morrand > [SPOILER]
Hmm, I’d been operating under the assumption that Shahpar had not met Lance before the first Winter Special, but I suppose it’s ambiguous.
[/SPOILER]
Craig
posted @ Sat, Jan 17, 2026 8:03:38 pm EST from 63.119.86.210

The closest I can recall any of the gargoyles looking up at the night sky was Hudson seeing a sort of vision of Verity in it at the end of "Dark Ages: Alliance" (with no hint of the vision being linked to the stars or other regular features).

[SPOILER] If the second Winter Special took place in January 1998, that would add to the urgency about recovering Egwardo that I mentioned a few weeks ago; Egwardo's hatching would be just two months away by then. Definitely a strong "ticking clock" element. (And that was a good observation about the kittens.) [/SPOILER]
Todd Jensen
posted @ Sat, Jan 17, 2026 6:34:55 pm EST from 68.99.93.213

Speaking as, apparently, the room's standard bearer for unfortunate circumstances, or something along that line, a two-week embargo sounds about right. There's a balance between the nuisance of having the plot surprises spoiled and the nuisance of adding and then reading past the spoiler tags, and there might be some value in holding on to them a bit longer for especially potent plot twists. (Tip o' the hat to Craig for giving me a good belly laugh this morning. Never figured I'd be setting a bad example!) I'll go with Matthew's suggestion for what follows.

It seems clear in the first Winter Special that Lance and the cat (whom I guess we are calling Sepideh) are familiar enough with each other that Sepideh welcomes being found by Lance, rather than hissing and defending her kittens. I do think this indicates that Lance had been [SPOILER] living with Shahpar and Sepideh for a while by the time of the first Special, long enough for cat and dog to have been living together [/SPOILER]--you can supply the Peter Venkman quote yourself if you like--[SPOILER] and to have figured out each other's place in things, and certainly long enough for Shahpar to have been taking inspiration from him. [/SPOILER]

The better tell would be in the weather, except that the Weather Service records only a trace of snow at Central Park in December 1997. Dec. 22-23 did see substantial rain in the actual records with a couple more days of moderate to heavy rain in the days that followed, but also temperatures that stayed above freezing almost right through the end of the year. In the January that followed, there were several more rainy days but very little snow at all, and a stretch of a couple of weeks early in the month that were substantially warmer than average (topping out at 65 deg F (18 C) on the 8th!).

The best hint as to the timing? [SPOILER] The kittens. It's been a long while since I've dealt with kittens directly, but by the second Special they are active enough to climb up on Bronx, and it sounds like that would be consistent with them being about four weeks old or a bit older. Going back to weather, if we're just looking at precipitation and not at temperatures, January 23, 1998, had a lot of rain (2.55 inches, which could equate to 2 ft of light snow if it had the chance) and that plus the stage of the kittens makes this the best guess I can offer for the date on which the second Special begins. That doesn't do much to explain the cards, but knowing a few people who make crafts for a living, the extra cards we see are likely extras that Shahpar kept for herself, drafts, proofs, or just unsold stock; I'm not sure they say much on their own about the timing. [/SPOILER]

I can't help but think that naming the stars would have seemed to the Wyvern clan a little like it'd seem to us if someone named each of the holes in the acoustic ceiling tiles. Anyway, assuming that the clans didn't have a need for long-range navigation that couldn't be served by landmarks, it seems like the primary sense of astronomy they'd have would be for gauging the time of year. (Using astronomy for finding longitude is hard, especially without a way to find local noon and keep time from it, so it may be just as well if they didn't need it for detailed navigation.) Knowing that certain patterns of stars at sunset indicate how near the equinox is could be very helpful, for example. Calling the pattern something other than "the spring pattern" or "the midsummer stars" (or whatever) is potentially something they'd only have picked up in order to communicate with their local human populations, assuming there was any special need for that.
morrand - [morrand276 at gmail dot com]
posted @ Sat, Jan 17, 2026 6:07:45 pm EST from 108.69.72.60

Phoenician> That set me down a bit of a astronomical rabbit hole. At first I wondered how some of the usual Shakespearian characters would react to having moons of Uranus named after them. I imagine Prospero was amused while Oberon was miffed that he only got a moon rather than a whole planet.

The next big point was on how gargoyles used astronomy. Most indigenous people used some form of astronomy across human history so I think it stands to reason that gargoyles did something similar or the learned it through cross-cultural osmosis not unlike how the Greeks developed their own form of astronomy from the Egyptians and the Babylonians. And considering how astronomy was most often used in navigation, I can imagine that sort of thing was pretty important to gargoyles since they're a strictly nocturnal species and can't rely on the position of the sun for things like time keeping or determining the East/West distance.

Another thing I thought about is that while the Wyvern Clan (and probably most gargoyles) never felt the need for naming, they didn't really oppose it either. I have a feeling that while they never felt the need to call the North Star anything special, just to teach others that the one that doesn't move always leads north, they adopted the human names for it sooner or later whether it was Cynosura or Dhruva or al-Judayy.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Fri, Jan 16, 2026 3:09:58 pm EST from 184.23.35.150

PHOENICIAN - I've wondered myself what gargoyles would make of human astronomers insisting on naming everything. Gargoyles would certainly be familiar with the night sky, for obvious reasons. I remember Greg Weisman giving a very poetic description on one of the "Voices from the Eyrie" podcasts about the beauty of the night sky and how its colors are a lot more varied than you'd think.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Fri, Jan 16, 2026 8:08:42 am EST from 68.99.93.213

I believe we did establish something like a week-to-two weeks for spoiler tags in regards to the new comics, but I know I've kept them up if there was word someone was having trouble getting their hands on an issue (be it physical or digital). At any rate, I'm not particularly attached to any frame of time, I just know that I see no reason to unintentionally ruin the fun for our regulars if a situation arises.

Tangent -- I took the time last weekend to reacquaint myself with Jupiter's Galilean moons, when I heard that Earth was positioned at its closest to Jupiter for the year, given our respective orbits. My telescope is nothing fancy (especially in the city), but it did allow me to see the four white dots of (in order, I believe) Europa, Callisto, Europa, Io, and on Jupiter's other side, Ganymede. Of course, Galileo Galilei was seven centuries after the Wyvern Clan, but I couldn't help but wonder what our Scottish gargoyles in the Dark Ages must of thought of any human insisting on names for the various celestial bodies in the night sky (especially if the planet or constellation was associated with a deity).

More Tangent -- Just wanted to give a happy anniversary to Wikipedia's creation twenty-five years ago today. For perspective, Wikipedia was only five years old (and the iteration of the software it primarily uses, MediaWiki, only four years old) when GargWiki was first established. :--)
Phoenician
Gus: "I always forget you're there." Hooty: "I forget I'm here toooooo."
posted @ Thu, Jan 15, 2026 10:47:34 pm EST from 68.2.64.232

It seems to me that most of the regular contributors here read the issues pretty quickly, usually at least within a few days of release, barring unfortunate circumstances like morrand being unable to obtain Demona #4 for several weeks. It does feel like the spoiler tags go on well past the period where all of us have read the issue. Of course, there may be lurkers who don't regularly post, and that could be a concern as well.
Craig
posted @ Thu, Jan 15, 2026 7:10:22 pm EST from 69.118.30.106

MATTHEW = That seems like a good idea to me.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Thu, Jan 15, 2026 6:36:16 pm EST from 68.99.93.213

When we talked about when to turn off spoilers, I remember there was some back and forth depending on the medium.
When Young Justice was premiering new episodes we usually waited a week before taking spoilers off (just in time for a new one to drop). With the comics it was never really established. I think at one point we agreed on two weeks and then it just extended.

I figure starting next week would be a good cut off point for taking spoilers off of the Winter Special and all of the Demona miniseries.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Thu, Jan 15, 2026 3:56:02 pm EST from 184.23.35.150

I MISSED YOU FEASLER MY BABYGIRL I LOVE YOUUUUUUUUUUUU
GoliathRocks - [jkaoobkomvmlvvlfs at enotj dot com]
i love u feasler
posted @ Thu, Jan 15, 2026 11:38:02 am EST from 205.123.251.62

Hi guys! missed you all so much, I hope you missed me!! ;)
Feasler - [vtnztvcdltaoxelsph at nespj dot com]
i love you too
posted @ Thu, Jan 15, 2026 11:37:30 am EST from 205.123.251.62

Thank you sincerely for taking the time to read this. I truly appreciate your interest, and I hope the information offered here is helpful to you.
https://hobba-gangnam.isweb.co.kr/ - [self-hacking at naver dot com]
https://hobba-gangnam.isweb.co.kr/
posted @ Thu, Jan 15, 2026 8:24:22 am EST from 180.182.66.3

Ah, sorry. Christmas feels like so long ago that I forgot the Winter Special is only three weeks old.
Craig
posted @ Wed, Jan 14, 2026 7:45:32 pm EST from 69.118.30.106

I was a bit surprised to see a comment on the latest Winter Special without spoiler tags, but it's a relatively minor element (not like revealing [SPOILER] the solution to the mystery [/SPOILER]), and I suppose that everyone here has already read that issue.

And, yes, the "making ready for next Christmas" does seem the best explanation. (I suppose it could make a question for "Ask Greg", but with thousands of questions in the queue, we'd have a very long wait.)
Todd Jensen
posted @ Wed, Jan 14, 2026 7:07:48 pm EST from 68.99.93.213

One thing I was thinking about in regards to "Stone Cold Case": Shahpar says that Lance has become her muse, indicating that a bit of time has gone by since the first Winter Special. Per GargWiki's timeline, the first Winter Special takes place from December 22-23. So, "Stone Cold Case" is presumably set in January at the earliest. Yet Shahpar has made a Christmas card with Lance in a Santa hat! I guess she's getting a very early start for next year?
Craig
posted @ Wed, Jan 14, 2026 5:38:25 pm EST from 69.118.30.106

Testing something
Algea
Tibi, Magnum Innominandum, signa stellarum nigrarum et bufoniformis Sadoquae sigillum
posted @ Wed, Jan 14, 2026 5:23:16 pm EST from 64.227.1.156

MASTERDRAMON - Thank you. I hope that's it.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Wed, Jan 14, 2026 7:43:20 am EST from 68.99.93.213

The "Nobody here but us chickens" message seems to be the default display when the Ask Greg side of things is unable to load data, to my understanding. I've seen it many times in the past.

So not necessarily any indication of a threat actor.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009 at mymail dot pomona dot edu]
"If someone ever tells me it's a mistake to have hope, well then, I'll just tell them they're wrong. And I'll keep telling them until they believe. No matter how many times it takes." - Madoka Kaname
posted @ Tue, Jan 13, 2026 11:10:15 pm EST from 75.85.65.128

I wonder why. One of the trolls from past visits (though we haven't had much trouble with those lately; we've seen far more bots than trolls here lately).
Todd Jensen
posted @ Tue, Jan 13, 2026 9:46:41 pm EST from 68.99.93.213

Judging by what happened with the Greg's Answers, I'd say it was hacked.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Tue, Jan 13, 2026 9:35:40 pm EST from 184.23.35.150

And the room is back up again; thank goodness. I wonder what happened to it yesterday.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Tue, Jan 13, 2026 7:18:22 pm EST from 68.99.93.213

Big thanks to the crew at GargWiki for remainding me that today is Clark Ashton Smith's 113rd birthday!

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/t3QWc12M228

May Tsathoggua bless your night.
Algea
Tibi, Magnum Innominandum, signa stellarum nigrarum et bufoniformis Sadoquae sigillum
posted @ Tue, Jan 13, 2026 5:18:35 pm EST from 147.182.166.251

Craig> I remember that episode with Tummi meeting the blind woman (amusingly enough it's also called "Eye of the Beholder"). What also stood out was that Duke Igthorn and his forces, despite being proudly evil, didn't feel comfortable harassing a blind woman. One of those, "We might be villains, but we're not scumbags" moments.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Mon, Jan 12, 2026 4:38:03 pm EST from 184.23.35.150

Matthew the Fedora Guy > Another Gummi Bears / Gargoyles connection also occurred to me recently. In the past, we've mentioned a few episodes that had premises similar to Gargoyles scenarios (such as Tummi befriending a blind woman who doesn't know he's a Gummi Bear). But I don't believe the episode "Dress for Success" has been mentioned, wherein the Gummies attend "Folly Day" at Dunwyn Castle, taking advantage of the fact that they'll be mistaken for humans in costume. I wonder if that episode was a conscious influence on "Eye of the Beholder" at all.
Craig
posted @ Mon, Jan 12, 2026 4:07:53 pm EST from 69.118.30.106

Fifth!

A while ago we talked about Gargoyles and its relationship to Gummi Bears, one thing I forgot to mention was that Gummi Bears beat Gargoyles to the punch at least in one regard: casting Star Trek alumni.

Roger C. Carmel (Harry Mudd from the original series) had a recurring role on Gummi Bears before his death in 1986. I doubt that was a big influence on the casting process in Gargoyles, but it's still funny to think about.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
You're Gonna Carry That Weight
posted @ Mon, Jan 12, 2026 3:47:37 pm EST from 184.23.35.150

Fourth!
Craig
posted @ Mon, Jan 12, 2026 10:55:09 am EST from 69.118.30.106

Third
Phil
posted @ Mon, Jan 12, 2026 10:09:36 am EST from 50.192.123.171

Second!
Matt
"My daughter?! How dare you mock me! I have no daughter." - Demona, 1996
posted @ Mon, Jan 12, 2026 8:35:54 am EST from 204.184.178.1

First.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Mon, Jan 12, 2026 8:21:31 am EST from 68.99.93.213