[SPOILER] Angelika writing down Demona's story reminded me of Olympia Savage in Young Justice writing down Vandal Savage's story. Unlike Vandal, Demona seems more tolerant of her life being chronicled.

I want to go back to see if there are any moments of Katana reacting to Demona in any previous Dynamite stories as possible foreshadowing that they were once acquainted. [/SPOILER]
KC
posted @ Thu, Dec 18, 2025 8:46:15 pm EST from 209.74.237.9

The second-best thing today was hearing Bill Fagerbaake's voice come blasting out of the radio while I was doing the lunch dishes: it was for a "Spongebob" promo, but still welcome.

The best thing was that my comic shop actually got "Demona" 5 on time, so I can come up with a few things to say about it during release week and not three or four weeks later.

An interesting thing about that. When the first half of the "Fantastic Four" crossover came, I couldn't quite come up with much to say. I'd mentioned my thoughts on why that is back when it was still fairly new, and they don't much matter right now. But this one...well, I put fingers to keys halfway into the issue. I guess I had enough to say at that point that I needed to start getting it down before I could forget.

I mean, you start right off with [SPOILER] a Wind Ceremony, [/SPOILER] you know the story is going to have some impact, after all.

[SPOILER] My goodness, do both Magni and Angelika look old. In some regards, I'm glad they had a long life together, but I am sorry that the demand of the story didn't let us see more of it. At least not yet. I am happy to note a few human figures around the pyre: Ishimura clearly does things differently, but this is one difference that I think is very right.

The mourning underway, Angelika sets to work doing the only thing that can be done to preserve a life: tell its story. It is plain from the tone throughout that Angelika knows her time is almost over. The moment of delight that they share in Angelika's acknowledgement, in words, that she considers Demona her mother (and not one of her mothers, interestingly) is endearing.

All this good feeling and you know it's going to have to crash down eventually, and right at the moment you're recognizing that, a sinister figure approaches the dock at Hakata.

And there's Katana, whose presence we've had hinted at since the blurb for the last issue, sixteen years old and a bit of a little terror. To see her call Angelika "grandmother" is a strong hint that Angelika (and Demona, presumably) has at last found a home in Ishimura. (Baby Katana is cute as a button, too.) It is clear (as Katana is out proving her prowess) that Angelika knows her mother: knows she needs to have someone to keep her out of trouble, perhaps knows her all too well.

Our sinister figure, after a search, masks up, and it's clear how this is going to end.

I note that Demona is evidently satisfied with teaching the blade to the humans, too. Presumably the state of Ishimuran society is rubbing off on her, at least in that regard. The bond between Angelika and Demona is reinforced again by Demona abandoning the class suddenly, almost without a word to the class. And so the class is attacked, leading up to the final struggle.

Angelika's face, on hearing that the leader of the enemy force wears a mask with three red slashes, is a tell. She knows what that means.

And so there is a fight, and Demona fights up to her name, and all the while it is clear Angelika's time is up. The interspersal of her image during the fight, gradually growing younger and younger, is a lovely effect.

It all culminates, as it must, in Demona returning to form, blaming the humans, all of them, for everything. Her having lost the focus of her life for all these years is devastating in the plainest possible sense. Perhaps especially so that Angelika missed the sunrise by such a short span of time. (It is interesting to note, even just as a distraction, that Angelika does not turn to stone with the sunrise; I don't think that's been acknowledged "on-screen" before now.)

Night falls. Demona makes the necessary connection back to issue #0 (and some very mistaken archaeologists, I'm sure) and, once more, refuses to participate in the Wind Ceremony for someone she loves. That she refuses to acknowledge the passing of the past formally is, of course, completely in-character. On the other hand, in their language, I suppose she knows (or at least very much suspects) that her time in the Wind will never come, and that is a lot for her to bear.

Which brings us back around to where we started, in a way, with Katana ready to follow Demona in the same way Angelika did...and harshly rejected. (Really harshly: it's hard for me to tell, but it even looks like Demona slashes Katana to make very sure she cannot follow.) Thus the answer to why Katana did not want to go down with the others all those issues ago, and so many years in the future.

And off she goes to her destiny.
[/SPOILER]

I'm going to have to be offline for a little while before I can talk over other people's thoughts on this. It's this laptop screen, you know. Getting kind of hard to read.
morrand - [morrand276 at gmail dot com]
posted @ Wed, Dec 17, 2025 5:25:58 pm EST from 108.69.72.60

Good morning, folks!

As usual, I intended to stay up late to get the digital release of Demona #5 when it dropped (which happens around 11pm here), but drifted off 30 minutes before. I was woken up around 11:30 to Phoenician and Bishansky blowing up my phone (and I'm grateful for that!). I read it a couple times before going back to sleep. As usual, these are my (mostly) pure and original thoughts though I've been chatting a little with Phoenician and Bishansky about it over the past ten hours.

[SPOILER] - Let's start with the only real error in the issue: It seems the title was left off (of the digital version at least, I'll get my physical copy later today and we'll see). We've been informed that the title is "Forever Sound the Mystic Chords of Memory..." Lovely, that. I hope that if this omission is not correct in the physical copy that we will see it corrected in the trade that will come one day (assuming we get that!). Maybe it'll be corrected in the digital copy at some point too.

- Another Wind Ceremony and FINALLY we get Demona's willing participation in this one. She is even one of the torchbearers! From the solicitation, we knew Magni was going to be dead (and that isn't too surprising anyway given that he and Angelika are pushing 100!). I did not expect to actually see him though. I figured he had died before they had reached Ishimura. But it appears the three of them spent 16 years as a part of the Ishimura Clan. Magni looks great on his funeral pyre (weird thing to say, but there it is). Old, yes, but so beautiful and noble and regal. Love that image and Frank's art is AMAZING. I particularly like how his tail is wrapped around this legs. The gargoyle leading the ceremony may be the Clan's leader or their priestess or both, but she is neat. The Ishimura Clan apparently adds the box of butterflies to their Wind Ceremonies which is a cool touch. And we see another web-winged gargoyle among the Clan which makes that feature no longer unique to the Wyvern Clan.

- Angelika is looking quite ancient and so sad at the loss of her mate. She reminds me a lot of my own grandma here. My grandpa died a few years ago. My grandma has looked older and sadder ever since. They were together for over 70 years and my grandma is now in her mid-90s, so a lot of the feels here strikes me close to home. Our rookling Katana holding Angelika's hands is so sweet. Demona too has a very tender moment when she offers to carry Angelika (who seems to be too old to even glide). I like that Angelika's age here really puts into perspective that 1997 Hudson is old, but he's not ancient. He can still glide and fight and hold his own. He's really relatively young. In fact, 1274 Angelika is old enough to be 1997 Hudson's mother! A clan elder indeed. And she holds the locket that we've seen a few times in this arc. I like to think that this originally came to Angelika as a gift from Magni in their younger days aboard Sigurd's ship (which is where it first comes into the story chronologically).

- We see the Ishimura leader/priest training humans and gargoyles alike just as we were told in "Bushido". Demona watches on. I'd love to know more about her feelings towards humans during the 16 years in Ishimura. How much did she trust them? Did she sleep in plain sight at the Temple (we see her do so at least once later)? Surely 16 years of watching these humans and gargoyles live and work together must've had some impact on her. While the 23 year alliance at Castle Wyvern and the 17 year alliance with Macbeth were longer spans, this alliance seems stronger. Hmmm.

- Rookling Katana is precocious indeed! And brave too. I can't imagine many who could sneak up on Demona, chop off a lock of hair, and retreat laughing without facing serious harm! There is a lot of contrast in this story between 1095 Angelika and 1274 Katana (which I love), but this is one of those moments. In 1095, Demona chastised Angelika with eyes ablaze when the rookling just walked up behind her. Now in 1295, Demona seems more amused when Katana did far worse. And I see a lot of fun parallels between young Katana in 1274 and young Brooklyn in 971.

- Angelika, inspired by Shahrizad, is writing her memoirs (I wonder what became of those writings: did they end up in the New York museum exhibit? Are the safely held in Ishimura? Or were they lost to time? I can imagine Angela or someone pouring through the archives to learn more about Demona one day as Gandalf did when researching the One Ring in Minas Tirith.). Demona reacts to being called mother and sweetly embraces her ancient daughter. Lovely and heartbreaking. I'm getting ahead of things here, but it is moments like this that really make me wonder about Demona's reaction when she learned the gargoyle she saw in Paris in 1996 is indeed her daughter. We saw the complexity of her feelings towards Angela later, but truly learning she had a surviving daughter after all the centuries and after all the time with Angelika puts a new perspective on the events of "The Reckoning" and other moments. Really, a lot of Demona can be seen with a news lens and new context after this arc. Her theft of Egwardo, for instance, also has new context.

- Meanwhile, a suspicion we all long had comes to bear: a Hunter has arrived in Japan (hearing rumors of the tengu there no doubt. I suppose from her perspective "The Demon" has arisen again and summoned a fresh batch of gargoyle minions that must be destroyed. I love the new outlook we have on the family of Hunters following this arc also. Instead of an endless line of humans that fail over and over and over, we get a generational mission to quell the rise of The Demon wherever she arises. They are not failing for centuries but rather are succeeding in putting out the flames wherever and whenever they arise. That is what "The Hunt" that Fiona Canmore talks about really is. It seems that it wasn't until Robyn Canmore came along that Demona's longevity was linked to sorcery over devilry (if that makes sense). I also like that by having the Hunter engage the Ishimura Clan (but not survive it) we see Yama's new take on "gargoyle hunters" in 1996 when he encounters Robyn. All great stuff. Awful, of course, but great stroytelling. I wonder how many of the surviving clans have had issues with the Hunters over the centuries. You would think the London Clan was aware of them. Were the Hunters responsible for the Mayan Clan massacre in 1993? Anyway, this Hunter spends some time searching Japan for gargoyles and eventually hires some "evil ninjas" to aid her.

- It was Katana that braided the yellow hair Magni had kept of Angelika's alongside the red hair she stole from Demona! That's interesting. And I love that Katana and Angelika see each other as granddaughter/mother. I'm glad someone among the Manhattan Clan knows of and remembers Angelika and I hope Katana passes those memories on to Angela. The shot of Angelika and Demona with the hatchling Katana is so lovely. I kind of wish Magni was in that shot as well. Of course, my big wish is that Magni and Angelika had reunited in time to parent an egg of their own and perhaps leave a lineage in the Ishimura Clan (how wild would it be to discover that Yama or whoever was descended from Magni and Angelika?!), but alas that wasn't how it turned out. And I should perhaps stop thinking like a human. Katana and her sibs are grandchildren to Magni and Angelika in all the ways that matter.

- Angelika gives Demona the locket with the braided hair. A prize beyond compare. Demona isn't concerned with that. She still has hopes to restore Angelika's youth. But her daughter is ready to embrace death. Her mate is gone and she has lived a very long time. Again, I see a lot of my grandma here and it gets to me a bit. Angelika's only real concern is Demona and her loneliness and thus she thinks Katana should be Demona's new companion. Wow. I've got to wonder how much of this plan Katana is aware of. Would she even want to travel away from her clan? Of course, we know that eventually she will choose to leave with Brooklyn in a similiar way, so maybe Katana (like Demona and Angela) is just the adventurous kind. Kindred spirits. I love that we get to see a bit of one of Katana's rookery brothers here. I suspect we will see him again one day in TimeDancer if we ever get there.

- Demona training human and gargoyle warriors is a nice moment. Again, I wonder about her feelings towards the local humans. I'm also reminded of what Greg has told us about the future of the Ishimura Clan and how they will become a clan of teachers. Guardians will be trained there and the gargoyles will be very selective in what humans they train as Guardians since, in some ways, they are teaching these humans how to battle against gargoyles as much as alongside them. Does Demona have misgivings along this line as well? But Demona is called away shortly before the Hunter and her ninjas engage the Ishimurans. Ninja dude should've ceded the night to the gargoyles and attacked in the day. Oh well. Sayōnara.

- Demona's last moments with Angelika. I love the term "healing power of stone" and Angelika's "long way too morning" in response. Wow. All of the dialogue here is epic. Demona's "Be strong. Be HERE when I return." And Katana, sword drawn, vows to protect Angelika "With [her] life."

- Demona joins the battle (where we see a gargoyle riding a beast into the fray! Neat!) and she is in full rageful battle mode. Very cool images of Demona's fury (backed with red) against Angelika's decreasing age (backed with white). And Demona discovers the Canmore line is alive and well and still hunting (though this one won't be for long). At the temple the candles and Angelika's life die out. I'm glad she did not die in violence. That was a possibility we have discussed the last few months. She went out peacefully though I wish Demona had been by her side. Demona arrives too late. Katana's teary eyes are so sad and she tries to deliver Angelika's last words, but Demona instantly throws herself into grief and rage. Look, I knew this issue was going to be sad, but I didn't expect Greg and Frank to so perfectly capture the heartbreak and anger that comes from grief. Wow. Nothing Sensei or Katana can say or do can calm Demona. She is lost to them. And, as always, she turns to blame. And her blame always falls to humans, even though that makes little sense. Even though Angelika wouldn't have wanted that. "I have been denied everything..." As painful here as it was for Goliath in 994, only Goliath chose loyalty over revenge while Demona is choosing revenge over loyalty. This scene is amazing. Well done.

- And the sun rises over Ishimura. Katana's sadness and Demona's rage are frozen in the healing power of stone. Not so healing for Demona though, I guess. Only Angelika remains as flesh. This is the first time we've seen a gargoyle as flesh in daylight and this finally canonizes that turning to stone is a natural process. That process doesn't happen when you die.

- Some time later and Demona is burying the memories of her time with Angelika, even the locket is tossed in the crypt. As if she could forget the last two hundred years so easily. It breaks my heart that Demona skips out on Angelika's Wind Ceremony. Back to the old mindset that she told "True" and Angelika centuries earlier: it won't bring them back. Her line of "Nought will ever bring her back." raised an eyebrow for me. Do you think that Greg was thinking of the most mysterious of Oberon's Children when he wrote that line? Of course this whole scene parallels (nearly frame for frame) the ending of Demona #1 with Katana replacing Angelika. Of course, this time Demona refuses to let that happen, even throwing Katana to the ground and rejecting her. One of the rare moments of a gargoyle refusing to accept their status as a rookery parent (Demona is always an exception to the Gargoyle Way!). Demona is leaving this "cursed land" (I suspect she never returned to Ishimura) and she will now return to a life ALONE. But, whether she can face the pain or not, Angelika is always with her. The butterfly, from Angelika's Wind Ceremony I presume, finds Demona. I think the butterfly will always be a symbol of Angelika to Demona (and to us! Her wings were always evocative of a butterfly) and I think we will see that symbol again in time. It is also worth noting here that Demona has abandoned all of the armor and kimonos and everything she wore during her time with Angelika. She has returned to how we last saw her before meeting Angelika. Basically, she has learned nothing. The tragedy of Demona continues. Never The End... [/SPOILER]

Those are my (extensive) thoughts. I look forward to reading yours!
Matt
"My daughter?! How dare you mock me! I have no daughter." - Demona, 1996
posted @ Wed, Dec 17, 2025 12:06:33 pm EST from 69.229.197.48

My biggest question right now: [SPOILER] Has Katana told Angela about Angelika? [/SPOILER]
Algae
'Nuff said
posted @ Wed, Dec 17, 2025 11:17:03 am EST from 88.87.179.191

[SPOILER] Oh, and we got the answer to the biggest question I'd had about this issue: whether Demona would attend/take part in Angelika's Wind Ceremony or not - and, of course, she didn't. (Which I'd suspected, though I'd left myself open to the possibility that she'd surprise us.) At least she attended Magni's Wind Ceremony, though. [/SPOILER]
Todd Jensen
posted @ Wed, Dec 17, 2025 8:44:09 am EST from 68.99.93.213

Just read "Demona" #5.

[SPOILER] It was a very touching ending to the mini-series.

There was one big surprise in it. I was expecting Angelika to be killed by the Canmore Hunter; instead, she simply quietly departs from old age, in a "her time had come" manner and touching fashion, with the young Katana beside her. One of the really great touches was that Demona still finds a way to blame it on the Canmore Hunter and the humans in general, crying out in fury that if it hadn't been for them, she could have been beside Angelika in her final earthly moments - and I think it was even more effective than if it had been Angelika being slain by the Hunter.

(I found myself empathizing a bit with Demona's grief at not being with Angelika in those final moments - though not the anger. A few years ago, my cat Obie passed on during the night, and while that was saddening enough, what upset me more was that I was asleep in my bedroom when it happened (she passed on lying in the armchair in the living-room). I wished that I'd known it was her last night on Earth, so that I could have sat up with her and properly said good-bye to her.)

We get, as I'd hoped, a lot of echoes of "Demona" #0 and #1. Another Canmore Hunter to parallel their new beginning in #1, and Katana as a gargoyle rookling to parallel the young Angelika. One extra touch I really liked was Katana attempting to accompany Demona, the same way Angelika had done, and this time, Demona refuses her. She's gone back to being alone again - though the butterfly at the very end does provide a slight sliver of hope.

I'll have more to say later, but I thought it a fine end to the mini-series. And we've the second Winter Special to look forward to, next week. [/SPOILER]
Todd Jensen
posted @ Wed, Dec 17, 2025 7:56:29 am EST from 68.99.93.213

Nice to meet you! I took the time to read through your post and found it very informative and well explained. Thanks for sharing such useful content — I really enjoyed it and learned a lot from your insights.
TKTX - [a010761190901 at gmail dot com]
TKTX
posted @ Wed, Dec 17, 2025 7:25:50 am EST from 222.110.30.191

Could I see the blossom as other blossoms, Then would there be no dew to cloud my heart.
-The Tale of Genji

[SPOILER] And so comes the end of Demona's comic series. At the start a duo, now concluded, a solo.

I have to give credit to the comic for a short, but excellent representation of Japanese culture. The butterflies released in the wind ceremony were a great touch as they're often used to represent the soul as well as longevity, transformation, femininity, and life and death. Another nice touch came in the kimonos Demona is seen wearing in the comic and cover art. Again it's a color with multiple meanings as it symbolizes spiritual purity but is also associated with death. Rather appropriate considering the comic begins with the loss of Magni and ends with the loss of Angelika.

When we were first introduced to Angelika and Demona's unusually affectionate display towards the locket, I theorized that she behaved this way because out of all the gargoyles she encountered in her long life, Angelika was the one most likely to follow in her footsteps and her hatred of humanity. The opposite turned out to be true. Of all the gargoyles in her life, this one seemed to value life and people from all over the world the most. Despite experiencing a tragedy not unlike Demona had gone through, she never succumbed to hate or lashed out at the world around her. Everywhere they went, she grew while Demona didn't, at least not in the ways that matter. Every occupation and adventure, whether as survivor, warrior, raider, protector, mate and grandmother enriched her life. How appropriate that in her last days she tried her hand at storytelling, a lesson learned from a human no less, and her last words to tell her mother to not choose a life of loneliness.

Another important bit of cultural depictions is the sakura (cherry blossom) petals used in the comic. While the most common interpretation is that they symbolize death the deeper meaning is a little bit more complicated. The falling of the petals is meant to symbolize the transition of one stage of life to the next, childhood to adulthood or life to death. Here we see the transition of Demona from reluctant parental figure to lonely immortal. But there's the rub, she was a lonely immortal at the beginning, and ended the same way. Starting and ending with killing a Canmore and continuing the cycle of revenge. She had gone through everything Angelika had but didn't grow from the experience, her hatred of humans kept in check only for a (relatively) short time. Even in Ishimura, perhaps the best example of gargoyle/human relations, she couldn't let go of her grief-wrapped hatred. She could've parted with young Katana on better terms or at the very least gently told her that this was a path she needed to take alone, but she instead struck her because neither gargoyle nor human is safe from her loneliness.

Speaking of which, we finally have a reference of time for Katana besides "feudal Japan." I thought the date 1274 seemed familiar and when I looked it up I remembered that this was an important period of time. This was one of several ill-fated invasion attempts against Japan by the Mongolian Khanate, Kublai Khan's invasion at Hakata bay was ultimately thwarted by the Hojo clan and the samurai (the samurai class was in its infancy at this period of time). I can imagine Canmore would take advantage of this period of time in order to get into Japan, maybe even getting in through connections forged with the Khan himself. Again, this is just speculation.

To conclude, I'd like to bring up a bit of a revelation and another theory. Demona didn't often display much affection for Angelika until the very end of the series, I have the sneaking suspicion that a big reason for her wanting to steal Brooklyn and Katana's egg wasn't just to mold another gargoyle in her image and hatred of humanity. It's also because she wants to recapture the feeling of motherhood she didn't appreciate until it was too late. This is pretty twisted, but it may also be the undoing of her latest scheme. Just as her grief was key to end the City of Stone arc, her misplaced need for love might just be the thing to put an end to the egg-napping. [/SPOILER]

That's all for now, but I'll be back with more thoughts soon enough. Until then, thank you Greg, Frank and all the other artists and staff who worked on the comic. Here's to many more!
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Wed, Dec 17, 2025 5:30:28 am EST from 184.23.35.150

Does anyone else notice that the digital issues tend not to release exactly at midnight? I'm not sure if it's just me or a more widespread thing. Usually they'll pop up after a few minutes of refreshing, but today, it took until 12:42am for Demona #5 to turn up on both my computer and phone app. Not a big deal, but it's just something I've wondered about.

Anyway, thoughts on Demona #5...

[SPOILER]
No title this time around. Not sure if that was an intentional choice or an accidental omission, but I see that GargWiki has the title, as provided by Mr. Weisman. In fact, Bishansky and Phoenician seem to have been raring and ready to go tonight. As soon as I finished the issue, I checked GargWiki on the off-chance that the name for the new Hunter was listed, and saw that she already has her own entry!

The title, "Forever Sound the Mystic Chords of Memory..." seems to be partly borrowed from Abraham Lincoln's first inaugural address. Specifically, the phrase "mystic chords of memory" comes from the same sentence which gives "Better Angels" its title: "The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battlefield and patriot grave to every living heart and hearthstone all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature."

The Wind Ceremony is absolutely lovely. The butterflies are a beautiful touch, and Frank's splash panel of all the gargoyles and butterflies in the air is just gorgeous. (I'm already running out of adjectives/synonyms to praise this issue!) I love Demona's offer to carry Angelika...it's amazing to see that she's still capable of this kind of tenderness and empathy at this point, when I think most of us had assumed her heart had completely hardened after "City of Stone."

Also great to get more of Katana, who has remained a bit of an enigma in the present-day due to the limited page count and large cast to be serviced. Child Katana is very charming here, displaying a playfully ruthless and competitive side ("I win! I win!") that clearly appeals to Demona. Demona's little smile when Katana chops off a lock of her hair is so damned charming. Life with Angelika, and life in Ishimura with some sense of belonging again, has clearly done her a lot of good. Back in 1093, she would have decked anyone who violated her personal space in such a way. We also finally learn why Katana is acting strangely back in "A Prize Beyond Compare..." Clearly, even if she doesn't know exactly what Demona is up to at the museum, she senses that it's more of a sentimental mission than anything nefarious. It will be interesting to learn more about how Katana feels about Demona in the present, and particularly to see their eventual confrontation over Katana's child, given this insight into their backstory.

The scene of Demona coming across Angelika writing her memoirs is great as well. I've been helping my Dad proofread documents that he's been writing, detailing what he's been able to learn about our family history, and specific reminiscences from his mother (my grandmother), who passed last year. So I was very much in the right headspace to relate to Angelika's wish to preserve her and her mother's history in writing, and I was very touched by the notion...as Demona clearly is as well, to Angelika's and our surprise, particularly at one specific word.

It wasn't unexpected to see Demona watching her daughter grow old and ultimately die, as the solicitations made it pretty clear months ago that that's where this was going, but expected or not, it's still very poignant and effective. Demona's line, "Be strong. Be here--when I return," is especially moving. Katana's "With my life" at the end of that scene is great as well (look at that adorable little warrior!).

The shot of Demona's eyes glowing on page 15 is nightmare fuel. I'm not sure we've ever seen her looking quite this scary.

As someone who found the final issues of "Here in Manhattan" and "Quest" a bit rushed and not fully satisfying, I was wondering how Demona #5 would land for me. I think a similar issue is SORT OF present here, in that the new Hunter (Siobahn Canmore per GargWiki) is dispatched with so quickly that she barely even makes an impression. But here, that anticlimax is the point: Siobahn is a distraction, taking Demona away from the real meat of the story at a pivotal moment. This ending chapter worked far better for me, because the true focus is the emotion and the relationship, and Siobahn is just an inconvenience and an annoyance. Even the fight is interspersed with Demona's memories of Angelika, reminding us where she truly wants to be in this moment. Frank does get to draw a few great battle panels, though.

I wasn't a fan of the "I have been denied everything" line. It feels fan service-y, and honestly pulled me out of the moment. Instead of focusing on Demona's emotions in the moment, I was instead suddenly very conscious that I was reading self-referential Greg Weisman dialogue. Eh.

The page of the three gargoyles turning to stone at the height of their emotional confrontation is very effective. Good use of that classic gag from the early episodes.

The final pages are very moving. I can very much relate to Demona's attitude here: I personally don't get much out of funerals, or of holding onto physical mementos. Once someone is gone, once the personality and essence of that person is forever rent from this life, rituals and objects don't give me much comfort. As Demona succinctly puts it, "Nothing will ever bring her back." And yet, I can also relate to Demona many (MANY) years later regretting that she disposed of the locket, and wanting to have it after all.

The tragedy of Demona rejecting love because it inevitably comes with pain is so heartbreaking, and so quintessentially Demona. And again, relatable, on some level. I think we've all been in the position where we're tired of being hurt, and are tempted to just shut ourselves off from the world. The "Never the end..." tag feels especially meaningful here, as Greg seems to be implying that Demona's story isn't fully written yet. Despite the dark path she's been on for so long, maybe someday she'll surprise us, and herself. She certainly surprised me throughout this miniseries, and revealed some layers I never expected.

As I've said before, this series has been by far my favorite Gargoyles comics run. It's been great to see Greg trying new things in terms of pacing and tone that we wouldn't necessarily have associated with Gargoyles, while still feeling very much a part of the world. It's been great to have such a small cast and a character-based story. And of course, it's been amazing to have Frank Paur back in the fold doing some absolutely stunning work, and proving his chops in a different medium. So thanks to Greg, Frank, Robby, Nate, Jeff Eckleberry, and everyone else responsible for bringing us this terrific addition to the canon.
[/SPOILER]
Craig
posted @ Wed, Dec 17, 2025 3:02:46 am EST from 69.118.30.106

Not sure what that was all about, but I'm glad it's fixed for now.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Tue, Dec 16, 2025 11:24:51 pm EST from 184.23.35.150

Phew! Back up again.

I saw a few preview pages of "Demona" #5 earlier this evening. [SPOILER] I'd thought that Magni's passing took place a while before the events in this issue, but instead, we see his wind ceremony in Japan, with Demona, Angelika, and a young Katana all present. The Wind Ceremony mostly follows the same pattern as the one we saw in "Dark Ages: Alliance", but with a lovely unique-to-Japan touch of butterflies being released to take part in the gargoyles' gliding. (There's also a mountain in the background, presumably Mt. Fuji.) I'm looking forward to seeing the whole thing tomorrow. [/SPOILER]
Todd Jensen
posted @ Tue, Dec 16, 2025 10:29:37 pm EST from 68.99.93.213

While I don't seriously want Dynamite to do a crossover between "Gargoyles" and "Adventures of the Gummi Bears" at present (for now, two crossovers are enough, though the Fantastic Four one was fun, and the upcoming "Darkwing Duck" one likely to be even more entertaining; I'd like to see more regular canon stories), I did find myself imagining an encounter between them (the most likely way for that being either a Timedancing Brooklyn, or maybe some of the Wyvern clan during the "Dark Ages" period) with the gargoyle(s) in question telling the Gummis something like "Yes, your last encounter with a living gargoyle wasn't that great, but we've got more in common with you guys than we do with the gargoyle that Duke Igthorne fellow claimed you'd sent to King Gregor". (With the particular appeal of that statement being the acknowledgment of the influence "Gummi Bears" had on "Gargoyles".)
Todd Jensen
posted @ Mon, Dec 15, 2025 7:53:40 pm EST from 68.99.93.213

morrand> Your comment about Animaniacs and Freakazoid! made me realize something. Combine those two with things with others like Invader Zim, Homestar Runner and Charlie the Unicorn (which just turned 20 last month, oye), as the reason why Millennials have such a weird sense of humor.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Mon, Dec 15, 2025 5:44:11 pm EST from 184.23.35.150

There was definitely some 'Gummi Bears' merchandise. I have a Zummi plush doll; there were dolls and figures of all the main characters, and some children's books. But as Matthew TFG says, 'Wuzzles' was the big merchandising push out of the two original 1985 Disney TVA shows. That show was developed in collaboration with Hasbro. (I'm not sure if this is true, but one story I've heard is that Disney and Hasbro each independently developed the concept of "characters who are half one animal and half another"...once they caught wind of one another's projects, they decided it would be more profitable to work together, rather than sue each other.) I've watched all thirteen 'Wuzzles' episodes, and it's really shocking what a difference it is from the first season of 'Gummi Bears,' given that the two were produced side-by-side. 'Wuzzles' feels much more like a pale imitation of the 1970s Hanna-Barbera style, with a lot of try-hard verbal and visual humor that really doesn't land. I don't mean to oversell 'Gummi Bears' as a masterpiece or anything, but it's lightyears ahead of 'Wuzzles' in terms of music, voice acting, and especially writing. Not to take anything away from the folks who worked on 'Wuzzles,' many of whom have done good work elsewhere...but it really feels like the bar for quality was set far lower on that series. Funnily enough, 'Gummi Bears' and 'Wuzzles' both aired at the same time (8:30am Saturday mornings, respectively on NBC and CBS), so they were in direct competition with each other. Obviously, 'Wuzzles' lost.

For those interested, Mark Evanier (perhaps best known for writing all the episodes of the 1980s 'Garfield & Friends') wrote a blog post about his time developing the 'Wuzzles' pilot (and why he left the show due to Disney's meddling): https://www.newsfromme.com/2024/05/17/ask-me-the-wuzzles/

As for the Spielberg-Warner Bros. shows, one thing I've repeatedly heard is that Spielberg insisted that the shows be fully scored with a thirty-piece orchestra, just like the classic 'Looney Tunes.' Warner Bros. pushed back, saying that it would be too expensive, but Spielberg insisted. That's something that even Disney never did (as Greg has noted, 'Gargoyles' reused a lot of score from prior episodes; and as Carl Johnson has said, the show was about 50% live orchestra and 50% synthesized orchestra). That full score really makes a difference on a show like 'Animaniacs,' amplifying the comedy beats.
Craig
posted @ Mon, Dec 15, 2025 4:35:00 pm EST from 69.118.30.106

Fedora Matt: Fair points, and in the era of the supermarket toy aisle, it was a risk to make a show for afternoon TV that didn't have a merchandise line to draw from. Disney and, a little later on, WB both deserve credit for taking that risk, although I don't suppose they had much choice other than to start from the entertainment side and then maybe work their way back to the merchandise (which, at least with "Gargoyles," they did with zeal; I don't specifically remember any "Gummi Bears" merchandise, although without bothering to search I imagine there must have been). If you're going to start there, you're going to have to do it right and make something strong enough to stand out on its own merit, and I think in the end we were all the beneficiaries of that.

Steven Spielberg could have gotten behind twenty-six half-hourly episodes of a test pattern and got it into syndication, I suspect. Besides the name recognition and the good writing, both "Freakazoid!" and "Animaniacs" also benefited from being screwball comedies, and that probably helped get them on the air too. But I don't want to dismiss the idea that the bar was being raised starting with "Gummi Bears," and putting on any animated show that was more than a half-hour toy ad became a lot easier once someone went first with it.
morrand - [morrand276 at gmail dot com]
posted @ Mon, Dec 15, 2025 3:08:13 pm EST from 108.69.72.60

THIRD!

Thanks Craig and Matthew for the recommendations. I think I will watch those over Winter Break!

1.5 days until Demona #5!
Matt
"My daughter?! How dare you mock me! I have no daughter." - Demona, 1996
posted @ Mon, Dec 15, 2025 12:36:35 pm EST from 204.184.178.1

Ah, yeah, "Knights of Gummadoon" is fun. Especially since Greg considered using Brigadoon on 'Gargoyles' at one point.
Craig
posted @ Mon, Dec 15, 2025 5:31:03 am EST from 69.118.30.106

Morrand and Craig> Good coverage of the state of tv animation of that age, one thing that's overlooked though was the impact of merchandise-driven shows of the era (for both good and ill). Things like Transformers, G.I. Joe, My Little Pony etc. found a market in entertainment, and one thing you can count on with Disney is to try and corner a market of entertainment. That attempt was The Wuzzles which obviously didn't last in the long run. But the other piece of animation that was produced at around the same time and that helped to create a new age of television animation that'd go hand-in-hand with the Renaissance of film animation of the era.

morrand> You referenced both Animaniacs and Freakazoid!, I'd be remiss if I didn't mention both had the support of Steven Spielberg who helped produce a number of cartoons for Warner Bros at the time. Just goes to show what you can can be done with some creative minds and the proper financial support to back it up.

Matt> If you're still interested in recommendations for Gummi Bears, I have a few suggestions. Besides the ones listed by Craig for the first season I'd recommend "A Gummi by Any Other Name" from season 1. From season 2, "Over the River and Through the Trolls", "The Crimson Avenger", and "Hard Dazed Knight." From season 3, "Water Way to Go" and "The Knights of Gummadoon."

There are others, but those are just the ones I can think of right now.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Mon, Dec 15, 2025 4:47:53 am EST from 184.23.35.150