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My question did Katherine ever find out that Magus loved her? And I remember him saying that Katherine and Tom raised the hatchlings like a family. Well didn't he have a place with them, too? And also do you think things might have been different if Magus ever told Katherine his feelings to her?
I'll leave it to everyone to decide for themselves what Katherine knew and/or when.
Yes, he was like another father to Angela and the rest.
As I've said many times, I'm not too interested in hypotheticals.
The Magus refered to the gargoyles as "unnatural creatures;" I find this an interesting sentiment from someone who has spent his life studying magic, which is something that has historically been refered to as unnatural itself. Is there a specific reason for his prejudice?
No comment.
1. Why did the Archmage-Plus specifically pick Macbeth to serve him alongside Demona other than just following the directions of his future self?
2. How did the Archmage intend to deal with the returning Oberon and his entourage? Could he have fought Oberon off if he had succeeded in taking Avalon from the gargoyles?
3. Who was the greater threat in the Avalon Three Parter? The Weird Sisters or the Archmage?
1. Do you think he needed a better reason? (I do, but I may be a touch smarter than he is.)
2. Not sure he knew about Oberon's pending return.
3. Depends on whether you're the Magus or Goliath.
Will you ever tell who Tom's father is in the comic books or in a TV show if you made one? If so, would it be in GARGOYLES or in one of the 5 spin-off shows?
Thank you for your time.
-Charisma82
Eventually, I'd get to everything. This might happen in Dark Ages, but a Gargoyles flashback or even a TimeDancer episode might get us there first.
What does Demona think of the way Katherine, Tom, and the Magus raised her clan's children?
Wow... Makhasu, I'm impressed by how fast you were able to type at 4 in the morning. This is a lot of questions, particularly considering that I specifically asked people NOT to flood the submission queue at least until I had caught up.
Anyway, again, I'm not inclined to spell this stuff out for you too much. I think the episodes should stand on their own without too much annotation. Take a look at "The Reckoning" again, and I think you'll find enough clues to the answer to this question.
Hey again.
Okay I'll get straight to it. . . Did Katherine and Tom ever consumate their relationship? The Magus said they became as husband and wife, but it's not like there was anyone ordained to perform a marriage; so, I took it as a comparison and not a literal union.
That's a long term relationship, but I'm thinking that they weren't brought up to have sex outside of marriage.
I do think they consumated their relationship, and I think they viewed it as a marriage, performed the best ceremony they could under the circumstances and then lived their lives.
And my name is really Greg. :) My question refers to Tom's search for Goliath. If I'm remember correctly, Tom left Avalon every 100 years to search for Goliath. So basically, Tom left Avalon 10 times. One brief point; through calculation, I determined that 41.67 years past for Tom and the others on Avalon, while 1000 years past for those outside. In "Avalonian Years", Tom left the island approximately every 4 years to search (I hope I'm correct on those points). Any thoughts on where Avalon sent him those 10 times and how long before he was sent back to Avalon?
Tom did not leave Avalon every 100 years to search for Goliath. Tom left to see if he felt it would be safe for the Gargoyles to return to the outside world.
I have very concrete ideas about most of Tom's trips. But I'm not going to reveal them at this time.
How did Elisa know how to wake up Sleeping King Arthur in Avalon part 3?
The Magus filled her in off-camera.
Iâve always been very interested in the Archmage. I really love his transformation from a kind of one-dimensional villain in âLong Way âtil Morningâ to a character with such an interning as in âAvalonâ (and to a lesser extent âVowsâ). And I absolutely love the idea of Archmage Plus being a villain in the Timedancers and G: 2198 series.
I also really enjoy the Magus. When he first appeared in âAwakeningâ I was really mad at him, but when he die at the end of âAvalonâ, I was amazed at the huge change that had occurred in my perception of his character. He became such a tragic hero.
Anyways, because of my interest in these characters, some questions have come to mind,
1. When did the Archmage first come to live at Castle Wyvern?
2. Why did the Archmage start to âworkâ for Malcolm?
3. When did the Magus become Archmageâs apprentice?
4a. What is Archmageâs real name? 4b. What is Magusâ real name?
5. When was the Archmage born?
6. When did the Archmage discover the ruins and megalith in the caverns near Wyvern?
7a. Did Magus know about the magical ruins in the Archmageâs lair? 7b. Did he know about the Archmageâs plans for "ultimate power"?
8. Did Archmage deduce that use of the Gate, the Eye and the Grimorum together would give him the "ultimate power" or did he find the information from an outside source (i.e. another Sorcerer or magic book)?
1. Well, I suppose it depends how you define "Castle" Wyvern... but the answer is 971.
2. He made a strategic alliance.
3. 982.
4a&b. I don't know or can't remember.
5. 914.
6. That I'm not revealing.
7a. Define "lair"..
7b. I'm not revealing this either.
8. Outside source.
in "Awakening" Xanatos mentions that the Magus wrote the story of the Gargoyles down in the Grimorum, which is how (he claims) he found out about Goliath's Clan and the way to break the spell. my question is, how far does that story go? in "Avalon" we see the Magus writing in the Grimorum before he went off to Avalon and lost the book. did Magus write the story up to the point of reaching Edinburgh or Constantine's takeover or even all the way up the plans to leave for Avalon?
i wonder this because i wonder how much Xanatos knows about what happens to the Clan's eggs. he tells Goliath that the eggs are not in the rookery and we know that that is of course true, but is he hiding information in "Awakening" about the fate of the eggs?
I assume that since the Magus more-or-less knew or suspected that he couldn't take the book into Avalon, he wouldn't risk divulging the "plan" in its pages -- since he couldn't guarantee that the book wouldn't fall into Constantine's hands.
A question about the gargoyles' time living with the humans in Castle Wyvern between 971 and 994. In "Awakening" at the beginning, all the humans living in the castle, except for the Captain of the Guard (and Tom, but he wasn't a regular inhabitant) were, from what we can tell, hostile towards the gargoyles.
Now, since gargoyles and humans had been living side by side for 23 years, I found myself wondering a little about this. I know that prejudice can often take a very long time to overcome, but I still find it a matter of mild concern that after living with gargoyles for 23 years, with ample opportunity during all that time to see what they were really like, the humans would still be so hostile towards them. (Katharine did get conditioned to fear gargoyles due to Prince Malcolm's foolish use of them as bogeymen when she was a child, of course, so her attitude is believable.)
Of course, I suppose that it would require the entire "Dark Ages" series all the way down to the Wyvern Massacre to give a real answer to this question, but I did think that I'd comment on it. (And if after 23 years of sharing their home with the gargoyles, nearly all the humans still disliked them, I can see how it is that Demona is so cynical and pessimistic about peace between the two species. On the other hand, since Katharine and the Magus did abandon their old attitudes after the massacre and even dedicated the rest of their lives to looking after the orphaned eggs, there is hope.)
There's always hope. I think the prejudice was subtle and on-going, because nothing had ever been done about it.
Most humans in the castle weren't looking to slaughter the Gargoyles or even kick them out. But they took the Gargoyles' defense of the cliffside for granted... enough years had passed that the camaradery of the great battles they shared had been -- not forgotten -- but dampened.
And the leader sets the tone, and for the reasons you listed above, Katharine was not sympathetic to or fond of the Gargoyles. So those Lords looking to curry favor would tend to being dismissive. I also think that the Gargoyles still represented a mental wildcard to the humans. A great force in their midst that they couldn't fully control. It was disturbing. And then there are the archers, who do their jobs well, but who may have had chips on their shoulders because they weren't sufficient to guard the castle... and because their own boss seemed to respect the Gargs more than his own men.
The idea was little things contributing to on-going tension ... and a leader who was part of the problem, not part of the solution.
Why couldn't the Magus make a counter spell for the frozen gargoyles?
The Magus was not great at INVENTING spells. Just at performing them.
I've been a fan of Gargoyles for a while and I was wondering what a few characters were based on. The mythology is put into the sotry so well and fits like a puzzle. Anyway, I was wondering who the Weird Sisters and Megus. The mythology of the story is beautiful and the plot is extraordinary. So, That's my question- What were Megus and The Weird Sisters based on?
The Weird Sisters were based primarily on the Weird Sisters, from William Shakespeare's play MACBETH. They were also influenced by various triple/lunar goddesses from various mythologies, in particular the Graces, The Furies, the Fates/Norns.
The Magus is more of an "original" creation. He begins, I think, as fairly standard D&D wizard material. But I like to believe that he transcends the stereotype.
in the "Avalon", when Magus is talking to Elisa, there is a flashback of Tom and Katherine playing with the young gargoyles. i was curious if you knew how old the gargoyles were in that flashback. do you have in your timeline what year that was?
I do not have a fixed year for that brief flashback assigned in my timeline.
I'd just like to say that the Magus' death is, I think, the strongest moment in GARGOYLES. The Magus is loved by every fan, and it's because of all the humanity you were able to instill in him in about five minutes of screen time. His tragic love for Katherine coupled with his guilt which almost seems biblical by this point in the series, and the enchanting setting of Avalon, all make the Magus into... I don't even know! Just recalling his final moments brings tears to my eyes. That trembling finger. And his reaction to Goliath's thanks is heart-swelling. He simply doesn't comprehend how Goliath could be thankful to him and it's too much. Good job.
Thanks.
To be fair, we had a bit more than five minutes of screen time with the guy... but I am rather proud of how we turned the corner with him for most (but I doubt for all) of the fans. Turned him from a true jerk to a true hero. That's always fun.
the magus kinda looks like puck,is it weird?
I can see why you say that, but I also don't think they look THAT much alike.
Is it weird? I dunno. I guess that's subjective.
AVALON PART THREE
One thing I forgot to mention in my thoughts on Part Two (and it's still relevant because it was featured in the recap): the Archmage's devouring of the Grimorum. I, too, found that a great image, and a nice way of sidestepping the "no magics" rule. Not to mention I love the little "[gulp] Ah..." the Archmage does.
Anyway, onto the fight.
When the folks at the palace decide to check out the Sleeping King, and Tom prepares to go, the Magus looks at Katharine's worried face and then volunteers to go instead. Yet another something I had to watch several times before I could fully appreciate it.
Angela and Gabriel check out the grotto (is that what it's called?). I like it when Demona jabs the laser rifle in Angela's ribs, and the younger gargoyle's first reaction is to elbow Gabriel and say "Stop it!" It was cool how Goliath temporarily overrode Macbeth and Demona's mind control by "appealing to their better natures," and then how the Archmage so easily reasserted his control. He had become quite a bit more powerful here, afterall. And then, of course, once things turn sour, and one of his enemies tries to take the Eye, the Archmage loses his cool and decides to start attacking NOW. His lines here are pretty neat and chilling ("They're my creatures now," and "...if they are so *eager* to *DIE*!" are ones I rather like, too).
It never ceases to amaze me how the Magus, a 72 year-old scholarly type, is able to make Elisa, a 27 year-old athletic type, ask him to slow down. I like Magus' line about being used to traveling alone, and how Elisa's mention of "the Princess and the Guardian" is contrasted with the Magus calling them "Katharine and Tom." His story was both a surprise and heartbreak to me--I had really thought from AVALON PART ONE that he would "get the girl" as most heroes do. As I said then (three weeks ago), the Magus had never looked quite so heroic. I had disliked him quite a bit in AWAKENING ONE and TWO, yet by the end of his appearance in TWO, his remorse kind of mitigated my disdain for him. In the first part of AVALON I really got to like him--you could see the depth of his feeling for Katharine, and his resolve and cunning with the way he saved the eggs and all. In PART TWO he showed how weak he felt without his magic book, and here...well by this time, the Magus had become a character I really liked and sympathized with.
Perhaps that's one reason that I became pretty much goggle-eyed upon learning that Katharine had fallen in love with Tom and vice versa. Then again, I did (and to some extent still do) suffer from a sort of "agism in male and female relationships." Of course, for that reason, I also applaud the princess and the pauper getting together simply because it now becomes a bit more unique. And I love the baby gargoyles!
BTW, Greg: rest assured that Elisa's lips were corrected in later airings, and on my tape the scene with the baby gargs actually looks more like a night scene (don't ask me how, maybe it's just my tape).
The Hollow Hill sequence was cool! I loved the Magus' spellcasting (now he has to ryhme like an Oberati), though I was of course confused until the Magus explained how he was able to do that. The "leap of faith"...Indy Jones, yeah, but I like how Elisa looked jumping.
And then the pillar lowers with (to me) some guy on it. She walks up to him, and says his name, "Arthur Pendragon..." It was at about that point that my jaw hit the floor and my eyes became as big as the moon. This was something I had not been expecting (due to my unfamiliarity with Arthur's "death") and as such became a huge, and enjoyable surprise to me.
I also like his presentation to the rest of the good guys. Until Elisa mentioned it, I had never realized that Goliath had never truly beaten Demona or Macbeth. I really liked this--it made them seem even more dangerous than before. And of course, King Arthur Pendragon, the legendary hero, reveals that he hasn't the slightest idea "what's going on." A funny moment that shows that, though legendary, Arthur is still a human.
I like how the Archmage looks when he says "I will wait here...for Goliath." An uber-villain look without a doubt.
Arthur's taking command of the situation and showing his strategist side is a nice scene (and he later proves that he is indeed a great warrior as well), and I noticed right away how (thematically) well paired off the adversaries were.
I think I'll follow your lead, Greg, and divide them up:
Arthur and Macbeth: The way Macbeth had spoken of Arthur in LIGHTHOUSE, this battle was only to be expected. I didn't mind Arthur's "manner of magic" as oppossed to "sorcery" (a little variety is alright in my book). I was surprised at Macbeth's sucker-kick when it took down Arthur. *That* part of the cliffhanger--Macbeth's sword at Arthur's throat--really got me (they were all tense, but Mac had the greatest warrior in legend at sword point!). Of course, Arthur still manages to defeat Macbeth (marvelously, I might add) with that oh-so-cool image of his ringed fist heading straight for Macbeth's face (the camera).
Demona vs. half the cast: I guess it says something that Demona needs THAT many people to take her down. One thing I love about this fight is how badly Gabriel's wings get torn up. The poor guy really gets battle damage here. Another moment--the gargoyles on the battlements fire arrows point blank at Demona...and MISS COMPLETELY!! "Not prepared...never honed combat skills" indeed! And then Demona goes after Elisa. I wonder if maybe somewhere in Demona's ensorcelled brain she sees this as a rematch of their previous hand-to-hand in HIGH NOON. Eventually, Katharine gets into the act in a very unexpected way. A bit of a stretch with her firing the gun perhaps, but still kind of fun.
The Magus vs the Sisters: I never caught the full meaning of Luna's "There is no future for you," but somehow I knew that the Magus was going to die in this battle. Something about his character, the tragedy and struggling. It made sense to me, from the moment he said "Leave them to me" about facing the Sisters, that he would die fighting them. His use of the magic is extrodinary, and I liked how the Sisters became outraged by his using Avalon's power. I also love Phoebe's fearful "Where is the Sleeping King?" when the Sisters finally make it into the Hollow Hill. And then the Magus casts his last spell. To be honest, I thought he was "all dead" when his hand went limp and fell backward onto the beir (sp?). I was actually kind of glad that we had a little bit more time with him afterwards.
Goliath and the Archmage (and Angela): This was a big one for me. The Archmage is pretty much the oldest adversary of the Wyvern Clan (with the possible exception of Iago). There is a sort of "epic" quality here with the way the Archmage and Goliath talk to each other (A: "I've waited a millenium for this." G: "You lose again, Archmage"--how many times have superheroes said that last one to their archfoes?). I remember wondering how Goliath was going to get out of this, until Angela showed up. One of my favorite scenes in this ep is when the Archmage freezes the lake, Goliath sinks out of sight as the Archmage laughs, and then the Archmage's eyes go wide as Goliath shoots up from the depths, giving a gurgling roar, and leaps through the ice. Finally, Goliath removes the Eye and the Archmage almost seems like he will continue being a threat. Then he gets incinerated by "magic energy" and dissolves in a cool death scene. Count me as another one who thinks the final line of the Archmage is pretty cool. There is a sort of sense of that "epic" quality coming to an end here. Goliath has defeated what was (as far as we know) the first true arch-villain he had ever encountered. There could be a world of meaning within his "It is over." And then the Archmage's scrying pool, as if to spite them, displays the dying Magus.
The death scene is a good one. In some ways, I find it more moving now than I did then (again, don't ask me why). I like the final exchange with Goliath.
G: "I owe you."
M: "You...but, I cursed your clan."
G: (shaking his head) "You saved my children."
And of course Katharine's grief over the passing of her friend from childhood caps the touching moment. Good voicework from Jeff Bennett and Kath Souci. It took me several viewings to notice it, but I thought the shooting star was a nice touch.
I always wondered why the "good-byes" seemed so strange to me. I suppose individual good-byes would be more realistic, but for a narrative...eh. I kind of got that Arthur would be visiting Manhattan eventually, so the foreshadowing was not wasted.
Goliath should laugh more. ;)
Angela's coming along. A new regular. This was something I had been wondering about for some time--if one of these new gargoyles we had just been introduced to would actually come along for the rest of the show. It made sense that it was Angela, what with all the angst her parentage would bring to light.
When Tom spoke about Avalon sending you where "you need to be," I kind of got a smile as I thought to myself "Oh, you guys aren't going to be getting back home for a while..." and got prepared for a world tour. Perhaps my reading about gargoyles in Guatemala, London, and Japan influenced me here.
One last interesting note. As with the previous two, I showed this one to my mother when it first aired. YEARS LATER, as I was telling her about your original plans for sending the Magus with Arthur, Greg, and your reasons for giving him a "good death" instead, she said, "Well, they also probably had to kill him off because his voice was too expensive." I, confused, looked at her and asked "What do you mean?" She, now looking confused herself, said, "Well, he was voiced by Michael York...wasn't he?" So when you see Jeff Bennett again, you may want to pass onto him that he does a good York!
This was a good ep with a feeling of closure and a sense of something exciting coming just over the horizon. It could have been a season finale, even. Just my thoughts.
I've never worked with Michael, though he's an acquaintance of my parents, but I know that other shows have used him, and I've never heard that he charges more than the typical going rate. I'd love to work with him some day. But I don't think that Jeff was doing Michael, per se. Jeff "created" the Magus voice back on Awake1. He's just phenominally talented and versatile.
The redemption of characters like the Magus and to a lesser extent the Captain of the Guard is one of the things I'm proudest of in the series. The Magus' story is sad, certainly, but he is so much more ennobled in his death, because of how hard he worked not to wipe out his sins, but to make up for them.
And on a more creative note, it's just fun to take a character who everyone hates, and find a way to turn him into a character who everyone feels for. It's very rewarding.
Hi Greg. Looking over your G2198 responses, I picked up on something a little confusing.
You say that Samson, Delilah and Zafiro all learn Bushido in Ishimura. Then you say that Nick also goes to Ishimura to join the Order of the Guardian, and is trained in the way of the Gargoyle Warrior. I'm a little confused as to whether both groups are essentially doing the same thing--are the gargoyles *also* part of the Order of the Guardian? And yet you've referred to Nick several times as just "Guardian", as if he were the only one. So if you could please clarify this for me...
1a) Are Delilah, Samson and Zafiro also part of the Order of the Guardian? b) If not, are any gargoyles part of this Order? c) Is Delilah, Samson, and Zafiro's training in Ishimura completely separate from Nick's training? d) If so, were they able to meet in Ishiura, or do they only get introduced to each other later?
2a) I'm assuming that because it's an "Order", there must be more than one member, but because you've referred to him simply as "Guardian" (perhaps as in "the one and only"), *is* Nick the only one? b) If not, as a very rough estimate, how many would you say there are in 2198 before the invasion? ...a handful, dozens, hundreds?
3a) Is Ishimura the only training area of this Order, or is it one of many? b) If Ishimura is the only place the Order trains initiates, why was that particular location chosen?
4a) I admit I haven't done the math, nor am I sure of the life expectancy of a human living on Avalon, but is Thom, the original Guardian, still alive in 2198? b) If he is alive, does he help lead or train those in the Order? c) Is the purpose of the future Guardian(s) the same as the purpose of the first Guardian? (Thom)
1. There are two "academic" tracks in Ishimura. One for Gargoyles and one for humans, though they have many classes that overlap. Any and all gargoyles are admitted to the program in Ishimura, but the admissions process for Humans is very stiff. I picture lawsuits over the inequity. But the reasoning is that they are teaching skills that in theory can be used against them, so they need to be very careful about who gets these skills. Since (a) the admission process is difficult and (b) the course work is difficult, very few humans graduate to Guardian status. Nick is not the only Guardian, but they aren't a dime a dozen. Frankly, I doubt Nick met Samson for the first time in Ishimura, because I would think that the Maza family and the Manhattan clan would still be pretty tight. Samson probably met Nick more or less immediately after he was born.
2. Less than a hundred.
3. Ishimura has a long tradition of teaching Bushido to humans. In a global environment, it made sense to locate the school of the Gargoyle Nation in that location. Avalon was much less practical.
4. The purpose is the same, and Tom is the clear inspiration for the Order. I'm not going to reveal whether or not he's alive. Mathematically, it is possible. Assuming Tom spent nearly all of his remaining life on Avalon, he'd be biologically 62 in 2198. (As opposed to biologically 54 in 1996.) But that's no guarantee of survival.
Hi Greg. Here's my question.
In Awakening part one, a man covered in white made a bargain with Hakon. Was that The Magus? And what did it have to do with the whole spell thing? Because I know it was Demona and Captain of the Guard's idea to let the Vikings have the castle. I just don't know what the Magus(or whoever it was)had to do with it.
Thanks!
It was the Captain. We simply tried to fool you into thinking it was the Magus.
Dear Mr. Weisman,
What was the Magus brewing in the Episode Awakenings I?
Thanks!
I either don't remember or never knew.
I apologize if this has already been covered. I didn't see it, but I wouldn't be surprised if I missed it.
My inquiry is about the Magus-Katharine-Tom relationship. I normally hate love triangles because in every love triangle, there is one who loses so there is a built-in "ouch" factor for me. But in the case of Magus-Katharine-Tom, was there ever an opportunity for the Magus to win Katharine? Or were his feelings entirely one-sided which would make it all the sadder? Or if there was a chance, did he doom himself due to his feelings of inadequacy (as he relates to Elisa) or more due to his feelings of guilt for what he had done and a feeling that he did not deserve happiness?
To me, the Magus is such a tragic character because he seems the most guilt-ridden over the part he played in 994AD. Consequently, he takes on a huge amount of the burden of responsibility (and seems to be the only one to takes immediate responsibility). Yet, he appears to pay such a high price. He lives in what seems to be a state of self-flagellation as he banishes himself from the world and gives up the basis of his chosen trade to honor his service to the princess as well as honor his word to Goliath, only to watch the love of his life marry another. Finally, he spends the remainder of his days in relative seclusion.
Goodness, but the above is sad, but I think it is what makes this series so different. It didn't flinch from the melancholy.
Thanks for your time.
You're very welcome. Thanks for the nice comments. I think your analysis is pretty dead on.
I think maybe the Magus might have had a chance with Katharine had he asserted himself earlier on. When the three of them first began their exile on Avalon, it would hardly have been surprising if the two of them had "married", treating Tom as their foster son.
But the COMBINATION of the Magus' feelings of guilt and inadequacy (on a number of levels) combined to prevent him from making a first move. She wasn't raised to make that move either.
It's hard to say if she ever felt as deeply about him (romantically) as he felt about her. Probably not. But the potential might have been there had he been even slightly direct about his feelings.
received from 205.213.142.103 on Monday, September 3, 2001 11:32:32 PM
Anonymous writes...
3.Why is there a gargoyle in Avalon named Azrael? I mean it's the name of the Muslim angel of death hardly Christian.
Greg responds...
3. You try naming thirty-six kids in one sitting.
recorded on 10-17-01
But in christian mythology there are like hundreds of angels surely Catharine, Magus and Tom could have remembered thirty-six angels out of the hundred?
I'm tempted to follow a question based on a smart-ass response with another smart-ass response, but I'll demur.
I'm NOT an expert on angels. I named all the ones I could think of, and that included Azrael. There would be research done before I actually named them on air, but I'm not necessarily backing off the Azrael name. The Magus may have made that choice for reasons of his own.
And you tell me that there are hundreds of angels in "christian mythology". Hundreds that have been named? Really? Can you name 36 for me? I'd appreciate it. And please, do not count Saints and or other virtuous humans.
1. had Tom ever seen a gargoyle or gargoyle clan before arriving with the refugees at Castle Wyvern in 994?
2. where were Tom and his mother and all the others from anyway? why were they refugees?
3. who was Tom's father?
4. besides his mother, were any of the refugees related to Tom? were any of the other refugees his father?
5. why did Katherine allow the refugees shelter at Wyvern? did they give her something in return, or was she just being nice?
1. Probably not. Certainly not that close up.
2. They were from a nearby village. And they were refugees because the Vikings had been raping and pillaging there way to Castle Wyvern.
3. Hah! Good question! I'm not saying at this time.
4. No. No.
5. It was her responsibility. Feudal lands worked by (in essence) serfs bring feudal responsibilities to protect those serfs in times of danger. It was the system.
is angela really demona's daughter?
Biologically, yes. But Katharine is her clan mother.
Time to Ramble...
This third part of the tryptich, was designed to be a kick-ass battle. Lots of action, lots of excitement. All (or nearly all) the pipe had already been laid out. We had two of our toughest mortal villains (Demona and Macbeth) working with the mysterious and powerful Weird Sisters and the MEGA Archmage Plus, who possessed the power of Gate, Book and Eye. That seemed like some real competition for our good guys, who had wounded to protect.
It was time to go to war.
A few other soldiers:
Director: Dennis Woodyard
Story Editor: Brynne Chandler Reaves
Writer: Lydia C. Marano
As the main titles were playing and Keith was narrating, my seven-year-old daughter Erin mentioned that Goliath and Darth Vader both do voices for phone companies.
Erin also figured out that Angela and Gabriel were being stalked by Demona, before she actually came on screen.
JALAPEÑA
Goliath says it like a curse word when he realizes that A&G are being followed. That was how I wanted to use it. As I've mentioned before, the art staff eventually threatened a coup if I didn't drop it.
But if I ever get to do Gargoyles 2198, I'm bringing it back. That's a threat, not a promise.
Anyway, Goliath attempts to appeal to Demona and Macbeth's better natures. It starts to work, but it's too late. The Archmage has a good line: "They are my creatures now."
Then Bronx and Boudicca attack, saving our 'goyles. This was hinted at in Part Two. And clarified later when Angela comments on it. But it also was my way of serving notice that Bronx was no longer going to be the puppy-most-left-behind. The World Tour was his coming out party.
Anyway, the Archmage now changes his plan. Not because he doesn't want to take any chances, but really because his sensibilities have been offended. He has another good line: "If they are so eager to die..."
But it's really that balance I was trying to maintain between his newfound ultimate power and his original clichéd origins.
HUNTING HOLLOW HILLS
Elisa asks about the Sleeping King. The Magus says he's been sleeping in his Hollow Hill. More hints as to who the king was. (If the name Avalon wasn't hint enough.)
On the way, Elisa pumps Magus for information like he was in the interrogation room back home. She already guessed that he had a thing for Katharine. She wants the lowdown. It's really not her business. Call it a habit of her profession.
(There's an animation error on my tape, which I hope was corrected for later airings. When the Magus starts to narrate the flashback, both his and Elisa's mouth are moving, mouthing the same lines. Obviously, Elisa's animator misread the X-sheets and thought she was talking instead of the Magus.)
(Of course there's another semi-error which I've tried to explain away in the past. The lighting on the scene where Katharine and Tom play with the baby-gargs Angela, Gabe and Boudicca seems very daylight. I've always claimed that it was just a very bright moonlit night. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.)
This last flashback got my five year old son Benny talking. He asked "How did the gargoyles even get born?" And had to be reminded about the eggs from Part One (which we saw three weeks ago). "Oh, yeah," he said.
Then when we got to the Sleeping King, he compared that to a character that's on his radar: The sleeping MATA NUI from Bionicle.
The Magus uses magic, explaining that "magic is the lifeblood of Avalon." This seemed logical to me. That a practioner like the Magus could train himself to access that ambient magic -- but at a price.
My wife Beth was very impressed with Jeff Bennett's performance here. As a change of pace, Jeff was only playing one character -- as opposed to his usual fifty. But it was a truly heartbreaking performance, I think.
And I have to ask, given the Magus' first appearance in "Awakening, Part One", did you guys ever think that you could or would find that character this appealing, this sympathetic? I think that our ability to allow characters to grow and change was one of the hallmarks of our series. And I had the backbone of his change planned as early as "Awakening, Part Two": (1) his love for Katharine which is unequivocal and (2) his guilt over what he did to the gargoyles, which he never tries to dodge or make excuses for in any way.
The Leap of Faith. It does seem too Indiana Jones now. But obviously it must not have at the time. Either that or we were kidding ourselves. Still, I like Elisa here a lot.
The Platform lowers on cue and Elisa finally names the Sleeping King: "Arthur Pendragon, King of All Britain... You are needed." We wanted to keep it simple. That simple. I also wanted to begin establishing the name Pendragon. Everyone's heard of King Arthur. But you have to have had a bit of exposure to the legends to be familiar with the Pendragon name. I always thought it was cool. And I think that even then I had the notion of using it as the title for a spin-off.
Anyway, we get back to the Palace, and Elisa states a fact that I wonder if anyone had focused on before (regarding Demona and Macbeth): "You've never actually beaten either of them." Goliath agrees: "Simply foiled their plans or fought them to a stand still.
And then Arthur asks: "What's going on?" which I always thought was kind of funny. They're counting on him to help save the day. He doesn't even know the set up.
So while we get him up to speed, we cut to the Archmage who orders the Sisters to "Dispatch the Sleeping King." Erin smiles and says,, "What they don't know..." is that it's too late. But what I found interesting is that Erin actually did trail off. She knew that she didn't need to state what they didn't know. Cool.
DIVIDING THE TROOPS
True to Elisa's hopes (and my interpretation of the character of legend) Arthur in fact does immediately take charge.
He'll go with Elisa, Tom and Gabe to fight Demona & Macbeth.
Katharine, Bronx and Boudicca will guard the wounded 'eggs'. (Katharine has one of her bookend tough mom statements here: "They'll not harm my eggs again!")
Goliath and Angela will attack the Archmage.
And the Magus agrees to take on the Sisters.
Eventually -- after Art figures out that Demona feels Mac's pain and Demona establishes that she and Mac need to put distance between them to minimize the link -- things change a bit and Arthur faces Mac one-on-one, while Kathy, Bronx, Boudicca, Ophelia, Elisa, Tom and Gabe all team up to battle Demona -- who as always, may present the greatest threat of all, even when it's against her own interests.
All this seemed very appropriate to me. I like how the battle divides up. How the opponents match up. And you'll notice at the cliffhanger/commercial break that every one of our battles is going badly for the good guys. Macbeth seems to have the upper hand over Arthur. The Archmage has Goliath down. The Weird Sisters are clearly overpowering the Magus and even Demona is on the verge of wiping out all her opposition at the Palace.
KING ARTHUR PENDRAGON vs. MACBETH
We gave Arthur a mace, because I didn't want anyone to think that some random sword he was carrying might be Excalibur.
When Arthur says, "What manner of magic is this?" it made me wish we had just gone ahead and said "What sorcery is this?" like we usually did.
There's some fairly effective slo-mo animation in here. Slow motion in animation (when called for in scripts) usually makes me nervous. If not done well, it can just look like a poorly-timed, poorly-animated scene. But here it seems to work.
I like how the battle ends. Arthur takes the sword fragment, and for a second, it looks like he's going to skewer Mac. But instead he uses it to pin Mac to a tree. Setting him up for Arthur's punch into camera with his ringed fist. Disney S&P let us do that. ABC S&P didn't allow those kind of fist coming into camera shots on Goliath Chronicles. But I wasn't informed of the change in policy until after "The Journey" was animated.
PRINCESS KATHARINE, OPHELIA, BRONX, BOUDICCA, GABRIEL, THE GUARDIAN & ELISA MAZA vs. DEMONA
Ophelia gets another nice moment here, as even injured, she attempts to stop Demona.
Elisa again takes advantage of the fact that she knows that Demona's hatred for her is so extreme and irrational, that she'll literally drop her weapon for the chance to grapple with Elisa, the chance to tear her apart with her bare hands.
Of course, this is after Elisa demonstrates that she never carries enough ammo. After uselessly shooting at a beach and a hollow suit of armor, she's out of bullets by the time she gets a target of flesh and blood. Of course, we made Elisa a touch dopey in this department for S&P reasons. Elisa, being a NY cop, had to carry a gun. But short of doing an episode about gun violence like "Deadly Force" (which Toon Disney refuses to air these days), we couldn't actually let Elisa shoot anyone with her gun. So we found other uses and excuses.
But ultimately, it's Katharine who brings Demona down, looking quite intentionally like a medieval Ripley, saying the other bookend: "No one threatens my eggs."
THE MAGUS vs. PHOEBE, SELINE & LUNA: THE WEIRD SISTERS
Luna says to the Magus: "There is no future for you." That was a clue from the voice of fate. Anyone pick up on it?
I also like how all the Sisters say together: "You will suffer!" But of course, he's been suffering for decades. What he will soon be is free of all suffering...
I wanted to show here (among other things) that magic itself was neither good nor evil. Magic simply existed at the disposal of those with the power to wield it.
The Magus defeats the sisters and collapses onto Artie's platform. Erin asked quietly: "Did he die?" Benny looked for another way out: "He might have just lost his power."
GOLIATH & ANGELA vs. THE ARCHMAGE
Erin asked what the Archmage was planning for Goliath... and I had to answer something like "a painful death."
Goliath asks what I thought many of you might be asking: why doesn't the Magus just kill him. And David Warner answers as only he could: "Because I'm having too much fun."
We have all this Gate-Jumping. This was an afterthought. Because at one point I had thought of having our guys steal the gate back, I had forgotten to have the Archmage use the gate in the script. So at the board stage, I asked Dennis to put this in. We were very tight for time, but he obliged me. Ideally, I'd have liked to show them briefly in some other times, but I knew we just couldn't afford to design new layouts for two second shots. Even so, who knows where and when they went? Who knows how long they were gone? Sometimes their poses changed. But Goliath is like the Old Man of the Sea. He never lets go. And finally he takes the Eye away.
The Archmage is already in trouble, but how much he doesn't know for a few seconds. Then the power of the Grimorum destroys him from within. A nice creepy companion to him eating the book in Part Two.
And I love David's last line, the forlorn: "All my lovely magic..." Believe it or not, I had to fight a little to get that line in. Just a little. But still.
DEATH OF A HERO
The Magus' death stll moves me. His quiet desire for rest. Katharine's love for him. (Not romantic love, but love nonetheless.) K: "Oh, Magus, what have you done?"
The Magus still concerned that he owes a debt to Goliath and Goliath's forgiveness. The eyes closing and the star shooting overhead.
For S&P reasons, we decided not to make it absolute that he was dead. No one mentions death. Just rest. Sleep. And he is lying on the Sleeping King's platform by his own request.
And many fans, even adult fans, chose to believe he might still come back someday. Hey, more power to 'em, I guess.
But I felt/feel that would cheapen the moment. Cheapen the sacrifice. We sent our heroes into battle. And in battle, their are casualties. Some things are worth fighting for, but if we don't understand costs, then I want people to know that when something isn't worth fighting over, they shouldn't.
FAREWELLS
For various reasons, many of our voice actors in this episode recorded their lines separately. So we recorded each character saying goodbye to everyother character. Not knowing exactly what we would use. We, in my opinion, wound up using too much of these wild goodbyes. It's very awkward sounding to me now.
Gabe & Goliath establish why Gabe and his clan don't join Goliath in Manhattan and why Goliath doesn't bring his clan back to Avalon. Though both clans are born of the old Wyvern Clan, both have found new homes, which they will not abandon.
But Angela has a bit of Demona in her. The iconoclast, she wants more than normal clan life has to offer. She wants to see the world with Goliath. He proudly agrees. He wants one of his children with him. Gabriel and Angela say goodbye. He refers to her here as his rookery sister (not as his "Angel of the Night" or some other equivalent). This was done to make clear that they regarded each other as brother and sister, not mates. I basically wanted to leave her unattached for the Trio. Nevertheless, many fans still thought that they were a couple.
Art goes off on his own to be less conspicuous, and Goliath laughs a borderline Thailog laugh. He also plants pipe for Arthur's eventual stop in Manhattan.
Mac & Demona are freed from the spell, leaving them with no memory since they were first ensorcelled. There's an awkward bit of business here as the gargs who were guarding them move away, just so that Goliath can move in and push the skiff off. Flaw in the boarding that no one caught, I'm afraid.
The Sisters move off, having been forced off-camera to explain most everything.
Bronx & Boudicca part. Now that's a couple.
More pipe: Goliath swears that no one will ever use the eye or the Gate again. Famous last words.
Tom: "Elisa, I thought you understood. Avalon doesn't send you where you want to go! Avalon sends you where you need to be!"
Both Elisa and Erin said: What does that mean? at about the same time.
What did you think when you first heard that? We had officially launched the World Tour, but you didn't know it yet. What were you thinking?
Anyway, that's my ramble. Where's yours...?
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