys issue #2 isn't listed.

Wait a minute. http://www.slgcomic.com/info-exec/display/shipping has the following notation:
12/7/07
Gargoyles #7
Does that mean issue #7 is definitely coming out this Wednesday?
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 8:41:12 pm EST from 98.20.213.94

Algernon >> Most of the serpents in Egyptian mythology look like ordinary snakes (especially cobras) but they breathe fire in their role as defenders of the pharaoh and the sun god. However, there are some serpents in the afterlife (Duat) which I would consider dragons since they have wings, legs, multiple heads, etc. Though I've never seen reference to a multi-headed serpent breathing fire.

Several of them are mentioned an illustrated in the Book of Am-Duat, which I have been reading here:
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/egipto/egyptian_heavenhell/bat/index1.htm#index
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 7:43:26 pm EST from 71.34.43.187

Wingless> The project isn't done yet, is it?

WHO auctioned them off?

and was the total in the $1,000's, or add zero's?

Just curious.

Thanks!
Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 5:43:46 pm EST from 198.53.239.8

i just ordered 6 and bad guys from SLG. I was wondering how long does it normally take SLG to ship the comics And how long does it take to get the comics.
Thanx
bob
bob
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 5:22:33 pm EST from 66.202.98.39

Happy Hanukkah (Hanukah)(chanuka) to those of you here that celebrate it! I've always wondered why the word has multiple spellings ;P


VA-Ah, well it is the one episode that of TGC that wasn't destroyed by bad writing. The only really annoying things about it is the monolgoue in the beginning and that goliath glides off in the end on his broken wing. As for watching downloaded episodes...I personally don't see how that's much worse than video taping episodes on tv-which is what I did. And it's not as if there's any other way you could watch it.
Purplegoldfish - [Skydragonn at aol dot com]
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 2:39:07 pm EST from 69.183.34.195

Greg B> I give you Macbeth, though I doubt he would have been included if not for being notarised by old Willy, but what about say Titania who was entirely a creation of the bard. Heck why stop at Shakespeare? What about Greg's plans to incorporate Dracula into the Gargoyles Universe?

Moving beyond Gargoyles for a sec, how many great movies, books, TV shows and comics have been based on the works of the bard. I just find it slightly scary that we are entering an age when virtually all contemporary culture is owned by one corporation or another.

Vaevictis Asmadi> I don't remember ever reading anything about dragons in Egyptian mythology, could I get more info please?
Algernon
The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.- Terry Pratchett
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 1:07:49 pm EST from 86.41.203.231

There seems to be some good news about Spectacular Spider-Man, including an additional 13 episodes... before the show has even aired!
Scott Iskow - [smiskow at lycos dot com]
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 11:28:56 am EST from 207.226.255.67

L.T. Williams> Just my opinion, but I think the Justice Guild was weak for the very reason you sighted. Who wants pale imitations? Analogue characters are fine -- as a second choice.

The JGA were a second choice. As I mentioned, The JSA clashed with their modern portrayal, thus they couldn't use them directly.

Infact, Greg might use some analogue characters should he end up writing the Team Atlantis into the comic. Though he does want to use the Atlantis cast.
Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 11:05:31 am EST from 71.115.192.199

So... "The Rock" in less than a week... everyone excited?
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 10:56:51 am EST from 24.207.163.239

Battle Beaste - The Audio tape, Script & Story board for "The Last" was auctioned off at at a gathering (think in New York 2003). It went for quite a bit, so several of us went together on purchasing it (largely thanks to IRC Goliath) - and thus the project Vash has been hard at work at over the last number years came to be.
Wingless
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 3:23:01 am EST from 99.245.254.123

Vashkoda IS a woman? Huh. (Sorry. Just surprising.)

So, how did you manage to purchase the voice tape and story boards from Disney???

Interesting. Can't wait to see it...
Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 1:22:26 am EST from 198.53.239.8

Well I finally got my comic today.

*SIGH* *SPOILERS*

I'm sorry to say that I don't think Dingo was the right character to start off with. I would have gone straight for Yama. But, he's next.

COLOR V. Black and White:

I though the comic would be just black and white, no grey scale color fill-ins, like early "Ninja Turtles" were. I happy to say that I think the black and white is pretty good.

I am not crazy about the artwork, but seeing as how it is "Gargoyles" I am tickled to have it! Some of the art I did like was the Robin/Dingo fight; Robin's back flip in particular.

I thought "Tasmanian Tiger" was WAAAY to Batmanish/the Tickish, but I thought he was funny none-the-less.

But, overall, I am happy the book is out and art aside CUDOS to the artist and Greg W!
Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Fri, Dec 7, 2007 12:59:56 am EST from 198.53.239.8

I'm avoiding the spoilers, I just got the email that my comics shipped so they should be at ready when I go home for the weekend...

Purplegoldfish >> I thought that they changed some things from the original script/plans when the Journey was made. I wasn't aware they were pretty much the same.

The other reason is that my comics I paid for, whereas my copy of the Journey isn't legal...
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 11:49:15 pm EST from 71.34.43.187

copyrights: Every character and story are built up from or are inspired by the works of others from the past. How could they not be? We create what we know, and it's nearly impossible to create a character without inspiration from existing characters.
Everyone knows that the Disney Company based most of their animated movies off of existing stories. They don't claim to have created the idea behind the stories, it's just common knowledge. But they took these characters and settings and made them their own. They own the "disneyfied" versions of the characters, but not the characters themselves. (It makes me mad thay they claimed "winnie the Pooh" as their own, as they did not create those characetrs)

I don't think it's right to take someone's character and say you created it, but I think we should be able to create characters based on others without having to pay a huge sum to the original creator. Shakespeare's plays are still popular today because of all the different intrepretations of characters through books and film. Imagine if one company owned the sole rights to Shakespeare's plays-we'de be missing out on a lot.

VA- I'm just curious why you don't want to see "the journey" episode. It's actually pretty much scene-for-scene, word-for-word of the comic. (I once read the comic with the episode on) The animation is not as good as the first two seasons, but it's still decent and it's a good episode. The only big difference is that the scene with goliath and Arty aren't in it. The scene in the clock tower is pretty well animated and you can actually tell what's going on which is something I had a lot of trouble with in the book. Nothing personal or anything, I just really like the episode and was wondering why you have such an aversion to it (It is nothing like the other TGC episodes.)

Still haven't gotten bad guys since I'll just get it when I get #7. Honestly the premise doesn't excite me much and I'm not all that interested in these particular characters but I'll give it a chance. I've read the spoilers-the Tasmanian tiger sounds kind of lame and I thorougly dislike WITCH, so I'm having doubts about my liking this spinoff-but I am glad that gargoyles is branching out, and I hope it will be successful.
Purplegoldfish - [Skydragonn at aol dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 8:49:50 pm EST from 69.183.34.195

Point is, I'm sure Greg would have managed just fine. As for the episode title, he would simply just need to try for another name.
Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 8:19:42 pm EST from 71.115.192.199

Puck was not invented by Bill Shakespeare.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puck_%28mythology%29

204 days left until The Gathering 2008 in Chicago, Illinois!
Patrick - [<-- The Gathering 2008]
"There's nothing to explain. You're trying to kidnap what I've rightfully stolen." - Vizzini, "The Princess Bride"
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 8:14:33 pm EST from 76.241.137.12

And wasn't some of the stuff with the Weird Sisters based on Hollinshed's Chronicles?

But Puck and Titania are pure Shakespeare.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 7:52:33 pm EST from 71.34.43.187

Greg B. : Yes, it was Scott Cleverdon.
Spen
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 7:18:11 pm EST from 66.43.205.110

Macbeth was a real historical figure, not a creation of Shakespeare's. Although City of Stone is much more historically accurate than the Bard's play.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 7:06:46 pm EST from 75.56.245.4

Greg B> I have all the TGC eps on tape, but they are in my mom's basement. I don't keep them on hand, of course.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 7:02:08 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Love, love dragons, though I'm primarily interested in dragon-viewpoint books and dislike certain iconic images (I used to refer to Anne McAffrey's works as "horsebug" dragons)

As to "Dragons: A Fantasy Made Real", I'm guessing where some viewers see a similarity is in the basic theory of "air sacs" of some kind being used to lighten the dragon for flight. There's "Dragons" and "Flight of", and then Naomi Novik used a similar idea in her books. But I do recall reading somewhere else that this wouldn't really reduce the beast's weight enough to allow for flight.

When I think of real versus ideal dragons, though, I keep coming back to Terry Pratchett and Guards! Guards!

For the record, my favourite fictional dragon is actually Khisanth from the Dragonlance series of RPG novels. Most books like that suck, but I thought Mary Kirchoff really made a great character out of her. The only reason I'm looking forward to the Dragonlance animated movie is that I'll get to see Khisanth in cartoon form, though in her original role as a simple enemy to be destroyed.
Incisivis - [incisivis at hotmail dot com]
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality; even larks and katydids are supposed, by some, to dream" -- Shirley Jackson
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 6:51:12 pm EST from 216.36.154.204

Just my opinion, but I think the Justice Guild was weak for the very reason you sighted. Who wants pale imitations? Analogue characters are fine -- as a second choice. But no analogue to Macbeth would carry the same weight and dramatic heft as Macbeth himself. Even the name. Can you imagine if the title of the episode of his first appearance were "Enter Macfife" or whatever? Who'd have cared?
L.T. Williams
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 6:43:46 pm EST from 71.93.81.240

Question, does anyone out there have TGC on tape? Specifically the end credits?

I was wondering who voiced John Castaway after "The Journey"? I know it was Alan Cumming in that episode, but would you believe that IMDB doesn't even acknowledge that?

Did Scott Cleverdon come back for Castaway's other two appearances, or was that still Alan Cumming? Anyone know?
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 6:36:36 pm EST from 75.56.245.4

VAEVICTIS - It mentions Apep, at least. I don't remember it mentioning any fire-breathing Egyptian dragons.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 5:08:51 pm EST from 4.245.20.136

Algernon: While it would be a shame if Greg couldn't use the Shakespeare characters, I doubt very highly that Gargoyles would suffer in quality. Even then, analogue characters could work just as well.

Heck Bruce Timm and company did well on the Justice League episode Legends with their newly created Justice Guild Of America (They wanted to use the Godlen Age Justice Society, but since it clashed with the teams modern portrayal, DC forbid the usage of the team).
Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 4:28:35 pm EST from 71.115.192.199

Admittedly, some of the author's assertions aren't good, but nobody's perfect. LOL
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 3:41:24 pm EST from 199.38.51.134

Oh, this is cool! Just found it, and it seems to be quite comprehensive. I need to bookmark this when I get home from work. It's got alphabetical and by-country listings, historical stuff, theoretical speculation, all that good stuff. ^..^

http://www.blackdrago.com/index.html
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 3:26:47 pm EST from 199.38.51.134

Kth> Thanks. I'll go check out the site again.
Asatira
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 2:38:38 pm EST from 131.204.97.9

Todd >> That sounds like a fascinating book! Does it mention the dragons in Egyptian mythology? I am reading about Egyptian mythology right now and I was surprised to learn that it includes fire-breathing dragons. And some Egyptian dragons are pretty weird-looking -- all sorts of multiple heads and odd numbers of legs.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 2:38:23 pm EST from 71.34.43.187

Tony> I am a certified dragon nut, and in my case it's congenital and incurable. ;P
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 10:41:47 am EST from 199.38.51.134

I'm surprised that someone mentions "dragons" and the comment room blows up with excitement. I think dragons are awesome, and I have collected all twelve Dragons of Fantasy by Michael Whelan, but I have no where near the knowledge that some of you have about them. I'm amazed and astonished. I guess if you love one fantasy winged creature you love them all.

' * * *

The red dot on the front cover of Bad Guys #1 is yet another mistake by SLG. Surprised? No. Will it deter sales of BG #1? No. Should we not worry about it? Yes. Should we be happy that there are no logistical errors? Very much so.
TiniTinyTony <The Gargoyles Pulse>
The Gargoyles Pulse - updated every Monday
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 10:19:23 am EST from 159.240.11.254

Asatira> Yeah, they kind of forgot to put the 4 to 6 limb transition in the special itself. It's on the offical site for the show, but they cut it out of the program. I think that it was silly to leave out something so important as how they managed to have more limbs than all other vertebrates, but they didn't ask me. ;P

Apparently aquatic dragons began with 4 limbs, but a mutation allowed another set of legs, and it was so successful that it passed to all future species. The aquatic dragon pictured was reputed to live in shallower water; I'd imagine an open ocean species would have had larger wings for propulsion and/or steering, and forelegs for grasping prey or defense against sharks and other large predators of the time.
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 9:47:02 am EST from 199.38.51.134

Kerry (Kth)> yeah, I realized I got it backwards when I looked at the wiki. I was a bit frustrated by how the wings went vestigal, ie the front limbs that had been the wings became regular legs, but there were still wing remnants. After thinking about it, I think some of the structures, namely the membrane and some bones, were the part that "moved" for lack of a better word, and became vestigal, then became fully seperate wings when operational ones were needed again. That's one way of going about it (and I'm over thinking)
Asatira
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 9:33:20 am EST from 68.119.95.174

Asatira> Well, the aquatic dragon did have wings, just tiny ones. The Asian (forest) dragon didn't need them to be any bigger, as the bamboo forest is too thick to permit that large a creature to fly through it. But as they spread westward, they'd have encountered mountains and plains better suited to flight and the wings would have evolved to be larger again.
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 9:06:48 am EST from 199.38.51.134

Greg B and Copyright> Let me but it this way. Wow do you think "Gargoyles would have turned out if the rights to the collected works of Shakespeare had been owned by old Willy's great grandkids? That would mean no Macbeth which means no "City of Stone". No Oberon, Titiania or Puck, which means no Owen or baby Alex.

Half of the great works of western literature or art are based on the other half that came before it. Do we need Mickey Mouse or Superman? Maybe not, but I think you should ask yourself what makes them so different from King Arthur or Anubis.
Algernon
"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up" -C. S. Lewis
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 9:01:01 am EST from 149.157.1.180

I rather enjoyed the AP special. I liked how they approached the development of the limbs, although I still wonder how the wings re-evolved from the aquatic ancestor they had. I liked the designs overall. I wonder if the artist ever made prints of them or not.
Asatira
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 8:59:21 am EST from 68.119.95.174

Oops. Sorry. Stupid thing ate the link. Let's see if this one works better.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Dragon_%28Mockumentary%29
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 8:55:42 am EST from 199.38.51.134

Vaevictis> Unfortunately, it wasn't a series, just a one-time special. It'd have been nice if there was... an hour on each major dragon type would have been interesting.

While the hydrogen for lift/fire was used, they added methane. Both are produced through food metabolism (and stored in a single sac), and platinum was the catalyst to create flame, not bioelectricity. I don't think surface platinum would have been plentiful enough for such a thing, but I'm not a geologist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Dragon_(docudrama)
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 8:54:44 am EST from 199.38.51.134

Al> Yes, my copy and every other copy I've seen has the red square. I asked about it in here last week, but no one said anything.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 8:26:31 am EST from 24.207.163.239

Ah, I hadn't thought that the initials were an in-joke, but it makes sense. Thanks.

SIREN - I have a book about dragons, tracing their role in legend and history from ancient Mesopotamia to the present day, written by Peter Hogarth. I wonder if he's the same as the Dr. Peter Hogarth you mentioned.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 6:31:09 am EST from 4.244.208.145

Out of curiosity, anybody else's copy of Strangers have a red dot in the middle of the front cover?
Al
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 5:54:21 am EST from 202.7.176.139

Interesting! The preview of it that I had watched looked to be extremely similar to the book in its theories. Now I am curious (for those who watched the series?) what are some of the differences between the two theories?
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Thu, Dec 6, 2007 12:05:03 am EST from 71.34.43.187

Vaevictis Asmadi> The Animal Planet special was not based on Flight of Dragons. The theories of dragon flight differ. As well as the theories on fire breath and overall behavior. Dr. Peter J. Hogarth was the consultant of Dragons: A Fantasy Made Real.

Dragonology and Dragons and Unicorns are also two other great books on the "natural history" of dragons.
Siren
Don't knock on Death's door. Ring his doorbell and run, he hates that.
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 10:53:52 pm EST from 68.202.76.113

Todd: Who wrote and did the art for Bad Guys #1?
Gorebash
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 9:57:35 pm EST from 70.22.232.91

Vaevictis Asmadi - <Hmm, with DPH and Gorebash both having the same font color and no avatars, they're confusing to tell apart.> I don't like using an avatar unless the text of my comment exceeds a certain length. It goes back to the days when I was using standard telephone dial-up for my connection. It would drive me nuts when somebody would post something really like "me too" and use an avatar because it would make the page load that much slower when I viewed the page with images. I'm not saying that I don't feel that way at times, but I don't express it. There's one big difference between Gorebash and myself: the fandom owes him a bunch for setting up Ask Greg.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 9:51:00 pm EST from 216.96.17.35

Todd: I would have thought that the GW and KC initials looks HIGHLY familiar the credits of Bad Guys . . . :D
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 9:21:33 pm EST from 157.242.207.32

I remember the film from when I was little. I watched it all the time. Imagine my frustration to find the book by the same name was so different. Then I eventually found "The Dragon and the George" in my college's library, as well as a copy of "Flight." Much more appreciated as an older reader for both.
Asatira
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 8:30:37 pm EST from 68.119.95.174

Vaevictis, I don't think the animal planet special wasw based on the book. While some of the theories were similar, there were also differences.

And to you, Gore and Kerry, I'll consider the mentions of The Dragon and the George to be a recommendation, and look into getting it from the library before my semi-annual trip to Chicago in a couple weeks. Thanks, friends.

And Incisivis, as a couple of us have said, the science behind the "Dickinson theory," as I call it, is fairly sound. I'll see if I can find a copy of the paper I wrote on the subject for you, give you something to work off of.
Shadow Wing
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 7:52:43 pm EST from 64.12.117.134

Todd Jensen:

Australian here, but not a clue sorry. I would imagine however that it is nothing significant, just a method of coding police cars for easy identification or whatnot. I don't even recall ever seeing a car marked like that in real life, so it might just be an NSW thing.
Al
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 7:43:38 pm EST from 202.7.176.139

Hmm, with DPH and Gorebash both having the same font color and no avatars, they're confusing to tell apart.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 7:36:27 pm EST from 71.34.43.187

Bad Guys: Review coming, but just let me say that I really enjoyed it.

Dragons: I have to say, I am a big dragon fan and was pretty disappointed with Flight of Dragons. Not as an adaptation, just as a movie. But I really would like to read the Flight of Dragons book: I'm developing my own dragon race, and like reading alternate perspectives on what I'm doing. But I've always felt that it's biologically impossible to make dragons that are completely true to the real axioms of biology and still have all the abilities and power they have in fiction. I'm just going to take bits and pieces from real animals and then invent my own consistent internal rules.
Incisivis - [incisivis at hotmail dot com]
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality; even larks and katydids are supposed, by some, to dream"--Shirley Jackson
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 7:35:11 pm EST from 216.36.154.204

I've a copy of "The Flight of Dragons" myself, and think it's a fun book. To everyone who hasn't read it, I highly recommend it.

* SPOILERS FOR BAD GUYS #1 *

Does anybody more familiar with Australia (and particularly with Australian law enforcement) than I am know the significance of the "GW" and "KC" initials on the police cars that show up after Dingo's battle with Tazmanian Tiger?

* SPOILERS END *
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 7:21:47 pm EST from 4.244.215.143

I'm all for the company/individuals getting a return on investment when they create a movie/video and I understand the need to remain some degree of control over the use of the characters. But sheesh, by 30-50 years after a movie's release, I expect the cost of the movie to be recovered plus a pretty nice return on investment. Since the movie has been recovered, there's really no need to hang on to the property. But if after 3-50 years after the release of a movie, if it has not broken even in terms of cost, it probably never will so there's nothing lost in moving the movie to the public domain. What this is about is excessive greed. If you want to hang on to the rights of a movie indefinitely and continiously earn money off of it, fine, then put the movie on the web and let people watch it with advertising.

Gorebash - <I know the proper spelling is "Gorbash", but when I first started using it I had yet to read any of the books and came up with the E spelling on the spot.> I actually like the way you spell your name.

http://www.brokenfrontier.com/reviews/details.php?id=1639 <- Review of Bad Guys issue #1
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 7:06:14 pm EST from 216.96.17.35

VA: "I'm not as excited as all you were because I didn't have to wait ten years. So I didn't wet myself with excitement."

Who told you about that!?? (**Blushes**)

But anyways, yes, we were pretty giddy getting the first few comics. And I do remember many of us doubting we'd have so many issues to come after that six month delay. (Man, and we're getting a comic every month now! I don't think i'll ever get tired saying that . . . .)

So i presumer that you're planning on reviewing them under the 'grander' stories (Isues 1+2, 3,4,+5, 6, & 7,8,+9)?

Rankin/Bass: That reminds me, I got a gazillion Christmas specials to start watching . . . :D
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 6:24:34 pm EST from 157.242.207.32

Oh, sorry to double post, forgot to add,

I believe that the Animal Planet special was based directly on the book, Flight of Dragons. And I believe the book also contains quotes from The Dragon and the George.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 5:56:59 pm EST from 71.34.43.187

Wow, somebody just posted a question asking Greg how to acquire super powers. o.0

Flight of Dragons >> I have that book, I actually got it from my high school library when they were getting rid of it. I don't know why they wanted to get rid of it, but it is a great book. I don't think the ideas in are *truly* biologically possible (I'm not enough of a biochemist to figure out for sure), but they are mostly plausible.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 5:55:21 pm EST from 71.34.43.187

Greg B: Do we need Mickey Mouse in the public domain? Well let's put it this way: Walt Disney needed the works of the Brothers Grimm, which are in the public domain, to create all those movies the Disney empire is based upon.

So, yes, we do need Mickey Mouse and Superman in the public domain. Just like Walt Disney took the works of others and created something new, future generations should have the chance to do the same with Mickey and Superman.
Gorebash
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 4:17:58 pm EST from 207.206.239.1

I've seen Flight of Dragons, I've actually got TWO copies of the book, one an original printing the other a soft-cover reprint that came out a couple years ago. I've also read the entire Dragon Knight series from Dickson including the precursor to the series "The Dragon and the George".

The name initially came from the Rankin & Bass cartoon It is something I first saw when I was pretty young (4 or 5) and have loved ever since. The book I had never seen until I found a copy at a local library and starting searching to find my own. The book series I don't think I started reading until 1998 or so and was caught up in time for Fair Maid of Kent's release in 2000.

I was saddened to learn of Gordon Dickson's death in 2001. It was obvious there were many more stories to tell in the series (rumor has it he was already working on the next book when he passed). But it's nice that we were left with an obvious compass for the direction the series was taking (such as Jim's rating going up even though he'd been told he'd never be above a D).

I know the proper spelling is "Gorbash", but when I first started using it I had yet to read any of the books and came up with the E spelling on the spot.
Gorebash
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 4:15:07 pm EST from 207.206.239.1

Shadow Wing> Definitely. I was just making sure, since the dragon biology in the movie was taken from Flight of Dragons, and the storyline from The Dragon and the George.
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 3:23:47 pm EST from 199.38.51.134

Matt> Well, yes.

I can just picture the ice that won't melt when (if) Yama and Taro meet again.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 3:21:21 pm EST from 76.228.105.243

I do mean The Flight of Dragons. And worth commenting is that it isn't a story, but a theoretical book of science on how dragons COULD HAVE existed. And not just some cheap, shallow explanations aimed at young children that really make no sense (coughcoughDragonologycoughcough), but sound theories from a truly scientific perspective, like the Animal Planet special "Dragons: A Fantasy Made Real."

Not what I expected, but a fascinating read nonetheless.

(And the Rankin/Bass movie was "based on the book" only in terms of using Dickinson's theories on dragon fire, dragon flight, etc.)
Shadow Wing
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 3:17:48 pm EST from 164.106.232.146

Shadow Wing> You have Flight of Dragons, or The Dragon and the George (the novel version of St. Dragon and the George)?
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 3:06:21 pm EST from 199.38.51.134

Shoutout and/or question to Gorebash:

Am I right in guessing that your name comes from the old Rankin/Bass cartoon "The Flight of Dragons?"

If so, would you be interested in seeing the original book? I have a copy, and as I hope to attend The Gathering 2008, I can bring it if you like. But I doubt it's what you expect.

And as the book is out of print, that would probably be your best chance of seeing it.
Shadow Wing
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 2:49:12 pm EST from 164.106.232.146

We'll see, but remember that Vinnie went to Japan to work for Taro.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 2:44:18 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Matt> Yeah, he did.

Most likely, he'll ally with Yama for some reason, given that he's in Ishimura.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 2:20:21 pm EST from 76.228.105.243

Vaevictis> I'm pretty sure Greg said that we'll be seeing Vinnie in Bad Guys #2 in a couple months.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 1:56:40 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

So everybody is posting their reviews of Bad Guys, and I'm still waiting for my order. I really want to post my next "question" right away, but first maybe I'll join in the fun?

Back when I first go the DVDs (and watched most of the eps for the first time) I was posting my reactions on the Comment Room. I got out of the habit, so maybe I'll start up again with the comics now. Not long fancy reviews, just my scattered reactions (as before). (BONUS -- now with proofreading!)

1-2
So I'm not as excited as all you were because I didn't have to wait ten years. So I didn't wet myself with excitement. But I do like the comics. I've also never watched The Journey (don't want to), so I can't compare these comics to it.

It is very different reading Gargoyles instead of watching it. I've never read comics at all before this, so it is quite an unfamiliar medium. I really came to like the animation style of Gargoyles, it was quite beautiful. The comic art is in a different style and will take some getting used to, but I don't dislike David Hedgecock's style. He does good facial expressions. Sometimes the individual characters do look off however, Broadway is consistently off-model and it really bugs me. Angela's wing-claws are too small. Hudson looks green and Alex's hair changed color... though with Alex you never know, he also grew into a toddler in no time, so maybe halflings/quarterlings are just weird like that. It was hard to follow the fight on the rooftops because of the darkness, but also because I'm not used to following action in a comic. I'm used to seeing it animated.

The story itself is kind of sad in #1-2. The gargoyles were just settling into Manhattan, and now the Hunters have ruined everything. The Quarrymen are pretty scary and the make me angry. And Margot Yale, she makes me so mad! She claims gargoyles are mere animals, but I can't help thinking that she really believes they are magical/demonic monsters. I mean, would she be freaking out like this, would the government set up a Task Force, if an unknown species of great ape were discovered in Manhattan? People would get irrational but not *this* violent and paranoid. The sad thing of course is that in real life, people totally would react to gargoyles this way. And these are the "ordinary" citizens, I can't imagine what the religious conservatives are doing.

*Matt tells people there is no known threat from these gargoyles, but I know that probably 2 or 3 people in all New York actually listened to that...

*Vinnie is so overly dramatic. "I hunted one down and got REVENGE." Then he's worried about "emotional trauma caused by the pie-throwing incident." XD The look on his face in that frame is hilarious, like he's feeling so terrible that he threw that pie. I like Vinnie, I really hope Greg tells us about his adventures in Japan!

*Lex is so funny with Alex, with the kid pulling on his ears and nose and the look on his face. And I also like the look on his face when Xanatos wants to give Alex a piggyback ride, like Lex is thinking "Who is this guy and what did he do with the real Xanatos?!" And ignoring a direct call from Duval... nice going, X.

*The juxtaposition of Margot's histerical claims with the clan's real nature is very well done. And I like seeing Macbeth being an ally to the clan here. I think of him as a "good guy" even though he was real nasty in Enter Macbeth. He comes accross as so much more sympathetic in City of Stone.

*I miss Keith David's voice in the fight scenes, but the voices on the show WERE distinctive enough that I can mostly hear them in my head as I read.

*I like the way Goliath handles Artie's shooting at him. Short and sweet explanation (and demonstration) of the facts, but he also takes care of that gun.

I'm sure I forgot a bunch more of my initial reactions.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 1:41:58 pm EST from 71.34.43.187

And I think, it should belong to the company or estate which brought it about in the first place. Does the public really need Mickey Mouse in the public domain? No. Superman? No.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 1:03:30 pm EST from 75.56.245.4

Personally I think a work should be given about ninety years after it's first published before falling into public domain. This gives the original creator or their inheritors plenty of time to get rich off their success.

If not I would prefer an inversion of DHP's position where the original work itself remains under protection but the characters and concepts in it fall under public domain. That way, Arthur Conan Doyle's grandkids get royalties from stuff like "A Study in Scarlet" but Neil Gaimen can still write a story about Professor Moriarty.
Algernon
The pen is mightier than the sword if the sword is very short, and the pen is very sharp.- Terry Pratchett
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 12:36:29 pm EST from 149.157.1.180

Greg B: I'm afraid I must side with DPH on this. Copyright laws are a bit ridiculous. The ironic bit is that Disney is the reason why.

http://randomfoo.net/oscon/2002/lessig/free.html
Gorebash
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 11:22:15 am EST from 207.206.239.1

Thanks for the encouraging words. Some may see it as overkill. I see it as a valuable resource.

dph> Thanks. I've never been to that site.

Vashkoda> If you like my complication of data from other sites, feel free to either copy all my source HTML code and paste it to have on your site or link directly to my site from your site. Thanks.
The Gargoyles Pulse - [TiniTinyTony]
The Gargoyles Pulse - updated every Monday
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 10:56:25 am EST from 159.240.11.254

errg double post sorry

I meant 1999-2000
Justin - [jlindley07 at gmail dot com]
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 10:02:41 am EST from 74.135.61.121

I have to second Greg B on this.

DPH> It seems like if it isnt your understanding of the Illuminati it's what you'd prefer in terms of things that necessarilly arent reality.

This goes back years for me, you may not remember me DPH, but I remember a long time ago, circa 1990-2000, when you and I briefly worked an something you came up with involving the anatomy of a gargoyle and how their feet evolved etc.

I promise, Im not flaming, simply voicing an honest criticism. I also promise this is in no way and attack. Just throwing in my 2 cents.
Justin - [jlindley07 at gmail dot com]
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 9:59:33 am EST from 74.135.61.121

DPH> What you like to think and reality don't often mesh. Honestly, I don't see why these movies should fall into the public domain. The people and studios who made them are still around, and are entitled to ownership.

You, however, are not entitled to watch a movie for free.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 9:33:52 am EST from 75.56.245.4

What I'm inclined to believe in is that movies/videos don't remain under copyright indefinitely. What I prefer is that after 30-50 years movies/videos enter the public domain, but the characters within the movies don't. This would give people the right to distribute the movie and the creators the ability to retain control of their characters. Either that or the companies start making their old videos available to watch through advertiser supported websites.

Vash - So that's what you're up. Good to hear you from.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 3:07:59 am EST from 216.96.17.35

Thanks for the plug, DPH, but that site hasn't been updated in forever (I'd be feeling more guilty if I wasn't already stressed about board exams). Gah, I need more free time!

But since I'm already here, I will plug a project that I *can* still manage with my schedule. If there are any fan artists out there (including people good at cleaning line-art or even just coloring) who want to contribute to the "Team Atlantis"/"Gargoyles" cross-over episode video project, send me an email. I figure most of you know about this already, but for any new people who don't, just look up "The Last" in garg-wiki or "Ask Greg". Oh, and anyone who's creative at synthisizing background music or sound effects is also welcome (I've already scavenged the Gargoyles and Atlantis soundtracks).
Vashkoda - [mynamegoeshere at gmail dot com]
D2 <Can I have it?>
posted @ Wed, Dec 5, 2007 1:37:15 am EST from 71.107.20.60

Wouldn't be a better answer be working with Vash on the GNC - http://www.gargoyles-news.org/ ?

TiniTinyTony - I sent you an email with Vash's email address so you can get in touch with her.

Slg finally updated their release schedule page. I noticed that they don't have any gargoyles material listed for January yet.

I know this may sound relatively stupid and soon, but by the end of this year, will we know how well the 1st comic of the 1st spin-off of gargoyles sold?
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 10:24:14 pm EST from 71.29.71.67

I use Paypal a lot and never have trouble with it. I only use it if I need to buy something that don't take my Debit card. I will never have a credit card, i'll be in debt if I had one.
vicky82 - [vickyfanofwwe at aol dot com]
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 9:35:53 pm EST from 195.93.21.4

I don't see any problem with it. If anything, I think multiple resources would help to more effectively spread the word.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does?" -Gaff ("Blade Runner")
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 9:07:16 pm EST from 71.62.198.251

It looks like a nifty site. Not any new information, but all in one place.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 8:25:03 pm EST from 216.160.57.97

As long as the site is kept up to date, very up to date, I think it is a great idea. With two comics coming out and the trade paperbacks, and with the constantly changing dates, it is hard to know sometimes. In any case, I don't think it hurts anything.
Tony, might I suggest making this site your linked website on this page and advertising it on your posts as such. Good work.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 7:29:25 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Greg> Offering a place to conveniently check all compiled data from all three sites at one location...
TiniTinyTony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I live by one rule: No office romances, no way. Very messy, inappropriate... no. But, I live by another rule: Just do it... Nike.
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 4:34:52 pm EST from 159.240.11.254

TONY> Unless you have sources at SLG and Diamond that tell you things that we don't know, I don't see much point in what you're doing. We have SLG, Diamond and Ask Greg for this info already.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 3:46:55 pm EST from 75.56.245.4

QUESTION:

Tell me what you all think:

http://www.geocities.com/tinitinytony/GargoylesComicReleaseSchedule.html

Would you check it normally if I were to keep it updated?
TiniTinyTony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I live by one rule: No office romances, no way. Very messy, inappropriate... no. But, I live by another rule: Just do it... Nike.
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 3:03:20 pm EST from 159.240.11.254

Since the class action lawsuit against PayPal has ended back in '04 - '05, things have been a lot better.

I was identity thefted and PayPal took care of it. So even though they messed up, they cleaned up the mess.
TiniTinyTony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I live by one rule: No office romances, no way. Very messy, inappropriate... no. But, I live by another rule: Just do it... Nike.
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 2:32:24 pm EST from 159.240.11.254

Vaevictis - that's up to you. You have to trust someone sometime. I've been dealing with paypal for years and haven't ever had a problem with them.
Wingless
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 1:40:56 pm EST from 99.245.254.123

Oh no, Paypal is very bad! I don't trust them at all, not one tiny bit.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 1:29:26 pm EST from 70.56.168.98

The best thing to do these days if you don't like to give out your credit card number is deal with companies that use Paypal. that way, you only give your card number to Paypal, and the transactions happen through them. Your information stays with paypal. It's the best of both worlds-and SLG does take paypal(so does Midtown comics).
Wingless
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 1:26:36 pm EST from 99.245.254.123

I'm sorry if I am irritable. I've had a crummy month and an especially wretched week in which ordering the comics was almost the only bright spot (until things seemed to turn upwards this morning). I wasn't having any discomfort before when I ordered. I just wanted to get some advice from people who know anything at all about the comic business and hopefully aren't paranoid like I am.

Unprofessional wasn't the word I wanted to use but "un-legal" sounds really wrong, like I'm saying something is illegal. What I mean is it looks... not-enforce-able?
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 12:53:21 pm EST from 70.56.168.98

Vaevictis Asmadi> I sympathize with you concerning your plight, but isn't it obvious that concerning computers and technology, SLG is a little behind the times. Remember, they are a small business and a full time webmaster or IT person costs a pretty penny hourly. (For that matter, I don't understand how a business that sells comics primarily can afford to pay any of their employees a decent wage.)

When I view source at SLG's website, the man behind the site appears to be Erik Bosrup. Maybe you can ask SLG and contact him directly to assist you with your problem.

If for any reason you feel unsafe, I would unsubscribe, cancel your credit card, and order a new one. I wouldn't order online from any business that makes you feel that your information isn't safe.

I don't know how SLG conducts their business, but as for long as I've known them, it appears they are doing the best they can, but at times their best isn't good enough. You think I'd be used to delays, being a Nintendo fan and all.
TiniTinyTony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I live by one rule: No office romances, no way. Very messy, inappropriate... no. But, I live by another rule: Just do it... Nike.
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 11:39:02 am EST from 159.240.11.254

I don't mean to annoy anybody, I was just looking for some help maybe. The situation makes me *extremely* uncomfortable and worried about my security. I was hoping somebody who knows more about legal... stuff could reassure me or help me or something. But nevermind.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 10:30:02 am EST from 70.56.168.98

The privacy policy worries me because it doesn't look legally binding or anything. I mean, I gave them my credit card number.

And I don't think that getting spammed, with a fake unsubscribe link, is minor. It makes me quite angry.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 10:14:49 am EST from 70.56.168.98

Demonskyre> Agreed. Maybe I just don't know anything about the comic book industry, or maybe I've just been lucky, but I've never seen any real reason to complain about SLG. Have there been mistakes and delays? Sure, but they are doing their best and the mistakes and delays have been quite minor in the face of the awesomeness of getting Gargoyles after all these years. If I only got two issues a year, then that is two issues more than I would have if SLG drops the comic. And thats saying a lot.

Unfortunatly, some people can't seem to see how good we have it right now and feel the need to quibble over minor issues. And it is getting annoying.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 8:46:11 am EST from 24.207.163.239

VA> I don't see any issue with SLG's privacy policy; iI's not particularly in depth probably due to the fact that they're a small company, but it covers the big issue of not selling your info to third parties. But you're right; the "unsubscribe" text in the e-mails from SLG isn't linked to anything. I sent an e-mail to their info address asking how people can unsubscribe from the mailing list if they want to, so I'll let you know if I hear anything.

People, I'm all for airing legitimate gripes about problems, but I don't think constantly complaining about how "unprofessional" Slave Labor Graphics is will help anything. They are a small company in a small industry and the Disney deal is unlike anything they've ever tried before. Some of the people here don't buy comics other than "Gargoyles" and may not have a clear picture of how the comics industry works. Even if "Gargoyles" were being published by Marvel or DC, it wouldn't change the fact that Amazon isn't really set up to handle individual comic books and if you don't have either a local comic book store or some way of sending money electronically to pay for it on a comics dedicated website, you're probably out of luck. Yes, SLG has had problems and some of those problems are issues they can and should address. But SLG is also providing us with the first real new Gargoyles stories we've had since "The Journey". And if SLG decides to stop publishing the book, that's probably it. Marvel and DC and Dark Horse aren't going to grab the license, and I doubt any other independent publishers are going to be interested either. Yes, we should give SLG our feedback to try and help improve the product and the customer experience. But keep in mind, if SLG backs out, it's anyone's guess when or if we'll ever get another "Gargoyles" story.

dph> I would e-mail the sites' owners and explain the situation. If they don't take down the episodes, it's your call what to do next. You could threaten to inform Disney that heir copyrighted material is being pirated. If you actually inform Disney, there is a chance the sites will be shut down. You need to decide whether this is worth it, which largely depends on what other stuff is available on these sites. If they mostly provide stuff that can't be seen on DVD, which I think of as kind of a moal grey area, you may want to just leave it alone. But if they mostly provide material that people could buy or rent for themselves, there is no reason for the sites not to be shut down, as they are only providing blatantly illegal content.

Estella> I wish there had been a "Gargoyles" level in "Kingdom Hearts" as well, but I understand that it's very unlikely. Gargoyles is unfortunately not very well known in either the US or Japan and the purpose of "Kingdom Hearts" is to showcase characters and locations from the Disney canon that people already know and love, not to introduce them to franchises they don't yet know.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 8:05:15 am EST from 209.6.248.33

Mochi: No, I'm really not allowed to. I may have said too much already. ( ;
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does?" -Gaff ("Blade Runner")
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 6:43:01 am EST from 71.62.198.251

dph_of_rules> I do agree that Disney could use their online resources to make their classic programs available (The ones that don't get a DVD release). Cause frankly, using the websites for programming that's already available strikes me as a waste of resources.
Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 1:10:17 am EST from 71.115.192.199

gxb - I realize my hypocrisy in this situation isn't pretty. If there was an alternative, say we could watch copyrighted material online with advertising like regular tv, then I'm all for it. Ln2Tv off of aol video is a pretty good example of what I would support. I don't like the current choices that I'm given. That these websites exist suggests to me that the companies are using the wrong model.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 12:49:16 am EST from 71.29.242.199

I know everyone likes The Kingdom Hearts series and all, but I wish they had added Gargoyles to it. Sure it's not a movie, but it would've been cool to see Sora and the other characters as Gargoyles w/ Manhatten and etc as stages.
Estella
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 12:48:30 am EST from 75.169.6.102

dph> E-mail the webmaster and ask him to take them down. If he doesn't then I don't know what your next step is.
Tony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I'll be the number two guy here in Scranton in six weeks. How? Name repetition, personality mirroring and never breaking off a handshake. I'm always thinking one step ahead. Like a... carpenter... that makes stairs.
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 12:39:07 am EST from 70.15.84.29

DPH> So, you're fine with stealing as long as it's not something you have a vested interest ins financial future?

Nice priorities there, my friend.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 12:35:34 am EST from 75.56.245.4

Demonskrye - Thanks.

I have a question. Both www.boxsweeper.com and www.sidereel.com to episodes of gargoyles season 1. I would like to have the episodes removed so that sales will go up, but I don't the websites shut down Does anybody know an action to take that will not result in the sites being taken down completely, but gets the videos off? Those two are the only semi-decent replacements (that are free) for tv-link.co-uk since it went down.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Tue, Dec 4, 2007 12:27:00 am EST from 71.29.242.199

Does anyone else get random spam and adverts from SLG? I was informed that I asked for it on a special form (which I didn't) and that I could unsubscribe by clicking on a link (which wasn't a live link at all) and when I went to look at their online privacy policy, it looks suspiciously... unprofessional and untrustworthy.
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 11:34:43 pm EST from 63.225.151.172

Harvester >> Blood oath? Care to elaborate on that one? o.O''
The One Known As Mochi - [shogi dot keima dot 08 at gmail dot com]
Current Mood: (>T.T)> Figuring out what to do in life...
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 11:27:12 pm EST from 72.199.225.9

****Spoilers*****

I'm under the impression, from what T.T. said about not eating in six decades, that these are probably clones recently created. Which annoyed me a little; someone brings back the thylacine and they're used for a bank robbery!? Still, a little curious where he got them from in the first place. I mean, he's robbing a bank, so maybe creating them wiped him out. Or maybe he snagged the early results of a cloning experiment, perhaps? Interesting...

*****End Spoilers*****
Asatira
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 7:05:55 pm EST from 24.197.64.95

Gargoyles #7 coming out next Wednesday rather than this one might actually be better, at least from my perspective. Visiting Starclipper in University City twice in two weeks does seem a little too much for me - but a difference of thirteen days rather than six days between visits - now that's better.

* SPOILERS *

I've been reading all I can find about thylacines after "Bad Guys" #1; I feel reminded of all the reading I was doing on early Scottish history after "City of Stone" and "Avalon Part One" first aired. One thing I discovered was that they do have a thylacine embryo (though I can't remember just where); I wonder if that's how Benjamin and Natasha were created in the Gargoyles Universe. (Could the Tazmanian Tiger and Sevarius be in cahoots? They both show an enthusiasm for super-villain cliches.) Or maybe there really are a few thylacines surviving in some out-of-the-way part of Tasmania, as some cryptozoologists have suggested.

* SPOILERS END *
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 6:55:15 pm EST from 4.244.215.211

Alexandra: I got to take a blood oath at G'2007. So I can cross that off my list of things to do before I die. ( ;
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does?" -Gaff ("Blade Runner")
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 6:48:10 pm EST from 71.62.198.251

So #7 is coming out next Wednesday. I called my comic shop in Manhatten Beach if #7 was coming in this week, and they replied that they hadn't seen any solicitations for it yet, so that makes sense. As long as it comes out next week, I'll be able to get it before I fly back home for Winter Break!

Even though its not this week, that's pretty sweet news -- two new comics not only in a span of two months, but in two weeks!

So Side Note 1: Are we ever going to get some cover art in advance again, or did that #4/5 cover debacle last spring kill all chances for that? Because the first time we witnessed #6's art was the day it was released, and I'm wondering if that's going to be the same with #7.

Tony: I too, easily found "The Will to Love" on YouTube -- thank you, W.I.T.C.H. fans (I'd include myself, having seen the first season, but I seriously neglected Season 2 -- darn college cable!)

Re.Fang -- I JUST noticed Fang losing a bullet, so thanks for the review, Blaise (here's hoping you survived that crash with the pigeon :D)

And Side Note 2: When #7 comes out, we'll finally be able to see who had the best guesses in the contest that Ed did earlier this year! (Thinking back, I doubt I did good . . . )
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 6:27:14 pm EST from 157.242.194.201

dph> It's not too uncommon, especially with smaller publishers. The publishers give Diamond the date that they believe a book will come out, based on the information they have at the time. Something comes up and the book isn't ready in time and it slips back a week. Even the Big Two(Marvel and DC for the non-comics people among us) have been known to miss a ship date now and then. I don't know how far in advance Diamond gets the information they put into these shipping lists. But if you want to be sure, wait until the lists turn over on Mondays.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 6:23:47 pm EST from 209.6.248.33

DHP > I think this is just how SLG operates. :(
Vaevictis Asmadi
"We're not the last. We're not alone." - Hudson
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 5:54:24 pm EST from 63.225.151.172

Is it common for Diamond to say that something is coming out next week and then that week approaches and they change their mind by another week?

It looks like this has happenned twice so far with Gargoyles comics.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 3:59:03 pm EST from 71.29.242.199

NO Gargoyles #7 this Wednesday
http://www.diamondcomics.com/shipping/shipping_120507.txt
Boooo!

Gargoyles #7 EXPECTED next Wednesday 12/12
http://www.diamondcomics.com/shipping/expected_121207.txt
Yaaaay!
TiniTinyTony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I live by one rule: No office romances, no way. Very messy, inappropriate... no. But, I live by another rule: Just do it... Nike.
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 2:29:35 pm EST from 159.240.11.254

Is Gargoyles #7 still coming out this week? This is almost overwhelming!
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 1:32:05 pm EST from 24.207.163.239

Asatira> Thank you for answering my questions.

On a side note, I really want to attend a Gathering, but I calculated that without someone to go with I'd be spending between $1200 - $1400 for food, gas, registration, hotel, etc…

So I'm probably skipping this year, and hopefully I'll go when it's closer to Pennsylvania, i.e. New York.

bob>

1. Amazon gets them when SLG sends them. Which can probably be anywhere from a week to two weeks after the initial release it seems.

2. Tentatively, yes, #7 should be out December 5th.

3. If I had to guess, it's probably due to the reprint.

4. Unfortunately I don't know, but there are other sites you can purchase them i.e. http://www.slgcomic.com/product-exec/product_id/499/nm/Gargoyles_6

On a second side note, Bad Guys #1 is also available at SLG's website.
TiniTinyTony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I live by one rule: No office romances, no way. Very messy, inappropriate... no. But, I live by another rule: Just do it... Nike.
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 1:24:54 pm EST from 159.240.11.254

Alexandra> A lot goes on at these Gatherings. You get stuff like the Blue Mug-A-Guests, (adult panel) regular mug-a-guests (with people like Greg and Thom), guest panels, a costume show, an art room, and more.

Hope that helps.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:39:50 pm EST from 76.228.105.243

I cant wait to read bad guys but i have to wait until it comes on Amazon I'm ordering Bad Guys, 6, and 7 for my brother for christmas but Bad guys isn't there yet. so my questions are
1. does any one know how long it takes Amazon to get the comics?
2. # 7 is coming out dec 5th right or has this changed?
3. does any one know why amazon isn't sell #6 any more, last week they were selling it new and this week you can only buy it from the other sellers, is this because of the reprint?
4. Does any one know when and if # 6 will be back on Amazon?
Hope everyones enjoying being a gargoyles fan cause it could only get better if it was on TV!!!
bob
bob
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:28:55 pm EST from 66.202.98.89

Tony> I've never been certain why the Bad Guys presentation is referred to as a "Leica reel". Nowadays, the result of this process of shooting a series of storyboards with a temporary dialogue track is usually called an animatic or a story reel. As the Wikipedia article on Leica reels says, "Leica" is a German brand of camera that use to be used to shoot animation (which I didn't know until today.)

Bad Guys #1 Review - SPOILERS!!!> My husband stopped by the comic store and picked up Bad Guys #1 and a corrected issue #6. I'm probably in the minority here (possibly the minority of one that gets past prime produce thrown at her), but I was kind of "meh" on the issue. The cover is nice and even if I'm not crazy about the new font, it's certainly better than the standard title font "Bao Guys" cover we saw teased, Still, I wish they had gone with something a little more unique for the second font, maybe playing into the wanted poster theme (though I'm still concerned that doing that for every cover is going to make new issues and the book itself stand out less). Karine Charlebois is still probably the best interior artist we've had on either "Gargoyles" book, but her art on this issue doesn't seem quite as solid to me. Before anyone suggests it, it's not that I'm missing the color; I've read plenty of black and white comics without being bothered by the lack of hues. The lineweight seems a little too uniform and thin and there are some panels where the figures feel stiff. But it tells the story well and gets in some nice dramatic touches.

As for the story, I've worried in the past that the main book was starting leave new readers behind. With this comic, I'm worried that the stories may start to get too fan-centric for some fans, or at least me. I've never been to a Gathering and seen the Leica reel, so any references to it are lost on me. Which is fine, because I didn't feel like I missed anything or didn't get what was going on. But the song from W.I.T.C.H. may have been overkill. Had I ever seen the show and known the song from it, I might have gotten a chuckle out of it. As is, I was actively annoyed by it. I didn't understand why this song with no connection to anything that was going on was playing through the first half of the issue, connecting two scenes that took place at completely different times. If the song had been intended to trigger someone's memory of the flashback, I would have been at least OK with it. But as it, and now that I know what it is, it just feels a little too self indulgent. And again, what about new readers? Are they picking up the book because they like the main title, seeing a human, a mutate, a gargoyle, and what the cover tells them is a "self-aware advance artificial intelligence" hanging out together on page two and saying "Oh wow, I've gotta find out what's going on here!"? Or is it more like "Who ARE all of these people and what IS going on here?"? Like the first few issues of the main book, I felt the pacing here was a little slow and I ended my read feeling like not much had happened. Hopefully it will follow the progression of the main book and start to pick up steam as it goes along. I'm still curious to see how Yama gets brought into the group and maybe learn a little about what life is like for a gargoyle banished from his clan in the modern world. And before that, there's issue #7 to look forward to. Even with my gripes, it is definitely a good time to be a "Gargoyles" fan.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 11:49:20 am EST from 209.6.248.33

SPOILERS

Make basic explanation for how TT was able to simple slash through Matrix's armor when tougher attacks have bounced off harmlessly is simply that The Matrix itself was caught off guard.
Matt H
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 11:17:18 am EST from 98.192.208.157

Greg B> I was afraid of that. Oh well. I guess I was just hoping that since we're trying to work out so much other stuff to be scientifically believable there'd be a way to rationalize that too.
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 11:05:29 am EST from 199.38.51.134

Kerry> <<The Mutates' zapping has always bothered me... from what I can gather, electrical species require physical contact to transfer a big jolt. Water's an okay electrical conductor, but air is terrible. Has anyone figured out how they're able to project it like that?>>

Magneto, Electro and Storm teach classes on this at MIT. In other words, it's a cartoon/comic book. Just go with it.

As for why Fang is using a gun. We've never seen the electricity really prove to be lethal. Painful, sure. But not lethal. Maybe the charge is just not that high. But, a quick bullet between the eyes... always lethal.
Greg Bishansky
"Well, you could make a case that the world has already ended. That art is dead. That we're exhausted. That instead of art, we have… pop culture, daytime TV, gay senior citizens, women that have been raped by their dentists, confiding in Oprah. An exploration in depth of why women cut off their husband's penis."
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 10:44:58 am EST from 75.56.245.4

****Possible Spoilers*****


<1) What part of BG #1 was shown via leica reel at The Gathering?>
Come to the Gathering to find out. ^_^
<2) What other leica reels has Greg Weisman shown?>
That's the only leica reel he's shown at the Gathering. But a number of other things have been shown, including pitches for "Dark Ages" and "The Olympians," and a fan made animatic for a Team Atlantis episode called "The Last." But these are things likely never to be seen outside of the Gathering, so if you want to see them, you'll have to attend.

<3) I'm not getting how the T.T. clawed through Matrix. I was under the impression that Matrix was invulnerable. I'm guessing he didn't claw through him, but just clawed him and his programming sent a signal to Dingo's spine to interpret it as pain. So what benefit, if any, does wearing Matrix provide to Dingo? Did they team up just so Matrix didn't cover the world in nano-technology?>
Pretty much how you described it. T.T. did damage, but nothing permanent. It didn't go all the way through; later, you see there is no scar tissue on Dingo's back (but there is what looks like a little hole where Matrix probably connected to his nervous system). Matrix provides Dingo with a much better suit of armor. For example, his old one could never have sprouted extra arms, or morphed the muzzles and leashes. In addition, Matrix is self-repairing and potentially has limitless power. The interface was, in Matrix's mind, necessary to improve this partnership. And it was a learning experience.

<4) I never watched W.I.T.C.H and have no idea what this song sounds like. And I've seen people asking Greg for it and he doesn't have it nor does he have a means to supply it. Is there a place where I can sample the music to get a better idea? Maybe if someone told me the episode #, I could download it and watch it.>
I don't know if there is an episode up online. If there is, I can't tell you. But a link to the excerpt of the episode is available on youTube. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENFukihB3VM


****End Spoilers****
Asatira
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 10:38:10 am EST from 131.204.97.9

Matt> I think Fang having a gun actually does make sense. He doesn't have an infinite supply of energy to power his blasting ability; the gun would give him the option to conserve and/or recharge.

The Mutates' zapping has always bothered me... from what I can gather, electrical species require physical contact to transfer a big jolt. Water's an okay electrical conductor, but air is terrible. Has anyone figured out how they're able to project it like that?
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 10:36:38 am EST from 199.38.51.134

Everyone keeps talking about this leica reel and I had to look up what one was.

For the uneducated people like me who have never heard of the term: a leica reel is a rough draft production of a film using still shots from the storyboard drawings. Looking up the term made me realize that I've seen leica reels before on DVDs as bonus material, but the term didn't ring any bells.

So question(s):

1) What part of BG #1 was shown via leica reel at The Gathering?
2) What other leica reels has Greg Weisman shown?


*****************SPOILERS**********************
3) I'm not getting how the T.T. clawed through Matrix. I was under the impression that Matrix was invulnerable. I'm guessing he didn't claw through him, but just clawed him and his programming sent a signal to Dingo's spine to interpret it as pain. So what benefit, if any, does wearing Matrix provide to Dingo? Did they team up just so Matrix didn't cover the world in nano-technology?
4) I never watched W.I.T.C.H and have no idea what this song sounds like. And I've seen people asking Greg for it and he doesn't have it nor does he have a means to supply it. Is there a place where I can sample the music to get a better idea? Maybe if someone told me the episode #, I could download it and watch it.
5) So the cliffhanger in #1 will set up what will happen in #5? What do you guys think? #2 is for hunting Yama. #3 is for hunting Fang. #4 must be a dangerous mission for what Dingo is yelling at Hunter for. Then my guess is #5 and #6 will be the big mission alluded to in #1. Just guessing that this point.
TiniTinyTony - [tinitinytony hotmail com]
I live by one rule: No office romances, no way. Very messy, inappropriate... no. But, I live by another rule: Just do it... Nike.
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 10:09:24 am EST from 159.240.11.254

That was a quick Top Ten.

I noticed the bullet clip thing with Fang and thought it was pretty funny. Left me wondering though why he needed a gun since he has his electro-blasts.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Let this mark the beginning of a Golden Age, between all our clans, both Human and Gargoyle!!!" -Macbeth, 'City of Stone'
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 9:50:27 am EST from 24.207.163.239

BLAISE - Ah, so that's what that scene with Fang was about! I'd noticed it, but I hadn't been able to figure out just what was going on there. Thanks for telling us.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 7:26:00 am EST from 4.244.211.0

Well I am so excited I finally get to go to the gathering!!!! I was wondering if anyone could tell me what to expect? It seems like everyone already knows eachother so I am very excited to meet all of you and get to know you just as well! Thanks and have a good one!
Alexandra
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 5:52:40 am EST from 74.141.155.196

Wow! That was a quicky top ten.
Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]
It's silly. It's a silly movie. There just isn't much there. Once you take it all apart, there's not much story, is there?- George Lucas on Spider-Man 3
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 5:17:20 am EST from 69.54.209.25

****A large, black, military-style helicopter rises into view through the window. It flies in through the window...which it can do because it's actually the size of a toy. An equally miniature Blaise leans out of the door.**** Yup, I'm still alive. Just dropping by to give my thoughts on BAD GUYS.

****************SPOILERS!! SPOILERS!!****************


BAD GUYS ISSUE #1> I picked up my copy the day it came out, and have only now gotten around to writing about it. Well, I also decided to wait until the Room cleared.
I felt a quiet sort of excitement in regards to it--but a different kind of excitement than I get with the regular series. This is the first spin-off. This is the first story that WON'T focus on any of our usual main characters. As such, it will prove just how compelling the rest of the "Gargoyles Universe" can be.
So far, it's looking good.
-I recognized the opening pages from the leica reel shown at the Gathering (I wonder if anyone else noticed Fang accidentally losing a bullet from his ammo clip). I also recognized the song Matrix is listening to (and which shows up throughout Dingo's battle with T.T.) as "The Will to Love" from W.I.T.C.H.. I love that little shout-out, but it also works as more than just a reference/in-joke. Sometimes the lyrics echo the action on screen (albeit in subtle ways): the most obvious for me being the line "to find a girl on my wavelength" while we see Hunter spying on Dingo. All-in-all, it's a pretty cool bit.
-Anyway, rewind two months from the good ship "Redemption's" demise, and we are introduced to the Tazmanian Tiger: a guy who looks like he could have stepped out of any "Golden Age" comic book. When I first saw this guy, I had to pause for a minute to laugh out loud. I mean, have we EVER had a guy in the "Gargoyles Universe" like this before? By all rights, he should be a joke, and he is...right up until he slashes Dingo through the Matrix-armor. He still gets taken out pretty easy, but it kind of shows that, as silly as his name and costume may be, he's still dangerous. And I find myself wondering right along with Dingo just where the heck this weirdo managed to find not just one, but TWO extinct Tasmanian Tigers. Story for another day, I guess.
-As for the speculation that this colorful character (and just what color is his suit, anyway?) may turn out to be the newest member of the soon-to-be-UltraPack...I can definitely see that happening.
-Dingo is playing the part of super-hero for real, just as he wanted. He's got the silly insults for his enemies ("tasmaniac"), he's got the concern for the poor thylacines, he's even got his own Australian version of Superman's "Look, up in the sky..." entrance bit. And, lastly, he's got something our old gargoyle friends have a hard time with: the hearts of the people. Go Dingo.
-I'm happy to see the Shaman again, and I hope we manage to find out more about him.
-I loved the tableau of the Pack--it looks cool. I just had to say that.
-Yikes! I can see the hole in Dingo's back! I can completely understand Dingo's unease at the idea of the Matrix...well, "hacking" into his nervous system like that. Of course, once he's ordered the Matrix not to interface again, that is when the Hunter strikes.
-It's nice to FINALLY have Dingo's real name stated in the canon material. And I love this exchange:
DINGO: "Bounty hunter?"
HUNTER: "Just a Hunter."
I also love Dingo's "Really NOT the time for I told you sos..." when the Matrix follows Dingo's earlier order not to interface. I hereby add my voice to the others who like how the Matrix moved back only the part of its body that it had to.
-The fight between Dingo and the Hunter is well done. I have to say, I feel kind of sorry for poor Dingo here--no matter what he does Hunter is able to counter it. She looked especially cool when she caught the boomerang without looking. The most I can say for Dingo is that he knows how to roll with the punches.
-I was very surprised that Hunter had a method of neutralizing Matrix--I wonder what her briefing for this mission was like. It's interesting that we pick up with her AFTER she has already been sprung from prison and all that, and I look forward to having the gaps filled in.
-Strange how Hunter responds to Dingo's bit about going the "super-villain route" with "Who hasn't?" She was raised to believe that what she was doing (hunting gargoyles) was right, good, and justified. I find myself wondering how her world-view has changed since "Hunter's Moon."
-I love Hunter's face when she asks if "the helicopter was too big a tip-off" that the EMP had worn off. It's also pretty cool that the Matrix is the one who jumps at the chance of joining Hunter. Dingo just sort of resigns himself to it.
-Tengu hunting...and Hunter gets a wicked smile on her face when Dingo asks "What's a Tengu?". The most interesting thing is that they BOTH have hunted gargoyles before. Of course, for Hunter it was a lifelong mission; Dingo did it as a kind of team sport. Either way, I look forward to seeing how both of them will react to Yama.
I also find myself wondering if there'll be any room during said introductions for a sort of "You know Goliath?", "Wait, YOU know Goliath?!", "You BOTH know Goliath!?!" bit of exchange. Probably not, and it might be a bit too silly, but seeing as how all the members of the Redemption Squad crossed paths with Goliath, I'd be very interested in seeing them compare notes.

*************END SPOILERS!! END SPOILERS!!************

Well, back to the rat race. Until next time, farewell. ****Blaise pops back in the helicopter as it flies out the window. It then suffers a devastating collision with a pigeon and plummets out of sight.****
Blaise
"Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day. Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life."--Terry Pratchett's "Jingo"
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:52:10 am EST from 4.233.44.28

Tenth!
Phoenician - [<---My Kinda Useless Blog]
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:29:25 am EST from 157.242.209.26

9th...
The One Known As Mochi - [shogi dot keima dot 08 at gmail dot com]
Current Mood: (>T.T)> No longer enrolled in school... A sad day for me...
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:27:11 am EST from 72.199.225.9

8th
Justin - [jlindley07 at gmail dot com]
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:24:09 am EST from 74.135.61.121

seventh!
Asatira
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:20:29 am EST from 24.197.64.95

Sixth!!!
Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:06:22 am EST from 198.53.239.8

thanks siren. second is fine, but like I said, couldn't get any image on my screen. oh well, maybe next time.
oneuke
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:05:01 am EST from 66.167.105.65

sorry for all the posts. it wasn't showing up on my screen for some odd reason.
oneuke
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:03:28 am EST from 66.167.105.65

5th!

oneuke, You weren't first, better luck next time. You were SECOND
Siren
Don't knock on Death's door. Ring his doorbell and run, he hates that.
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:03:20 am EST from 68.202.76.113

fourth
oneuke
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:02:29 am EST from 66.167.105.65

4th in the name of issue #7
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:02:24 am EST from 71.29.242.199

first
oneuke
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:02:03 am EST from 66.167.105.65

3rd.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:01:51 am EST from 76.228.105.243

first
oneuke
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:01:26 am EST from 66.167.105.65

first
oneuke
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:01:01 am EST from 66.167.105.65

first
oneuke
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:00:36 am EST from 66.167.105.65

First!
Spen
posted @ Mon, Dec 3, 2007 12:00:24 am EST from 66.43.205.110