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Alfred Manifesto writes...

Yo
Long time watcher, first time question asker, I happen to be doing a research paper for colege concerning the literary references within Gargoyles (shakespeare and mythology). I was wondering what comments you might have concerning the way which you used these works. For example, your re-telling of McBeth in city of stone parts 1-4 is very different from the play. This makes sense because the play is an altered versain of the actual historical story to make it more entertaining as well as aceptable to the king of england. As i intend on focusing a majority of my paper to Mcbeth I was wondering how you went about combining history, shakespeare, and your own storyline. If you could make any general comments or speak about mythology in any way would be greatly apriciated. I ask not only because it would help my paper, but also it would be a personal thrill to even get a responce. I've known about this site for a while, but this is the first time i've had a decent question. Lastly, I know its quite possible this has been answered before, but i have not yet read all of the entries in the archives, you are creator and producer of one of my favorite cartoons of all time, how does one find themself in that possition of creater and producer? thanx for your time

Greg responds...

Well, unless your paper wasn't due until 2004, I guess I'm too late to help you there.

Macbeth (with an "a" and a lower case "b") the play was indeed a major influence on our version of Macbeth, but we chose to follow the less-told tale that was the true (or truer) history. But we kept the Weird Sisters in it, and even a few lines of Shakespeare where possible. Plus of course we added the gargoyle race, weaving Demona in and out of Macbeth's story. Or rather, we weaved Macbeth's story into the tapestry that is the Gargoyles' Universe.

As to my background, I'd suggest checking the FAQ and coming back here if you have more specific questions that the FAQ didn't answer.

Response recorded on January 21, 2004

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matt writes...

all this Demona/Macbeth talk (we've been reviewing City of Stone and High Noon lately, we are probably somewhere around The Gathering by the time you read this, both the episode and the event) and i thought of a question:

we know that the pain shared by Demona and Macbeth has a distance factor to it, if they are far away from each other when one gets hurt, the other probably won't feel it, but i was wondering if death is like this as well? if Demona was to get shot or whatever and died, would Macbeth miles and miles away also momentarily die?

Greg responds...

Distance mitigates the effect, but doesn't shut it off. Pain, death, whatever.

Response recorded on December 10, 2003

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Wolfram Bane (wolfram_bane@hotmail.com) writes...

Macbeth

In the Gargoyles universe, you mention that Luach was the son of Macbeth and Gruoch, and born in 1033. In actual history, Luach was the son of Gillcomgain and Gruoch, and born in 1030. After Gillcomgain's death in 1032, Macbeth married Gruoch and adopted Luach as his own son and heir, and Luach even succeeded Macbeth as King briefly in 1054. I was curious as to the reasons you modified these aspects of history?

Greg responds...

I didn't. Not to my knowledge. My research indicates that Lulach (Luach) was born in early 1033, after Gillecomgain's death, but too soon to be Macbeth's son (at least legally). We glanced over it in the episode, but, yes, Macbeth adopts Gillecomgain after marrying Gruoch in 1032.

Further, my research indicated that rumors were rampant in court that Mac was actually Lulach's biological father, as well.

It's possible the research I received was faulty. (For example, a typo caused us to spell and pronounce Lulach's name incorrectly.) But we made every effort to weave our fiction among the facts -- without changing those facts.

The date of Lulach's birth is approximate anyway. So any time between 1030 and 1033 is probably "legitimate".

Response recorded on October 15, 2003

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Todd Jensen writes...

When, in "City of Stone Part Two", Duncan manipulated Macbeth into seeking out Gillecomgain to avenge his father, what was he hoping the result would be:

a. That Macbeth would slay Gillecomgain, thus ridding Duncan of an increasingly unreliable and likely rebellious former ally? (The result, of course, that actually happened).

b. That Gillecomgain would slay Macbeth, Duncan's leading rival to the throne?

c. That the two of them would kill each other, thus ridding Duncan of both of them?

Greg responds...

Well, I'm sure his ultimate preference would have been c, of course. But either a or b were good news, so he'd settle happily for the a he got.

Response recorded on August 28, 2003

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Anonymous writes...

Silly question if Macbeth was to get his head chopped off or get blown to bit how would the weird sister's spell keep him alive?

Greg responds...

Who knows? Maybe it wouldn't. Maybe it would.

Response recorded on July 29, 2003

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Vanity writes...

Hi Greg:

I was just watching "City of Stone". It is a beutiful piece of work. I am very fond of it.

I espicially like the one scene where that woman runs up to Travis Marshall to relate what had happened and he just totally blows her off as "crazy". That got me thinking we ALL do that (as humans) completely discount the minority view as absurd and stupid. Classic example "The Flat Earth Society", oh, we just love to make fun of them. I have decided to be more open minded to even the most seemingly crazy ideas or beliefs. I have watched "CoS" many times but that scene never really hit me like it did just today. Was that intentional on your part? To show the err in human ways. You've said all things are true and what she said was true, just because no one believed her doesn't make it no less right. It reminded me of a Greek Philosopher I think his name was Isocrates I am not sure and his quote went
"If all mankind, minus one; were of a common opinion except the one of a differing opinion. All of mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one, than he, if he had the power; would be justified in silencing all of mankind..."

More things I loved about this episode.
King Duncan's death, in my mind one of the top 10 animated deaths ever.
Demona, saves Gruoch and Macbeth when she could have had her vengence, she chose the nobler of the two courses, made me feel all happy inside. I must admit though killing Gilcoumgain then would have saved her a lot of trouble and heart break later on.
Her plan was very sinister, and her killing of the statued humans was a very dark contrast to her more kind-hearted younger self we had just seen earlier in eps like "Vows". I also liked this too, she's not soft and weak as she is commited to her cause and for that I commend her. I agree with her goals, her means are brutal and me being human will make me possibly feel the urge to resist being smited, but I hope she sees her dream out and accomplishes it, power to her.
One thing very much dissapointed me, relating to Demona when she gave the access code to Goliath and Xanatos the code was "ALONE", not one you'd imagine she'd pick, totally took me by suprise when I first saw it; but Goliath was apparently unaffected by her choice of a password and the huge water works under her eyes. Does he have a heart of stone? She's not even real (I think), and I feel a lump in my throat, every time I see that; yet he knows she's real and didn't even care, creep.

MacBeth, what can I say I think he is great. I think his story is one of the more tragic on the show. Considering all that happens, he always loved and still loves Gruoch. The one time that we see him actually take interest in life and love again he is set up by Dominique and Thailog. His plight is very dramatic. Living but having to as Gruoch said "Remain dead", dead to his country, his home, and his family.

Gruoch: Even though she gets very little air time on the series I think she is great. My second favorite female character. She is strong, smart, wise, intuitive, loving, radiant, and very honest in commiting to her duty. I espicially like how she stood up to Demona at the end, what courage. She even scorned the Hunter as "Oh mighty" with her sarcasm, 'your not mighty your a coward'. I cannot see how you could not love her.

"COS" has its share of humorous wit to it as well. I absoulutely love this:
Elisa: "..the signal came from Pak-Media studios you own it so as usual this is your fault!"
Owen: "Mr. Xanatos is trying to fix things. What are you doing to help?"
I love Elisa's expression, that's good stuff.

-Since I do not want to go into great lenghty deatail about every detail of the show..-

King Duncan- Very paranoid.
Hudson+Trio- not much to say
Boudie(SP)- Probably has his heart in the right place but man what a --well cowardly guy--
Demona's Betrayl of MacBeth- this shocked me, leave him to die at the castle but she actually contacted Kenmore?
Wierd Sisters- I HATE them. I think they are corrupt, vile, and wicked, they should burn in a fiery lake in the seventh circle of Hell somewhere. For a very, very long time. (I make this judgement with my Knowledge of the "Avalon" eps)
Vengence begats nothing more than a vicious cycle of further vengence- true perhaps, but highly over exaggerated.
The betrayl of the Cast Wyvern- I want to know who slept at Demona's roost. When the Vikings sacked it.
Bronx and Demona's encounter- I loved it. Good job.
Demona and Macbeth- It's amazing how it goes, I like when Demona came back from the fight all happy and swirled Macbeth high off the ground. Her joyous attitude was refreshing, yet all to short in length.

That's all for this post. Thanks for listening.

Vanity~

Greg responds...

A few responses to your comments...

1. Yes, the scene with Travis and the woman was a comedic way to make exactly that point.

2. Can't say I'm rooting for Demona to succeed. I'm rooting for Demona, but not in that way.

3. We had an entire contest to explain "Alone" and got some very interesting responses. You might check them out in the contest archive here at ASK GREG.

4. I think it's presumptuous of you to assume you know exactly what Goliath was feeling. But one thing to keep in mind is that he had just witnessed the results of her mass murder spree.

5. I've said this before, but we all got to watch Emma Samms blossom as a voice actress over the course of just these four episodes. She had never done cartoons before. She was a bit stiff in Gruoch's first appearance, but, MAN, by COS4, she was just ROCKING!!! I give her and voice director Jamie Thomason a ton of credit for really bringing Gruoch to life when we needed it most.

6. I'm not sure that Bodhe did have his heart in the right place -- until, I like to think, the very end.

7. The notion that vengeance begets nothing more than a vicious cycle of further vengeance, is not only true but is if anything UNDERSTATED. Hardly exagerated. One only has to look at a newspaper to see that the Montagues and Capulets of this world simply refuse to recognize this obvious, obvious FACT. It drives me insane. Your casual dismissal of the notion doesn't thrill me either. (Sorry.)

8. You're welcome. I like your posts.

Response recorded on June 20, 2003

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warrioress writes...

In the episode "Sanctuary", how was it that Demona could knock MacBeth out cold and remain conscious herself? (right after the wedding, when she reveals her true identity to him?)

(Marina Sirtis did a pretty hokey French accent, if you ask me... ;-)

Greg responds...

She was ready for the blow. Plus she's a garg. She feels the exact same force. But it's tougher to knock out a garg than a human.

Response recorded on June 20, 2003

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Shadowman writes...

Hello Greg,

Im a big fan of the gargoyles and all and I was wondering if the gargoyles were still on the air would you bring back the Hunter? and few other questions.. how many Hunters were in the gargoyle history? I know they were 1 in the ancient times and 3 in the present and McBeth was kind of one... and the other question if you did brought back the Hunter what kind of look would he have? a High Tech-ish look more beyond what the 3 Hunters had?

Greg responds...

I don't know exactly how many hunters there have been. We've shown a sampling, including Gillecomegain, Duncan, Canmore, the Renaissance Hunter, Charles Canmore, Jason Canmore, Robyn Canmore, Jon Canmore. And, as you said, briefly, Macbeth. Fiona Canmore would have appeared in Team Atlantis, had that show gone forward, and Robyn would have continued as the Hunter in Bad Guys (though she'd largely be hunting other bad guys, not gargs) had that show gone forward.

There are more Hunters in the past, including some specific ones that I have in mind. But I won't pretend I've run the entire Canmore line from Canmore to Jon out in my head and listed every single one.

As for moving forward, I see the Hunters waning in favor of the waxing Quarrymen. But I'm not talking in absolutes.

Response recorded on June 04, 2003

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HANNA BERHANU writes...

Macbeth:
what is king Duncan's reaction to the news that cawdor is a traitor ?what will happen to his title'
2-do Macbeth and Banquo have the same reaction to ROSS'NEWS?
3-WHAT ANNOUNCEMENT IS MADE ABOUT MALCOLM? WHAT IS MACBETH'S REACTION?
4-HOW DID LADY MACBETH FIND OUT ABOUT THE WITCHES' PROPHECIES?
5-HOW WILLING IS MACBETH TO GO ALONG WITH LADY MACBETH'S PLANS FOR HIM TO ATTAIN THE THRONE?

Greg responds...

Are you writing a term paper, Hanna?

Or are you just quizzing me on my Reading Comprehension of the play?

This seems rather pointless.

Response recorded on May 28, 2003

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Shannon writes...

What proof Can we find that Macbeth was a man filed with greed, ambitons and desire

Greg responds...

Uh... beyond the fact that he's a human being and we are all filled with these things, at least to some extent...

And having said that, I wouldn't say that those are Macbeth's foremost qualities. (At least not in the Gargoyle Universe.) So how hard should I work to offer you proof?

I'm not sure I understand the question.

What proof do you require?

Response recorded on May 23, 2003

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The Souldier writes...

I have an off the wall question for you, in "Enter Macbeth," what was Macbeth drinking? Was it coffee, tea, or cocoa? It had to have been something hot because there was steam coming off of it. If it was cocoa, did he have marshmellows in it?

Greg responds...

I don't know.

Response recorded on May 19, 2003

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Chapter XLII: "Sanctuary"

Time to ramble...

This episode was directed by Dennis Woodyard, written and story edited by Cary Bates.

The one word title, as usual, was one of mine. I thought initially that we'd be even more focused on the Cathedral. That we might play a Quasimodo character. Heck, if Disney's "Hunchback" movie was going to have living gargoyles bouncing around, then I could have a Quasimodo swinging from the bell-ropes.

But the story, thank goodness, rightly evolved into a family drama with Goliath, Elisa, Angela, Demona, Macbeth and Thailog (and Bronx) providing us with one very ODD family. Quasimodo went away in favor of Thailog.

And we had to work a bit to make sure the thematic idea of the heart as a Sanctuary worked its way into the picture. Thank God for that French minister, eh?

During the "Previously..." recap the following exchange was heard between my eight year old daughter Erin and my five year old son Ben, after Angela learns (in that scene from "Monsters") that Goliath is her biological father:

Benny: He IS her father. He laid the egg.
Erin: Girls lay eggs.
Benny: His wife laid the egg.

ROMANCE

Enter, for the third time or the first (or, depending on your point of view, maybe this one doesn't count either), Ms. Dominique Destine. She tells Mac, "We have all the time in the world..."

This for me (and I know for Bond expert Cary) was a very memorable line from "On Her Majesty's Secret Service." And always a good sign that a relationship is going to come to a bad end.

Elisa tips her hand, which she can do cuz no one is awake, about how she really feels about Goliath here. "The most romantic city in the world and Goliath isn't awake to share it with me." (Or something like that, all quotations are approximate.) That's what she'd like to do, I'd wager. Soar over Paris with G. the way they soared over Manhattan in "Awakenings". Now had he been awake, do you think she would have made that request? Or would she in fact be distancing herself from him simply BECAUSE she had that impulse?

After her adventure on the Loch, it's nice to see Margot on a pleasant little stroll through Paris.

THE GARGOYLE WAY

Why is Goliath so resistant to parenting Angela? After all, though they're really more like younger brothers, he does his fair share of parenting the Trio.

He falls back on "The Gargoyle Way", but that's certainly inadequate, as Diane Maza will later point out. Yes, he's only one of her rookery fathers, but he's (a) the only one there and (b) the only one left alive except for the two souls trapped inside the AWOL Coldstone.

Ultimately, I think the answer is that Angela's sudden obssession with her "BIOLOGICAL" parentage makes him nervous because of the obvious extrapolation to what comes next. If she's obssessed with me as Daddy, then what happens when she learns who Mommy is?

And that's the key. He's divorced Demona. His wife who laid the egg. It took centuries and months, but after "Vows" he moved on. Now he sees Demona as a nemesis. A painful one to be sure, but a nemesis none the less. He's afraid of what the knowledge will do to Angela. He's afraid of what Demona will do with Angela, should Angela share that knowledge. And is he perhaps afraid of what -- under Demona's influence -- Angela might become?

THE CATHEDRAL

There's some nice animation in this episode -- but none of it is at Notre Dame. That sequence put us through fits in retakes and editing. Ugghh. It's still painful to look at.

But there's some nice stuff going on...

Demona says: "In here my love." to Goliath before she realizes its not Thailog. What did you all think of that line? At this point we had only seen one silhouetted monster from a distance. And since you knew Demona was in town, we intentionally tried to lead you to belive that she was the Monster at Notre Dame. Were you expecting Thailog? Or did you think that Demona was addressing G as 'my love'?

Goliath's arrival is a shock to her, so what did you think then?

Then Thailog's arrival is supposed to be a bigger shock to you guys. Was it?

I love hearing Thailog say: "My angel of the night."

Demona has a good line too: "Jealous and paranoid."

Later, we set up Nightstone Unlimited and their two "human" identities, Alexander Thailog and Dominique Destine.

At this point in production, we knew that Fox was going to have a baby but we had not named it yet. I couldn't think of a better first name for Thailog and later I couldn't think of a better first name for Alexander Xanatos. At first this bugged me. But I began to realize it made perfect sense. Xanatos had programmed his "first" son well. If X would pick Alexander, why wouldn't T have picked it as well. And there's something so symmetrical about both his kids being named Alexander.

TOURISTS

Elisa sits at a french cafe talking out loud to herself. Ugh. Very awkward. Obviously, we couldn't come up with a solution we liked better. I'm sure it occured to me to do it in voice over, but just chucking a V.O. sequence in the middle of an ep is very awkward too. Suddenly, the movie is POV Elisa, and we weren't doing that here. (Cf. "Revelations" and Matt's VO narration.)

I do like her last line though, coming as it did from a long time Superman scripter, Cary Bates: "This is a job... for the Gargoyles!"

THE WEDDING NIGHT

We had Macbeth use the Lennox Macbeth name instead of Lennox Macduff because we thought it would be too confusing to give him an entirely different name to any new viewers. And it makes sense that he has multiple aliases. But it still bugs me and I think in hindsight, I wish we had just been consistent.

Demona kicks Macbeth into unconsciousness, and Erin asks: "Why didn't she get hurt?"

And that's a very fair question. As usual with D&M's Corsican Brother connection, we tried very hard to be faithful to it, but it was very hard. And we wound up being a bit inconsistent. The best I can suggest is that when Demona knows she's going to hurt M and it isn't just on impulse, she can more or less steel herself against the magical feedback. It's still painful. But she doesn't show it as much.

The Gargoyles wake up and Elisa says: "Look alive, guys!" Well, they do now, don't they?

I love how Thailog slips Mac the gun and then later yells at Demona, "Didn't you search him?!" He's an evil genius that one. And passive-aggressive too.

Thailog's plan is brilliant, I think. So elegant. So simple. And if not for Elisa, so effective.

Mac's suicidal tendencies resurface. Demona's legendary temper gets the better of her common sense.

Thailog really comes into his own in this ep. Sure, Xanatos said he may have created a monster, but now Thailog has outsmarted X, D and M. Who the hell is left to outsmart?

And he has some great lines too:

"You and what clan?"

"Teamwork is so overrated."

"Aren't you spunky?'" (Another Lou Grant reference of course.)

To be fair, he couldn't immediately know that Angela was blood kin, but still doesn't his reaction to her give you the creeps? When X says Angela is lovely in "Cloud Fathers" I don't think anyone thought he was being salacious. But T? Yeah, baby.

Of course, Goliath finally gets the picture after this one. Up to this point, he was thinking Demona's the lost cause but maybe Thailog is salvagable. Now he knows better. At least about T anyway.

BATTLE

There's a lot of water in that water tower. It looks cool though. The animation here makes up for the Cathedral stuff.

I love Goliath's two-handed punch.

I love Demona's punch-drunken sway, as she makes her move to, as Mac says, "put us out of our misery..."

But I've always wondered why the background painters put multiple pictures of Elisa on the wall of Macbeth's chateau. Odd, that.

When I was young, I used to love MASH, particularly back in the Wayne Rogers days. (And, yes, Wayne is a friend of my dad's now. But they didn't know each other back then so I was unbiased.) But one thing that used to drive me nuts was the repetition of the following exchange:

<LOTS OF SHELLING IS ROCKING THE HOSPITAL. SUDDENLY, IT STOPS.>

Hawkeye: Do you hear that?
Someone else: Hear what?
Hawkeye: Silence! The shelling's stopped!

This was fine the first time they used it. By the twentieth time it got VERY old.

But we do a version of it here after Elisa shoots Demona ending the battle.

Why? When it used to drive me nuts? It's amazing what I'll pay tribute too.

KEITH meet MR. DAVID

I love playing Thailog against Goliath, because I love those Thailog/Goliath exchanges where Keith plays both roles. That's one of the main reasons we created Thailog. To enjoy listening to Keith go to town.

1st Epilogue:

Goliath: "She has done you a favor, Macbeth."

That line should be a bit of a shock when G first says it. But it makes a lot of sense after he explains. And I love the look that Goliath and Elisa share. They aren't even pretending they don't share those feelings. They just won't act on them.

And how about Goliath actually telling a joke: "Just make sure you get a good look at her at night." Word.

2nd Epilogue:

One of the things I like about our series is we didn't have to end each episode the same way.

This one ends rather darkly. Goliath won't acknowledge the obvious. He just broods. Angela turns to Elisa: "Elisa, I have to know." And Elisa confirms that Demona is Angela's mother, because it's ridiculous to either lie or to not confirm the obvious that Angela has already figured out. But she knows G didn't want A to know that. So everyone is left unhappy as we sail into the fog.

And Erin ends the episode saying: "I think Elisa should be her mother."

(Me, I've always seen them sharing a more sisterly relationship. But I thought Erin's idea was sweet, and certainly came out of the sexual tension between E&G.)

Anyway, that's my ramble. Where's yours?


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Sanctuary Outline Memo

In prep for my ramble on Sanctuary, here's my notes to Story Editor/Writer Cary Bates on his first outline for "Sanctuary"...

WEISMAN 2-13-95

Notes on "Sanctuary" Outline...

GENERAL
Cary, I'm going to resist the temptation of beating this all out for you. That's how I got so far behind before. And at this stage I doubt I could do it any faster or better than you. So I want you to do a second draft on this outline, addressing ALL of the notes below. I sympathize, in advance. This is a complicated story. But I know we (meaning mostly you) can make it work. Don't take too long. And feel free to call after you've read this. We may be able to work out some of the problems over the phone. Good luck and here goes:

"SANCTUARY"
How does the title fit? What is the theme of the story? Is it about feeling safe? Safe in the arms of someone you love? I like that notion, but we'd have to emphasize it a lot more.

And simultaneously, more of the action should be centered around Notre Dame Cathedral. Economically, we can't afford to design backgrounds for an entire city. So we should keep the action focused on a few locations, that climax at the gargoyle covered cathedral-"sanctuary".

Plus, we don't want newspapers to be generically talking about a "mysterious winged creature". We want them focused on the Creature haunting the Cathedral at night. Maybe they think it's someone posing as Quasimodo, or his spirit or maybe they even think it's a gargoyle come to life or something. Of course, it's really Thailog. (Not Demona, by the way.) He's been there since "Double Jeopardy". Arriving long before Demona and Macbeth arrived.

We need to involve Thailog more at the end. Make him part of the conflict. I think he would have upgraded a bit. Used some of that $20 million to armor himself for battle. Not necessarily robotic armor, but at least a chestplate. Maybe wrist and shin guards. Keep in mind, we want him to be more powerful than Goliath and more threatening than any other villain. We should probably arm him with some big high-tech bazooka/laser/cannon type-thing too.

And we don't have to break up Demona and Thailog at the end. We just need to know that Thailog doesn't really care for her.

Remember, Thailog's plan isn't to kill Demona and Macbeth for the sake of killing them. He wants what they have managed to acquire over the last nine hundred years. If he could add that to the fortune he's parlayed from the money he stole from Xanatos, he might be able to compete with Xanatos financially. He needs to have already merged Demona's holdings with his own. So that his corporation (and we should get a cool, evocative name for it) we'll inherit in the case of her demise. And he wants to inherit Macbeth's stuff too. So if Mac and Dierdre marry, and both die together, (which is the only way they can die) he'll get everything.

Now, I'm not pretending this is easy to accomplish. As I read the outline, I was wondering if we needed a maguffin or two to symbolize this wealth. Maybe Macbeth's Paris Mansion itself. But we managed to figure something out for "Outfoxed" that clearly and dynamically spelled out Halcyon and Fox's "financial conflict". We can do the same thing here. With the same clarity.

OTHER QUESTIONS
Does Macbeth plan on telling "Dierdre" the truth about himself?

Is this the first time since Gruoch that Macbeth has been in love? Since he's an immortal has he avoided close relationships, not wanting to outlive his lover? Or watch her grow old? Or has he been through this before? Maybe not often, but once or twice over the last nine hundred years. How did he handle it in the past? Is he doing something different now? Highlander questions, basically.

Is Macbeth afraid for Dierdre's life? Does he think Demona might try to harm Dierdre to get back at him?

Do Goliath, Elisa and Angela assume at first that Macbeth and human Demona are in cahoots and only realize/remember later that since M&D have no memory of anything between City of Stone and Avalon, that Macbeth might not know that this human woman is in fact Demona?

Do we have an opportunity, maybe when Goliath and Elisa are searching Paris for the villains, for them to be romanitcally affected by the City of Lights?

When it's over, instead of Macbeth simply remaining bitter and once again suicidal, could Goliath point out to him that life offers possibilities... that if Macbeth could fall in love with Demona, he could certainly fall in love with someone else? Someone nice who would make his long life worth living again, at least for a time.

SOME SPECIFICS
A bunch of things, (some of which Cary the Story Editor should have been able to catch from his reading of past scripts, tsk tsk). Some of these notes may be moot after a rewrite of the outline.

Beat 2) Goliath, Elisa and Angela know that Demona and Macbeth left Avalon unconcious and together. Wherever they landed it would also have to be together. (Of course, Goliath and Co. have been travelling for awhile. So there's no guarantee that Macbeth and Demona stayed together after landing wherever they landed. It's just a good bet.)

There's also no reason for Goliath to assume that Macbeth and Demona are involved with each other still. (After all, they hate each other.) Also no reason to assume that Macbeth would be hurt by the association. And though there's no love left between Demona and Goliath, Goliath has no reason to feel sympathy for Macbeth. The audience might. Some of them would know Mac's backstory from City of Stone and sympathyze, but Goliath doesn't know the whole story. And he's got no reason to think more of Macbeth than Demona. Ironically, it is Thailog, more evil than any of the others, who Goliath would have the most sympathy for. He sees Thailog as a victim of poor upbringing. He'd like to reform and rescue his "son".

On the other hand, by this time Goliath believes that they land everywhere for a purpose. If he sees Macbeth and/or Demona, it's not too big a leap for him to figure that whatever the purpose, it involves these villains.

Beat 4) Again, here we'd like the headlines to be more specific to the Cathedral.

Beat 5) Elisa would recognize the human Demona from "High Noon".

Beat 7) We are forcing the creation of a lot of different sets and backgrounds here. Also don't forget that Demona's transformations to gargoyle (and back) are painful. Also don't forget that Macbeth feels any pain that Demona feels and vice versa. Distance reduces the pain, but we've never been really specific about how much distance or what the reduction is. Does Macbeth, across town, feel a little of Demona's pain at transformation? If so, he could blame Demona, knowing as he does, that he feels her pain. All that would tell him is that Demona is in the vicinity. It wouldn't reveal that Demona is Dierdre, unless he saw her transform. On the other hand, Demona might be far enough away that Macbeth feels nothing. Or just a slight twinge of soreness, that he doesn't immediately connect with Demona. We can play it any of these ways, we just need to deal with this "Corsican Brother"-style pain-sharing. We can't ignore it.

Beat 10) We've got a lot of set-up with little action up to this point. Maybe we can streamline a bit. Also, it feels like Mac's hovercraft might be a little unwieldy for this sequence. Maybe he's on the flying equivalent of a jet-ski or something a bit more svelt.

But there's another big question. What is Macbeth's objective towards Demona at this point? He knows that the only way to rid himself of her is to die himself. He may have forgotten the lessons of City of Stone and Avalon, but I would think that his love for Dierdre would prevent him from wanting to die. Later we imply that he's chasing Demona in order to chase her out of town. But that's pretty goofy logic. "I haven't seen you in weeks. So I'm going to hunt you down, to make sure you stay out of my life."

Beat 11) We definitely want to do something with the Eiffel Tower. Maybe even stage a battle there in the first or second act. But the Tower is open to tourists at night. Does anyone see them hanging there? Or are we way into wee hours by this time?

Beat 13) Goliath can't steal this guys camcorder. He's not a thief. Even destroying it is pretty malicious for Goliath, who's never gone too far out of his way to hide from humans.

Beat 16) Gargoyles don't kiss. They stroke hair. And it's "Notre Dame" ("Our Lady"), not "Notre Damn" ("Our Damnation"?)

Beat 17) The Cathedral is a very temporary safe house for Thailog while some safer, new place is being built for him. (Or maybe that's part of what Thailog is after: Macbeth's Paris Mansion.) It is not abandoned. Thailog is safe their during the day, because he's like a needle in a gargoyle haystack. After dark, he can stay out of sight in the upper reaches, until the Cathedral closes for the night. But he can't have much of a set-up there. Computers? Paintings? I don't think so. Particularly when we've got reports of a creature climbing around the church at night. People might investigate. They wouldn't find Thailog. But what would they make of that computer?

Beat 18) Demona may have no desire to "see" Goliath, since she found Thailog. But she'd still want him dead. Plus she MUST be curious about this female gargoyle. She thinks she knows all the gargoyles that exist, and none of them are female. She'd have to know. (And for that matter, so would Thailog.)

Beat 19) Think about how silly it would look in live action, if a villain who looked like Thailog, whipped out a brush and in a few seconds added a necklace to a painting. It's equally silly looking in animation. Maybe moreso because it's so easy to do.

I don't understand the pre-nuptual agreement at all. Why does Macbeth feel he needs it? (And don't tell me his lawyers push him around.) Besides, the whole idea of it goes against what we want to have happen in the story. Thailog wants Mac and Demona to get married. And have Demona inherit so that he can inherit from her, when both Demona and Mac die. Or am I missing something? I don't think we want this to be about stealing money from a safe. That's small potatos for Thailog and Demona. Either we need to have some irreplaceable (possibly magical) maguffin in that safe, or we should be dealing with the whole ball of wax. The former would probably be easier, but I'd like to go for the latter ball of wax if we can.

Beat 20) Again, I don't buy Macbeth's logic for hunting down Demona.

Beat 21) Angela can't operate a camcorder. She's not Lex. (And as noted above, I don't see anyway for our guys to have this anyhow.) Plus she wouldn't recognize Thailog. Also it feels like a pretty big jump for Goliath to figure that Demona and Thailog are working together. Not an impossible jump, but a big one.

Also, I was unclear. Did Goliath have a chance to give instructions to Elisa or did he turn to stone before he had time?

Beat 23) Again, I don't believe Macbeth lets lawyers push him around. And I don't think we need this pre-nup agreement in the story.

Beat 24) I really don't like this camcorder. And I don't know why Elisa needs it here. Like if she followed Mac and Dem, returned to Goliath without visual proof he wouldn't believe her story?

Beat 25) "How can I prove my love to you?" "Give me the combination to your safe." Yeah, that wouldn't make me suspicious.
I'd almost rather play any scene like this where Macbeth is insisting on giving something to Dierdre, who protests that she doesn't want it. The more she protests that all she needs is his love, the more he wants to lavish on her. In this way, he is predictable, but he's not being fooled by "crocodile tears" into doing something that seems incredibly fishy.

Beat 26) Again, Elisa would recognize human Demona from "High Noon" the first time she saw her. But here I was entirely unclear. How does footage of Dierdre prove that she's Demona, when Elisa didn't recognize her in person?

And this bit about Dierdre being Demona's name...? Gargoyles didn't have names in the tenth century. Naming is a human convention. Goliath referred to Demona back then as his angel love, or his angel of the night. Do we want to change "Dierdre" to "Angel" or "Angelica" or "Angelique". I don't know if you still need this, since Elisa would recognize human Demona, but I suppose you could, as long as we wouldn't be confusing the audience with Angela.

Why wouldn't Goliath want Elisa along? And why would Elisa agree to stay behind?

And what is it that Angela's staring at? Footage of human Dierdre? This isn't going to help her make the connection between herself and Demona. Visual clues aren't really the answer at all, since she would have seen Demona in the Avalon 3-parter. She learned from Sevarius that Goliath was her biological father. Here she learns that Demona was Goliath's love all those years ago. She puts two and two together over the course of the episode. Figuring out the truth only after she's already come to regard Demona as evil. You won't have room here to deal with the ramifications of that discovery. You're just setting things up for another story.

Beat 27) Why does Macbeth want to capture Goliath and Angela if he wants to get Gargoyles out of his life for good?

Beat 28) Goliath is "spreading" lies? To who? I mean we know he's not. But who does Macbeth think he's spreading lies to, that makes him want to imprison Goliath to stop it?

Also Macbeth could NOT have heard about Thailog. He was under the Weird Sister's spell when Thailog made his only other appearance. Besides who would he have heard about him from?

Beat 32) Again, not at all happy about Thailog's magic paintbrush. Particularly since it proves nothing here. It's not a photograph. If Macbeth thinks Goliath might lie about Dierdre, why wouldn't he think that this is a further lie somehow accomplished by Goliath.

Beat 33) I'm glad Macbeth keeps his cook. That guy can make a mean omelette.

Beat 36) Again, don't forget that Macbeth and Demona feel each other's pain while fighting.

Beat 39) These are huge leaps for Angela to make. How does she know this about Thailog. Also does Thailog show up there, state what he states and then not get involved in the fight? Or is that a typo for Goliath? Maybe we should let the battle climax at the Cathedral. Thailog is there. Goliath tries to "save" his son from Demona's evil. (Goliath assumes this plan is Demona's, not Thailog's.) Thailog just laughs. Reveals he wants Mac and Demona to kill each other. And he'll kill Goliath to prevent him interferring. Or something like that.

Beat 41) Killing Demona would at least knock Macbeth out.

Beat 42) Again, doesn't Thailog want anything besides their deaths?

Beat 44) Goliath still needs to be in some discomfort vis-a-vis the biological mother and father thing. It's not the gargoyle way. Brynne is going to deal with this (she'll have the space to deal with it) in her Africa story. Let Elisa be the one who confirms Angela's suspicions.

Beat 45) Again, I think we're working against our own ends. Why does Thailog need Macbeth and Demona dead, if not for what he can gain by their deaths?

Beat 46) Again, I think we can let Demona and Thailog go off together. Also, we've spent the whole episode with Demona turning back and forth from human to gargoyle. Demona does not turn to stone -- ever.

Beat 47) Angela should not get any comfort from Goliath in this episode. You don't have the time to deal with it here. If she receives comfort, it would come from Elisa.

MOVING FORWARD
O.k. try another pass. I'd streamline, by opening with the skiff arriving in daylight. Elisa leaves the stone gargoyles on the skiff tied under a bridge and goes to explore Paris. A place she's never been. She probably calls home again. Maybe she tries her parents this time, and again gets an answering machine. To save money on a voice actor, the answering message can be one that Elisa recorded for her parents months ago. (My sister is on my parents' machine with a message she recorded two years ago.) Elisa's voice says something like: "My parents don't know how to work their answering machine, but if you leave a message for Peter or Diane Maza, there's a fifty-fifty chance they'll call you back"). You don't have to jump through hoops to get the message erased this time. Then she briefly wanders around Paris like a tourist until she spots Mac and "Dierdre" who she immediately recognizes as Demona. She doesn't know that Mac doesn't know it's Demona. She'd probably assume they're up to something bad together. And also guess that they're why she and Goliath, etc. have landed in Paris. She follows them at a safe distance, etc. She doesn't want to get spotted. Near nightfall, she might head back so that she can inform Goliath when he awakens. Or she might not want to lose Macbeth and Demona until after she's found their H.Q. Or maybe when Mac and Dierdre split up, Elisa follows Dierdre to see where she lands, then loses her among the tourists at the cathedral.

Anyway, that's somewhere to start.


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Galvatron writes...

1.Did the Porter from MacBeth the play exist in the gargoyles universe?
2.What about the Lennox from MacBeth the play? Banquo(not the mercenary)? Fleance(not the mercenary)?
3.Did Hecate from MacBeth the play exist in the gargoyles universe?

Greg responds...

1. Probably.
2. Probably in one form or another.
3. In some form.

Response recorded on August 08, 2002

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Chapter XXXV: "Avalon, Part Two"

Time to Ramble...

"PART TWO"
Director: Dennis Woodyard
Writer: Lydia Marano
Story Editor: Brynne Chandler Reaves

I guess you guys were used to longer multi-parters from us, so you probably didn't think this was the last part when you saw Part Two come up after the title. I tried something different at the end though. Instead of writing "To be continued" I had them put down "To be concluded". It seemed (at least in my head) to increase tension to know that the next part would be the last.

I've been told by people that out of context, this episode is incomprehensible. I hope it's not quite that bad, but I will say that unlike the rest of our eps, I felt that multi-parter eps don't quite need to stand alone in the same way.

Still with all the time travel stuff, it's very complex. I remember Lydia having to come into my office after her first draft and needing me to diagram the time travel for her. The loop that the Archmage takes. I love it. But I guess it's not that easy to follow.

Anyway, this ep was designed to be the second part of a tryptich. This is the one where we focus on our villains and bring them all up to date, just as in part one, we focused on our heroes. All gearing to a MAJOR BATTLE coming in Part Three.

THE EGGS

Picking up where Part One left off, Elisa looks at Angela, Gabriel and Boudicca and says: "These are the eggs?" I love her tone there.

Guardian: "Sorry, I always call them that." It was a cheat to buy us, at least with some percentage of our audience, the shock value of expecting eggs and finding fully grown gargs and beasts instead. Still, I believe that a guy like Tom, dubbed "Guardian of the Eggs" would continue to use that term to refer to his kids, even after they are grown.

Goliath is initially shocked that the gargs have names. Angela says the standard human response: "How else would we tell each other apart?" This was done intentionally to both cover the issue of non-garg naming (which I still think is neat, but which is often a massive pain) and to indicate that these are gargs raised by humans.

BEACH FIGHT

So I'm in my office one day, after the script to "Avalon, Part Two" has gone final. And Supervising Producer Frank Paur and Producer/Director Dennis Woodyard come in. Frank hates the script. Dennis is calmer, but he seems to clearly agree with Frank, more or less.

I'm annoyed because it's VERY late in the game for them to be giving me these kind of notes. Things get heated between me and Frank.

I yell something like: "Well, what do you want me to do?!!!"

And he yells something like: "We need some action! Like a fight on the Beach with the Archmage!!"

And I start to object for about a second. Then I go, "Oh, yeah. A fight on the beach with the Archmage. That'd be cool. Would that fix it?"

"Uh. Yeah."

And that was it. Our fights were always like that. We always only wanted to make it better. He'd get worked up, but the solution wound up being simple and when push came to shove (we never actually pushed and shoved by the way) we agreed on nearly everything.

It was also good to have Dennis' calming influence. Frank and I would go momentarily nutty and Dennis would always maintain.

So anyway, after the fact we added the memorable fight on the beach. Now I can't imagine the episode without it. It forced us to trim down some the Archmages travels (cause we were already long) but it definitely improved the episode.

I think, not sure, but I think I wrote that fight because it came so late in the game. It's also possible, I might have taken it back to Brynne and/or Lydia to write. I really don't remember anymore.

Either way, there are some great lines:

Goliath: "Don't be too insulted!" I love how he goes nuts here. We really get a reminder of his warrior-ness.

Archmage: "Don't crow too loudly, after all, what have you accomplished: you beat up a beach." You beat up a beach. That's one of my favorite lines in the whole series.

Archmage: "At dawn you all will die. Get used to it!"

Tom: "Let's get out of here before the very air attacks us!"

The fight itself is pretty cool too. I like how Bronx and Boudicca immediately team up. I like the symbolic nature of the Archmage growing wings, turning to stone and then shattering. I think that was a board-artist's addition. I don't remember seeing that in the script. (And I'm too lazy to stand up and check right now.)

At the end of the fight, my five year old son Benny asked: "Why can't they glide to the castle?" I had to explain the flight rules.

ANGELA & GABRIEL

Elisa slides up to Goliath: "Angela sort of looks like Demona, except her coloring is different. Exactly whose daughter is she?" Again, I love Salli's reading here. That need to know. The jealousy. The feeling for Goliath -- who dodges the question by saying that all children belong to the clan.

But of course Elisa knows. Knows something that I believe never occured to her before. Sure, she knew that Goliath and Demona had been mates, lovers. But she didn't let her mind traverse to the next logical step. Parents. Together. Goliath and Demona.

And of course, the audience knows it too, I hope. It was never meant to be a secret to anyone but Angela who her biological parents are. These lines also served to point that out.

On the other hand, we didn't make a big deal of Gabe's bio-parentage. But I wanted it to be semi-clear that his folks were Othello and Desdemona (Coldstone and Coldfire). Anyone get that at first viewing?

REUNIONS

Everyone returns to Oberon's Palace. There are many injured and Gabe is apologetic. As Leader, he feels responsible. But there was 'never any need to hone our combat skills' before this.

Tom & Katharine are reunited. Elisa, the cop, picks up on the human dynamics, the relationships, immediately. She sees the Magus' reaction to their reunion.

I also really like the exchange between the Princess and Goliath.

K: "This is more than I could have hoped for."
G: "What you've done for the eggs is more than I could have dreamed of"

SLEEPING KING

We kept dropping hints. He's mentioned by the Magus, but the conversation moves quickly on.

Later, the Weird Sisters mentioned him. The Archmage is surprised to hear he's not a myth, causing Seline to say her famous: "All things are true." line. The Archmages promise to kill the king later.

And Elisa brings the guy up at the end. This policy was me trying to play fair and make his awakening in Part Three not seem artificial. But also not to allow the guy to distract from the matter at hand.

Of course, most of THIS crowd must have known the s-king was a ref to KING ARTHUR. Particularly when the Hollow Hill ref was thrown in too. But did anyone not know on first viewing?

LOOSE ENDS

This was an episode for tying up Loose Ends in a big way. Solving some mysteries.

Why did the Weird Sisters do what they did? (At least objectively.)

Why were Demona and Macbeth working together in "High Noon"? (Elisa: "They hate each other." Guardian: "I saw no sign of that.")

And how did the Archmage survive?

Tom unwittingly hints at the truth when he says that the Archmage seemed to be able to be in two places at once.

Now let's reveal...

WEIRD SISTERS

Wow! Did we get negative feedback from fans when we played the Sisters as villains here. Of course, I always had it in my head that the Sisters had three aspects. Grace, Vengeance and Fate. Sometimes one aspect is ascendent, but there is always a touch of all three in anything they do. But after the Sisters' Fateful appearances in "City of Stone", many fans rebelled at the notion that the objective reason they did all those things was for simple petty vengeance here in "Avalon". Oh, well.

[When Benny saw the Sisters for the first time, he said "Weird Sisters" with an interesting tone of awe. They're his favorites. But he didn't comment on them being bad guys here.]

The sisters have some nice lines...

L: "What is time to an immortal."
Phoebe: "This is true." (in ref to what cannot be broken can be bent).

ARCHMAGESES

Okay, this was just fun for me. In many ways the origin of much of this was the flat out talent of David Warner. He brought such life to the underwritten (and clichéd) part of the Archmage in "Long Way to Morning" that I just knew I'd have to bring him back. Many of the events of "Vows", "City of Stone", "High Noon" etc. were all geared toward bringing him back as a real THREAT!!

Yet with all this, I didn't want to forget the character's roots. We tried to set a balance between his clichés and his new power.

Think about it. The Archmage+ (as we called him in the script), had only been plussed for about a day. Still he's full of arrogance. His power hasn't raised him above that hybris nor above the thirst for vengeance nor above gloating or above impatience. That's his flaw, but also the fun, I think.

And of course, David. Wow.

Praise for Salli Richardson as Elisa. For Kath Soucie as Princess Katharine and all three Weird Sisters. For Frank Welker as Bronx and Boudicca.

But this Archmage stuff here is a tour de force, I think. David just went through, playing both characters. Both versions of himself. Keep in mind, he hadn't been privy to all that the writers had planned. He had come in for his small parts in both "Long Way" and "Vows". Now suddenly, he's this guy(s). Amazing.

"Do you know what to do?"
"I should. I watched you do it."

"Show some dignity."

"I could put you back where I found you."
"No, no." (I love that no, no. So tiny and fearful.)

"Not where. When."

"If you don't know, don't guess."

"The book must remain in play."

"Try to keep up."

"We're not doing her any favors."

"The rules that cannot be broken can surely be bent."

"Nine hundred and seventy-five YEARS??!!"

"I hadn't thought that far in advance."

"What am I supposed to do, eat it?!"

"Now I understand."

"As it did. As it must. As it always will!"

All great fun.

FLAWS

All these episodes were being produced simultaneously. All in various stages of production. So inconsistencies were bound to happen.

The Egg boats are messed up here. Demona's model in her flashback. Etc.

And storywise, what's the deal with Macbeth? I can see why the Archmage wants to include his former apprentice Demona in his plans. He felt betrayed by her, and is glad not to be doing her any favors by enslaving her.

But Macbeth?

Okay, it's not a true flaw. Macbeth is included because the 'plan of the Archmage' -- birthed whole from the timestream without the Archmage ever actually coming up with it independently (though he takes credit) -- included Macbeth.

It is the provence of Luna, not Seline, at work.

But still, I'd have liked to have been able to figure out some connection between the Archmage and Macbeth so that he wouldn't question the boy's inclusion. Thankfully, the Archmage+ is so arrogant, he takes credit and thus never questions. It occurs to me now, that I could have made a connection between Mac and his ancestors, all related to Katharine and Malcolm. Oh, well.

CAPTIONS

These became fun for me. Adding Captions indicating place and time is one of the very last steps in production. So I'm in there for the "On-Line" with Jeff Arthur, our post-production supervisor, and I'm just indulging...

Sure we start with...

"Scotland, 984 A.D."

But pretty soon we're at "YESTERDAY" and "SIX HOURS AGO" and "ONE MINUTE AGO" and finally "NOW".

It still makes me smile.

POWERING UP

So the Archmage gets the eye. Power. But he's still an idiot. He needs wisdom. He eats the book, which I always thought was really creepy and cool. Now he understands. Now we truly have two Archmage+es. But they can't coexist forever. Aside from how complicated that would be to choreograph, and aside from the fact that the timestream needs the younger of the two to fulfill his role....

They also couldn't coexist because both are too arrogant.

So we repeat the scene of departure to close the circle and tack on: "Finally. I thought he'd never leave."

BATTLE FLASHBACK

We get to see a new clan awake from stone. I hoped that was fun.

Ophelia appears (pre-injury). She looked way cool. For all those people who thought that Gabe and Angie were a couple, take a look at the way Gabe is holding Ophelia and looking at her after she's injured.

LAYING PIPE

In addition to the Sleeping King, we were also laying pipe for our whole fourth tier WORLD TOUR. Tom says: "Avalon dropped me in your laps." He credits Avalon with sending him to Goliath.

The Magus declares that he is without magic and useless. Katharine rebels at that: "Don't say it, and don't think it!" She loves him. Just not the way he wanted her to love him.

Bronx and Boudicca want to go with Goliath.

Elisa asks about the Sleeping King...

And Goliath, Angela and Gabriel take off on a stealth attack.

And we immediately see that the Archmage knows they're coming.

Uh oh.

As the Archmage says... "[We've layed all the damn pipe we could possibly need and more], Now the fun really begins!"

To be concluded...

And that's my ramble. Where's yours?


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Todd Jensen writes...

The posting of the FAQ (thanks, Bishansky and JEB!) and your comments on them (including the "Weird Macbeth" part) prompted a question about this unmade two-parter from me.

We know that you had planned the following casting choices for this episode:

Macbeth as himself (or, more accurately, as his Shakespearean counterpart).
Demona as Lady Macbeth (the role that she was hatched to play :)
Goliath as Macduff
Elisa as Lady Macduff

Do you remember any of the other casting decisions for this story (i.e., who was to play Duncan, Malcolm, Banquo, Fleance, the Porter, etc.)?

Greg responds...

Hudson was Duncan, I believe.

The rest I don't remember off-hand, largely because I don't think I had done much casting. It never got past the premise stage, unfortunately. It was the one story that I wanted to do that upper-management wouldn't approve. Even then, they were willing to approve it for a single episode. But I felt I couldn't do it justice in 22 minutes. So in essence, I'm the one who kiboshed it.

That really says something about the creative freedom we were given on the show. 66 episodes. And only one semi-rejected premise.

Response recorded on January 22, 2002

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Anonymous writes...

World Wars
Did Macbeth fight in any of the world wars? If so which side?

Greg responds...

Yes, Macbeth has fought in many wars.

And certainly in WWII he was with the allies.

Response recorded on November 13, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

MacBeth
How many identities does MacBeth have in 1996? Is he really a professor?
By 2198 does everyone know that he the Scottish king that Shakespeare wrote about?

Greg responds...

At least two that he keeps active.

He's a medievalist. Doesn't mean he teaches.

No.

Response recorded on November 13, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Where is MacBeth in 2198?

Greg responds...

On Earth.

Response recorded on October 17, 2001

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Jimmy writes...

Ok, I checked the archives and couldn't find anything about my 3 questions:
1.) Where does Macbeth get his money? He has advanced weapons, a really snazzy hovercraft, a castle in or near Manhattan that burned down only to be built again, and add to the mix the fact that he goes around hiring mercenaries, installing massive guns for security systems... So where is he getting this cash. A millenia would drain any fortune he may have. Establishing a trust would be tough because he may be in trouble with social security. So where does his money come from? Antique sales? You already said he isn't willing to part with many of his valuable things. Mabye he's a really good writer and has a book deal, or mabye he's just been getting a LOT of social security. Which is it?

2.) How does Macbeth hide his identity for so long? The amount of money he has is bound to attract attention.

Greg responds...

You checked the Macbeth archive and didn't get an answer to this question? Check again.

The short answer is if you buy land when it's cheap, later it will be worth a fortune. If you have equity, most things of any worth go up in value. And even things of little worth become valuable if they are old enough. And he has a lot of old things. He doesn't necessarily even have to sell much. He has equity.

He's also smart and tough. He can live on very little if he needs to. Etc.

2. He's smart enough to 'die' periodically and leave his wealth to a new identity.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Gipdac writes...

*Macbeth/Demona/Hunter/2198*
1) Do the Canmore siblings (The Hunters) know about Macbeth (What, with his still being alive and all)?
2) Have they ever tried to hunt him?
3) Does Macbeth have any descendants living by 1996?
4) Do the Canmores (at least the ones descended from Jon) still hunt Demona in 2198?

Greg responds...

1. Not saying.
2. Not saying.
3. Not saying.
4. There are no more Canmores, at least not of that line. But the Castaways still hunt her. Her and all gargoyles through the Quarrymen.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Lord Sloth writes...

Enter Mcbeth:

1) Why does McBeth's stone dungen floor burn so easily? I've never seen Stone burn so well.

2) Did McBeth loose much of importance in the fire, I'd imagin there would be a lot of old magic relics, and the like. b) Did the fire burn Everything he owned? c) Did he build his new house on the ruins of his old one? d)Do you now the history of his old house, is it relivant and will you tell us?

3) Why didn't Owen call Bruno's group, or summon the steel clan, or do something more, when Hudson and Broadway took the Grimorum?

5) Did Mcbeth put Bronx in a seprate cage on purpose cause he thought they would figue out how to get him out? Was he testing them?

6) What did Macbeth tell Xanatos he planed to do with the Gargoyles? b) What did he plan to do with them once he had found their "queen"? c)Did Demona tell Macbeth about Goliath and the spell on him? And then he figured out where she was in NY when the castle was brought there, and know she must be behind it?

6) I just want to be sure this is correct. Lex and Brooklyn didn't think Bronx was strong enough to break open their cage, and Bronx only did it the second time because he had an order from Goliath. Is that all right?

Thank you.

Greg responds...

1. And you may never see it again. Consider yourself lucky.

2. Yes.
b. No. For starters the fire did not spread to Paris, where he also owns a chateau.
c. Yes.
d. Haven't given it one. And it's gone now. The newer one is just a replica.

3. Summon them where?

4. There doesn't seem to be a question four.

5. All went according to plan.

6. He didn't.
b. That would depend on events.
c. Not necessarily.

The second question 6. Bronx had momentum the second time. He could have gathered it the first time, I suppose. But it cost him to break through, so maybe your right. They didn't want to take any chances. Get help while he's free.

You're welcome.

Response recorded on September 09, 2001

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Airportman writes...

Hey, Greg

This is my first post here, and it's quite lengthy. I've been looking through the archives, and I'm pretty sure this question has never been asked before. But if it has, I honestly don't know what category it would be filed under. It's mainly about who knows what throughout the course of the Gargoyles story.

Nobody in the audience knew anything about Demona and Macbeth's relationship and former lives prior to "City of Stone," but who in the Gargoyles universe, if anyone, knew anything? I've been watching my taped episodes recently and this really stood out at me this time. It's always been the one thing about the show that bothers me.

It really sticks out in "The Price," when Hudson says, "Believe it lads, Macbeth's dead." Later in the episode, Lexington seems genuinely convinced that Macbeth actually is dead, which leads me to believe that he doesn't know about Macbeth's background by that point. However, later in the same episode, Hudson explains to Xanatos, "Demona and Macbeth are immortal. Has it brought them happiness?" Was Hudson simply feeding a line to Lexington? Was Lex not supposed to know about the whole Demona/Macbeth thing? It's wierd, because Elisa also knows about it by the time of "Sanctuary."

That leads me to another question: how does Hudson know? And Goliath for that matter? Who was it that told them about Demona's history? It couldn't have been Xanatos, because he didn't know either until "City of Stone," or he wouldn't have been fooled by Demona's excuse for living so long. I'm actually not too sure Xanatos ever finds out.

I could only think of one way that it could work. Here goes:

In "Temptation," Demona says to Brooklyn, "It's a long story, centuries long." I was thinking that Demona may have told her story to Brooklyn at that point, and that he later told Goliath, who told Hudson and Elisa. In that case, was this privelidged information that Goliath only trusted Elisa, Hudson, and Brooklyn with? This would explain Hudson's behavior in "The Edge," and give Brooklyn a shoe-in for Second in command, but it would not explain Brooklyn's puzzlement about Macbeth's identity in "Enter Macbeth," unless Goliath had told him not to tell Lex and Broadway. However, Goliath clearly has no clue who Macbeth is at that point. Could Brooklyn have told him later? Lex clearly knows about Demona's immortality by the time "Hunter's Moon" rolls around, so I was thinking that Brooklyn may have decided that it was necessary to tell Broadway and Lex everything when he was leader.

I don't think Macbeth would have told Broadway his story in "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time," when Broadway was tied up in his jet or at his mansion; the timing seemed all wrong.

So I guess what my question boils down to is this:

When did the clan first learn about Demona's past, and her relationship with Macbeth, and am I on the right track with the whole Brooklyn idea?

By the way, Gargoyles is my favorite show. It still amazes me how you were able to weave such an intricate story about such real characters, and teach real life lessons about vengeance, tolerance, family, reconciliation, and so much more, all within the confines of a childrens' cartoon. This was truly a story that made full use of its own medium, and made strong points about life. I believe that Gargoyles is probably the most beneficial and educational childrens' programming I have ever seen, in terms of teaching life lessons, and I too am completely disgusted that Toon Disney won't air "Deadly Force." Thank you for reading this long ramble of mine, and also for providing the best television program to date.

Greg responds...

Thank you.

I definitely have gone through this before. So it's somewhere in the archives. Like in the Macbeth archive or Demona most likely. I'm afraid you're on the wrong track, mostly because you are taking the word "Immortality" too literally. It's used in different ways in different places.

1. In "The Price", Hudson does know that Macbeth and Demona have been alive a LONG time. That makes them Immortal on at least one level. When he says immortal in this one, he's only referring to their obviously long life spans. But at this time, he doesn't know about their link, their inability to die unless one kills the other. The fact that they've lived that long might only mean that they've never been killed and have some kind of eternal youth spell or something. So Hudson can believe that Macbeth has FINALLY died when the first robot bites the dust.

2. After the Weird Sisters are captured in "Avalon, Part Three", they are (off-screen) forced to reveal the link between Demona and Macbeth, i.e the terms of their immortality. So at that point, a bunch of people know the truth, particularly Goliath, Elisa and Angela.

3. So by "Sanctuary", Elisa knows. And clearly, Demona has also told Thailog.

4. When Goliath, Elisa, Bronx and Angela return to NYC in "The Gathering, Part One" and after they have time to sit down and relate their adventures (between "The Gathering, Part Two" and "Vendettas"), they relate the Demona/Macbeth story to Hudson and the Trio. So now most of the cast is up to speed.

Mystery solved?

Response recorded on September 09, 2001

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zakhur writes...

We know by City of Stone part 4, that MacBeth's son Luach is dead, probably even killed by Canmore himself. My question is even though there were circumstances that made them enemies, they were still very good friends when they were young, didn't that make Canmore at least think about not killing his cousin?

Greg responds...

They were very good friends when they were young? That's news to me. Did you see how they looked at each other after the Weird Sisters issued their prophesy?

And while they were still young, Luach's dad killed Canmore's. That probably didn't endear the cousins either.

I think you are reading too much into the fact that on one hike, they were having a good time until things got serious.

Response recorded on September 05, 2001

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Gipdac writes...

1) Do the Canmore siblings (The Hunters) know about Macbeth (What, with his still being alive and all)?
2) Have they, or any other Canmores, ever tried to hunt him?
3) Does Macbeth have any descendants living by 1996?
4) Do the Canmores (at least the ones descended from Jon) still hunt Demona in 2198?

Greg responds...

1. Not saying.

2. Not saying.

3. No.

4. Yes.

Response recorded on August 15, 2001

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Lord Sloth writes...

When Dominique was pretending to love Macbeth, was there any instant that she got hurt in his presence (stubed her toe or something)? Also, is it JUST pain that Demona and Macbeth both feel? Or can one feel the other touching his\her skin? How bout plessure? If Ms. Destine was to go as far as to bed with Macbeth (though I doubt that would happen), would that be VERY INTERESTING for Macbeth? I tend to think like this a lot.

Thanks

Greg responds...

Simple touching doesn't pass from one to the other. Intense feelings of pain and pleasure would.

And no, obviously Dominique was careful not to be in range when she was transforming. And she didn't slip up either.

Response recorded on August 08, 2001

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Lord Sloth writes...

In the old ask Greg, you told someone to repost a queston (what did Demona think of the play, Macbeth?) latter, after you thought about it. Well, I'm asking now.

Also, you said that Macbeth was highly amused by the play about him. Were you being sarcastic? I'd imagein that he would OUTRAGED at how William treated him, and his wife and made Duncan and Malcolm the mistreated ones. So was that just a smart ass answer on your part?

Greg responds...

No.

Response recorded on August 06, 2001

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Gipdac writes...

) Will there be any romantic feelings between Brooklyn and Demona in GARGOYLES 2198, like the Puck's "Future Tense".
3) Will Macbeth play apart in GARGOYLES 2198? If so, in what way? Now that the revamping is over.
4) How do Demona and Macbeth feel about each other by 2198? Now that the revamping is over.
5) Does Samson know that he is a descend of Demona? If so, does he consider Demona as his great-great (or how ever many greats they are) grand mother?
6) Does Demona know that Samson is a descend of her?

Greg responds...

). There'll be feelings. Not saying what kind.
3). You keep repeating "now that the revamping is over". What does that mean to you? Does it have significance? Do you mean now that the contest is over? Anyway, I've answered this. Macbeth will show up eventually but not right away.
4). Now that the revamping is over, I'm not telling.
5) He knows. And to some degree, yes.
6) Yes.

Response recorded on July 11, 2001

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Todd Jensen writes...

A little query that recently occurred to me about the "feeling each other's pain" part of Demona and Macbeth's link. Where does Macbeth feel the pain when Demona receives an injury to her wings or her tail?

Greg responds...

Back or butt.

Response recorded on July 11, 2001

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Sloth writes...

Another one for "Pendragon".... Why does MacBeth show so much contempt for Arther after speaking so grandly of him and Merlin in "lighthouse"? By the end of the episode he sounds more like himself, but durning the race for the sword, I thought he should of treated him as more of a worthey opponent.

Greg responds...

I don't hear contempt there. Just competition for a prize that he felt he had as much a right to as Arthur did. I guess it's a matter of interpretation.

Response recorded on July 10, 2001

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Demoness writes...

~Macbeth~

Oh my god, I'm not asking a Oberon and Titania question! Its a miracle! :)

I know this has been answered before and I have read your response to the question, but I am a little bit confused still.

You said that any fatal injury Macbeth & Demona sustain, the magical spell that keeps them alive would immediately heal them, and rapidly depending on how serious the fatal injury is.

So, if either were beheaded, would their head fall off and reattach itself or would the spell immediately begin to heal the severed area before it had a chance to fall off?

The same with a severed limb?

Greg responds...

Look at what you wrote: "...if either were beheaded, would their head fall off and reattach itself or would the spell immediately begin to heal the severed area before it had a chance to fall off?"

It's a hypothetical. What's the point? Neither one has had their head chopped off. Despite nearly 1000 years of adventuring times the two of them, I will personally guarantee that neither has been beheaded. This isn't Highlander. There's no rule about this. What there is is the statement of the Weird Sisters, who said that neither would die until one kills the other -- when both would die. Whether you choose to believe them or not is up to you.

Response recorded on July 09, 2001

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Jim R. writes...

I haven't said much in a while, but now I have a question:

Since the 2198 contest is over, will you reveal anything pretaining to what happens to MacBeth? I noticed you mentioned Demona to still be around in 2198 so I suppose that MacBeth must be also. Will he be a part of the 2198 spin-off or play a major role? The Pendragon spin-off? Any others?

Greg responds...

Macbeth is still alive in 2198. And he will eventually make his presence known. But not right away. I do have big plans for him. But probably not until 2199 at the earliest.

Response recorded on July 06, 2001

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John writes...

Hi Greg,
Today no talk, just the question:
In "Sanctuary", Macbeth got a picture of Elisa hanging in his livingroom. Was that a joke by the writers, or have you too not noticed it untill yet?
By the way: do you know, that John Rhys-Davies will play Gimli in the Lord of the Rings movie?
OK, that's all
CU, John

Greg responds...

I knew John was in the movie, not what he was playing.

I have noticed that there is a picture that looks like Elisa. At present I have no explanation for it. It certainly wasn't in the script.

Response recorded on July 06, 2001

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Corrine Blaquen writes...

Hee, hee. I just noticed something that I found amusing. Macbeth must have some sort of 'Red-Headed Curse' upon him or something! All the women that affect his life somehow have had red hair. His dear wife Gruoch was the first. And then Demona, whose red hair has virtually become a trademark! His hired mercenary Fleance is a carrot top. And by extension of Demona, his French ex-wife was a redhed too! None of the females in the series with any connection to him don't have red hair. I like it. It's neat. Was it intention, or is it just an amusing fluke? If a fluke, did you ever notice?

Greg responds...

I'm color blind.

Response recorded on July 03, 2001

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WereFox writes...

Does the spell of immortality completely heal Demona and MacBeths injuries. Do bullet or stab wounds heal without a trace or do the leave battle scars. It had occured to me that the spell might not have to heal them to be good as new, just enough to keep them alive. If being "alive" is the minmal requirement. Then the two of the could theoretically go into comas for the rest of eternity and still be considered "alive" for the purposes of the spell. I know, now way you were actually going to do this. Just exorcising a "creativity demon."

Greg responds...

Hey, exorcise away.

Response recorded on July 03, 2001

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Corrine Blaquen writes...

How would Macbeth react to the Canmore siblings? They are, after all, descendants of his arch-nemeses, and overall the family hasn't proven to be very honorable.

Greg responds...

He'd not be fond of them.

Response recorded on July 02, 2001

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matt writes...

why did you and the writers decide not to have Macbeth join Arthur as one of his knights?

Greg responds...

Mostly because Macbeth didn't seem to want to join.

But also because I didn't need him there as a regular in Pendragon. Frankly, he and Arthur have too much in common.

Arthur and Griff and later Blanchefleur and Merlin seemed like a good core group to start with.

Macbeth makes for a good guest star.

Response recorded on July 02, 2001

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Demoness writes...

In your opinion, if Gargoyles ever became a motion picture, out of the well known actors, who do you think might best play Macbeth?

I say Sean Connery. He's got the looks (well use too, stick some hair on his head and he's fine), the accent, and he's played a King and warrior before. :)

Greg responds...

We just had this discussion here. Check out the Ask Greg Archives under Macbeth, or Live-Action Movie or Voice Talent.

Response recorded on July 01, 2001

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Oberon writes...

1) Why did the Weird Sisters spend so much time and effort making Demona and MacBeth their pawns, and keeping them alive for nine-hundred and something years?
2) Why did the Archmage want those two in particular?
They seam pretty powerfull but there have got to be people of equal power in the 20th century (even people who would be willing o go the Avalon)
3) If they had over 900 years, why didn't the Weird Sisters get afew more pawns (would have been a good idea, considering ththier attack on Avalon failed)

Greg responds...

1. Partially, because the Archmage asked them to. And for other reasons, I'm not yet revealing.

2. I don't think the Archmage fully knew the answer (or thought to care). Demona, he thought he was punishing for an earlier ("Vows") betrayal. But even that argument is specious. And he didn't know Macbeth from Adam.

3. The Archmage didn't ask for any others. That restricted them, vis-a-vis Oberon's Law.

Response recorded on June 20, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

You know that gargoyles don't age as fast as humans and Demona and MacBeth feel the same things is that whay MacBeth lived for a long time or is it because MacBeth is a king?

Greg responds...

neither

They've been cursed, remember?

Response recorded on June 20, 2001

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Entity writes...

Hi Greg,

You refer to Demona and Macbeth as "foot-soldiers" in the context that the Weird Sisters used them for (or sought to use them for). Isn't that a bit of an under-title for them? Why go through all the trouble of obtaining Demona and Macbeth if only to use them as "grunts"? First off, isn't the entire purpose of foot-soldiers/grunts to have a lot of them? Merely two suggest specialization, and indeed, they seem to have been chosen because they were special. What was the Archmage's motivation behind obtaining these two in particular, and any two in general? Did he just not want to have to get his hands dirty with "menial" tasks? Did he want the ego boost of having underlings? Were Demona and Macbeth candidates because they were "the best" and therefore more of an go boost?

Greg responds...

Terms like "foot soldier" and "cannon fodder" were clearly used by the Archmage to make him feel more important. In fact, he was cherry-picking very talented warriors.

Or one might argue, he had nothing to do with the selections. How did he even know about Macbeth? Sure his older self told him, but how did he know? Sure HIS older self told him, but how did he know? And so on, and so on, and so on...

Response recorded on June 19, 2001

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matt writes...

i just watched "Enter Macbeth". i think this was the first of lots of sad ending-episodes... after this in "Reawakening" Coldstone is awakened and apparently dies, in "Metamorphosis" Derek is mutated and decieved by Xanatos, really sad ending, in "Legion" Coldstone is brought back but is destroyed by a virus, and on and on until "Hunters Moon" when the Clocktower is destroyed and the gargoyles are exposed. a very bittersweet series, really, i love it! anyway, back to my point, in "Enter Macbeth" you opened with Xanatos in prison in a dark cell eating bad prison food, while the gargs are living it up at the Eyrie, Broadway cooking in a well-equiped kitchen, Hudson watching the tube in his own tv room, Brooklyn and Lex playing cards in the big foyer, Goliath reading in the nice library, and the Grimorum safe in a high-tech glass display case. but by the end of the episode the clan is the ones living in the dark uncomfortable cell, the Clocktower, no more tv room, you have to break into the public library to read, the best you have for a kitchen is a hotplate, and the Grimorum is now stored in a closet behind a regular wooden door, and as for Xanatos, he's back home now, living the good life atop the worlds tallest building. now, my literature teacher in high school taught me to always see symbolism in everything and though i didn't see it before, this whole episode teems with it. i just wanted to congratulate you and the writers, this is great television, i think!

Greg responds...

Thanks.

Images of HOME were consciously threaded throughout this episode. You've left out Macbeth's glorious home, which goes up in flames for his efforts.

Some justice in the world.

Response recorded on June 10, 2001

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Oberon writes...

In the Wierd Sisters incantation on Macbrth and demona they say "forever and eternal bound" so my quetion is
1) Can the Wierd Sister undo their spell
2) Can anyone else (with the exception of D and M killing each other)

Greg responds...

1. Nope.
2. Doubt it.

Response recorded on June 09, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Is there a reason that MacBeth owns the real Mona Lisa while the Renaissance hunters used Leonardo's weapons? Is it a coincedence?

Greg responds...

I never said Macbeth owned the real Mona Lisa.

I just never said he didn't.

Response recorded on May 04, 2001

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Jason Barnett writes...

You've stated that you'd like to see the people who voiced the characters portray them in a live action movie. However John Rhys-Davies would make a fairly poor MacBeth because of his size. So excluding him who would you like to see portray MacBeth?

Greg responds...

I don't know. Connery? He's probably too old now. Guess we'd have to hold auditions. :)

Actually, I'm not sure I agree with you about John.

Response recorded on May 02, 2001

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Angel writes...

In Hunter's Moon, Demona is going to blanket the world with her virus, killing all the humans, i was thinking that, if Macbeth is human and Demona is responsible for the virus, would'nt die, and wouldn't she?

I'm sorry if this has already been covered, but i haven't seen that epiodes.
Anyway, just wondering.

Greg responds...

It's SO been covered. Did you even look in either the Demona or Macbeth archive?

Short answer: It would depend on Demona's true intent.

Response recorded on May 02, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Are the were-panthers and Natsilane also suppose to be weapons of war like Demona and MacBeth?

Greg responds...

Demona and Macbeth (lowercase b, by the way) were not weapons of war. They were foot-soldiers.

There is purpose afoot, but I hesitate to make such a one-to-one comparison.

Response recorded on April 09, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Why did the Weird Sisters have Demona and MacBeth steal Coldstone? I mean MacBeth and Demona stole it to make sure that the Gargoyles didn't find out about the theft of the three talismans, but what did the sisters have to gain from it? They could have teleported the duo beyond the grasp of the gargoyles.

Greg responds...

Demona and Macbeth were not in control.

The point was to steal the three items without alerting Goliath's suspicions. Stealing Coldstone accomplished that. Goliath never even realized the three items were missing. Teleporting has nothing to do with anything.

Response recorded on April 09, 2001

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matt writes...

in "Sanctuary" when Macbeth and Demona are fighting, Demona gets a hold of a gun and so does Elisa, Macbeth pulls back his jacket to let Demona shoot him and in the last second starts saying "NO!". is this because he realizes he doesn't want Demona to kill him and or is it because he sees that Elisa is about to shoot Demona and thus he won't die?

Greg responds...

He sees Elisa and realizes that her intervention will spoil his suicide attempt.

Response recorded on April 08, 2001

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Vashkoda writes...

1) Have you given any thought to how MacBeth and Demona will die--if they ever do?

2a) Can you think of any specific way in which the magical bond between them can be dispelled (other than through death)? b) Can the bond be altered in any way, or are the conditions fixed?

3) Demona and MacBeth asked for the Sisters' help, and thus they were justified in magically linking the two together and "interfering in mortal lives". But once that act is ended, how can they put the two under a geis and force them to steal the magical artifacts and fight for the Archmage (I doubt they were given permission)? Does Oberon's law permit them to continue interfering with any mortal whose life they've already once affected?

Greg responds...

1. Yes.

2a. Not telling.

2b. Not telling.

3. Emotionally exhausted, Demona and Macbeth relinquished their personal sovereignty. Watch the scene again.

Response recorded on March 29, 2001

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Bruno writes...

Hi, Greg,

About Angela: Right after the World Tour, what are her opinions about...

1-Macbeth?

2-Fox?

3-Dingo?

Thanks.

Greg responds...

1. He seems all right.

2. She doesn't seem to trustworthy. But at least she's not trying to kill me.

3. He seems all right.

Response recorded on March 29, 2001

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Slow writes...

Re: High Noon

I have to say that I was very confused about the three Desdemonas. Until someone mentioned it in Ask Greg I just figured it was the writer wanting to do strange and surreal stuff inside Coldstone's head. The animation was so good I never would've noticed the colour mistake. If it wasn't for this venue, I'd never have known.

"This is diverting." "You don't know the half of it."

Sure, I laughed when I first heard the line accompanied by the expression on Coldstone's face. But when I watched the episode again a few years later, I thought that Macbeth's response may have been a hint (subconsciously, maybe) that the entire situation was a diversion (staged to get the talismans). Am I wrong to think that Mac may not have been as interested in the girl-fight as it sounded?

Greg responds...

Nah. It works both ways.

Response recorded on March 13, 2001

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Erin Peretti writes...

I am absolutely fascinated with your comment that Gargoyle's MacBeth was more historically accurate than Shakespeare's (obviously ommitting Demona and immortality).

What parts were more accurate?

I know this is a pain, but would you happen to know where I could find some historically accurate accounts of Macbeth? His home, his full name, whether Duncan was the perfect king potrayed in the play, etc....

What research materials did you use when writing Mac for Gargoyles?

Is Glamis castle in Scotland really Mac's castle, as I have been told?

Thanks so much!!!

Greg responds...

Most of the research on Macbeth was done by Monique Beatty and Tuppence Macintyre. I did little or none myself. (I didn't have time.) Monique was my assistant (and is now a producer in her own right). Tup is a close friend and a Los Angeles Deputy District Attorney.

I know Holinshed was of some use. But I don't know what other books they used specifically.

Almost everything we did -- minus the gargs and Weird Sisters and the Mask of the Hunter -- was more accurate historically than Shaekespeare. (Not better, just more accurate.) Duncan and his father hired Gillecomgain to assassinate Mac's father. They rewarded him with Mac's title and with Gruouch. Mac eventually killed Gille and married Gruoch, adopting her boy Lulach as his own. There were some rumours that Lulach WAS his child.

Mac killed Duncan in battle, not while Duncan was a guest in his house. Mac ruled wisely for seventeen years and was overthrown by Malcolm Canmore, who was backed by the English. Etc.

I'm not 100% sure about Glamis, but I believe Macbeth's historical home was Castle Moray (also called Murray).

Response recorded on March 13, 2001

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Vanity writes...

I have been reading Macbeth and Demona responses and the above mentioned for "High Noon" where questions were asked why Macbeth didn't feel the pain when Elisa and Demona where in combat. And I think people are putting too much emphasis on the fact that Macbeth could prepare for the blows. Couldn't it be that, and if you watch the fight scene; Elisa didn't really "hurt" Demona enough to evoke the spell? Granted Demona ran head-first into a statue but that might not of hurt too much.

Greg responds...

A combination of all of the above -- including that we screwed up a bit.

Response recorded on March 13, 2001

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matt writes...

how long had Demona and Thailog been a couple when Goliath arrived in Paris? how long had Demona and Macbeth been in Paris?

Greg responds...

The following dates are tentative, based on my current reworking of the timeline -- still a rework in progress.

Demona and Macbeth arrived in Paris on 1-1-96.

Demona first encountered Thailog on 1-2-96.

Goliath, Elisa, Angela and Bronx arrived in Paris on 1-21-96.

Response recorded on March 07, 2001

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Jim R. writes...

I am still a bit confused on how is it that Demona and MacBeth have to die, if they do? I know that no one else but either one of them can kill them both, but what I'm confused about is...

Possiblities
1. Do they both (AND) have to kill each other at the exact same time?
2. Or does at least MacBeth OR Demona have to kill the other in order for them both to die? (Keeping in mind, OR in math means one, the other, or both.)

I wanted you to be impressed with my cool Mr. Spock logic I was pondering today because I was bored and needed to use my discrete mathematics knowledge formally. So, I'd thought I'd apply math to Gargoyles somehow. Hope you understand.

Let "m" stand for MacBeth, and "d" for Demona. TRUE being if one is killed. FALSE if not. Here's my truth table for possibility #1.

m | d | m and d

T | T | T
T | F | F
F | T | F
F | F | F

Therefore, if they both kill each other, that would be the only TRUE outcome, whereas all others are False because if one lives, then they both do, correct?

And here's my logic for possibility #2.

m | d | m or d

T | T | T
T | F | T
F | T | T
F | F | F

Therefore, only one is FALSE because according to #2's theory, either Macbeth or Demona kills the other, then they both die, or if they both kill each other.

I hope my logic is not flawed somewhere...Mr. Spock would not be impressed.
See Gargoyles does help out with math!

Greg responds...

Math is good.

But really you don't need it here. If you listen to the Weird Sisters it's pretty clear.

One has to kill the other (OR both kill each other at the same time). They don't both have to do it. Just the terms of the bond.

Response recorded on February 22, 2001

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Chapter XXVI: "High Noon"

Following fast on the heels of City of Stone, here's my ramble on High Noon...

The recap is interesting here. It's all Coldstone oriented. Demona, Macbeth and the Weird Sisters aren't mentioned. Nothing from City of Stone, despite this being a direct sequel to those events. The reason is that the recaps got early criticism on a Disney Afternoon mailing list for giving too much away. We'd show a villain who didn't appear until the end of Act One, thus cueing our audience to expect that villain all along. A valid criticism. So we tried to adjust here. Coldstone's participation wasn't a secret. The episode opens in his "internal cyber-world" and he's shown dormant in the Clock Tower in the very next scene. But when Demona and Macbeth first walk past Elisa and Morgan, we're not supposed to know who they are. So I intentionally kept them out of the recap to preserve that reveal.

The heather Othello gathers has no scent. Why not? Everything in that world, except for the souls of the three gargs was simply a mental construct. Sight, sound, touch. So why not smell? No chemical senses, you might argue. But why no chemical senses? Why touch and not taste? I think that the lack of smell was an unconscious or subconscious boundary that Desdemona did not want to cross. Something to remind her that this world is not real. For all we know, Othello and Iago could smell whatever they imagined they could smell.

I like seeing Hudson and Broadway learning to read. We cheated a bit. I'm not sure they could have progressed as fast as they did in the short time since "Lighthouse". But we took that liberty to show that they had been working assiduously at it.

I have mixed feelings about Hudson's "Why would she want to 'hit a sack'?" line. On the one hand, I'm not sure we ever did enough of this. Playing with the contrasts in language and expression between their world and ours. On the other hand, it just seemed a bit late in the game for Hudson not to have heard this one already. (And for that matter, I have no idea when that particular phrase originated. For all I know they've been hitting the sack since the Middle Ages.)

Elisa makes a point of saying that she's "no hero". Just a gal doing a job. But of course, we know that's not true. It's simply how she'd prefer to view herself -- particularly when she's so tired. I tried to use this episode to emphasize that Elisa works the night shift. That she gets off work just before sunrise. Starts work just after sunset. (I actually imagine that she works a four day ten hour shift, plus mucho overtime.) Sometimes it seemed like the fans had forgotten that. I got a lot of questions back then like: "She works during the day and hangs with the gargoyles at night. When does she sleep?"

Morgan has a real nice role in this one. Keith is great as Morgan. So distinctive from Goliath in a part that was a mere throwaway in Awakening, Part One. Morgan and Elisa's easy rapor in this episode and Avalon One is what gave me the idea that he might someday ask her out (on that 2nd Halloween episode I've mentioned a few times). And the notion of a Keith-Salli-Keith triangle tickled me a bit.

Enter Macbeth as a perp with a human Demona dressed as a cop. (Always nice to show our characters in different costumes on occasion.) I'm curious how many people IMMEDIATELY recognized Demona as herself? After all, you'd only gotten a BRIEF glimpse of her human form in "The Mirror". And we hadn't shown it at all in "Vows" or "City of Stone". In fact, City of Stone began what we then called our Third Tier of stories. (Tier One was the first season. Tier Two was the first eight episodes of the second season: Leader, Legion, Metamorphosis, Lighthouse, Silver Falcon, Mirror, Eye of the Beholder, Vows.) And of course, City of Stone was transitional, so one could argue that Tier Three was beginning here with High Noon. Anyway, Demona's in atypical dress and species. Who knew it was her?

And once you did know, what were you thinking? The gargoyles have the same questions, I'd imagine. Last they (and you) saw, Mac and Demona hated each other, and had been taken away by the seemingly benevolent Weird Sisters. What was going through your heads about all this? Did you wonder at the seeming inconsistencies, like their knowledge of the Clock Tower? Their ability to get Coldstone out of the tower in daylight, unseen?

When my son Ben saw Demona, he thought it was one of the "triplets", which is what he calls the Weird Sisters. (They've fast become his favorite characters.) When I pointed out that she had red hair and not white, yellow or black, he was resistent to giving up on the idea that they weren't going to appear. (I was glad they eventually did. And now I wonder what he's going to think about the next seven episodes in which they do NOT appear.)

Throughout this, we cheat a bit on Elisa's exhaustion. We knock her out, but keep her tired. The subtle differences between various means of being unconscious and their effects on how tired one is confuse me.

I love Mac and D's exchange...
Mac: "You're still thinking like a gargoyle."
D: "I am a gargoyle." And don't you forget it.

Again, back in those days I just thought the audience would get revved up merely because we were teaming up THREE of our major villains. Macbeth, Demona and the villainous side of Coldstone. In Batman or Superman that would be a BIG EVENT. A huge threat to the hero. Did it have that effect on you guys? I feel vaguely that in a strange way, it did not. That our villains were so complex, that for once they backfired on us. That it wasn't viewed as, "Wow, our heroes have barely survived an encounter with one of those guys, how will they handle three?" Rather, the conflict was less interesting than the machinations and personalities. Am I being clear? Your thoughts?

This episode had some truly gorgeous animation in it. And the transformation scenes are both very cool. The Pain Link plays well here, though occasionally seems more geared to comedy than drama for some reason. The theme of gifts coming with a price... particularly the gifts of tricksters is emphasized in this scene.

Meanwhile Othello is desperately trying to remain an ostrich with his head in the sand. A position that on at least one level, Elisa 'believes' she'd like to take as well. With Othello, I think it's a real possibility that he will never act. With Elisa, I don't think we believe it for a moment. That's part of the reason they're both in there. To make sure that the theme of "Standing Up" is emphasized. Which brings us to the title, "HIGH NOON". That was one of mine, I believe. And I stole it right from the Gary Cooper movie. Sure we'd have a battle at High Noon. Because this was Elisa's story, not the gargoyles. Because the gargoyles would be asleep and vulnerable. But also because it was that kind of archetypal the-hero-stands-alone western battle.

You may notice that Xander Berkeley (the voice of Iago) does not appear in this episode. Because Iago has no lines when he's not in control of the Coldstone body. Again, I'm always so impressed with what a great job Michael Dorn does contrasting the Othello and Iago personalities without actually changing his voice.

I like Elisa's line when Brooklyn asks her if she recognized the woman with Macbeth. "She seemed familiar." Think about this for a second. If this was real life and not a cartoon, do you think you'd recognize Demona in Dominique? And yet I completely buy that Elisa recognized something in there. There's a strange nega-intimacy between Elisa and Demona. (Which is one of the sick reasons why I created Delilah, later.)

Goliath and Elisa engage in a little dueling patronizing here. Elisa has to go back on shift, so can't accompany the 'goyles to Mac's place. Goliath is pretty smug when he says the six of them can handle it. (The smugness, I hope, is undercut when he follows it up by saying, "You have a whole city to protect." Which is how he views it.) Then Elisa talks to them like they're little kids. She wants a full report when they get back. (Who says these two weren't made for each other?)

Lex, who has been and will continue to be very adept at breaking alarm systems, etc., for once admits that it's all too easy.

I like the moment when Goliath taps the camera with his wing. A nice little touch. And very well animated.

Lex is always the voice of warning in regards to Coldstone. This is important. Goliath listens to Lex this time. And Lex is fooled when Coldstone reveals Demona's involvement, seemingly before they know Demona is involved. I thought that was very clever on the villains' part.

Bronx smells Demona behind the closet, just as he did behind the tapestry.

I like how the marble bust flies and crashes. Another nice touch in the boarding and animation. Nice weight to the whole Brooklyn-Demona-Bronx fight scene.

I liked staging the Macbeth, Husdon, Broadway fight in a library. Felt like a thematic rematch from "Lighthouse".

The pain link here is a BIT of a cheat. Usually with them in different rooms on different floors, it wouldn't be quite this intense. Maybe the library is directly above whatever room Demona was in.

Lex is sure Coldstone's wrong about Demona. Brooklyn's "Uh, guess again." line is fun.

The entire battle at Macbeth's place is part of a technique I enjoy using on occasion called "Suspended Structure". This is really an Elisa and Othello Story. But we let the gargs carry the action for a period of time, while the true protagonists can't or won't take action. This keeps the story moving, without compromising the inaction of our "leads".

Demona confronts Elisa at the clock tower. The animators get a little carried away here with some of Demona's body language. God knows, it's fun to watch. But would she really do all those sexpot poses? Is that in character?

It is fun to see her hail a taxi though.

Morgan's back. Elisa now looks VERY tired. Again, great work from the animators. It's all in the eyes. Morgan helps Elisa though he thinks she's just talking about normal copwork. It only proves there's really no such thing as a "Normal Life". Morgan certainly doesn't think he has one.

Meanwhile Desdemona's gettin antsy. It's the "in" that the Weird Sisters need. They take over. Unfortunately, here, the animators screwed up. The three Desdemona's were supposed to have silver, gold and raven hair. Instead, in most shots, they just look like three Dessies. Then when they finally do get the hair right, it's just before they merge back into one Desdemona. At which point, the hair color should have been Des'. Instead, I think it's Luna's -- briefly. Oh, well. Anyway, I could have just done this with Desdemona herself. But I wanted to give the audience a hint that the Weird Sisters were still involved. Ben was thrown by the hair. He almost didn't believe these were the triplets.

I like the line: "Even shadows must be true to their shade."

High Noon at Belvedere Castle. Coldstone wonders that he can see the sun. Again, that's me making sure people are clear that Coldstone is RE-ANIMATED STONE, not flesh. I don't think it's visually clear. (Part of the problem being that Othello's coloring is too similar.)

Then Elisa arrives -- counting on Macbeth's honor to keep Demona from shooting her. For that reason, she intentionally doesn't bring her service revolver to the party. Quite the gambit. Elisa also counts on Demona's temper -- and on the fact that Demona is unaccustomed to fighting with reduced human strength. She goads Demona: "I'm here to save him." and "You fight like a rookie." I love, positively LOVE, the former of those two lines. Elisa is a hero in her own right. Though Goliath has rescued her on occasion, I felt we did a pretty good job of always evening the score. She's no damsel in distress.

Mac & Coldstone: "This is diverting." "You have no idea." (Quotations approximate.) I like that. A tip of the hat to my being a guy, if you will.

We cheat a bit here on the pain link too. One could argue that Mac IS feeling the pain. But he's ready for it and covering. He does seem to be grimacing a bit when he says, "You have no idea." But still, I think we cheated.

I love the animation on the Othello, Desdemona, Iago fight.

Battle over, Coldstone leaves. Sends himself into exile. This is the gargoyle way.

And hey, our jogger is back. Again wondering where all these statues are coming from. That's just fun continuity for me. And Elisa: "Don't ask me. I'm just taking a nap."

And then the whole final scene between Mac and D and the sisters is so much fun. I love the sense of the fog lifting from their eyes. "What Primary Objective?" "Why are we working together?"

And I'm also proud of the trick. A very Xanatosian tag here. Steal Coldstone to distract the gargs from noticing the thefts of the gate, book and eye.

And how about that reference to "The coming battle..." that the Sisters end the episode on? What did you all think of that at the time?

I'll try to post the High Noon writer's memo tomorrow. (Meant to do it yesterday, but I forgot.) Anyway, Done rambling. You're turn. (Again, I'm interested in both your original and current responses to the episode.)


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Baal writes...

Hey, um. Sorry about Question 2 in my Angela post.
I guess you DID say that you weren't gonna answer in questions about 2198 until the contest was over. (Although SOME people are already asking questions.

Here are some questions of my own.
1. Do Arthur and his comrades go on a quest to retrieve the Holy Grail. (I think I've seen yes in the archive). If so, does this pit the against Percival/Duval, the leader of the Illuminati.

2. Does Macbeth get involved.

Greg responds...

1. Eventually and yes.

2. A bit.

Response recorded on February 15, 2001

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Chapter XXV: "City of Stone, Part Four"

Time to ramble...

Picking up right where Part Three leaves off, Demona is forced to back off on killing Elisa right away because of Bronx. I really like that scene, mostly for how it illustrates Bronx's level of sophistication. It's not like he understands English, beyond a few simple names and commands. But he understands tone of voice. Something that Demona uses. She talks him down by saying nasty things in a nice tone of voice. He's still suspicious. But as long as her actions and tone don't get hostile, he's content to back off. At one point though, she can't restrain her venom, and he starts to growl again. And she has to regain her composure.

FLASHBACK

Great Choral music during the battle. Carl Johnson and music editor Marc Perlman (both of whom will be attending the Gathering this June in Los Angeles) did a magnificent job with this.

And there's some great fog as well.

It's also nice to see a legitimately joyful Demona, hoisting Macbeth into the air. He laughs, but his mind's on other things, wondering why Bodhe wanted to talk to him without Demona present. Perhaps he's feeling guilty. Perhaps she picks up on that, which is why she eavesdrops.

A tragedy of bad timing: My sense is that Macbeth is about to read Bodhe the riot act, when Luach interrupts. Mac essentially agrees with Luach, but not with his manner. He takes JUST the wrong moment to teach him a lesson about being a good king. Luach reacts badly and storms out. And it is Luach's behavior that Macbeth is considering when Demona leaves. Two seconds later, I'm quite sure the conversation went like this:

Bodhe: "Well, sire?"

Macbeth: "Well, what?"

Bodhe: "The Gargoyles, sire. You must disavow them!"

Macbeth: "Don't be a fool." etc.

The siege is pretty cool too. (Though you'd think boulders dropped from the battlements would be a touch more effective.)

Mac rescues Gruoch. Even at this age, I still think they're a sexy couple.

I like the scene where Canmore removes his Hunter's Mask. Like Gille before him with Demona, he's truly annoyed when Mac doesn't immediately recognize him.

"Never would I have done so! We have been allies for thirty-seven years!!" Demona ain't a great judge of character.

Luach and Bodhe show up. I like this scene too. (O.K., I'm partial. What can I tell you?) Bodhe has an interesting moment. One of two things happens here. Either he's pleased to finally have one of his own blood (i.e. his grandson) installed as King or the death of Macbeth has finally awakened the hero inside him. Or both. For once, I tend to give Bodhe the benefit of the doubt. I think, at this late date, he's finally come into his own. I like to think he died a good warrior's death at Luach's side.

Demona wakes up. She claims not to believe Gruoch's admonishment, but NOTE, she does not kill Gruoch. Underneath it all, she knows that Gruoch is right and feels chastened.

Macbeth wakes up. Here we have our final scene on Lunfanan Hill. It parallels the previous break-up of Mac and Gru. That time Mac sent her away, but he loved her still. This time she sends him away. She loves him too. But this parting is permanent. Very moving to me. "I will always love you." And because of that, he must leave her. But we know he hasn't forgotten her even into the present. Her loss informs what follows.

Back to the present. Over episodes two and three, things in the present have been progressing very slowly. Now the present takes center stage.

Demona echoes what I'm sure by this time we were all thinking: "Take off that mask. You aren't fooling anyone... Macbeth." And he explains that he wears it as a symbol of her betrayal. (And for a psychological edge, no doubt.)

Meanwhile, we have that semi-feeble exchange between Goliath and Xanatos in the air. Feeble (a) because in one little scenelet, the mouth on Xanatos' armor is moving like it had lips; and (b) because the whole tapestry thing was a fairly forced way to get X and Goliath back to the castle.

I like Demona's line: "Let's not start that again. You blame me. I blame you..." etc. It's a very rational Xanatosian moment for her. But that rationality is born from the knowledge that she can't kill Macbeth without killing herself. Her usual vengeful attitude is useless. What she doesn't know is how suicidal he is. "Revenge is a dish best served cold. And I have waited 900 years for mine." Hey, leave a dish out for 900 years and it will get pretty cold.

There's always a bit of comedy in the pain-sharing battles of D&M.

When the floor starts to give way, it reminds me of a scene that was WAY better animated in the DuckTales pilot. Where the bricks of gold fall away in a simlilar vein. It's nice here, but it was awesome there.

I also like when Demona has Mac's E-M gun, tosses it and catches it to fire at X and G. Nice little touch.

And Xanatos' truly frightened yet underplayed: "This is bad." when he sees the computer screen.

I like the multiple falls that get us down to the Atrium -- a wonderful setting for the final confrontations.

And Goliath's speech: "...Death never does."

Again we get multiple images of the Sisters throughout this scene. And again, I had to fight for that.

Each Sister gets to take a mental punch to weaken first Macbeth and then Demona. Are they being hypocrites here? One aspect of their persona is, certainly. But there's more going on, some of which I still haven't revealed.

But the key thing in terms of this scene (and the events of AVALON) is that both Mac and Demona need to be mentally weakened for the spells of control that the Sisters are going to use on them in HIGH NOON and AVALON. And M&D need to borderline volunteer to relinquish control over themselves. Macbeth, who has been suicidal, is tired and willing. Demona's tougher. But even she doesn't put up much of a fight. "You tricked me." she says. And certainly they have, but she can't break the grip of three children, and though of course they are not ordinary children, one must wonder if she really wanted to.

Goliath: You have learned nothing.

The sisters (as children) say their cool (and ironic) line: "We have written their stories. They are our responsibility. They are our children." My three year old son Ben says: "I love the triplets."

But theirs is a story for another day.

Xanatos really has to sweat in this one. Unusual for him. I love his line to Bronx: "What are you looking at?"

But once the skies burn, he's back to his old self: "Magnificent." Believe it or not, it took some effort to really get the skies burning. The animation came back with only a few contrails of gas burning. We used video tricks to get that whole sky-burning effect that was SO important to the story.

When the gargs rush back inside they were supposed to lift Elisa up into the air in their joy at seeing her unstoned again. Thus you have contrast to explain Xanatos' line to Owen, "You'll forgive me, if I just shake your hand." (But you also have to wonder how he'd respond to Fox when next he saw her.)

And Xanatos gives a line I'd been waiting to use for a year. "I always wondered why I allowed you gargoyles to live. You come in handy now and then." I had always worried that an audience raised on certain villain cliches would just assume that the reason Xanatos never killed the gargs on one of the myriad occasions when he had the chance, was because we were bad writers. This X/G exchange was here to demonstrate that X wasn't that kind of villain. That he was never wasteful. Maybe at this point in the series, it wasn't necessary to spell it out. But it was still nice to get the sentiment across.

Of course, this ends the Xanatos/Demona partnership. Uneasy though it had been. It's why VOWS had to come first.

And that's my ramble...

Where's yours?


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Chapter XXIV: "City of Stone, Part Three"

Time to ramble...

So the sun rises on the next day. Elisa IMMEDIATELY starts talking, even though she's facing the wrong way, putting to the lie all those nice fans who tried to make excuses for why she was animated facing that direction.

It's also kind of cool to watch Goliath and Brooklyn turn to stone and then see Owen turn from stone to flesh. He's got that URGENT-Owen tone going there for a sec, then quickly regains his usual Owen composure. It's fun.

There's a line in here about mixing magics, which was supposed to be a vague, vague cover for later revelations that Owen is Puck. Owen suggests getting the Grimorum from Goliath. X responds it wouldn't do any of them any good since none of them are sorcerors and MIXING MAGICS is supposed to be dangerous. That last phrase is REALLY a reference to a notion in X's head, that Puck might be able to help. X than rejects the notion himself. He's right about mixing magics, but that isn't the main reason that Puck won't help. Puck won't help because that's not the deal that Owen made with Xanatos.

I like Xanatos' casual confidence though: "We'll just have to set the sky ablaze."

Travis scene is fun for me too. Gives me one of those oblique opportunities to semi-break the fourth wall. A woman comes up, tells Travis the truth. He discounts her story, nominally because she doesn't watch television. Anyone who doesn't watch television must be a kook. Now a report on Mass Hypnosis... (That last bit is in there to explain in passing what the world response to the City of Stone events is likely to be.)

FLASHBACK TIME: Duncan has a beard. "Some cousins are not that close." I love how Neil Dickson read that line. And I love Duncan's genuine surprise when Mac saves his life.

Mac saves Demona again. Proving what a good, loyal guy he is.

And then we bring in the Weird Sisters, in the most SHAKESPEAREAN scene in City of Stone.

But first let's talk about the title. I LOVE that title. "CITY OF STONE". I think it was one of mine. But I have to admit it's flawed. Though it's spooky and evocative it really only covers the present day story. The present day story is certainly important, but I think we'd all agree that the real juice in this four-parter is in the tenth and eleventh centuries. And the title doesn't really cover that stuff at all. I didn't notice it at the time, because the importance of the flashbacks snuck up on me. At first I thought they would simply inform the action in the present. But it wound up being more of the reverse. Still I like the title. It sounds like a Movie title to me. What do you guys think?

Anyway, we bubble, bubble, toil and trouble it a bit. I love the nasty expressions that Canmore and Luach shoot each other. [I also love J.D. Daniels work as Canmore. He's such a little nasty. Great contrast to his work as the goody-good kid Tom.]

I'm fairly certain that we screwed up on Luach's name. The name should have been Lulach. But a typo got us stuck on Luach. At first I thought maybe either name would be accurate, like Malcolm and Maol Chalvim. But now I think we just blew it.

I love Luna's line: "You would lecture US on fate."

Erin, my six year old daughter, began to get very annoyed with Duncan here. "Why doesn't he give Macbeth one chance? He just saved his life! Duncan is a fraidy-cat. And stupid." I love a good judge of character. When Bodhe ("Be reasonable, Macbeth") tells Mac that Duncan's after him, and Mac can't believe it, Erin felt quite vindicated, "See, [Mac] just asked the same question that I did."

I like Mac's sad line to Gruoch: "The Journey will be brief."

And I like D and Mac's exchange:

Mac: "You are the answer."
D: "I'm uninterested in the question."

Ben, my three year old son, was having a little trouble with how fast everyone was aging. He didn't always get that the flashbacks weren't taking place right after each other. He got the difference between past and present. But not that we kept leaping forward from say 1032 to 1044 etc. "That's a different Demona," he would say, before I explained that she was just getting older. It then occured to me that I'm not even sure if he knows that white hair specifically signifies old age in a cartoon. After all, Brooklyn's hair is white. So's Luna's, in all her forms. (It's supposed to be silver, but it looks white most of the time.)

Mac is surprised, and not a little freaked out, to hear that there's still a Hunter out there. With Gill dead, he has no clue who it could be.

He offers an alliance, and Demona -- clearly thinking of the Captain of the Guard -- says, "You sing an old song." That, for me, helped tie in our Wyvern flashbacks to the whole Mac/Demona story. I was always afraid they weren't really related enough.

The whole thing with the Sisters looking different depending on the point of view, was another idea of mine that most people thought I was nuts about. (Like having characters unaware of the change in themselves in "The Mirror".) It worked just fine, and in many ways is clearer than any alternative I can think of. But man, I had to WORK to convince people.

The sisters are pretty tricky here, they use the barest excuse of an offered trade to more or less enforce their will on Mac and D. Bending Oberon's law without breaking it. That's not too important here, but will obviously be important in later episodes.

The clues of course are planted in the spell. "Forever and eternal bound and each the other's pain resound." How many people got the implication here as opposed to figuring it all out when the sisters explained it near the end of part four?

Seline handing Mac that magic ball was another instance of us cheating a bit. We were sick of using the fall to the death shtick. But we couldn't just have Duncan skewered. So this was an S&P compromise. The good news was it looked pretty cool. Brief but scary. It even seems to scare Mac.

When Gruouch says that she's afraid Mac's made "a bad bargain," she was supposed to touch his hair to give a visual reminder that he had given up his youth to protect his clan -- and that it scared and saddened her more than a little. I gave that note over and over, but somehow it never got in there. It still works, but I really wish she had run her fingers through his hair there.

D likes Mac and Gruoch here. Look at her face. Maybe she sees a bit of herself and Goliath in them. (With Gruoch as Goliath, of course.)

I like the battle too. It's very economical staged, yet it feels kinda epic to me. Very smartly story-boarded. I really like Demona's clean sweep of Duncan's cavalry off their horses.

Mac says: "You fight like a demon." Laying the groundwork for Demona to get named. This was a bit of an argument with S&P. "Demon" was supposed to be an off-limit word for us. I convinced Adrienne Bello it was important to justify Demona's name. And my bosses backed me up. (That never happens anymore, by the way.)

There's a character in here that we never name except in the credits. He's Duncan's right hand man and Demona appears to brain him by flying him head first into a big rock. He's called MacDuff in the credits. Obviously, another name from Shakespeare. I think maybe he didn't die, but became an ally of Canmore's in part four. But I'm not sure. I know that in part Three, Charlie "Travis Marshall" Hallahan did his voice. In part Four, the character I'm thinking of (both of whom have red hair at least) is voiced by Jeff Bennett.

M&D find the mask with Duncan, and Mac says, "so the battle is truly over for us both." Which is majorly ironic, since we know the battle will continue for at least 900 years.

Bodhe comes out from the background only after "THE NIGHT IS WON!"

Bodhe, though contemptuous, is a very fun character to write. I love his little aside about Canmore: "He'll be trouble; slay him now." We like Mac better that he won't kill a child. But you'll notice that Demona won't kill the kid either.

The coronation is fun. That whole naming sequence is fun.

M: "They will learn to respect you."
D: "I'd rather they feared me."
M: "They'll do that too... 'Demona'"

A nice bow tied on that "Know her?!! I named her!!" line from way back in "Enter Macbeth".

Now as we prepare to segue back to the present, Erin recognizes the three sisters as serving wenches "Because of their hair". To which Ben says, "Me too". But when we get to the present, neither realize that the sisters are also posing as cops. Mostly, because they're police hats largely cover their hair.

Now finally, back to Elisa. Confused as hell, but beginning to catch on at the mention of PackMedia Studios. She heads for the Eyrie. X's response: "Ah, the charming Detective Maza." Love that guy.

Owen and Elisa do their little dance and we get to play a gargoyle recurring bit with them as they freeze into stone mid-argument. At this point my kids catch on to the basic rules. (All of which might have been clearer if we hadn't had such a big gap between watching part two and part three). Erin: "So the humans are the opposite of the Gargoyles. When they turn to stone, the others wake up."

Xanatos starts explaining the plan, and my son turns to me and says, "Daddy, I have to tell you something." [Which is how he starts most conversations these days.] "I had a lot of dreams about fire in the sky." I'm not sure if I believe him, but it was a nice conversation piece.

I like the way Goliath looks at Elisa when he says, "This has to work." Feelings showing.

Then everyone leaves to go pass gas. :) [I know. I'm really mature.]

Bronx goes after the tapestry. We wanted to keep that subtle so that we weren't tipping our hand. Did anyone wonder about that or did it just slide by? Did anyone remember at the cliffhanger that Bronx had been left behind to save Elisa?

Anyway, there's my ramble. Where's yours?


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Entity writes...

Hi Greg,

We've all been awaiting this ramble for a long time, and no doubt, the coming weeks will be VERY enjoyable. :)

CITY OF STONE, PT 1.

I'll admit to you that the opening terrorist sequence wasn't all that effective to me. It came off rushed. But it provided an excellent transition to Demona. And then... THE FLASHBACK. The first of many. My God, this was glorious. I always imagine that if I were to ever show off Gargoyles to someone new in under 5 minutes I'd show them this flashback. Even though deductive reasoning filled the holes that this flashback does in, it was still such an experience actually seeing it take place, like witnessing history. The Wyvern Massacre was the defining moment of the series. And now, to see the behind-the-scenes was breathtaking beyond description. Demona's tearful turn to stone, then horrific discovery at sundown were amazing. That 'blood-curdle' music is just great, too.

Let's see, I can't go on like this with every scene, so I'll try to sum up from here.

You mentioned it was originally going to be a three-parter. Allow me to accidentally spit my drink all over my keyboard at reading that. Even now, I think about how much better it could've told its story with five or even six parts. Just three? Impossible. There is so much jammed in there. Too much, really. I'm glad you're here for insight, because I'll be honest: I got scarcely any of what you had in mind for various characters' motivations and inter-relating. Everything was crunched to 'sound bites' and didn't get enough flesh for me to interpret what you were aiming for. Of course, I got all the necessary things needed to understand the flow of the story, but I regret not getting the rest...

This is completely random, but I just thought I'd say that when Macbeth removes his Hunter's Mask later, in Part 4 I think, I like how his hair was ruffled. A nice touch. Very appreciated.

Anyway, to do with Part 1, I have really one more comment. I think the "mistake" you made with the Weird Sisters in their portrayel in this multi-parter has to do with just one key scene... aww, crap, here I go referring all the way to Part 4 again. Oh well, the scene in question is the very end, the "they are our responsibility... our children... that is a story for another day" scene. Up until then, I believe our impression of the Sisters was of benevolent helpers, like you wanted us to believe, according to your memos. However, in this scene, they suddenly "reveal" that they actually had a reason for helping them. That there is a greater design. That Demona and Macbeth have destinies to fulfill. I, and I'm sure most other people, suddenly got insanely excited thinking that D&M were going to be instrumental in saving the world from some great prophecy or something. But as it turns out, it's just a petty strike on an island...

Just my take. (I'd be interested - if this doesn't sound like me usurping your forum, Greg - in what others' takes were.)

Lastly, I just thought I'd mention that, ironically, I was talking with a friend this morning about the play Macbeth. I mentioned Gargoyles and off-handedly about its superior historical accuracy, to which Friend reponded that Macbeth, the play, was fiction. I insisted there really was a Macbeth and Duncan, but he was convinced otherwise. Interesting, huh?

Of course, I myself thought it was all made-up by you and the makers of the show till I looked it up in my Encyclopedia, to see what kind of historical "damage" you were doing in drawing these elaborate tales set in real countries' pasts... heh.

Greg responds...

Again, the sisters have many aspects. Like the moon. Vengeance was certainly one. Petty vengeance at that. But they have other motivations as well. That is a story for another day.

(And I'm always interested in other takes. I welcome them here.)

As to Macbeth and the legends/history, we always tried to be as accurate as we could. Not necessarily out of benevolence, but because the truth, when mixed with our gargs, made for such GREAT stories!

You're friend needs to be dragged into a library. It never bothers me when people don't know things. But it sure is disturbing when they're positive they know something and they're wrong.

Response recorded on February 01, 2001

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LSZ writes...

I don't think you've ever clarified this, and it doesn't seem to be in the archives, so:

How does the Macbeth-Demona immortality spell work? Does it miraculously repair their bodies after they suffer death-worthy damage, like beheading or being smashed in stone sleep? Does it arrange events/luck so that anything that would physically kill any normal person simply never hits them? Or has there simply been no incident where Demona or Macbeth suffered what would be fatal injury?

Greg responds...

You couldn't have checked the archives too carefully, because I've dealt with this MANY times. There have been no incidents where Mac or Demona have suffered a fatal injury that was objectively fatal, like a beheading or being smashed in stone sleep. They've been stabbed, shot, etc. But nothing CATASTROPHIC. When they are shot or stabbed, they heal -- ironically, the more severe the injury, the faster they heal. That is, if the spell has to be invoked to save them, they heal quickly, because they are healing magically. But if the injury wasn't fatal in the first place, than the spell is not invoked and each heals at his or her normal rate. For Demona, she'll TEND to be fully healed by the next sunset. Mac might take a little longer. He's human, and he's also biologically older.

Response recorded on January 17, 2001

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Chapter XXIII: "City of Stone, Part Two"

Time to ramble...

Xanatos again does equally well as hero and villain, as he opens the episode saving his and Fox's lives.

He's got some nice lines here too:

Another reprise of Launchpad McQuack's old: "Any landing you can walk away from..."

"At least she's not chipped."

"Demona and I need to have a little talk."

"No sense hailing a cab." Or stealing one. I'm not sure if it's clear, but we wanted to give the impression that traffic was hopelessly stalled by all the stone people behind the wheels of their cars. And that Xanatos would have to hoof it.

And then it's back to the clock tower where my favorite line is Brooklyn's as he's looking at what he thinks is a statue of Elisa:

"The nose is all wrong." Gotta love a critic.

Goliath doesn't objectively know that the statue is really Elisa, but his instincts are clearly firing up early warning signs.

Meanwhile, my daughter Erin is busy advising all of us: "They should make sure... cuz that's really her!" and "I bet they're going to Elisa's house." Which they weren't.

CONTINUITY
Originally, we had planned to (as usual) leave Hudson behind with Bronx. But we switched it to Broadway, so that Hudson could come with and reestablish his fine relationship with Robbins. I should point out that we BEGAN work on City of Stone before Lighthouse. We knew we needed a blind man for City. That blind man was then developed for Lighthouse, making for a great scene in City. Sometimes, things just seemed to work.

Brooklyn still hates Demona intensely. Forcing Goliath to compensate.

My son Ben was all nervous that "They're gonna turn to stone again." He was vague on who the "THEY" were.

Demona's reign of terror on the statues presented us with interesting S&P problems -- and some bizarre but VERY FUN solutions. Adrienne understood the necessity of having Demona blow up and/or smash a few of the stone humans. Even though the implication was death for those people. She was okay with it on the condition that we didn't spell it out, because, at worst, the death's were so fanciful, they certainly weren't imitatible. But she did want us to limit the number of deaths. So at one point she nixed the idea of blowing up yet another statue, but allowed us to blow up the shopping bags (and hand and arm) of one. This seemed less harsh to her. Of course, bloodthirsty lot that we were, we loved it. Because if you think about it, it was certainly more horrific come sunrise.

I finally saw the two statues that people thought were Brendan & Margot. Certainly, they looks like them a bit. But trust me. Two different people got destroyed. That woman was a brunette. And the guy was wearing a toupee.

At this point, Benny became as concerned as Goliath that Demona would shoot Elisa.

Then we segued into our flashback and Benny was still trying to figure out why Demona scratched Gillecomgain in the previous episode. Erin, meanwhile, wanted to know why Gille was wearing a mask.

Me, I'm still fascinated with Bodhe for some reason. I love how he talks big at first, until Mac makes it clear that he's not going to obey. Then he goes into pleading mode.

I also love the scene with Gruoch on Lunfanan Hill. Very heartbreaking and romantic. Did kinda make me wonder what would have happened if Macbeth had just said "Screw it!" and spirited Gruoch away with him. What would there lives have been like then?

The Weird Sisters are fun at the wedding. I like the line: "Certainly not our hero." It's one of those self-aware-tv-moments-that-ride-the-edge of which I'm so fond.

I also really like Duncan's scene with Macbeth after the wedding. He's such a manipulative bastard.

And now we begin to parallel similar scenes in City One. The Weird Sisters again go to Demona to get her to ally with Mac.

Demona: "Ally with a human. Never Again." Well, obviously Demona should never say never again, but in this context she's thinking about her alliance with the Captain and the tragedy that led to.

There's a nice little beat with Gruoch's rose. Gruoch seems cold to her new husband Gillecomgain. We wonder if we should feel some sympathy for a man who has married a woman who loves another. We wonder if he has feelings for her as he gently takes up the rose she was sniffing. But then he crushes it underfoot, so basically we feel okay about hating him again.

Erin asked: "Why'd he step on it?"

And I didn't want to answer, because the writers are trying to manipulate you.

Ben answererd for me: "Because he's a bad hunter." A much cleaner explanation, don't you agree?

Notice here that Mac is not yet the fighter that he someday will be.

Notice also if you watch all four parts of City of Stone together that Emma Samms who voiced Gruoch -- but had never done voice work before -- gets progressively better with every episode. She's somewhat stiff in City One. As with many live-action actors, she's unused to using her voice alone to project subtleties. She's a bit better here. But by City Four, she's rockin' the joint with some really powerful work. I can't remember when I've ever seen any performer push the learning curve that quickly. Most either get it or don't. A few of those who don't, slowly improve with practice. Emma just revved UP.

Did anyone else feel that we went to the well with that long drop from the Terrace at Castle Moray once or twice too often? Again, we were trying for parallelism, but I hope it didn't get boring.

Erin: "I like Macbeth when he was a little boy. I don't like him when he's a grown up." (I think she meant she liked the younger red-headed heroic Macbeth in general in these City flashbacks. Didn't like him as a present day villain in Enter Macbeth, etc. This actually pleases me a great deal. It's the ability to create sympathy in villains that separates Gargoyles from many of its rivals.)

I love that moment when Demona rips the mask off. Gille indicates his scars, "'Tis you're handiwork, remember?" And Demona honestly and simply answers "No." And he goes BERSERK! Bad enough she scratched him and altered the entire course of his life. But that the event was so insignificant to her that she doesn't even remember it...! Now THAT pisses him off.

Gillecomgain should have known: "Live by the drop, die by the drop." As he follows Findlaech's course to doom.

I also like the little moment o' connection between Mac, Gruoch and Demona. Demona actually says Thank You to a human.

And another wedding. Two in one episode. Bodhe introduces: "Lord and Lady Macbeth!" I wanted to get the designation 'Lady Macbeth' in here somewhere. Just to provide more obvious contrast between our version of Gruoch and Shakespeare's.

I also get a kick out of the chilling little scene back in the present with Brooklyn & Goliath. Brooklyn bringing up the "Massacre at Castle Wyvern". Fearing that Elisa could wind up a victim too. This sets Goliath off to the point where he is CLEARLY thinking that he needs to KILL Demona now. "Once and for all." And then those creepy little stone Weird Sisters. Yikes.

Then Xanatos has finally made it across town and is back in hero mode. He saves Owen. And shuts off the broadcast, clearly thinking that that will break the spell. At least, I hope that was clear. Honestly, I'm not sure if it was. I wanted the audience to think that would work. Then be surprised when it doesn't. Did that work for anyone?

The "Hunter" shows up. Demona at first recognizes only the mask. How many times must I destroy you?! she says. A hint to events in the past of both City and Hunter's Moon. But than when she sees him feeling her pain, she knows exactly who's behind that mask. I'm curious how many people picked up on that. This was the first time we showed them feeling each other's pain. The first time we had them in real proximity to each other.

Their fight is kinda cool. There's a neat moment when Macbeth is flying Demona like a kite. And he's very gutsy throughout, leaping after her. Of course, he's semi-suicidal, so it's no surprise he's fearless. But we don't know that yet.

And finally, our cliffhanger. X is so sanguine. "You want vengeance or a solution?" And we end on a surprising image: Goliath and Xanatos shaking hands. Now, it's like no big deal. They ended up teaming upfrequently. But I thought that then, it would be startling.

WHAT DID YOU ALL THINK?


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City of Stone Outline Notes

Since I just did my ramble on City of Stone, Part One, I thought I'd reprint the "memo" on that episode. Actually, it's a memo on all four episodes. My "NOTES ON OUTLINE" to Michael Reaves. Michael's story was a three-parter and we were still hoping to turn City of Stone into a home video, so I expanded it to a four parter.

Greg Weisman 7-12-94

NOTES ON OUTLINE for "City of Stone"
O.K. O.K. I changed a lot. (Less than you probably think, but a lot.) You gave me great raw material, but I wanted to focus it more. Also since you wrote the three-part outline, this movie thing came up. Gary's informed me that they can sell it better if it's more in the 75 - 80 minute range. That freed me up to add a little more material for clarity. If we don't use it as a video, we'll make it a 4-parter instead of three. If it turns out short, we can add the bit about "Birnam Wood coming to Dunsinane", which I've left out for now. We discussed some of the other changes at our lunch with Frank. But I'll reiterate them, and the reasons why, below.

General Notes...

Weird Sisters - The more I thought about this story, the more I came to believe that the Sisters were the key to cracking it open. Currently their role is limited, and yet they are the only characters who could see the whole picture. I definitely wanted to expand their role, particularly in the 20th century segments. But as I worked on achieving that goal, I realized that I wasn't clear on their motivation. I'd be happy to take you through all my thinking (there are probably two or three good story ideas in the stuff I rejected for the Sisters), so if you're ever curious, let me know. But cutting to the chase, here is what I wound up with...

Presentation: The three sisters (Phoebe, Seline and Luna) will always be depicted as triplets and female. The only physical distinction will be their hair color. Phoebe has golden hair, Seline has black hair, Luna has silver hair. (The same voice actress will play all three parts.) The three will rarely be seen apart. These will be the consistent visual (and aural) elements that will allow us to recognize them, because otherwise their appearance will vary from scene to scene, and sometimes within scenes. In the eleventh century, Macbeth sees them as old human crones, but Demona would see them as three old female gargoyles, even if they're both looking at them simultaneously. In the twentieth century, they might appear as three fashion model types in modern clothes. In our opening sequence Goliath will see them as three strange little nine year old girls. When speaking to others they present a united front. But personality-wise, particularly for conversations between themselves, I'd like to give them subtle differences. Phoebe is optimistic and cheerful. Seline is a cold realist. Luna is spiritual and distant.

Motivation: The sisters work hard to put Demona and Macbeth together in the eleventh century: to save them both, to hook them up and then to secretly add in the immortality thing. WHY? Obviously, they need these two for something. Something that isn't going to happen for centuries, or else why make them immortal. The obvious answer seemed to me to be the attack on Avalon. The sisters need powerful foot soldiers to attack Avalon for their master (probably a reworked Archmage [David Warner]). For a reason to be figured out later, the master won't be ready to attack until 1996. So the Sisters have time to plan ahead. They've decided that Macbeth and Demona would make the perfect foot soldiers. So they create immortal warriors who they then let walk around for a millennium. D & M become embittered and borderline nuts. Vulnerable to the Sisters machinations. Demona's "City of Stone" thing falls right into their hands. We have to assume that the Master is almost ready to attack Avalon. Time for the Sisters to take direct control of D & M. But over the millennium, D & M have become pretty savvy magically. It makes them more useful to the sisters but harder to control. The sisters help Goliath and Xanatos defeat Demona and Macbeth in this story so that they will be weak, defeated and vulnerable to the Sister's control.

Revelation: The cool thing is we don't have to reveal hardly any of the above in this story. In fact, we can almost present the exact opposite face. In the eleventh century sequences the Sisters will seem to really help the sympathetic Macbeth and largely sympathetic Demona defeat the nasty Gillecomgain and Duncan. In the 20th century sequences, they will help Goliath defeat Demona and Macbeth, and will again seem like three really useful ladies. There's no need to mention the master, the plan or Avalon. Our audience will think these three are great. Then if/when we get to do the Avalon story, we'll reveal the truth. The audience will hate them more cuz they'll feel as used and manipulated as Demona and Macbeth and Goliath, etc. were. The most we'll do is leave D & M under the Sisters' power at the end. We won't even hint at their malevolence.

Macbeth - Mac was great in the eleventh century stuff, but he and Xanatos seemed redundant in the present. I think we need to get clearer on his present motivation as well. Xanatos wants to save his city. I don't think Mac cares. Think of him as a nihilist. Past caring about anything. He wants Demona for the reasons we've already discussed. He's not interested in helping Manhattan. He's not part of the solution. He's a wild card who should in effect be part of the problem. We should see that immortality has done about the same to his disposition as it did to Demona's. He's honorable, but only up to a point. Reference his first appearance... he wouldn't attack the gargoyles as stone statues, but he had no compunction against kidnapping them to lure Demona to him. That's a fairly skewed definition of honor. Frankly, this yarn is more Macbeth's story than anyone's. We take him from youth to immortality. Through and beyond his entire natural lifespan. He's the one who learns something: Life is precious; vengeance and death accomplish nothing. Demona never learns this lesson. And Goliath really already new it. So we should emphasize the theme with Macbeth as much as possible. In many ways, he's carrying the emotional and thematic weight of our story.

Macbeth & Demona's Link - From 1040 on, neither can die unless both do simultaneously. If one kills the other, then both die. But if a third party tries to kill one without the other, then they both live. But there must be a penalty. I think they both feel each other's pain. (At least each other's physical pain.) We don't have to worry about cuts and scrapes, but any major blow that one feels, the other feels as well.

Reversing Demona's Spell - Since Mac won't be helping with a magical cure, I think we need another solution. (Kat Fair also pointed out that almost everyone would have their t.v.'s off and thus miss the counterspell.) I keep returning to the notion of a time limit to the spell that equates to "until Judgment Day". For our first spell, we had "until the castle rises above the clouds". From the Grimorum's point of view, that meant "until hell freezes over" or some equivalent. We can do the same thing here. Remember, Demona is getting this spell from a book that was written with no knowledge of modern science (let alone cartoon extrapalatory science). Heck it's in Latin. For example, "You will turn to stone at night until the seas boil and the skies burn." The solution to this is for Xanatos and Goliath to team up and find a way to make the seas boil and the skies burn, while simultaneously stopping Demona, saving the "statues" and dealing with Mac. That will focus their quest. It will also help give Xanatos something real to do. Only he has the technology to make the sky burn and the sea boil. I know you're concerned that this will be perceived by our audience as a cheat. We did the clever cheat once when we brought Goliath out of Demona's trance. But I see this as different. This equates with our original spell. The one that put our gargoyles to sleep for a thousand years. The solution was not a cheat. It took Xanatos' Herculean resources to match the spell's condition for reversal. The same can be true here. At first let's give the false impression that just by turning off Demona's broadcast, the spell will be reversed. Then when that fails, I'm gonna use the burning skies in what follows, but if you've got another idea for the spell's limit or reversal, that's cool. It's just a 'for instance'.

All them Scotsmen - A lot to keep track of. Let's simplify by focusing our villainy on Duncan & Gillecomgain. We won't ever see King Malcolm II. The nasty machiavellian thug Gillecomgain will work for the nasty machiavellian Prince Duncan, who later becomes the nasty machiavellian King Duncan. We will also introduce his young son Malcolm III, but we'll let him go by his alternate name Canmore so as not to confuse the audience. Canmore won't be evil, just misguided and righteous; he believes that Macbeth and Demona are evil. There are still a lot of characters, but subtracting Malcolm II will clean things up, I promise.

The Hunter - I've also added an element. The Mask of the Hunter. It belongs to Gillecomgain. After his death, Duncan takes it. After him, Canmore. In modern times, Macbeth will wear a modernized version of it. The identity of the Modern wearer will be a mystery to some of our audience until the end. Of course, anyone who saw "Enter Macbeth" will guess soon enough, but the Mask itself will carry frightening meaning -- the equivalent of a KKK hood -- and for those who guess it's Macbeth, the mystery will be why this Macbeth, who is so sympathetic in the past, would wear this horrible mask in the present. As we go through the eleventh century flashbacks chronologically, the conceit of the Hunter's mask will, I believe, help to focus our audience to differentiate between all the Scots, and even keep a few of them guessing as to the identity of the Modern Hunter.

Matt Bluestone - I definitely don't want Matt to have found out about the gargoyles in between the first and second seasons. He should be right where we left him. He knows they exist. He's seen them twice. But he doesn't know anything about them. And he certainly doesn't know that Elisa knows them. That's a great episode in and of itself. We don't want to toss it away in an off-hand line.

Flashbacks - I definitely want to intercut between the 10th/11th century sequences and the 20th century sequences. Without that intercutting, I'm afraid the two stories will seem largely unrelated. As often as possible, flashbacks should have a point of view: Demona's, Macbeth's or maybe the Weird Sisters', but they don't have to be presented to our other characters as stories unless that works in a given instance. Basically, we're using the same format that we used in "Long Way To Morning". Often the appearance of Demona, the Weird Sisters or the Mask of the Hunter will work as a convenient visual bridge between past and present.

Timeline - You may notice a few slight discrepancies here from the "Gargoyles Timeline" that you have. Here are the changes I made:
1. I placed Gillecomgain's birth at year @ 978 so that he would be @ 16 years old in 994 when he first meets Demona; @ 42 in 1020 when he kills Findlaech; and @ 54 in 1032 when he buys the farm.
2. I moved the wedding of Gillecomgain and Gruoch from 1030 (which was an approximate date anyway) to @ 1032, in order to compress events of that period into a more cohesive flashback.
3. Since I moved the wedding two years forward, I moved Luach's birth two years forward as well, from 1031 (another approximate date) to @ 1033. This makes Luach @ 7 years old in 1040 when his father becomes king; @ 24 in 1057 when he becomes king; @ 25 in 1058 when he is murdered.
You may want to note these changes on your timeline for future reference.

Demona - This yarn tells Demona's story. But she doesn't learn from it. We have to make sure that the audience is getting more than just a simple chronological depiction of her history. Since she doesn't learn the lessons of the past, we have to make doubly sure the audience does: Life is precious; vengeance and death accomplish nothing.

Goliath - Although this story belongs to our villains more than anyone, I think we need to thematically make it one of our leads as well. Goliath, obviously, gets the nod. Again, the theme is: Life is precious; vengeance and death accomplish nothing. If he forgets that, he will become like the villains he battles. "Every life is precious" applies to how he feels about all those human statues (particularly Elisa), but also -- and this is the key -- to how he feels about Demona, as well. Goliath has to work very hard to stop Demona, and then very, very hard to save her life. (Deep down, it may have something to do with her being the last female gargoyle that he knows about and/or their past relationship, but we can generalize to the notion of life's "preciousness".) The Weird Sisters can help reinforce this. (Of course, they're lying. They want Demona alive for their own personal use. But the message will sound right here.)

BEAT SHEET
1995
I. Hostage situation - Manhattan - Night.
A. ELISA & MATT outside.
B. LEAD TERRORIST inside says the cause means everything to her.
C. Our six Gargoyles take out terrorists.
1. GOLIATH approaches terrified Lead Terrorist.
a. Leader is willing to sacrifice her men to save herself.
b. Goliath is disgusted.
c. Leader flees and nearly gets herself killed.
d. Goliath saves her, almost despite himself.
D. Hostages are clearly more frightened of Gargoyles than terrorists.
1. Trio's frustration with ungrateful humans.
E. But three hostages approach Goliath.
1. We don't yet reveal that they are WEIRD SISTERS.
a. 3 nine-year old girls named PHOEBE, SELINE & LUNA.
b. Identical triplets except for hair color.
2. They are strangely unafraid of Goliath.
a. They comment on Lead Terrorist. Something like:
i. Seline: "The cause is everything until her own life
is threatened. But it's good you saved her."
ii. Phoebe: "If you forget what she has forgotten:
that every life is precious, you'll be no different
than she. "
iii. Goliath: "I'll never be like that terrorist."
iv. Luna: "We weren't talking about this terrorist."
3. Goliath looks at lead terrorist.
a. When he looks back, the Sisters have vanished.
b. This is strange. Who could they have been talking about?

II. DEMONA... wings through Manhattan skies - Night.
A. She clutches a torn piece of parchment.
B. Push in on her for flashback.

994
III. Wyvern Castle before the Massacre - Scotland - Night.
A. Repeat pp. 23-24 of 4319-001.
1. CAPTAIN & Demona try to convince Goliath to take all the
gargoyles to harry the Vikings away.
2. Instead Goliath assigns Demona to guard the castle with most of
the gargoyles.
3. Goliath leaves.
B. Demona & Captain discuss situation.
1. Original plan is blown.
a. HAKON would've attacked while gargoyles were away.
b. Gargoyles would have returned to human-free castle.
2. Captain reassures her that plan can still work.
a. He'll have Hakon attack during day.
b. Humans will still be dragged away.
3. Demona worries Gargoyles will be vulnerable.
a. Captain promises to protect them.
4. Demona agrees.

IV. Just before Sunrise - Wyvern. Demona is clearly antsy.
A. For a second she may consider revealing truth to PRE-COLDSTONE.
1. But she wimps out.
B. She takes off and hides in nearby woods or somewhere.
1. She turns to stone as the sun rises.

V. Smash Cut to sunset, she explodes out of her shell .
A. She rushes toward Castle which has clearly been sacked.
B. She sees dead gargoyle rubble.
C. She sees Goliath and HUDSON approach.
1. She can't face them and flees.
2. She's losing it. talking to herself.
a. She'll return later with some excuse.
b. He'll be so glad she's alive.

VI. She returns to castle and watches from a distance - Night.
A. Just in time to see Goliath in stone at night being placed on the castle.
1. Near the stone forms of Hudson, BROOKLYN, LEXINGTON,
BROADWAY & BRONX.
B. She watches KATHARINE, MAGUS, TOM and others leave.
1. They take wagon loads of Gargoyle eggs with them.
C. She takes off in opposite direction.

VII. Weeks later at a Scottish farmhouse, a starving Demona scavenges for food.
A. A sixteen year old boy [Gillecomgain] investigates the noise.
1. He holds a pitchfork, defensively.
B. Like a trapped animal, Demona slashes at him with her claws.
1. His face is hurt, but he falls back into the shadows, so we can't
see.
2. In the shadows, the boy's eyes glower at Demona accusatorily.
C. Demona flees, saying that'll teach those humans to betray us.

1995
VIII. Return to Present as Demona lands at Packmedia studio- Night.
A. XANATOS & OWEN are there.
1. All is ready. X had necessary equipment brought in & set up.
a. It can over-ride every broadcast channel in Manhattan.
i. Cable too.
B. She has the last stolen page from the Grimorum.
1. With it, she claims, she can steal time from other people.
a. This, she claims, is how she has remained immortal.
i. Stealing a little time at a time on a small scale.
C. By combining spell with broadcast technology...
1. They can steal one minute from the lives of everyone who watches broadcast.
2. She & X will share stolen time.
3. Given the number of people they'll reach, this'll keep them
young for a long while.
4. Spell will broadcast through the day
a. Culminate after sunset tomorrow.
i. Xanatos should return then.
D. Xan likes idea, but he's not without his suspicions.
1. Tells Owen to keep an eye on her.
2. Warns him not to simultaneously look AND listen to spellcast.
a. Xanatos leaves.
E. Demona videotapes spell.
1. Incantations; gestures; magical light show.
2. Owen listens but does not look.
a. He knows Latin and knows spell isn't what she claimed.
i. Don't tell audience what it is yet.
3. Owen puts up a good fight, but she takes him out.
a. She ties him up. Tapes his eyes open in front of monitor.
4. Puts tape in machine. Sets broadcast override. And leaves.

IX. Elisa's Apartment - Afternoon.
A. Elisa gets out of the shower and turns on t.v.
1. Remember, Elisa works the Nightwatch
a. She has slept thru the day's broadcast.
b. CAGNEY's present but ignores t.v.
2. Demona's tape plays spell over and over on t.v.
a. Elisa watches it, switching channels. But it's everywhere.
3. She plans on telling Gargoyles as soon as they wake up.
B. She heads for precinct.

X. Manhattan sidewalk - Afternoon.
A. Weird sisters watch Demona's broadcast in store window.
1. They appear to be three attractive NY fashion models.
2. A crowd of confused New Yorkers are also watching sets.
B. They discuss situation calmly.
1. Phoebe: "This is exciting. It's begins again."
2. Seline: "Concentrate, sister. Or it will all end here."
3. Luna: "There are no beginnings or endings."
a. "Remember -- it was only 975 years ago."
4. Or some such rot as they calmly walk away.
a. Tight on Demona's face on t.v. screen.

1020
XI. Dissolve to Demona's face, older, lined by time & hardship - Dunsinane,
Scotland - Night.
A. (She's biologically in her early 40's.)
B. Demona leads a small band of gargoyles in smash and grab.
1. She uses medieval human weapons.
C. Human soldiers curse gargoyles.
1. It won't be long before the "HUNTER" wipes them out.

XII. Demona & Co. return to their Cave on Lunfanan Hill - Night.
A. She makes sure that even the gargoyles who were too weak to
participate in the raid get food.
B. Establish that she's gathered last surviving gargoyles etc.
1. The Gargoyle-Hunter has hunted them to near extinction.
2. Demona keeps them alive by sheer force of will.
C. When another gargoyle suggests making peace with humans...
1. She takes him down brutally. (As she did with Owen above.)
2. She brooks no challenge to her authority.
D. Three old, female gargoyles (Weird Sisters) arrive.
1. Demona doesn't know them, but she has no reason to fear them.
2. Sisters have spotted the Hunter near Castle Moray.
3. Now's Demona's chance to get him.

XIII. FINDLAECH, High Steward of Moray, entertains at his castle - Night.
A. Also present is his fifteen year old son MACBETH.
1. There is a strong resemblance between father and son.
B. The guests are the beautiful young GRUOCH and BODHE, her Father .
1. Clear attraction between Gruoch & Macbeth.
C. Adults discuss Macbeth's cousin, PRINCE DUNCAN.
1. A flawed young man.
2. They have their doubts about his ability to someday rule.
3. But he is to be king someday. They are loyal.
D. Gruoch and her Father go up to bed.
1. Findlaech calls for servants to clean up dinner.
a. None answer his call.
E. The Hunter steps out of the shadows.
1. He wears a distinctive mask that completely covers his face.
a. Black with red claw marks painted across it.
b. Obviously, there are eye-holes, so he can see.
2. He attacks Findlaech. No explanation or reason.
a. There is a fight, but Findlaech is killed.
[Note: Adrienne is o.k. with this death. But not with the method depicted in the outline. It would be best if we could come up with some unique (and semi-fanciful) method of killing that we can use consistently throughout movie. Talk to me and/or her about this.]
F Upstairs, Gruoch hears the fighting and rushes to help.
1. Against her cowardly father's wishes.
G. Hunter goes to kill Macbeth when Demona arrives.
1. Fierce battle between Hunter and Demona.
2. At a crucial moment, Demona must choose between saving Mac and preventing the Hunter's escape.
3. Without thinking, she saves Mac, allowing Hunter to escape.
a. Perhaps Gruoch's concern for Mac touched some long buried feelings?
H. Mac & Gruoch are grateful, but Demona leaves, disgusted with herself.

XIV. 19 year old Prince Duncan paces the floors of Edinburgh Castle near dawn.
A. The Hunter enters by a secret door and is welcomed by Duncan.
1. Hunter removes mask.
2. His face has scars matching the painted claw marks of his mask.
a. We realize that this is the boy that Demona attacked in the
farmhouse, above.
3. He is identified as GILLECOMGAIN (age 42).
B. Gillecomgain reports that Findlaech is dead as ordered.
1. Though Mac lives.
C. Duncan is largely pleased.
1. Findlaech was popular.
2. With his support, Mac might have become King.
3. Without his father, Mac is just another poor relation.
D. As a reward, Duncan makes Gillecomgain the High Steward of Moray.
E. Duncan calls for a celebration.
1. Three serving wenches (the weird sisters) approach with a feast.
2. Tight in on Gillecomgain's discarded hunter's mask.

1995
XV. An unseen man watches Demona's broadcast, muted - late afternoon.
A. He puts on a modern version of the Hunter's mask.
1. (It has no visible eye-holes. It must use special one-way lenses).
B. This new HUNTER clicks off the t.v.
1. Note: This is MACBETH in his mansion, rebuilt since 4319-008.
a. He can be dressed in his modern battle armor and duster.
b. It's o.k. if many of our viewers realize it's him, we still
won't reveal it yet.

XVI. Elisa arrives at precinct house - just before sunset.
A. Precinct phones are ringing off the hook cuz of Demona.
1. Matt & MARIA CHAVEZ dealing with calls and complaints.
B. Elisa slips upstairs to be there when Gargoyles awaken.

XVII. Xanatos' castle near sunset.
A. He gets in his helicopter heading for Studio, with Derek at pilot.
1. Derek asks if Xanatos saw Gargoyle broadcast. (Derek saw it.) a. Xanatos made a point of skipping it.
B. Phone rings. It's Owen calling from Packmedia Studios at sunset. 1. Owen has just freed himself from his bonds.
2. Owen turns to stone before he can say anything too revealing.
C. Suddenly, the copter starts to drop.
1. Derek has turned to stone next to Xanatos.
2. Chopper's going down.

XVIII. At clock tower, the Gargoyles explode out of their shells and come to life.
A. They move inside, ignorant of the day's events.
B. Elisa's "statue" stands just inside of the clock face.

[If and/or when we divide into multiple parts, I think this is where part one ends.]

1. They don't realize the statue is Elisa.
2. They assume it's a statue of her.
a. Keep in mind that gargoyles (except Goliath) haven't seen
each other as stone, because they are always stone at the same time.
3. But how did statue get here?
4. Who else but Elisa would leave it?
5. Why would Elisa give them a statue of herself?
6. And why wouldn't she wait to see their reaction?
7. And if it wasn't her, who left this here and how and why? Etc.
C. Only Goliath has seen his friends as stone.
1. He doesn't necessarily state his fear. But he's uneasy.
2. He assigns Hudson and Bronx to guard the statue.
3. He and the trio will patrol the city, as usual.

XIX. Xanatos fights to save his life.
A. Pulls chopper out of dive and brings it in for rough landing.
1. Any landing you can walk away from, hmm, Derek?
2. Derek doesn't answer. At least he's unchipped.
B. Xanatos looks around him. Everywhere people are "stoned".
1. Obviously, Demona and he need to have a little talk.
2. Pulls a mega-weapon out of the first aid kit or whatever.
3. Heads off to PackMedia Studio on foot.

XX. Goliath & Trio patrol the night skies.
A. From a height, everything seems peaceful at first.
B. But eventually they discover the "stone" populace.
1. Maybe a single blind man & his seeing-eye dog are unaffected.
a. Brooklyn talks to blind man over the barking of dog.
i. Dog is freaked out by gargoyles, not "statuary".
ii. Man doesn't realize he's talking to gargoyles.
b. Gargoyles learn about broadcast from blind guy.
i. He heard it and was told about it, but didn't see it.
ii. Gargoyles figure out the truth (including Elisa).
iii. Brooklyn is furious at Demona as usual.
c. They tell the blind man he'd better stick close to home.
C. Goliath says they'll have to split up to find Demona.
1. Brooklyn will stay with him.
a. Goliath's afraid Brooklyn's a loose cannon.
2. As for Broadway and Lex...
a. He tells them to stop by clock tower.
i. Fill Hudson in.
ii. Send him and Bronx off as a third team.
b. Broadway worries about leaving Elisa unattended.
i. G: "She's as safe in the tower as anywhere."
c. The priority now is finding Demona.
i. Lex: "But How?"
ii. Goliath is afraid that, unfortunately, finding her
will be all too easy.

XXI. On Manhattan streets we follow a highly visible trail of rubble and destruction...
A. To Demona, who is having a grand old time with the "stoners".
1. Here she blasts one with a laser-cannon.
2. There she smashes one with a medieval mace.
3. She's practically giddy, talking to herself and the "stoners".
B. She remembers her appointment with Xanatos at the studio.
1. Can't let him turn off the broadcast.
2. She heads off with impunity in that direction, continuing the
destruction as she goes.

XXII. The New Hunter [Macbeth] is flying his hover-jet through NY's night
skies.
A. Demona's broadcast silently plays over and over on a small monitor.
B. A computer voice tells us that it is tracking the t.v. override signal.
C. Soon. He says. Soon. Fade into flashback.

1032
XXIII. Dunsinane, Near Moray -- The Original Hunter [Gillecomgain -- age 54,
but still as fit as any warrior] battles Demona (age 47).
A. It could go either way, but the sun is rising and she must flee.
B . Both swear to finish it later.

XXIV. At Castle Moray, Macbeth (age 27) and Gruoch's Father converse.
A. Mac can't believe that Bodhe is marrying his daughter off to
Gillecomgain.
1. He threatens to run away with Gruoch.
B. Bodhe protests.
1. Prince Duncan has ordered the marriage.
2. If they defy the Prince, it's equivalent to capital treason.
a. There'll be no safe place for them to run.
i. Which is fine for Macbeth, but think of my
daughter.

XXV. Mac & Gruoch rendezvous on Lunfanan hill as planned to run away.
A. But Mac is distant, unfeeling, unloving.
1. Tells Gruoch to marry Gillecomgain but won't give real reason.
a. Because he knows she would risk anything for him.
B. She's clearly devastated by his cold dismissiveness. (So's he.)

XXVI. The Wedding of Gillecomgain & Gruoch at Castle Moray.
A. Macbeth lurks in the back.
B. Prince Duncan (age 31) is there.
1. He's showing off his one year old son PRINCE CANMORE.
C. Maybe Gruoch's bridesmaids are the Weird Sisters.
D. After the ceremony, Duncan & Gillecomgain confab.
1. Duncan wants Gillecomgain to tie up the last loose end.
a. Kill my cousin Macbeth.
2. But Macbeth is Gille's insurance.
a. Mac's an heir to the crown and popular.
b. If Duncan gets out of line, Gill will reveal that Duncan
ordered Findlaech's death.
i. Which cousin will wind up King then?
3. Duncan is major league steamed.

XXVII. Macbeth is summoned to Prince Duncan at Edinburgh.
A. Baby Canmore plays nearby.
B. Duncan plays Mac like a lute.
1. He's just discovered something truly shocking and horrible.
2. He knows who the mysterious Hunter is...
a. The man who killed your father...
b. It's Gillecomgain.
3. Duncan laments that Gil fooled him completely.
4. Oh, if only Gillecom were gone, Duncan would:
a. Give Macbeth his rightful title: High Steward of Moray.
b. Give him Gruoch's hand in marriage.
5. But Duncan doesn't dare attack Gille openly.
a. It could start a civil war between Moray and rest of
Scotland. All would suffer.
6. Duncan shakes his head. What can be done?

XXVIII. At Moray, in a scene parallel to the death of Findlaech:
A. Macbeth steps out of the shadows to battle Gille.
B. Gruoch hears fight and comes downstairs.
C. Gill is ready to kill Gruoch to save himself.
1. He taunts paralyzed Mac.
2. He slips on the Hunter mask as final insult.
D. But Demona is here watching.
1. She had been tipped off by Weird Sisters again.
2. She didn't know which of them was the Hunter.
E. Tables turn. Mac rescues Gruoch while Dem fights Hunter.
1. Maybe in here, Gil reveals to her that he was the boy she scarred
for life.
F. Mac rescues Demona in some way.
G. Gille/Hunter buys the farm in some way.
1. Preferably by whatever method Gill used on Findlaech.
H. There is a brief moment of respect between Mac & Demona.
1. Then off she goes.

XXIX. Outside Castle Moray just after the wedding of Macbeth and Gruoch.
A. Prince Duncan puts on the Hunter's mask himself.
1. There will always be a Hunter, he says to his baby son.
a. The boy is attended by the Weird Sisters.
2. And there will always be the Hunted.

1995
XXX. Manhattan/Night. Goliath and Brooklyn come across Demona's trail of
human rubble.
A. Goliath and Brooklyn are devastated.
1. This reminds them of the massacre at Wyvern.
2. Goliath: "Every life is precious."
3. Brooklyn hates Demona. "This could be Elisa."
4. Goliath erupts. NEVER!!
5. Goliath swears to put an end to Demona's evil once and for all.
B. Suddenly, three stone figures begin to speak to Goliath without
transforming back from stone -- very spooky.
1. The Weird Sisters as speaking stone versions of the nine-year old
girls that Goliath met earlier.
2. They agree that Demona must be stopped.
3. But they remind him of his own words -- every life is precious.
a. Stop her, but don't become like her.
b. Vengeance begets nothing but a vicious cycle of further
vengeance.
4. They advise him to follow the trail of rubble.
5. Then they crumble into rubble themselves.
C. Goliath and Brooklyn follow trail of rubble.

XXXI. Xanatos & Demona arrive at PackMedia almost simultaneously.
A. Xanatos is determined to turn off broadcast.
B. Demona is determined to stop him.
C. Big fight. (Stone Owen at risk.)
D. The New Hunter [Macbeth arrives].
1. Just seeing that mask drives Demona to fury.
2. But she's not nuts, she flees.
3. Hunter fires off a cable attachment that wraps around her ankle.
4. As she flies off, he holds on by cable -- determined.
E. All this allows Xan to shut down broadcast.
1. He expects Owen to turn back to flesh.
2. Owen does not.

XXXII. In the skies above Manhattan, the Hunter tries to hold on and nail
Demona.
A. Big aerial sequence.
B. Ultimately, Demona shakes him (roughly) and flees.
1. Let's subtly indicate somewhere in here that when one is hurt
both feel pain.
C. He summons his hover-thing. He hasn't given up.

XXXIII. Goliath and Brooklyn arrive at PackMedia Studio.
A. They find Xanatos (and stone Owen) and evidence of battle.
B. Goliath is accusatory, but Xan disarms him by copping to his mistake.
1. "Do you want vengeance...or a solution?"
C. They declare a temporary truce and form an uneasy alliance.
1. They shake on it.

[And this is where Part II would end if and/or when it becomes a Multi-Parter.]

XXXIV. Morning at clock Tower. Elisa transforms back to flesh and blood.
A. Note: she does not explode out of stone shell. She transforms back.
1. Difference between Gargoyles organic process and her magical
one.
B. She has no idea what happened to her.
1. But "two seconds ago" it was sunset.
2. Now it's sunrise and the gargoyles have vanished.
3. Did she lose the entire night?
4. She exits clock tower.

XXXV. Back at the Studio, Owen has transformed to Flesh in front of Xanatos.
A. Xan starts to explain what happened to Owen.
1. But Owen's figured it out.
2. So Xan tells Owen about Gargoyle alliance.
a. Good. Owen suggests searching Grimorum for
counterspell.
b. No good. Even if there's one in there none of us "good
guys" knows how to use magic.
3. Xanatos asks Owen for the exact terms of spell.
a. Owen translates from Latin:
i. "You will turn to stone each night until the sky
catches fire."
4. Xanatos: "Then we'll just have to set the sky ablaze."
a. "Hurry. We've only got 12 hours."

XXXVI. TRAVIS MARSHALL reports.
A. People are panicked.
B. The mysterious broadcast has ceased.
C. But most everyone in the city, including this reporter, has no memory
of the past night.
D. He interviews hysterical woman who claims everyone turned to stone.
2. Incidentally, she missed the broadcast. Doesn't watch t.v.
a. Therefore, she must be crazy.
E. Experts theorize mass hypnosis?

XXXVII. New Hunter [Macbeth] watches report.
A. He can't believe Demona slipped through his grasp again.
B. Fade into flashback.

1040
XXXVIII. The royals hike leisurely up Lunfanan Hill on a gloomy, foggy
morning.
A. Duncan (age 39) is there. He is now High KING of Scotland.
1. With him is his son Prince Canmore (age 9).
B. Macbeth (age 35) is also there with his son LUACH (age 7).
C. All are trying to make nice.
D. Duncan nearly falls to his death. Macbeth saves him.
E. Duncan is more stunned at Mac's loyalty than grateful.
1. He tells Mac he had his doubts, but now he's convinced Mac's a
loyal subject.
F. Suddenly, they come upon cave of stone gargoyles including Demona.
G. Duncan goes to destroy them starting with Demona.
H. Macbeth intervenes; pleads for them.
1. Duncan reluctantly acquiesces.
a. Doesn't like it, but the guy did just save his life.
I. They start down the mountain.
J. They meet the Weird Sisters in their Old Crone Shakespearean guise.
1. "Double, double toil and trouble: Fire burn; and cauldron
bubble."
2. The Weird Sisters hail all four of them as Kings of Scotland.
3. Macbeth protests. Duncan is king.
a. Sisters: King now. But each of you shall be king in turn.
b. Mac: Certainly Prince Canmore, but not him & Luach...
c. Sisters: We have spoken.
K. The sisters vanish.
1. The two boys look at each other suspiciously.
2. Macbeth tries to write it off as nonsense.
3. Duncan (who's been quiet) agrees.
a. But we can see he's already plotting. Dissolve...

XXXIX Lunfanan again, later that day, with Duncan and some men.
A. Suspicious of Macbeth's relationship to the gargoyles.
B. He plans on attacking Macbeth with his army.
1. Doesn't want gargoyles to help Macbeth.
C. Hates to attack so near to sunset, but tomorrow he might not be able to
find them.
D. He puts on the Hunter's mask.
E. He gets up mountain in time to destroy maybe one or two gargoyles.
F. But the sun sets and Demona (age 51) and the others explode to life.
1. Still, all Demona can do is flee with her band.
2. She's getting old, weak.
a. Who will lead after she's gone?
b. If only there were some way to regain her strength and
youth.
i. She must seek the Weird Sisters.

XL. Castle Moray. Old Bodhe warns Macbeth that Duncan's bringing an
army.
A. Macbeth has his loyal retainers, but they can't defeat Duncan.
B. He can't protect his family.
C. Old Bodhe (cowardly as ever) suggests Mac surrender.
1. If he does, Duncan might spare Luach and the rest.
D. Macbeth agrees.
1. He says a cryptic "I love you" to wife and child and rides away.

XLI. Night in the misty wilderness. Lost, Macbeth and Demona stumble upon
each other.
A. Mac begs Demona to help him defend his family.
1. He promises to help her keep the gargoyles safe.
2. She's heard that before. What guarantee does she have?
B. Suddenly, the Weird Sisters appear from the mist.
1. We see that Mac sees them as Old Human Crones.
2. While Demona simultaneously sees them as Gargoyle crones.
C. Sisters suggest an act of good faith. Is there anything Demona wants?
1. Demona wants youth.
2. Would Mac be willing to trade?
3. Anything to save his family.
D. Sisters arrange trade. Magic light show, incantations and morphing.
1. Demona becomes the young Demona we are familiar with.
a. A permanent change from this point on.
2. Mac becomes the older Macbeth we are familiar with.
a. From this point on, he's permanently in his early fifties.
3. Any of our audience that speaks Latin will learn about the
immortality link.
E. Sisters send the new allies off with one last tidbit:
1. "Duncan gave Gillecomgain all his orders."

XLII. Bothgoanan, Scotland. Night. Mac's forces and Duncan's are ready to
battle.
A. Calm before storm. Gruoch and Luach are there.
1. She touches Mac's grey hair gently.
2. She's afraid he made a bad deal.
B. Demona enters tent. It is time.
C. Old Bodhe takes Gruoch and the boy behind the lines to safety.
D. Mac and Demona go to join there forces and face the enemy.

XLIII. The Battle of Bothgoanan. Night.
A. With the gargoyles help, Mac's forces are winning.
1. Mac calls admiringly to Demona: "You fight like a demon!"
B. Duncan is killed in some way. (Preferably the same way Find & Gil
bought it.)
1. Hunter's mask is found as evidence he was responsible for
Findlaech's death.
2. Macbeth is hailed as new High King of Scotland.
C. Prince Canmore is brought forward.
1. Old Bodhe urges the young boy's death.
2. Macbeth refuses. He will banish the boy.
a. Send him to stay with relatives in England.
b. No one notices that Canmore steals the Hunter's mask.

XLIV. The coronation of Macbeth at Scone. Night.
A. Demona, Luach, Gruoch and Old Bodhe are all there and happy.
B. Macbeth makes Demona his primary advisor.
1. He promises a golden age in human/gargoyle relations.
2. He promises that the humans will learn to respect her.
a. She'd rather be feared.
b. Mac: "They'll do that too... 'Demona'"
i. She likes her new name.
3. The happy golden age begins.
a. Everyone cheers. Humans and gargoyles alike.
b. The Weird Sisters, disguised as serving women, smile.

1995
XLV. Precinct, late afternoon. The Weird Sisters, disguised as cops, help out cheerfully amid the panic.
A. Elisa confers with Matt and Maria.
1. FCC has tracked down source of Broadcast.
a. Packmedia Studios show signs of conflict, but no hard
leads.
b. But Elisa knows who owns Packmedia.
i. But she's not saying anything 'til she knows the
extent of gargoyles involvement.

XLVI. In the Great Hall of Xanatos' Castle before sunrise, Owen and Xanatos (in
his armor sans helmet for the time being) are hard at work.
A. They are outfitting all of the Steel Clan robots with special packs.
1. Including Xanatos' own armor.
2. They have extra packs for the gargoyles who should arrive just
after sunset.
3. The audience doesn't yet know what the packs are for.
4. There's a lot of other temporary equipment set up, as well.
B. Elisa arrives ready to blame Xanatos for everything.
1. Owen: "Mr. Xanatos is trying to fix things. What are you
doing to help?!"
C. Before she can answer, the sun goes down.
1. Owen and Elisa turn to stone.
2. X: "That's one way to settle an argument."
D. All six of our gargoyles arrive.
1. Hudson & Broadway carry Bronx between them.
E. Xanatos explains plan.
1. Steel Clan Robots, Gargoyles and Xan will fly in pre-arranged pattern over the island of Manhattan.
2. They will carry packs that will distribute a harmless gas.
3. At a pre-set time, the packs will explode, igniting gas.
a. A time-counter on the computer screen indicates the time
before detonation.
b. Obviously, by that time, Xanatos & gargoyles must be out
of the upper atmosphere and clear of their packs.
c. Xanatos' robots will be sacrificed to ignite gas.
4. For ten seconds the entire sky will appear to be on fire.
5. Hopefully that will break the spell.
F. Sometime during all this, Bronx starts clawing at a tapestry.
1. Xanatos tells Brooklyn it's worth a hundred grand.
2. Brooklyn shoos Bronx away.
3. A distracted Goliath sees none of this.
4. Make sure this isn't too obvious a foreshadowing.
5. Let's loose track of Bronx after this for awhile.
G. Everything's ready. Xanatos puts on his helmet.
1. Goliath approaches Elisa. This has to work.
H. Steel Clan, Xanatos, Hudson, Trio and Goliath take off with packs.
1. Keep Bronx out of sight and out of mind for now.

XLVII. Steel Clan, Xanatos and gargoyles criss-cross the night sky distributing
the gas.

XLVIII. Back in Great Hall, a panel slides open behind Tapestry.
A. Demona steps out.
1. There are secrets about castle that even Xanatos doesn't know.
2. She can use computer set up to spoil Xanatos' plans.
3. But first she's gonna have some fun.
a. She approaches Elisa's stone form with her mace.
b. Didn't know this meddling human was still alive.
i. That can be rectified.

[And this ends part 3, if and/or when we go to four parts.]

B. Bronx intervenes between Demona and stone Elisa.
C. Demona temporarily backs off. She talks in a soothing voice, but:
1. She approaches computer terminal.
2. She reprograms gas-packs to explode early.
a. The computer screen time counter skips ahead quickly.
b. Xanatos & Gargoyles will die in explosion.
i. Intercut to Xan, gargs and robots in sky.
c. Not enough gas will be released to ignite the sky.
d. Then she'll use her laser-cannon to blow away Bronx,
Owen and especially Elisa.
e. Then there'll be no one left to stop her.
D. "What about me?", The Modern Hunter [Macbeth] steps out of the
shadows.
1. In a frozen city, it wasn't hard to spot all those robots and
gargoyles taking off from the world's tallest building.
2. He decided to investigate and found exactly who he was looking
for.
E. But Demona has already reprogrammed the computer access code.
1. It's too late to save the gargoyles and the city.
a. She presses a last button, locking out access to the
computer.
b. The time counter returns to a normal pace.
c. But a lot of time has been shaved off the countdown
before the pre-mature explosion of the gas-packs.
2. The Hunter doesn't care about any of that.
3. He just wants it over between them.

1057
XLIX. At Dunsinane, the Hunter [Canmore -- age 26] leads English soldiers.
A. He is met by Demona leading a combined platoon of gargoyles and
human Scottish soldiers.
B. It's maybe a minor victory for the Hunter; more of a stalemate, really.
C. Demona leaves to inform Macbeth.
1. Demona's still confident that together, she and Mac can put
these English down & destroy the accursed Hunter for good.
a. We get sense that Mac's golden age has been working.
b. We've never seen Demona so happy and at peace with
herself.

L. Castle Moray. Macbeth confers with Old Bodhe and Luach (now age 24).
A. Macbeth wants to know why Bodhe wanted to meet without Demona.
B. Bodhe explains that the Hunter has convinced the English that Mac is
evil because Mac associates with gargoyles.
1. English got rid of their gargoyles long ago.
C. If Mac gets rid of the gargoyles, the Hunter will lose his English
support.
D. Luach can't believe his father is listening to this crap.
1. Luach's about to leave to fetch reinforcements.
2. They haven't lost. There's no need to betray their gargoyle
friends.
E. But Macbeth says a wise king must consider all his options and then
make the correct choice.
1. He doesn't let us in on his choice.
F. And he doesn't realize that Demona has heard the whole thing.
1. She's sure Mac is going to betray the gargoyles.

LI. Demona approaches the Hunter in his camp.
A. She promises to keep her gargoyles out of his battle against Mac if the
Hunter will promise them protection.
B. He agrees.

LII. At Castle Moray, the Hunter launches his attack.
A. Macbeth is suddenly informed that the gargoyles are missing.
1. He's based his defense strategy on their aid.
a. The gargoyles were supposed to help hold off the English.
b. Long enough for Luach to launch a surprise counter-
attack with reinforcements from behind.
B. The battle is lost before Luach can arrive.
C. Gruoch begs Mac to flee with her, and he reluctantly does.
1. They take a pre-arranged escape route.

LIII. But on Lunfanan Hill, The Hunter is waiting for Mac & Gru with Demona.
A. Hunter takes off his mask, revealing himself as Canmore.
1. He is here to avenge his father Duncan and take back what he
considers to be his rightful crown.
B. Macbeth is stunned at Demona's betrayal.
1. But she knows Mac was planning to betray her first.
2. He furiously denies it, and while they fight...
C. Canmore kills Macbeth.
1. Demona doubles over with pain and seems to die as well.
2. As Gruoch cries over her husband...
3. Canmore confirms his belief that Demona & Mac were linked by
sorcery.
a. If one dies, both die.
b. Well, Canmore says, she betrayed Macbeth.
c. She ultimately would have betrayed me as well.
d. So it's a good thing I had all her gargoyles secretly
destroyed.
e. Hers was an unholy race and didn't deserve to live.
D. An Englishman alerts Canmore that Luach has arrived with Scottish
reinforcements.
1. He performs the better part of valor and retreats for now.
E. Luach and Old Bodhe arrive and find Gruoch crying over Macbeth.
1. The horrible sight makes Luach more determined than ever to
stop the English.
2. Even Bodhe's courage finally seems to awaken inside him.
a. He takes Macbeth's crown and gives it to Luach.
b. Luach is the new High King of Scotland.
c. Together, they will fight the English to the last man.
3. Gruoch asks for some time alone. Her father and son depart.
F. Weird Sisters appear in their Old Crone guise.
1. They approach Demona.
a. "The pain is great, child."
b. "But you are unharmed."
c. "Waken to the fate you've made for yourself."
2. Demona stirs.
a. Gruoch, still furious at Demona's betrayal.
i. She tells Demona that Canmore betrayed her.
ii. "Your people are gone, monster."
iii. "You are the last of your duplicitous race."
iv. Or something like that.
3. Demona flies off alone.
G. Weird Sisters now approach Macbeth.
1. For Canmore got it wrong.
a. He said when one dies, both die.
b. "But when one lives, both live."
c. And they vanish into the mist.
2. And then Macbeth stirs.
3. Far from being pleased, Gruoch is frightened.
a. Is it him or his ghost?
4. Macbeth assures her that he is alive.
a. Macbeth wants to join Luach in battle.
b. But Gruoch says no.
i. If he returns now, he undermines Luach.
ii. The English already accuse Mac of sorcery.
iii. This will be the final proof.
iv. It would divide even the most loyal of Scotsmen.
v. Luach & Scotland's only hope is for Mac to remain
dead.
c. Macbeth: But I'm not dead.
d. Gruoch: Then you must disappear.
i. Leave Scotland forever. It is the only way.
5. They share one last kiss, and she departs out of his life forever.

1995
LIV. Back in Great Hall, Demona & Hunter [Macbeth] in stand-off.
A. A confused Bronx looks on. All he knows to do is guard Elisa.
B. Hunter has sought Demona across the centuries for his vengeance.
C. She is unimpressed.
1. Take off that stupid mask. She knows he's Macbeth.
a. He takes it off.
D. Nearby, the counter continues to count off the time until the pre-
mature explosions of the gas-packs.

LV. In the skies above Manhattan, Xanatos & Goliath fly abreast for a moment
as they "pass gas".
A. Xanatos says it's working. Now if that dog of yours leaves my tapestry
alone.
B. Goliath quickly figures out the truth.
C. He and Xanatos head back for the castle.

LVI. Back at the Great Hall, Macbeth holds up the Hunter's Mask.
A. He only wore it as a reminder of her betrayal.
1. She says, "Let's not start that old argument. It's pointless."
2. Besides, what's he gonna do. To kill her, he must die as well.
B. Macbeth has lived so long he no longer fears death.
1. And, indicating "stoners", he has no desire to live in the kind of
world her evil is creating.
2. He'll do what he has to do to get his revenge.
C. They fight.
D. Xanatos & Goliath arrive just as a stray laser cannon blast takes out a
huge piece of the floor.
1. Goliath is just in time to catch Elisa and keep her from falling
down the hole to smash on the lower floors.
E. Macbeth & Demona largely ignore the new-comers.
1. They tumble down to the floor below.
F. Xanatos checks the computer.
1. She's locked him out by changing access code.
2. And pack's are set to go off pre-maturely.
3. We need to save her to save the others and the city.
G. Goliath orders Bronx to guard Elisa.
1. He and Xanatos follow the fight down.

LVII. On a lower dungeon-esque floor of the castle, Xanatos & Goliath catch up
with Demona & Macbeth.
A. Demona & Macbeth are in a berserker rage.
B. Xanatos & Goliath try to just separate them -- no luck.
C. So they wade in to incapacitate them.
D. The battle takes them down again onto a lower floor.

LVIII. The quartet of combatants fall down from the lowest floor of the castle
into the Arboretum beneath it.
A. Goliath & Xanatos use teamwork to come through the drop all right. 1. Demona and Mac hit harder, down through trees, etc.
2. G&X take advantage of this to take them out.
3. Demona is knocked out.
4. Macbeth nearly so, by her injury.
B. But the injured Mac grabs Demona and prepares to do away with her...
1. (And thus himself.)
C. Goliath: "Killing her won't solve anything."
D. "He's right, Macbeth." This from the Weird Sisters.
1. They step out from among trees as NY fashion model types.
a. Though we see that Macbeth sees them as the Crones.
2. They question Macbeth:
a. Duncan was afraid that your father would make you king.
Did your father's death stop you from becoming
king?
i. Mac: "No!"
b. You wanted revenge for your father. Did Gillecomgain's death settle that score?
i. Mac: "No."
c. Did your own "death" save Luach from Canmore?
i. Mac: "...no..."
ii. And the last 'no' breaks his heart.
3. Goliath pipes in. "Death is never the answer."
a. "Life is. Precious, precious life."
4. Macbeth: "I'm just so tired."
5. Sisters: "Then sleep."
6. Macbeth drifts off.
E. Xanatos doesn't know what the hell is going on.
1. He just knows he needs the access code.
2. Intercut timer and trio flying around at risk.
F. Seline wakens Demona, who is groggy, as if in a trance.
1. Phoebe asks Demona for the code.
2. Demona answers like she's talking in her sleep.
a. But she still refuses.
i. She will have vengeance for the betrayal of her
people. Vengeance for her pain.
3. Sisters: "But who betrayed her people? Who caused this pain?"
a. The Vikings destroyed her clan.
i. Who betrayed castle Wyvern to the Vikings?
b. The Hunter exterminated every gargoyle he found.
i. Who created the Hunter?
c. Canmore killed the last of her race.
i. Who betrayed Macbeth to Canmore?
4. Goliath: Your thirst for vengeance created nothing but more
sorrow.
a. End the cycle. Give us the code.
5. She does.
6. Armed with it, Xanatos shoots up through the hole in the roof.

LIX. Xanatos enters through the hole in the floor of the Great Hall.
A. He enters the access code into computer and stops clock with seconds
to spare. Whew.
B. Bronx looks on without a clue.

LX. Back in Arboretum, Demona begins to shake off her trance.
A. Her denial's kicked in. It was the humans' fault, not hers.
1. She wants her revenge.
2. She's learned nothing.
B. Sadly, the Weird Sisters (nine year old girl version) tell her she's tired.
1. She falls back into a trance beside Macbeth.
C. Goliath wonders what to do with Demona & Macbeth.
1. Sisters feel responsible for them.
2. They will take Demona and Macbeth and try to help them.
3. Goliath asks who or what the sisters are?
a. But that's a story for another day.
D. The three sisters vanish along with Macbeth and Demona.

LXI. Hudson & Trio fly over the river and drop their empty gas packs.
A. They head back for the castle.

LXII. Goliath joins Xanatos in Great Hall. It's time.

LXIII. In the skies over Manhattan, the Steel Clan Robots and their packs
explode.
A. The sky is ignited and for ten seconds is aflame for as far as the eye can
see.

LXIV. In the outer courtyard, Xanatos and Goliath watch the flaming sky.
A. Hudson and the trio land beside them.
B. A moment of true awe for everyone.
C. Bronx howls from back inside the Great Hall.
1. They rush inside.

LXV. Xanatos and the gargoyles arrive back in the Great Hall, in time to see the
stone melt away from Elisa and Owen.
A. Goliath is so happy he lifts Elisa up into the air.
1. She laughs. She doesn't have a clue what's going on.
B. Owen and Xanatos shake hands calmly.
1. Owen knows exactly what's going on and is pleased it worked.
C. Xanatos approaches Goliath just before the good guys are about to
leave.
1. They made a pretty good team.
2. All this time Xanatos has been wondering why he allowed the
gargoyles to live.
3. Now, he knows.
4. Occasionally, they come in handy.
D. Goliath starts to get angry, but then admits that occasionally...
1. Xanatos comes in handy, as well.

LXVI. The Gargoyles fly away from the castle.
A. Goliath carries Elisa. Broadway carries Bronx.
B. Everywhere below them are the signs and sounds that Manhattan is
waking up from it's stone sleep.
1. Safe once more, thanks to the gargoyles.

THE END.

That's it. Finally. As ususal, if you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask. Sorry it took so long to get this to you. A few last reminders: just write the script as one piece; ignore the part designations for now. Also, do not be afraid to over-explain things. Be as clear as possible. We do not yet know for sure where this is being story-boarded. With all the time shifts and differing ages in different scenes it could confuse anyone. Also don't assume familiarity with previous episodes. Don't hesitate to cite specific references to page or episode numbers of past scripts. Good luck.


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Chapter XXII: "City of Stone, Part One"

Time to Ramble on "City of Stone, Part One", which I watched the other night with my family....

Story Editor: Michael Reaves
Story: Michael Reaves
Teleplay: Brynne Chandler Reaves & Lydia Marano

Well, over a year had passed since we had revealed in "Enter Macbeth" that Macbeth had named Demona. Now we were gearing up to explain that little tidbit of info. I'm curious to know how many people were still focused on that before the "PREVIOUSLY ON GARGOYLES..." reprised it.

City of Stone was a story I had conceived originally (but briefly) as a Direct to Video movie. My boss Gary Krisel rejected it. He felt that a movie featuring the Gargoyles needed to feature our heroes a LOT MORE than this story did. Nevertheless, he liked the concept of the HUNTER a lot. So I got him to agree to let us do City of Stone as a multi-parter for the series. And I promised that Michael and I would come up with a new Hunter story that focused more on our heroes. Thus Hunter's Moon was born -- as a Home Video, originally, and we had an ending to shoot at for the entire second season.

Meanwhile, I couldn't actually disagree with Gary too much. This was Demona and Macbeth's story. The origin of two of our major villains. We had some great animation on this from Koko in Korea. Not as strong as our WDTVJapan stuff, but still very good.

What was the terrorists' cause, you might ask? I'm not telling. At the time, I had no answer. We were vague on purpose. Since then, I've come up with an answer. Now I'm being evasive on purpose.

I love Matt as a hostage negotiator.

But not as much as I love Brendan & Margot as hostages. They're a hoot.

How fast was everyone on the uptake with the Weird Sisters? Those three little girls. Even before the gargs showed, one was saying something like: "Don't worry, it'll be over soon." Did you think they were odd then? Did you notice them?

I like Brooklyn's "Don't gush" line.

When the Weird Sisters tell Goliath they weren't talking about THAT terrorist, my six year old daughter Erin said: "I think they were talking about Demona." For Chanukah, I gave Erin a Kenner Brooklyn, Broadway and Hard-Wire Goliath (which I told her was a Goliath robot). My three year old son Benny got Goliath, Lex and Xanatos. So for the first time, while they watched they could play with the toys.

It's interesting to watch the first flashback SET. All sorts of old footage from Awakening Part One, mixed with new footage. It's all very seemless thanks to great editing by Bob Birchard. And it wasn't easy. Because there was considerable confusion overseas throughout City of Stone, in terms of which model of Demona to animate. We had her standard model. Plus one that was slightly older, for the second set of flashbacks in this episode. They were constantly mixing the models up. We'd call retakes whenever we could, but sometimes we decided just to make due. So you have the flashback from Awakenings, where Goliath tells Demona to stay behind. That's followed by us finally seeing what Demona and the Captain said to each other after Goliath left. No great revelation in that scene, but we figured it would be nice to finally reveal it. Plus we wanted to clarify things from Demona's point of view. But in some of those shots, Demona appears to have aged a bit.

We see Othello & Desdemona. We are allowed to do something in this episode that we couldn't really do for S&P reasons in Awakening. To personalize the victims of the massacre a bit. In Awakening, we only got to meet the survivors. Finally we meet the victims. Of course, we're still cheating a bit, since my excuse to S&P was that our audience already knew (1) that these two died and that (2) they survived in a sense in Coldstone. But it did, independent of previous episodes, allow the startling moment when Demona picks up a fragment of Othello's face. Of course, I tried to get tha fragment -- and all those fragments in the immediate vicinity -- to be the pieces that survived into Coldstone. I think that was semi-successful.

Demona's cowardice overwhelms the courage of her strongly held convictions. She flees. Benny: "The sun's gonna come up." Yep. She turns to stone, shedding a tear. That "TEARS OF STONE" image was so effective that I allowed it to repeat in the episode. Later, her tear drops onto the stone Goliath and seems to be coming from his eye. A nice visual variation on a theme.

Demona: "It worked! At last my clan is free of human rule!"
Erin: "No. It didn't work."

Later Erin sees Demona watching Goliath holding some smashed gargoyles' remains and crying "my angel of the night". Erin says: "He thinks that was her [Demona]." Now you may be wondering why I'm reprinting such obvious responses here. But they interest me. It really struck me this viewing that in this episode, despite the "Previously" segment and all the flashbacks, that you really would be lost if you were a new viewer. Is there anyone out there for whom City of Stone was your first Gargoyle experience? If so, I'd love to hear from you. Did you have a clue as to what was going on?

Demona's classic neurotic short-circuit: "What have I -- What have THEY done to you?" The motivation that writer's live for.

And a little hint of Avalon things to come, as we see Tom, Princess K and Magus depart with the eggs. How many people had given the eggs any thought since Xanatos told the gargs back in Awakening Two that they were the last of their kind? And did this little tidbit whet the appetite, or did you forget about it immediately? I was already planning the Avalon/Archmage/World Tour/Angela stuff.

Benny (out of nowhere) asks: "What happens if someone is frozen in the sky?" We discussed various possibilities. But we're still weeks away from getting around to seeing "The Price". So I didn't want to spoil that one for him.

The intro of Gillecomgain. Erin (who has seen these before once, long ago) suddenly remembers: "His face is gonna get scratched."

Now, back in the 20th century, Owen points out that Xanatos' tv override works for "Cable, as well." I always liked that.

I also like Demona's VERY convincing lie. At this point, we don't know how she's survived through the centuries. Maybe she did do it by stealing minutes of life from thousands of people. And maybe now, she and Xanatos will do the same on a citywide scale. I always thought it was a very elegant lie. What did you guys think? Did you buy it?

The "Watch or Listen but not both" stuff regarding the magic, wasn't just a convenient excuse to give us a Robbins expository scene later. I always felt that the magic our various sorcerors did couldn't be as simple as it seemed. Anyone who reads the spell out loud can do it? No. There are complex inflections, movements, etc. involved. Study and willpower, etc. This was an attempt on my part to demonstrate that it was about more than just being in range with someone who has a copy of a Grimorum page.

On the other hand, I do think we cheated a bit to trap Owen. That spell she reads is the City of Stone spell. Yet it seems to put Owen, of all people, into a trance. We talked about her nailing him some other way first. But it was too clumsy and time consuming, so we just cheated.

Gathering Clue: Demona to Owen: "You are the tricky one." And she wraps him up in iron cable.

Elisa's watching Casablanca. Great movie.

Phoebe is looking at Seline when she speaks to Luna. Like Demona aging, we had a hell of a time getting the overseas studio to keep the three sisters straight. I began to insist that each of their appearances on the storyboard was accompanied by a hair color chart. And once more, it's black for Seline, blonde for Phoebe and silver for Luna.

We also made a real effort to put subtle character distinctions between the three sisters. Seline is the hard case. Phoebe is the gentle one. Luna is the mystic. It was part of hinting that the Sisters would serve multiple purposes in the series. Some of which I still have not revealed.

Back to the past. The guard says "Maybe they won't come." Erin asks: "Maybe who won't come?" And then the gargoyles come. The guards are taken down, and Demona raises her mace into the air. Erin asks: "Are they dead?" And dad... equivocates.

I like that gargoyle (Demona's second) with the breast plate. John Rhys-Davies did his voice.

At this stage, Demona believes that these scattered gargoyles are all that are left in the world. A second later, three gargoyles she's never met show up. (Now, true, they're the Sisters. But I was trying to make a general point, hinting that sometimes characters make absolute statements when they flat out don't know what they're talking about. Audience members beware.)

Benny immediately figured out that the three old gargoyle females were the weird sisters, or as he put it: "They're the humans. The one's that disappeared." I.e. the kids that disappeared in the first sequence of the episode. That made me feel a little better. People are always telling me that I write stuff that is too adult for kids to get. I tell them that I try to write on multiple levels. So that the kids get what they need to get and that adults, etc. get more. But it's nice to get confirmation that the kids do get it on occasion. Particularly in an ep as complicated as this one.

Intro Findlaech, Gruoch, Bodhe and young Macbeth. I like how quickly they are all characterized in that scene. F is loyal. B is equivocal at best. Bodhe is already thinking about how to marry G off to advantage. "What about Macbeth? Is he a match for the lass?" Yeah, sure he's talking about chess. I came to have a great deal of contempt for the character of Bodhe. (Too be fair, I have no idea what the historical Bodhe's character was like.) And yet, almost simultaneously, I became fond of him too. He was SO human. SO flawed. SO afraid of the world. And yet SO desperate to tread water in it.

We also establish the "SIGIL OF MORAY" which will become an important prop throughout.

I like that little blushing moment of G & Mac's. But mostly, I like it because of B & F's reactions. Bodhe is suddenly nervous that Gruoch might, shall we say, lose something with Macbeth prematurely. Though he pushed them together, he now rushes to separate them. But it's too late. The connection has already been made. F just laughs.

Now... Enter the HUNTER. The Hunter got a sort of Steve Canyon intro. That is, he's been talked about by various people for the last few minutes, though we haven't gotten a look at him. (This was the technique used when Steve Canyon was first introduced in the comic strips.) Now he shows up, and I trust he isn't disappointing. Benny immediately says: "THat's the one that got scratched." Sharp boy. (Keep in mind, that we haven't yet seen the adult Gille, so we haven't seen his scarred face yet.)

I love this sequence. It's a great fight, full of great little touches, flourishes, etc. Great storyboarding work here.

Again, characters are revealed in a nutshell. Gruoch's already loyal. Bodhe's revealed to be a coward. Even when his daughter rushes downstairs, he stays above.

Findlaech dies. It's a classic Disney fall-to-one's-death death. But there is a difference. F is the good guy. Usually, that's done with the villain. Was anyone shocked?

I love how at this point, Macbeth is nothing but an annoyance to both Demona and the Hunter. I also love how complex Demona is. Under it all, she's really something of a romantic. She rescues the young lovers. Then can't believe she did it. She's trying to will herself to be cold. So that she won't feel anything. But it isn't natural. She's not a cold woman, though her plans often are. It's that divide that's generally gonna screw her up everytime.

When the Hunter first enters on Prince Duncan, we were supposed to (BRIEFLY) think he was there to attack the Prince as well. But I don't think that comes off even slightly.

And o.k., yes, Gillecomgain has a face to match the Hunter's mask. It's worse than Clark Kent and those glasses. Does Scotland really not know it's him? Believe it or not, that never even occured to me initially. (Yes, I'm a dope.) Now, I'll chalk it up to the notion that everyone figures he's TOO obvious a suspect. You can almost here the water cooler talk:

MacMorris: "Hey, MacTavish, have you ever noticed that that Gillecomgain guy has scars across his face just like the red marks on the Hunter's mask?"
MacTavish: "What are you saying, MacMorris? That Gillecomgain is so stupid, he'd wear a mask and then put his scars ON the mask? Not much of a disguise. Know what I think. I think the Hunter is trying to throw suspicion onto old Gilley."
MacMorris: "Oh, give me a break."
MacTavish: "Hey, pal, it worked with you."

I made a real effort to just have the Weird Sisters EVERYWHERE.

Back to the present. Someone dons a Hunter's Mask. How many knew it was Macbeth right away? I figured at the time that regular viewers would figure that out pretty darn quick. That didn't bother me. For them, I figured the mystery would be "WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD MACBETH DON A HUNTER'S MASK, WHEN THE HUNTER KILLED HIS FATHER?" I thought that mystery was at least as intriguing. Do you guys agree or disagree?

I also liked the variation on the mask. No eyes. Nothing. Modern technology.

Fox. Fox presented an interesting dilemma. What was Xanatos' attitude toward her in this? We already know he loves her. But he doesn't include her in the immortality thing with Demona. Why? Demona won't allow it? Or he thinks Demona won't? Or he doesn't fully trust D and won't risk Fox until he knows the set-up works?

And then he finds out that she did watch the broadcast. He had told her not to, but she did. He doesn't fill her in. (Not that there's much time.) Is he prepared to let her lose a minute from her life (as he believes has happened)? How would he have felt if Demona wasn't lying about that? At the end of her life, would an immortal Xanatos be desperate to give her that one minute back? Of course, given Fox's heritage, which I didn't know yet, it's possible, she'll outlive him by quite a bit. Course, anything's possible.

How's the cliff-hanger? We haven't seen the city yet, but we do get to see Owen, Fox and Elisa all turned to stone. We're so used to the Gargoyles in stone, but not humans. I thought it was sort of chilling. The more chilling, because we know from earlier in this very episode, what can happen when living beings are turned to stone. (The Wyvern Massacre.) Now we've seen this four-parter a bunch of times and we're used to it. But I'm curious as to how you all felt the first time you saw Part One.

Another interesting aspect, is that 3/4 of the threat is to characters that we consider to be villains. Or more than 3/4. In the past, young Macbeth has lost his father and is clearly at risk. And Demona is being hunted. In the present, Fox and Owen are stone. And Xanatos and Fox appear to be falling to their deaths. Sure, the clincher is Elisa. But I think it's a tribute to how well-rounded are villains are that we care what's going to happen to them. Can you imagine most cartoons making the death of the villains a cliff-hanger? People would simply cheer.

One little flaw: Elisa's facing the wrong way. It was easier to board that way, I'm sure. But I can't figure out why she would have been standing and facing that direction at sundown.

Comments welcome, as usual...


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Baal writes...

Have you ever planned out the way Demona and Macbeth meet
their demise, or do they just continue living for years and years? Have you even planned that far...?

Greg responds...

Yes, I know.

I've planned many things VERY far out. Some of these things are random. Other things, I don't yet have a clue about.

Response recorded on January 02, 2001

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matt writes...

would Macbeth ever reconsider Arthur's invitation to be one of his knights?

Greg responds...

Not on an ongoing basis, but when needed, certainly.

Response recorded on December 22, 2000

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Heather N. Allen writes...

Salutations! (hmm, I ALWAYS think of "Charlotte's Web" whenever I see that...)

Anyway, just wanted to share a little testimony with you and all the kiddies out there about NOT doing your research:

See, I am a major Gargoyles fan (well, that's a given). And right now, in my senior lit class, we are reading Shakespeare's "Macbeth". Well, of course I thought I was going to be all smart and show everyone up with my (so I thought) vast knowledge on everyone's favorite immortal Scotsman. Now mind you, I didn't think the REAL Macbeth was still alive running around chasing after gargoyles and ancient swords (I'm not THAT dense!), but I basically thought he was a not-so-bad guy who was king somewhere in Scotland's history. Needless to say I was shocked to find that the play's Macbeth is (in a way) truly villainous! The play's Lady Macbeth is fiendish, as well! And the play's Duncan is a hapless, good-intentioned king who was unjustly murdered! And to think, if I had raised my hand to explain Macbeth to the class just a few minutes sooner, I'd have been made a fool of in front of my peers! (Well, Greg, at least now I understand better than most what you meant when you said the Gargs Universe Macbeth would be amused by the Shakespearean version of himself...)

The moral of our story--you've got library cards, kids: USE THEM. And if you don't, then at least keep quiet until AFTER the introduction to the story is over when YOUR lit class starts reading Shakespeare.

~H\A~
(who DID finish her abandoned "A Midsummer Night's Dream" due to Gargoyles ;)

Greg responds...

Heather,

Do keep in mind that aside from the gargoyles, immortality and magic, that our Macbeth was in fact more historically accurate than Shakespeare's. (I'm not saying better, by any means, just truer to history as we know it.)

Response recorded on December 21, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

In "The Journey", Banquo and Fleance are portrayed as working for Castaway, who is really Jon Canmore in disguise. Was this intended as a bit of irony, in light of the fact that they'd earlier worked for Macbeth, who was an enemy of the Canmores' ancestors Duncan and Canmore?

Greg responds...

A bit.

Response recorded on November 15, 2000

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matt writes...

if demona had succeded in destroying humanity in hunters moon 3 wouldn't she die as soon as she became human and was no longer under the protection of the praying gargoyle? also wouldn't that spell have killed macbeth and thus she would died or does the power of the praying gargoyle supersede the wierd sisters spell? im a huge fan thanks for a great show!!!!

Greg responds...

Hey, Matt. Check the Demona and/or Macbeth archives. I'm tired of answering that one.

Response recorded on November 02, 2000

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Ed writes...

Has Macbeth had many (any?) other aliases besides Lennox Macduff? Has he 'been' any person that we'd recognise?

Greg responds...

1. Yes. (Lennox Macbeth, for example, is the name on his French passport.)

2. Maybe.

Response recorded on October 19, 2000

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Gengar! writes...

what happened to macbeth's mother

Greg responds...

She died.

Response recorded on September 25, 2000

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Anonymous writes...

Macbeth Q's:

1. Has or will Macbeth fallen in love with anyone other than Gruoch or "Dominique"?
1a. Has he married anyone other than Gruoch or "Dominique"?
2a. Did he have any other children besides Luach?

2. The prefix 'Mac' means son, right? *Grins & Chuckles* Think his mom's name is Elizabeth?

Greg responds...

1. Maybe. But not often.

1a. Maybe. But not often.

2a. Maybe. But not many.

2. His mom's name, I believe, is Doada or Donada. And although Mac means son. His name is not MacBeth, which would mean the son of Beth. Rather, his name is Macbeth MacFindlaech. Meaning Macbeth son of Findlaech. The word "Macbeth" is probably, historically an Anglicazation of Maelbeatha.

Response recorded on September 02, 2000

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Ithica writes...

When do you think Demona and Macbeth became fully aware that neither could die without killing the other? Right after Canmore stabbed Macbeth? Later?

Also, Macbeth is quite clearly (at least at one point) a suicidal character. Did he ever try to just kill himself? If so, did he not know he had to kill Demona to do it, or just hoped it would work?

Greg responds...

Right after each got up after "dying".

Mac knows the rules.

Response recorded on September 02, 2000

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Kelly L Creighton/Kya White Sapphire writes...

OH and greg, hate to tell ya, but you know how you keep telling people to "check the archives" for the demona/macbeth dieing from virus/statue etc..? its not there. i dont know if its in the HUGE archives, but i read the demona archive and the macbeth archive. its not there. unless gore deleted it just as i went to go look for it. not that im asking that question, but i thought id let you know :)

Greg responds...

So check the BIG ARCHIVES. I know I've answered it many, many, many times.

The short answer is it depends on what was going on in Demona's head. (And frankly, the short answer should be enough in this case.)

Response recorded on August 23, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

Before Gillecomgain's murder of Findlaech in 1020, had he carried out other assassinations with human (as opposed to gargoyle) victims? I ask this because of Findlaech's line, "You are the Hunter... but who sent you to hunt me?", which suggests that the Hunter had gained a reputation for that sort of thing.

Greg responds...

Probably.

Bodhe's son (Gruoch's brother) MacBodhe died somewhere in there. But I don't have my references here at home, so I can't remember when in the chronology MacBodhe's murder occured.

But perhaps it explains a little bit about Bodhe's behaviour.

Response recorded on August 22, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

There was a discussion in the comment room last week on the original plans that you and Michael Reaves drew up for the Gargoyles live-action movie (which were rejected), and one element of it got a particularly interesting bit of attention that I thought that I'd ask you about. You mentioned that in the movie plans, Macbeth would be the lord of Castle Wyvern back in the medieval period, before Goliath and the other gargs were placed in their stone sleep.

The question that got raised was whether it would have been that advisable to introduce Macbeth into the movie in such a role. Unlike the bulk of the other major characters in the series (certainly the ones whom you mentioned in your plans for the story), Macbeth exists outside of "Gargoyles" as a very well-known Shakespearean figure. This raised, therefore, the question as to whether his appearance in the movie in the role that you and Reaves had planned for him might have been a bit distracting, on account of his literary connotations. Of course, we don't know as yet if you and Reaves ever managed to get to that part before your idea for the movie was rejected, but I thought that I'd ask you about it anyway.

Greg responds...

I think his NAME value would have been worth something. And it would have -- in success -- set us up to use him further down the line.

Response recorded on August 22, 2000

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Charles writes...

just reading your lighthouse ramble

I was myself surprsied, and continue to be, at the same moment your daughter was, being the scene where Macbeth says he will test Merlin's magic on Broadway. It felt out of character. Even disregarding what we were to later know of him, up to this point he doesn't seem to be the same type of ruthless villain as Demona or Xanatos. He has already gained that grey shading of character and it is hard to get a handle on his exact motives, but it felt to me he was already established to be very interested in concepts of honor and wouldn't stoop to such actions as using a sentient being as a lab rat, especially after he'd given his word. It's not honorable.

After later episodes and more background is given on him, his behavior in this episode just feels even more out of character. It becomes established that he is a man of deep honor, and while he doesn't act altruistically, like the gargoyles, he doesn't act nefariously either. He acts in his own best interests, but within limits. His saying he'd test Merlin's magic on Broadway is teh equivalent of Xanatos about to test the Cauldron of Life on Hudson, but this just doesn't feel right in my understanding of Macbeth. Such an action is a depth I don't see him willing to take, no matter what his ends are.

I'm also reading your memo and getting uncomfortable about the term "villain" being used in regards to Macbeth as a description and as an explanation for his motives and actions in this episode. I guess it was always my own personal taste and regard for the character that I never once saw him in that light; I always saw him as distinguishly neutral.

I can understand when you say this type of confusion is exactly what you wanted, but sometimes I don't see it as much a story type of confusion, where we just don't know him yet and are trying to figure this guy out, but more as a consistency confusion, where his character in other places is inconsistent with his character here.

Just a few of my ideas. And I love being able to get this much discussion and difference of opinion out of a t.v. show.
Here's hoping to seeing you in Orlando.
8-)

Greg responds...

The fact that Macbeth said it doesn't mean he'd have actually gone through with it. But he might have. I think you underestimate how far the guy had fallen. He didn't start to climb out of his hole of depression until Sanctuary at least...

I don't think he's inconsistent here. This is only his second appearance, and he's been fairly nasty up to this point. The fact that we see touches of something better doesn't forgive or make impossible the nastiness. He is a bit of a hypocrite, after all. And I think you're basing your assumption on what you'd like him to be, based on the total picture of him, rather than on how he behaved in his first two appearances.

But that's just my opinion.

Response recorded on August 21, 2000

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Anonymous writes...

I just found out that the real Grouch was related to Kenneth III. So wouldn't her relationship with MacBeth be classified as incestous?

Greg responds...

Related how? As distant cousins? Look, if it didn't concern them, I'm not going to let it concern me.

Response recorded on August 21, 2000

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Vazmento writes...

First let me say that you are ressponible for an extremely well produced series of which I am a die hard fan.

I have some questions about Macbeth.
1: Besides the three episodes of "Avalon" did Macbeth ever meet Boudicca?
2: How (primarily) did Macbeth make his fortune?
3: How long was Macbeth employed as a security guard at the prison where Xanatos was held?
4: I know Demona is a socceress, but shouldn't Macbeth have been more wary about entering into a spell with the Weird Sisters?
5: How long was it before Macbeth decided to track down Demona and end his life?

Greg responds...

First, thanks.

1. Not that I can recall.

2. Holdings that matured. Primarily.

3. He wasn't.

4. He was desperate.

5. Centuries.

Response recorded on August 19, 2000

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Demona (repost by Aris) writes...

Hi, Greg! I have a quick question for you -- why did Avalon send Demona and MacBeth to Paris? Goliath, Angela, Elisa, and Bronx were sent to Paris because of Demona and MacBeth. So, why were Demona and MacBeth there? Thanks!! :)

Greg responds...

Thailog. And a need for them to confront each other one more time.

Response recorded on August 01, 2000

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Moby the Mariner writes...

It's always seemed to me that Macbeth earlier apearences were much more villanious than his later ones. Clearly the Macbeth who cares not whether the Scrolls of Merlin were burned is very differet from the one who willingly knelt before Arthur. He's certinlly extreamly different from the Macbeth who defended the Gargoyles on national television.

I'm curious, did you always plan for Macbeth's character to become more grey as the series went on, or was this a choice you made after learning some of the real Macbeth's history?

Greg responds...

I always intend for nearly every character to become more grey as the series progresses.

But keep in mind, that Macbeth DID end up caring whether or not the scrolls were burnt, as soon as Broadway pointed out why they were worth saving. He was always pretty grey. Except perhaps in his very first appearance, where he was more mysterious than evil. He had an agenda. We just didn't know what it was back then.

Still, as time passed, after revealing about him what we did, it was hard not to view him in a more sympathetic light. So much so, that people were suprised he was even playing a vaguely villainous role in Pendragon.

Response recorded on July 30, 2000

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Charles writes...

me again. I was just reading the archives again and a question about demona and macbeth's immortalkity, and what they could survive through. You said that neither character was too eager to test the limits of their immoratlity by saying cutting off their own head or such. I would think this is something Macbeth actually would've done. Now, maybe I misread it or read into it too much, and please correct me, but I thought one of Macbeth's main motivations in "Enter Macbeth" and "City of Stone" was to kill Demona so that he could finally die as well. Almost suicidal. part of my reason for saying this, which is maybe where i read into the episode too much, was in City of Stone at the ending when he just confesses, so tragically in my opinion and I really loved that part, that he was just so tired. I read it as he was just so tired of being alive and living with his heartache of seeing all his loved ones die and tired of this vendetta against Demona. He was tired of being alive and wanted to rejoin his lost loved ones. Am I reading too much into it, and if I am, would you explain how you interpret his actions and motivations?

Greg responds...

I think he was suicidal. But I don't think he was prepared to fully admit that to himself. Macbeth was raised to believe suicide is sinful. etc, etc.

Response recorded on July 30, 2000

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tk writes...

My question today is if Demona and Macbeth can only die by hands of each others hand or so, What would happen if say Macbeth committed suicide not that he really would.
Thanks thats all for now,
Bye!

Greg responds...

It wouldn't work.

Response recorded on July 26, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

I've recently read a book on Shakespeare's famous "history play" cycle (the eight history plays from "Richard II" to "Richard III" about the Wars of the Roses) called "Shakespeare's Kings" by John Julius Norwich, which focused on the relations of Shakespeare's cycle to actual English history. And that inspired a fresh question on my part.

In your vision of the Gargoyles Universe, did any of the immortal characters (Demona, Macbeth, Puck, etc.) get involved in any way in this period of English history that Shakespeare was drawing on for his cycle, from Richard II's deposition in 1399 to Richard III's death at Bosworth in 1485? (We know, of course, where Demona was in 1495, ten years after Bosworth, and that it wasn't in England).

Greg responds...

I doubt Demona was around. Maybe in France during the Joan of Arc years. Macbeth might have been around. Or in and out of the country at least.

Puck -- well, I'd have to think about that.

Anyway, as you can see, I haven't really given it any thought.

Is it disappointing when I admit that I don't literally know everything yet?

If so, just imagine that it's a message from the Gargoyle Universe that hasn't come to me (ala Coleridge) in a dream yet.

Response recorded on July 26, 2000

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LSZ writes...

1) Do Banquo and Fleance know Macbeth is THE Macbeth?
2) If so, did Macbeth tell them or did they find out some other way?
3) If Macbeth told them, why did he?
4) How do they feel about him being the real Macbeth?

Greg responds...

1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. They knew too much. It was either that or kill them.
4. He pays them well. Nothing else much matters to them.

Response recorded on July 24, 2000

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Cave writes...

why do civilians like macbeth and xanatos have laser weapons while the police force is using automatics and slugs?

Greg responds...

Macbeth largely uses Electro-Magnetic technology, but I get your point. Both these guys are extremely rich and have the time and money to invest in the development of hi-tech experimental weapons.

And generally speaking, aren't cops always a step behind technologically? (That's not meant as a criticism, just as a reality check.)

Response recorded on July 24, 2000

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Chapter XVII: "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time"

Written by Brynne Chandler Reaves & Lydia C. Marano
Story Edited by Michael Reaves

Well, I watched "Lighthouse" again last night with my family. First thing I noticed was the bad "Previously" recap. This is all my fault. The recap features Macbeth, because I wanted to make sure the audience knew who he was. But that blows out the first act surprise reveal that he's behind it all. Up to that point in the story, you'd be thinking Xanatos. But because of the dopey recap, you know it MUST be Mac. Later in the season, after I got hammered over these recaps by the folks on the Disney Afternoon e-Mailing list, I learned never to put anything into the recap that wasn't revealed in the first five minutes of the show to follow. But here's a perfect example of me screwing up my own mystery.

We introduce archeologists Lydia Duane and Arthur Morwood-Smythe. Dr. Duane was named after writers Lydia Marano and Diane Duane. Professor Morwood-Smythe was named after writers Arthur Byron Cover and Peter Morwood. Arthur is Lydia's husband. Peter is Diane's husband. I don't know anyone named Smythe.

Macbeth episodes, at least up to this point, seem to be cursed with mediocre animation. (Of course, everything's relative. Mediocre on Gargs was still better than most series got. But relative to our expectations, this ep is pretty weak.) I bet Elisa would have really looked cute in that red baseball hat if the animation had been even slightly better.

I don't know how clear it is in the prologue. The idea there, was that the wind was blowing through the lyre. The haunting sound drew the archeologists further into the cave. They read the warning which indicates that the seeker of knowledge has nothing to fear, the destroyer everything. They are supposed to hesitate, look at each other, decide that they are seekers not destroyers and then open the chest. Merlin's clearly put a safety spell of some kind on the chest. An image of the old man appears and basically checks to confirm whether the archeologists are in fact seekers or destroyers. Satisfied, the spell disipates. But you can imagine what would have happened if a Hakon type had stumbled in.

Anyway, it never felt like all that came across. Did it?

Brooklyn (re: Broadway): "Ignorance is bliss." In High School, I had a classmate named Howard Bliss. We had chemistry together with Mr. Miller. Mr. Miller once asked the class a question that we all should have known. No one knew the answer, and our own idiocy generated laughter among Miller's students. He just shook his head and said: "Ignorance is bliss." He forgot that he had a student named Bliss. It generated more laughter. I don't know why I told you that. But it's what I thought about when Brooklyn read that line.

There's a semi-heavy-handed "Read More About It" feel to the clock tower conversation regarding Merlin. Goliath practically quotes those public service announcements, saying there are many books about him in the library. I don't mind. I had wanted to cite a few actual books -- like Mary Stewart's THE CRYSTAL CAVE -- but our legal department wouldn't give us clearance for that. Very short-sighted.

A connection is made between Merlin and the Magus. This was not an accident, as at that time, I had planned to have the Magus journey with Arthur on his Pendragon quests to find Excalibur and Merlin. I later changed my mind. But the Magus does at least play a Merlin-esque roll in the Avalon three parter.

I always wonder who was playing in "Celebrity Hockey" that night.

Macbeth's standard Electro-Magnetic weapon was my idea. I didn't design it exactly, but I did make crude little drawings of something that looked vaguely like a staple gun, with two electrodes that generated the charge. I was always proud of that weapon. It was uniquely Macbeth's (and Banquo and Fleances'). Set him apart from all the concussion, laser and particle beam weapons we used elsewhere. (I did the same kind of thing on the Quarymen's hammers.)

It's fun to listen to B.J. Ward voice both sides of the confrontation between Fleance and Duane.

Banquo's model sheet showed him squinting out of one eye. Some episodes, not so much this one, but some took that to mean he only had one eye. So he walks around looking like Popeye for the entire episode. (His big lantern jaw helps accentuate that.) There are a couple of Popeye moments in this ep. But more in his next appearance I think.

It was my idea to just have Mac's mansion rebuilt without explanation. I don't exactly regret it, but it's kinda cheap. We burned it way down. He has it rebuilt. It makes sense. But we usually dealt with consequences more than that.

When he rebuilds it, he installs those cannons. They were supposed to be giant-sized versions of the hand-held E-M guns. But they don't come off that way. Instead they fire at the gargoyles. And mostly seem to destroy the various turrets of Macbeth's own place. Ugghh.

As in "Leader" we get another scene of Goliath and friends confronting Owen at the castle. Looking for Xanatos, when in fact Xanatos isn't the threat. It made sense in both episodes. And it's always nice to showcase Owen a bit. But after two of those in four episodes, I wasn't gonna do that again. (At least not until KINGDOM.)

I love the "Macbeth Theme" that Carl Johnson created for the villain, which is featured at the end of ACT ONE.

Macbeth opens the "second scroll" and starts to read Merlin's seal. This caused tons of fan confusion, as he read "Sealed by my own [i.e. Merlin's] hand". No one seemed to get that he was reading that. They thought Mac was saying that he [i.e. Macbeth] had sealed the scroll. Of course that notion renders the whole thing confusing as hell. But it never occured to us that anyone would take it that way.

We also introduce Jeffrey Robbins and Gilly in this episode. Gilly is of course short for Gilgamesh, one of the legendary characters that Robbins once wrote about. It's just a bit odd, because Gilly is a female.

Robbins is a very cool character. Wish we had had the opportunity to use him more.

I like how when Robbins and Hudson are introducing themselves, Robbins gives his first and last name. Hudson says, I'm Hudson, "like the river". An echo of how he got the name. And a reminder that names aren't natural to him. Even if they are addictive.

John Rhys-Davies is just fantastic as Macbeth. I love his speech to Broadway. It accomplishes everything we needed it too. That line about the "human heart" by the way is a reference to the Arthur/Lance/Gwen triangle.

I also love his line: "I'm Old, but not THAT Old." This was a little hint to what we'd reveal in CITY OF STONE. Sure Macbeth's from the eleventh century, but not the fifth or sixth. It's like someone saying to someone my age, "So what did you do during World War II?"

Lennox Macduff. That was a cool touch. Also a hint as to how Macbeth feels about Shakespeare.

I like the Phone Book scene too. Hudson says "Hmm. Magic Book." Robbins replies: "Aren't they all." Great stuff.

By the way, as Robbins goes through the phone book, scanning names, he passes "Macduff, Cameron". One of my college roommates was Cameron Douglas, who was really interested in his Scotish heritage. That was a mini-tribute to him.

My daughter Erin reacts to the fact that Macbeth threatens to use Merlin's spells on Broadway. She points out that Macbeth had promised to let Broadway go after he had the scrolls. She's surprised he hasn't kept his word. My wife at that point reminds Erin that Macbeth is the villain. Erin gets that. But you can tell it isn't quite sitting right with her.

Later when Macbeth DOES let everyone go without a struggle, Erin is clearly not sure what to make of him.

And on one level, that's exactly as we wanted it. Macbeth is a troubled guy -- a hero who's devolved into a villain. A suicidal villain on top of that, though we hadn't revealed that yet. But he is a villain. Later, it's debatable, but here he's taken to being an ends-justify-the-means kinda guy. And even his ends are hazy at best.

I love Broadway's "precious magic" speech. It's so wierd hearing poetry from the big galoot. But that's so Broadway. The soul of a poet. Bill Faggerbakke was a huge help.

And I love Robbins "They are lighthouses in the dark sea of time..." speech. I love that it's not exactly the title. Brynne and Lydia did fine work on this one.

I wonder what happened to that lyre?


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Abigail Thorne writes...

How did Goliath and the others learn that Demona and Macbeth can only be killed if one kills the other? Demona told Brooklyn in "Temptation" how she had been dealing with humans for hundreds of years, and Macbeth told Goliath in "Enter Macbeth" how he had named Demona, which she herself said in "Awakening Part 5" happened long ago. So I get how they could figure out both were immortal, but how exactly did they figure out the terms of the spell?

And another thing--if they knew that only Macbeth could kill Demona and vice versa, how come they thought Macbeth died in the crash in "The Price" and Demona died in the fire in "The Reckoning'?

Greg responds...

From the Weird Sisters, after they were captured -- but before they were released -- in "Avalon, Part Three".

"The Price" took place before "Avalon". And they never said she was dead in "The Reckoning". Goliath simply acknowledged that he wasn't sure. I mean how many questions have I had to answer here about the rules of the whole Macbeth/Demona thing. If you all have some doubts about how that spell works, don't you think Goliath and Angela might also.

Response recorded on July 10, 2000

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Vashkoda writes...

Hello again. These questions are about King Arthur. 1) Would he still be alive by 2158? 2) Would Arthur ever be recognized by world leaders as being the actual "King Arthur"? 3) Would Arthur ever rule Britain again? (he's supposed to be the once and future king, right?) 4) Would he ever rule anything? 4) Will he have an heir? 5) You previously mentioned that McBeth wouldn't "inherit" Excalibur from Arthur. Would McBeth ever even own Excalibur? 6) What's the largest number (rough estimate) of knights that you picture Arthur having, from the time he was awakened until he dies? 7) About how many of those knights do you think might be gargoyles? 8) Do you picture Griff staying at Arthur's side until death claims one of them?

(please forgive the obvious "monstly" typo in my previous post. I would really appreciate an answer to those questions)

Greg responds...

1. Maybe.

2. By some. Not all.

3. Once and Future King of something, all right.

4. That would be telling.

5. He might hold it once or twice.

6. I'm not good with numbers. (It's amazing I can count to fourteen over and over again.)

7. See 6.

8. Yep.

Response recorded on July 07, 2000

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LSZ writes...

Wealth:

1) Who has more money, Macbeth or Xanatos?
2) How much money do the Canmores have?
3) Just how much did the Pack profit financially from their tv show?

Greg responds...

1. From a liquid standpoint, Xanatos. Macbeth may have some extremely valuable items, that would be worth a fortune if he was willing to part with them, but he's largely not...

2. An extremely large trust.

3. Quite a bit. But not as much as Xanatos did.

Response recorded on July 03, 2000

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LSZ writes...

Did Macbeth ever encounter any Gargoyles besides Demona in the centuries between his first 'death' and his first encounter with Goliath's clan in the 20th century?

Greg responds...

maybe... maybe not....

Response recorded on June 30, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

A sort of "ramble-reply" to "Long Way Till Morning".

I'll have to confess that the only part of my "first time I saw it" response to this episode that I now remember (other than my delight at another medieval sequence - the 984 scenes in this case) was that I initially believed that Prince Malcolm would actually succumb to the Archmage's poisoned dart, and that this was how he'd died. (It was obvious that he must have died at some point before the 994 events in "Awakening", naturally, since Katharine's ruling Wyvern by then). So the fact that, in the succeeding flashbacks in this episode after the initial one, he does live in the end, surprised me.

I certainly agree with you on the Katharine-and-Malcolm scenes; I'd also felt on my own before reading that ramble that Malcolm was unwittingly planting the seeds of bigotry in his daughter when he used the gargoyles as a means of frightening her to be good. (Kind of reminds me of something I'd read once in either "Dear Abby" or "Ann Landers" about a policeman protesting the way that a few parents use police as "bogeymen" to scare their children into being good similarly). Indeed, Prince Malcolm's judgement really does come across in this episode as a bit on the poor side beyond Katharine; he's overly confident about the Archmage no longer being a threat, while Hudson correctly recognizes that the sorcerer could return for revenge - and indeed, the Archmage does.

Demona's ambitious streak in the 984 scene reminds me a bit of Lady Macbeth similarly urging Macbeth to dispose of Duncan in Shakespeare's play - which, when you stop to think over her future, is rather appropriate. (Indeed, in "Sanctuary", Demona actually becomes "Lady Macbeth" in a literal sense - and if you ask me, she fits the Shakespearean character far better than Gruoch ever did).

I must admit that I've always had a certain fondness for Hudson, and he certainly comes across as a sympathetic figure here. One can't help but admire his dogged persistence in keeping Goliath safe from Demona in the present day. He may think of himself as all washed up, but he still does his duty in protecting Goliath against a very determined adversary.

Two scenes I particularly like in this episode, both near the end: the sight of Demona slowly approaching through the graveyard in the distance, and the bit where she emerges from behind the stone angel - both positively creepy.

Greg responds...

This was a great story, I thought.

And I agree with your Demona/Lady Macbeth assessment. A lot of that was intentional.

Response recorded on June 29, 2000

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Kevy Kakes writes...

In the episode 'Future Tense,' Demona is killed by Cyber-Xanatos, didn't Goliath know something was up then? Because clearly Xanatos is not MacBeth, and therefore cannot kill Demona...Puck knew Demona was immortal because of 'The Mirror,' did Puck just kinda forget, or was he not worried about the details of his little scheme. Just a little somethin' somethin' to ponder and answer for us, or just me

Greg responds...

I think that Goliath's head was fairly well turned upside down by all that had happened up to that point.

As for Puck, what in "The Mirror" gives you the impression that Puck/Owen knows about the Demona/Macbeth connection?

Response recorded on June 29, 2000

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Bengali writes...

1.What happened to Grouchs mother?

Greg responds...

She died.

Response recorded on June 23, 2000

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Bengali writes...

1.What happened to Macbeths mother?

Greg responds...

She died.

Response recorded on June 23, 2000

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Bengali writes...

1.What is Demonas opinion of Bodhe?

Greg responds...

I'm sure she hates the sniveling coward.

Response recorded on June 23, 2000

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Bengali writes...

1.What is Demonas opinion of Gruoch?

Greg responds...

1. I think they kept their distance from each other, generally. No animosity. But I don't see them as friendly. Of course, after it went bad, they hated each other.

Response recorded on June 23, 2000

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Bengali writes...

1.What is Demonas opinion of Luoch?, after all, he was a major supporter of her clan and was outraged when Bodhe suggested that Macbeth betray Demonas clan.

Greg responds...

I think she liked him during those 17 golden years. Or at any rate, liked him well enough. Probably wouldn't admit it, but liked him.

After it all went bad, I think he became just another human to her. But by then she was fleeing Scotland. And he didn't have long for the world.

Response recorded on June 23, 2000

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Faieq Ali writes...

In Huter's moon part three, Demona was going to cast a spell which would wipe out all life except gargoyles. But wouldn't she kill herself because, she would have killed Macbeth and she would have perished as well or would Macbeth be the only human alive? Would Demona's disease or plague have reached the shores of Avalon and killed tom and the Princess?

Greg responds...

Both these points are debatable. I've answered the first one before. (Check the archives for a fuller answer.) It would depend on her mindset. It's possible her survival would have kept Macbeth alive.

I think it's unlikely that it would have hit Avalon.

Response recorded on June 21, 2000


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