Jimmy_Q writes...

Now there's a HUGE difference between 994 Scotland and 1994 U.S. Wouldn't the differences in vocabulary, word usage, etc. between these times and places reflect that? If Goliath learned to read and write in 994 Scotland then how was it that he awoke in Manhattan seemingly capable of reading and comprehending modern day American literature? Did he somehow work on his literacy skills outside the series or what? I figured that, as the ultimate all-knowing diety of the gargoyle universe, you would know this.

Jessica Cotten writes...

Hey Greg,

Well, either I can't find my answered questions(there are a lot)or I just asked them in a way that wasn't appropriate. Oh well. Anyway, if you ever get to do gargoyles again would you use Timedancer or would you maybe use a different idea if a better one surfaced? Timedancer is good, but I wouldn't put Brooklyn with someone so different. Maybe, but then again; you are the one writing the shows not me.

Since I can't find my questions. Could you e-mail me at Alexlyons3@hotmail.com

Punchinello writes...

Hello Mr. Weisman.

I don't come here often, but occasionally I'm struck by the urge to quiz you on something. I was browsing the questions you're fielding, and I was struck again by something I notice every time I visit this page. There seems to be some preoccupation here with "the mind of the other." I noticed another poster make reference to your interest in it (although I cannot find any record of your having initiated the discussion).

While the series was still active I saw you invoke this theme frequently whenever you emphasized the cultural shock that the gargoyles experienced in modern America, and I appreciated the fact that you treated our linguistic tendencies to "name everything" as a curious human social construction. It helped to push the idea that these creatures were _not_ human and that we could not understand their natures or their motivations from within the context of human sensibilities. I see there is some similar talk here of the fay, and the notion that their essential nature might be something that is sufficiently far removed from humans so as to be outside our understanding. All of this puts me in mind of the anthropomorphic problem that the SETI administration outlined for dealing with the idea of extraterrestrial intelligence's. Human beings have a tendency to ascribe human values to non human species, and beyond that have considerable difficulty in contextualizing "the mind of the other" without unconsciously resorting to the context of human sensibilities.

Which brings me to the reason for this post; because being a student of the sciences (and probably less attached to my humanity than most people), I have found reason to be extremely critical of some of the aspects of the way the anthropomorphic problem is treated within the natural sciences as it applies to non-human animals. Generally speaking, my problem is that some of the more archaic ethical distinctions that are made between humans and other animals have their foundation in the premise that the ascription of certain mental capacities ( reflection, emotion, etc.) are the ascription of _uniquely human_ qualities. The fact that this premise, itself, is socially constructed rather than informed by data, seems to be lost on at least most _social_ scientists. What is troubling me is that I have begun to observe this kind of thinking migrate into the popular domain through science fiction. I don't really follow sci fi, but I've seen star trek, and I have had occasion to see the half-dozen or so other popular sci fi programs that one can find on television. I see a trend wherein the heroes casual disintegration of a planet is commonly justified with the hazily defined and indistinct ethics of "It did not harbor any sentient life."

This trend is scaring the hell out of me; because the expression "sentient" is not really used within the scientific community, so it does not have any agreed upon definition attached to it and there is no objective data informing the idea of it. The word seems to have infiltrated popular culture, however, where it finds frequent expression. That's what's bothering me. I see a lot of the same hazy ethical reasoning on this board. A number of messages expressing the confusion that humans in your story were subject to when they "mistook the gargoyles for animals rather than sentient beings" and in doing so, justified a campaign to exterminate them.

I would hope that a reasonable group of people would be given pause by the almost casual disregard for life that is being demonstrated with the prioritization of one life over another based upon the presence or non-presence of this seemingly magical endowment. Because if I am reading the intentions of the contributors to this board accurately, then it would appear their position is that if the occupants of that clock tower had been a group of stray dogs or a family of polar bears, then annihilating them with a wire guided missile would have been perfectly reasonable. "It's all right. It didn't harbor any sentient life." I would encourage the fans that come to this site to give some thought to what it is they mean by "sentience." What is the content of this sentience? If it entails that a creature can react to it's environment, anticipate, reflect and emote, then it should be pointed out that what available data exists indicates that this capacity is only about as exclusive a domain as most land based vertebrates.

I guess they shouldn't have disintegrated that planet after all. I hope to encourage others to give this issue the thought that it requires. I am also hoping to elicit some commentary from you, on the matter of how you perceive "the mind of the other." What mental distinctions do you draw between humans and gargates or faeries. I would be interested in hearing you address the notion.

Punchinello

Jim R. writes...

This is something I've been wanting to ask for a while.

A lot of information on the net in relation to Gargoyles is the criticism reports I read. Critics who evaluated Gargoyles say that as for children, it's a good show to teach morals, right-and-wrong differences, and social problems. They especially mention the episode "Deadly Force" in particular as a lesson learning experience about the dangers of weapons.

But, as for those of us adults, we believe Gargoyles was Disney's way of appealing to a more mature audience. Most of us would say its attractive because of the story, characters, episodes, Shakespearian underlyings, or the overall fictional universe idea makes it interesting. These things, I think, are what make adults come to Gatherings or purchuse merchandise, etc.

So, my question is: Who would you agree with more? The people like us fans, who ask you questions, still watch the series on our VCRs, and adore the story. Or, the critics who would say that Gargoyles is a good children's cartoon, suitable for teaching them lessons of behavior, ethics, etc.

Todd Jensen writes...

You mentioned once that you somewhat regretted calling the fay in "Gargoyles" "Oberon's Children", because that led some of the audience to get the wrong impression, and believe that the fay were Oberon's biological offspring. Actually, I was recently watching my tape of "Heritage", and noted a strong piece of evidence for Oberon not being the biological father of them (or at least not all of them). In the episode, Raven describes Grandmother as his cousin. That would certainly indicate that they are not biological siblings and therefore do not share a common father in that sense. So the series does have something to make it clear (for the observant) that the faeries aren't Oberon's children in that sense. I just thought that you'd like to know.

Sloth writes...

Ok, I think i'm outa worthwhile questions for the moment so i'll just make a comment about the show. One thing I really like about gargoyles (besides the great music, animation, story and characters) is it's hudge vocabulary. I remember when I was younger, the show taught me to use some cool words such as: subterfuge, cataclisim, clishe, abomination and many others that I can't think of right now. Just thought I'd mention someting that i thinks gone unmentioned.
Great work yall!

Ricky writes...

Greg,
Thanks for responding to my questions. I've written about four novels, but none of them have been accepted. Maybe it's my style of writting I don't know...but perhaps we can help each other in this matter. Would it be all right if I sent you a story on this web page despite it being against your guidelines...I'd like someone to read it, and since it's about Max Steel I thought you would be the more appropiate person to send it to. Just take a look and if you like it then perhaps we can colabrate on something.
Thanx

Todd Jensen writes...

This is something that I should be posting later, ideally, since you haven't yet gotten to the Avalon World Tour episodes in your ramblings, but I finally decided that I needed to let this out of me soon, so I'm doing so now.

I've noticed, over the years since I discovered "Gargoyles" fandom on the Internet, that many people didn't like the Avalon World Tour for various reasons (the length of time, the absence of Hudson and the trio, the focus on myth and fantasy aspects rather than more "mundane" elements like crime-fighting, etc.). On the other hand (while I may have had my moments of wondering when Goliath, Elisa, Angela and Bronx were going to get back to New York), I quite liked the World Tour. To a certain extent, I'll admit that I'm biased - my tastes naturally run towards fantasy/myth elements. But after doing a little thinking on this one, it increasngly struck me that, aside from all that, something of the nature of the Avalon World Tour was a must for "Gargoyles" at some point.

The reason for this is that the World Tour served a very crucial purpose (besides the general one that you mentioned of expanding the "Gargoyles Universe"). It made it clear that Goliath, his clan, and Demona weren't the only gargoyles left. And that was a crucial step. Because if they really had been, the gargoyle species would have been almost irrevocably doomed to extinction, with only seven members left, only one of those seven a female, and that one estranged from all the rest and very unlikely to reconcile with them. Goliath and the others would have been the "last gargoyles", not only in the sense of being the only ones left, but also in the sense that no new gargoyles would come along after them.

If that had been the case, it would have obviously made a rather depressing series. Admittedly, having the main character be the "very last of his kind" wouldn't necessarily be utterly melancholy - Superman is the very last Kryptonian, and his story's an upbeat one, on the whole. But the situation there's different; Superman's alien origin is treated more as a plot device to explain his abilities, so his being "the last of his kind" doesn't appear quite so melancholy. Goliath and his clan's "gargoyleness", however, was treated in the series from the start as a crucial part of them and their very nature, rather than a similar handy plot device to allow them to serve as effective protectors of New York. And also, it was clear enough from the start that an important part of the series would be the gargoyles seeking to make peace with humanity, to overcome the fear that so many humans view them with. Such a quest would have been futile (in a sense) if they were the last of their kind - the understanding on humanity's part of the true nature of gargoyles would come too late to avert the race's extinction - the best that the gargs would be able to hope for in such a situation was that they might be able to live out their last years without the general human population hunting them down, but still aware that there would be no new gargoyles after them. Not very happy.

So there'd obviously have to be gargoyles living in other parts of the world to ensure a future for the species. And Goliath and his clan would have to come into contact with those other gargoyles for the audience to see that they weren't the last. But the clan's situation would make that tricky. For one thing, there'd be the obvious transportation problems - they can't simply hop aboard the next plane bound for London or Japan. And given how secretive gargoyle clans would obviously have to be in modern times, even if Goliath and Co. had a mundane means of transportation to wherever it was that one of these clans was living, they would certainly not be likely to find out about these other clans easily. The only solution to both questions that wouldn't feel contrived was magic - as in the magic of Avalon that sends you where you need to be. That way, Goliath could be brought to the locations of the clans in London, Guatemala, and Ishimura in a convincing fashion.

So I think that the Avalon World Tour was indeed a practical must for the series, to allow the crucial moment when the clan can learn, as Hudson put it in "The Gathering", "We're not alone. We're not the last."

Jonny writes...

Greg, I was reading you're welcome letter and I noticed a mistake in it...you said you were the creator and producer Gargoyles, but you misspelled producer, you have "produser". Just thought you should know.

Anonymous writes...

Are the fiction serieses on the http://tgs.gargoyles-fans.org/ website cannon to Gargoyles? If so, I have some more questions.

BLT writes...

Greg, I must commend you for sticking by your guns and continuing to answer these questions from devoted fans long after the demise of the series. It's very encouraging.

And with that, I'll give (what I think is) an easy question: if you could be asked any question about the Gargoyles series at all, what would that question be, and how would you answer it?

Dracolich writes...

One more thing, I visited the Coming Attractions website, which mentions the Gargoyles movie. It had a plot synopsis that was written when Devlin was in charge. In my opinion, I'm SOOO glad it was rejected. For all fans who are curious, check it out <http://www.corona.bc.ca/films/> , but be warned. It is BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!!!

Blaise writes...

REVELATIONS

"Better late than never" as Elisa would say.

I liked this ep alot for several reasons. The first and foremost of course being Bluestone. He becomes the focus of an entire episode and finally meets the gargoyles. I kind of agreed with the "About time" sentiment the gargs had.

I'm not sure if, in my initial viewing, I believed Matt actually helped trap Goliath. Probably because I was so pleasantly surprised at hearing Efrem (sp?) Zimbalast Jr. as Mace. I think I may actually have decided to reserve judgement on Matt until the end of the ep (or at least I decided to do so when he went "narrating gumshoe" on us).

That's another thing I kind of like about this ep--the majority of it is told via Matt's voice-over and flashback. It just adds something to the story. And yeah, with his trenchcoat and character quirks, doing "gumshoe narration" seems to be natural for Matt.

On the subject of voice-overs, I didn't notice that Chavez had a different voice until I started looking at the credits at the end of the episodes. After that, I did notice the lighter sound, but still Ms. Gabrielli did a great job filling in for Ms. Ticotin.
And Mr. Asner's Jack Dane (with his wonderful use of the word "bum") proves a memorable character. I was quite happy when he showed up again later.

Anyway, back in the story, I also liked the attention to continuity. Matt's refernce to Elisa bringing in the TV in THE EDGE, the reappearance of Hacker, etc.
And like you, I loved the "enough food for a family of gorillas" and "dental plan" lines. I'm not sure why I like the former of the two so much, maybe because that just seems an interesting way of putting the gargoyles' eating habits in some perspective.

I was suitably impressed upon learning that Xanatos was only a "lower echalon" member of the Society. In fact, I was almost aghast. "How could this rich, powerful guy, whose been pretty much the main adversary and most successful bad guy in the series, be only in the LOWER ranks of the Illuminati?" So the Society got my attention pretty quickly here.

Can't say much about the car sequence, except that I can't help smiling every time the "three words" bit is played--it's just so perfect. Other than that, I like Elisa's quiet admission at the end.

The gargoyles' awakening in this ep does seem a bit more..."unique" than usual. For me it still feels like something in the animation, but Matt being new to it does add something.

The whole sequence at the hotel itself is real fun (hey I knew Goliath was going to get out well enough--I just wondered where Matt's fate would fall). Looking at your memo on this ep, I'm more than a little sorry that we didn't get to see the "false roof" room. That sounded great.

I don't know when, but somewhere in his talks with Mace, I kind of figured Matt was shaming him somehow. So I was prepared for a happy ending.
One of my favorite lines comes from Mace here when he talks about "wasting" Goliath: "It'll be a black mark. I'll be severely reprimanded. But if I allow Goliath to become the first prisoner to ever escape the Hotel Cabal...the flushing sound you hear will be me and my 75-year pension going down the drain."
I think the thing that really intrigues me about this line is the mention of Malone being punished for killing Goliath. I'm still dying to know the Illuminati's plans for the gargoyles.

Yeah, everytime I see Mace grab onto the elevator cables I have to wince.
And I suppose in some sadistic way, I like seeing Mace trapped in the Hotel--especially with that tic going in his eye as he completely loses his mind.

I thought Elisa's confession here was well done. I could understand her feelings about this and sympathize (though, of course, I can't say I'm special because I know the existance of sentient, non-human creatures).

And then the Hacker tag. I saw quite a few things coming in this episode, and this was NOT one of them. I didn't think Hacker would appear again after his spot at the beginning. But here he was, and as a member of the Illuminati. A very fun and intriguing revelation, IMHO.
Kind of a pity that we don't hear from the Illuminati again until THE JOURNEY.

THERE! I do believe I am finally caught up with your episode rambles (as of this writing).

Blaise writes...

OUTFOXED

Okay, finally back on track since mid-March.

First off, yes I'll agree this ep had a few problems, which you pretty much pointed out in your ramble--animation problems, especially in relation to Goliath's size, and the extra flashback are somewhat annoying. Still, this ep did have some nice stuff. And the sound wasn't too bad, I still heard, and loved, Goliath's "That. Stings."

Anyway, as soon as I heard "Cyberbiotics" I was interested in where this would be going. Hearing the name "Renard" I instantly guessed some connection with Fox. Her being his daughter did cross my mind, but I didn't rule out any other possible relation to him.
(If I may digress here; I knew that "renard" was another name for "fox" from its usage in a children's book I had had for years, THE TOMTEN AND THE FOX. Just felt like mentioning that.)

As for Vogel...when I first saw him I laughed. I thought he was a wonderful in-joke, one of the best I had seen in any series. I'm surprised people had a problem with him looking like Owen (as I said, I thought it was extremely amusing). Of course, at the time I first saw the ep, I was surprised he ended up having as big a part as he did. I thought he would just have had that one appearance at the beginning and then, that was it. But he turned out to be a very important (and interesting) character in this episode.

Renard intrigued me...mostly because of his unhealthy appearance and use of a high-tech wheel-chair. Despite this, he had a reasonably strong voice and managed to "talk-down" to Goliath (something Todd and I both find amusing about the interaction between the two).

Fox: I loved seeing her in the "red sweater and tight, black pants" ensemble. Her fight with Xanatos was fun as well--he knocks her down once, she gets back up, pins his arm behind his back, and then takes him down with a flip. Fun!
I never picked up that Xanatos was afraid when he mentioned "test results." Probably because as soon as I heard that I figured out that Fox was pregnant (I was finally starting to expect greater things from this series).

Back on the Air Fortress--I had missed METAMORPHOSIS the first time this aired, so I didn't know who this "antonsevarius" was that Renard mentioned. I didn't pay it much mind though (after all, Renard had immediately before named Owen as an ex-Cyberbiotics employee, and that really interested me). Basically, I forgot all about it when I finally did get a chance to see METAMORPHOSIS, so when I watched OUTFOXED again, and heard Renard mention "Anton Sevarius," it was like finding out the connection for the first time.

On a similar (but not quite) note, when Renard mentioned "My Anastasia. My Janine." Well, I guessed right away that Janine was Fox's real name. I don't know why...maybe that just seemed to fit her better to me than Anastasia (who I then figured to be her mother).

Vogel's betrayal and return to Renard's aid were, in my opinion, handled quite well. I found Vogel's actions believable, and had no problem with his change of heart.

Goliath gives Renard a great speech on the difference between the minds of living beings and automotons, and the two have one of my favorite exchanges in the series.
RENARD: "One thing I do know is your debt to me has been paid in full. A ship for a ship. We are even."
GOLIATH: "No. We are friends."
RENARD: [laugh] Yes. Friends.

And then the tag! I knew Fox was the "Hang-gliding ninja" and that she was Renard's daughter by now. AND that she was pregnant. But I still enjoyed this tag. I really liked the discussion between father and daughter, and the way the revelations were handled. A very fun ep.

Another digression: When I showed this ep to my mother, she instantly recognized the voices of both Peter Scolari, and Robert Culp. Anyway, I thought they did great jobs, and I still love the little nuances Culp managed to invest in Renard.

Hopefully, I'll catch up with your rambles by tomorrow.

matt writes...

hmmm, you just said:Greg responds...

I have three offices. One in Beverly Hills, my freelance office. One in Burbank, my Disney office. And one in my home.

I almost NEVER answer questions at home, because I almost never log on from there. I'd rather spend time with my wife and kids.

I answer at one of the other two offices whenever I have a free hour or so.

Occasionally, on vacation, if I have web access, I'll stay up late and answer after everyone else has gone to bed. Like now.

i find that very funny, cuz its 4:30 am here right now and i'm watching your answers come in! i guess i'm a true fan... or just really bored and unable to sleep...

anyway, so the Canadians are going to be kicking themselves for not getting G2198-517, huh? is that cuz Canadians are smarter than us Americans? (that goes out to Pyro X, long story...)
and number 74 is a noun, hmmmm...

ok:

74- adherants
74- companion

i think your clues made it harder to guess... hmmm, i'll be back...

matt writes...

i just watched "Enter Macbeth". i think this was the first of lots of sad ending-episodes... after this in "Reawakening" Coldstone is awakened and apparently dies, in "Metamorphosis" Derek is mutated and decieved by Xanatos, really sad ending, in "Legion" Coldstone is brought back but is destroyed by a virus, and on and on until "Hunters Moon" when the Clocktower is destroyed and the gargoyles are exposed. a very bittersweet series, really, i love it! anyway, back to my point, in "Enter Macbeth" you opened with Xanatos in prison in a dark cell eating bad prison food, while the gargs are living it up at the Eyrie, Broadway cooking in a well-equiped kitchen, Hudson watching the tube in his own tv room, Brooklyn and Lex playing cards in the big foyer, Goliath reading in the nice library, and the Grimorum safe in a high-tech glass display case. but by the end of the episode the clan is the ones living in the dark uncomfortable cell, the Clocktower, no more tv room, you have to break into the public library to read, the best you have for a kitchen is a hotplate, and the Grimorum is now stored in a closet behind a regular wooden door, and as for Xanatos, he's back home now, living the good life atop the worlds tallest building. now, my literature teacher in high school taught me to always see symbolism in everything and though i didn't see it before, this whole episode teems with it. i just wanted to congratulate you and the writers, this is great television, i think!

Phil writes...

I've been away for awhile (due to computer problems), and now I'm trying to catch up.

I read your list of characters ages (from about three weeks ago) and you gave Alex's tentative birthdate as 7/9. That's the same day as mine! Cool!

More later

VF writes...

Thought I'd take a stab at providing another viewer's reaction to an episode for you. So here are my observations about/reaction to "High Noon" -

The concept of there not being any scent in Coldstone's world was not jarring - it just seemed to be additional explanation of the rules that I was willing to go along with. It was already established in my mind that this was an alternate world that didn't necessarily have to follow the same rules of nature that my reality does. But I also thought, well, if it can be "real" enough to have heather growing in distant fields, why couldn't it also be artificially scented? But I assumed it was a technological limitation, not the unwillingness of a gargoyle soul to allow herself to smell.

I appreciated the continuity and progression of demonstrating Hudson and Broadway practicing their reading skills openly in front of their family, and I was genuinely pleased to see them doing so well. That I have reactions like this to a cartoon still amazes me, I have to confess. But those subtle yet significant touches provided further evidence to me that this show had some good writers and editors behind it.

Also, there was a lot of nice characterization showing Elisa's relationship with the rest of the clan - the exchange with Broadway about doing the right thing and claiming not to be a hero (when she so obviously is) and with Lex when she offers encouragement and shows confidence in him when she says he'll figure out the programming to fix Coldstone. Also, the part when Demona tells Macbeth her only consolation of enduring the pain of transformation is that he gets to suffer as well is priceless. It's deftly comical and tragically in character simultaneously. So lots of good storytelling and pacing of plot revelation going on here.

I did think it was a bit patronizing of Goliath to tell Elisa she has a whole city to protect and equally patronizing for her to order a full report later. I just sort of winced a bit at that exchange and thought "What was that all about?" I also had an adverse reaction to what I thought was Macbeth's really low blow in the library with the book reference, "And I know how to read them." For someone who had established such a strong code of honor, even among his worst enemies centuries earlier, that seemed more hurtful than any physical blow and really beneath him. So I'll generously attribute such uncouth behavior to his being under a spell, I guess.

In any episode of the series, I trust the reliability of Bronx's nose above all (i.e. in this case, his detection of Demona behind the wall of the closet). Yes, there are some constants in the gargoyle universe.

When the clan questions how two foes like Demona and Macbeth could be in collaboration, Hudson observes -- incorrectly but plausibly that -- "Maybe misery loves company." Ed Asner delivers that line with great finesse, hinting at a lot of complexity behind a seemingly simple statement. For one who appears to be an old-fashioned traditionalist, Hudson understands a lot more than other characters (and even viewers) may give him credit for.

Elisa had a very sweet and sincere line about not being able to leave the clock tower without knowing whether the clan was safe. She's a very dedicated friend. I was surprised that Demona would reveal her dual personality and transform in front of Elisa. I just thought that would be a trump card Demona wouldn't give up so easily, I guess. But I certainly thought it was completely in character for the scantily clad Dominique to strut her stuff in front of her rival - a pure sign of over-compensation for what is really subconscious insecurity and even a bit of self-loathing.

A line of Elisa's that really did not fit, in my opinion, was, "No more monsters - good or bad." I never, never would have believed, after "Awakenings" at least, that Elisa would've ever used that word in relation to her gargoyle friends. But I loved her new-found resolve with Morgan's help. Heroism shines through and adrenalin provides the needed strength; it's the great climax in the episode - the fight scene itself is simply the end result and is secondary to that moment.

More good lines follow: "I'm here to save him." "You fight like a rookie." (Elisa deserved some kind of one-up on Demona) and Macbeth's rye observation to a now Othello-controlled Coldstone that, "It seems your allegiance has shifted slightly" - here proving the concept that, when it comes to drama and comedic effect, more often than not, less is more. Incidentally, the error with the three Desdemonas' hair coloring didn't keep me from thinking of the Weird Sisters connection - I'm trained quite the opposite - any time I see three of anything in the series I'd think Weird Sisters, regardless of coloring.

And then there are the additional interesting revelations at the end, implying more to come in future episodes. But for me, that was almost just obligatory informational stuff needed to move the story along, it wasn't where the true strength of the episode lay.

For what it's worth. ...

matt writes...

a couple of weeks ago Jim R. asked about the picture of Brooklyn on the "Latest Responses" page, i recently pulled out my old gargoyle comics and found that that picture was taken from Issue 5 when Brooklyn and Lex were about to go "para-sailing", i guess he found that shirt wherever he found the skis and stuff. oh, and like i told Jim R. i think the thing on his shirt is *in Californian surfer accent* a "monster wave, dude!" hehehe...

Steven L. writes...

Hey,
I'm sorry this question has been asked before. I've been going through the archives for a while now (this'll be my first question) and I haven't come across any references to it, but you never know, right?
Anyway, I just saw a repeat of "Sentinel" last night, and it struck me as a very pilot-esque episode, like you'd set up in mind for a spin off (something like "Widget the World Watcher" meets "Transformers", only more grounded in reality). And yet, you seem to have no intention to spin it off. How come? Did you originally intend to, but decided against it as you felt it wasn't strong enough to carry a series, focusing instead on the other possible spin-offs? Or am I just making things up in my head?
Thanks.

Jim R. writes...

Doh! Wrong word in my last question: "conscience" is supposed to be "conscious" as in aware of one's surroundings. Sorry about that.

Blaise writes...

HIGH NOON

Came back to the rambles a bit later than I expected. Anyway....

First off, I felt the animation in this episode was some of the best in the series--fluid, characters had "solidness," and just overall very well done. My only real complaint is that sometimes the positions and movements of the characters seemed a bit too...BIG. Over-dramatic perhaps. The most obvious example is the very one you mentioned, Demona's "sex-pot poses." Those always throw me, because they just didn't really seem to fit the scene for me there. I suppose the idea put forward by several other fans--she was showing off against Elisa--is probable, but still.... On the other hand, I must admit that, yes, it is certainly...appealing to watch...the poses.
ANYWAY, still some pretty good animation. But while we're on the subject, Desdemona's skin-color seemed a bit lighter to me in this episode.

Yes, Michael Dorn does a great job contrasting the two personalities in his voice, doesn't he? Just the difference in between hearing him as Othello talking to Desdemona in cyberspace, and then as Coldstone/Iago calling Demona "Sister" is chilling. His voice work is one of the highlights of the episode IMHO.

I did not balk at the progress Hudson and Broadway made in their reading. For an animated television show, I thought this was a very nice show of development among the characters. Pity that even after reading it correctly when it really counted in THE SILVER FALCON, Broadway still has trouble reading the word "right." And perhaps, after a year of watching television, Hudson should have picked up the "hit the sack" phrase--he seemed to pick up "sitting ducks" a lot quicker than Broadway--but still, it was a fun touch.
I do kind of like the modesty Elisa displays in describing herself as no hero. I don't know why, but I do.

I didn't recognize Demona and Macbeth IMMEDIATELY. As soon as they were in the station and I managed to notice the beard on the "felon" I figured it was Macbeth. I didn't recognize Demona until she started talking (who couldn't recognize Marina Sirtis' voice as Demona?). What remained foremost on my mind was why these two were working together. I actually didn't wonder too much about the rest of the stuff--maybe it just didn't occur to me, or perhaps I figured all would be revealed in good time and just suspended my disbelief. I didn't think the two were capable of escaping the Weird Sisters, though. That is, unless the Sisters wanted them to.

As for Elisa...she REALLY should have gone to the doctor if she was out for that long. I admit, in light of this "enforced nap" I always had a problem swallowing Elisa's statement that she had only slept "a few hours in the last 40" (despite the fact that she certainly LOOKED like that statement was true).

I buy that Elisa found Demona familiar (you're right, there's that sort of connection between them).

The transformation sequence of Demona from human to gargoyle (and later from gargoyle to human) were EXCELLENT. I had been waiting to see her change since THE MIRROR and was a bit frustrated that it didn't occur anytime durning the five eps with her between then and now (y'see, I didn't know about the "tiers and tentpoles" back then). Thus, I was quite happy to see her working in human form here. Also, somehow I just KNEW the transformation was going to involve pain. I don't know why...maybe it's what I would have done with the spell if I had cast it on Demona. I can be cruel sometimes.

I'm afraid that the fact that we had three villains teaming up against the heroes didn't hit me as strongly as you would have liked. It's not just that the villains had such complexity, but also the fact that Macbeth and Demona usually are fighting each other. That kind of undercut some of the "WOW, THREE VILLAINS" factor. Also, the good guys still outnumbered the villains (even though the villains managed to outthink and incapacitate them)

I do love the interaction between Goliath and Elisa when the gargoyles head off to Macbeth's. I didn't find Goliath too smug, and I thought Elisa's "full report" remark was kind of fun and endearing.

The sequence at Macbeth's house was pretty cool as well. I also love it when Goliath taps the camera with his wing--I always was interested in seeing what other uses there were for that extra pair of appendages in addition to gliding.

"Just remember, one of them hates your guts." Lex has such a wonderfully blunt method of stating the situation. ;)
Of course Goliath responds with the equally fun "Then I'll just have to be very careful" after he's punched out the console.

Broadway: "Look at all these books!"
ZAP!
Macbeth: "And I know how to read them."
Nice exchange that succeeds in taking us back to LIGHTHOUSE. Also, it managed to impress my brother as being an excellent insult.

Bronx sniffs Demona behind the false wall, Brooklyn takes no notice. A repeat of the events that took place at the castle in CITY OF STONE. "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me." I get the feeling Brooklyn's going to pay a bit more attention to Bronx's hunches after this.
BTW, I just love it when Bronx scratches at the door...and gouges the wood.

I figured Macbeth in the library was probably directly over Demona in the...whatever room it was, for the pain link to work.

Yeah, the villains pulled a smart one with Coldstone/Iago volunteering the added information. I didn't doubt that they would.

Elisa and Demona have their encounter, and then Elisa runs into Morgan. I was surprised to find that Keith David was Morgan's voice--it sounded so different from Goliath. But Morgan is a fun character with some nice insight.
I don't know why, but I like Elisa's mention that if she went to sleep and woke up there would be "no more monsters, good or bad."

Elisa goes to the castle, unarmed, and Macbeth goads Demona into facing Elisa the same way. This is one instance where it makes sense that the villain gives up the advantage of a weapon--just the honorable Macbeth playing on Demona's contempt for Elisa to ensure an honorable fight. And I like that Elisa holds her own well. I'm glad that she didn't just turn out as another "damsel in distress" but worked as a heroine in her own right.

Meanwhile, through all of this, Othello has been hiding away, against Desdemona's pleas. Personally, Desdemona strikes me as the more mature of the two of them, the wiser and more patient (she continues to stick by this guy no matter what--this is one heck of a woman...gargoyle, whatever).
Even though the hair-color was always off, I recognized the three Desdemonas as the Weird Sisters (c'mon, triplets talking nearly as one, in a situation concerning Demona and Macbeth; who else could it be?).

Othello makes the decision and the fight for control begins. You have to admire the sacrifice Othello and Des make for the sake of keeping Iago in cyberspace. I couldn't help feeling sorry that it had to be this way.

After the fight's over, and the chains are blasted, Coldstone takes his leave for the safety of others. A couple things I really like here--Coldstone refers to Elisa as "my lady" and bows, and when Coldstone shakes his head to defer staying until Goliath wakes, he only is able to close the biological eye. His robotic eye can't close. Pity that only shows up here.
And then the jogger comes in for some nice comic relief.

The final tag struck me--kind of like the first Xanatos tag I saw. Coldstone was a feint just to get the talismans--the three the Archmage said would grant "ultimate magical power!" There they were! Macbeth and Demona start to question the situation, and in come the Sisters. I knew they had been involved, but I didn't quite know what they wanted the talismans for. "The coming battle" eh? Well, that was one I couldn't wait to see.

Of course I had to wait a while for AVALON. :)

Anonymous writes...

This one's not really smart assed, but still amusing:
Question-
We definitely know that the Illuminati, and particularly Percival/Duval, would have been major antagonists for "Pendragon". Now that the "Arthurian survivors" contest is over, could you tell us now what other recurring antagonists you had planned for Arthur and Griff?

Greg responds...

Ask me later, but with more style.

Greg "Xanatos" Bishansky writes...

Don't have time for a large ramble on "Outfoxed", so I'll just comment on a few key points.

Cyberbiotics> I was wondering what became of Cyberbiotics after "Awakening", so it was nice to see them again. And personalizing them in Renard, so we know who it was that got hurt by Goliath and everyone's actions.

I didn't think much of Vogel's resemblence to Owen. I thought they were cousins or something, or perhaps that one was a clone. He also made an interesting character, and I thought his change of heart was believable at the end.

Halcyon Renard. First of all, that is a great name. I like the sound of it. Yes, I did figure that he was Fox's father. I may have flunked out of French class that year, but I knew what Renard meant. He was a great character to, and Robert Culp did a great job doing his voice. Also he made a nice opposite to Xanatos.

Goliath was well-used in this episode. Also nice to show that he's far from perfect in his waiving off his responsibility in the destrcution of Fortress I.

Fox was great in this episode also. She became one of my favorites here. I was surprised by her pregnancy, but it seemed to be a natural step in where she and David were going. Seeing her beat David in their karate match was fun, but I'd like to see him win one some day, he lost to Owen to. Fox's attitude at the end with Renard was priceless, and nice to learn her birth-name. Janine was very appropriate.

Also, with Demona, Elisa, Angela, Fox etc, "Gargoyles" has a lot of great woman characters. That's one thing I really like about this show.

The theme/moral of integrity was a good one, and well handled. I understand how Renard feels when he says it's a daily struggle. I for one have been guilty of taking the easy way out and waiving off integrity. But I try to practice it as often as I can.

This was a very good episode. Not one of my favorites, but very good.

Also, don't ask me how, but I knew that David and Fox were going to have a son. I also knew that IF Goliath and Demona had an egg it was a daughter. Don't ask me how, I just knew.

Hopefully I'll have a longer Ramble/Review for "Revelations". I enjoy doing those.

Lady Dominique Macbeth writes...

Greg,
At the end of Metemorphosis, after Elisa learns her brother has been mutated, she sits in a corner of the clocktower crying. I completely understood this--a perfectly natural reaction-- but what I didnt understand is why no one tried to comfort her. I mean, she is close to the whole clan and ou said by this time Goliath already had definate feelings for her, so why didnt someone try to help her through something that could quite possibly be the hardest time of her life?

Thanks so much!!!!

matt writes...

oh, and if i remember correctly, you said that March 21 was not only the Spring Equinox, and the possible hatch date for gargoyles, but its also your son's birthday, so, Happy Birthday Ben even though its belated by now... talk to you later!

Sapphire writes...

Oh Greg the episode Metamorphisis was pretty cool the mutagen thing and all. Do you know in reality how they do gene transference between different organisms like the gene tranference between Derek and a panther, electric eel and bat. Viruses they insert genes into viruses and inject them into a creature where the viruses insert the foreign genes into the creatures DNA and it usually takes 5 months for the creature's DNA to accept the foreign genes as opposed to the 2 days in the episode Metamorphisis. Also there is also a high risk that the immune system would gobble up the mutagen plus the body also gets rid of cells that are mutated so in reality if a mad scientist ever injected you with a mutagen containing the DNA of animals your immune system would destroy the mutagen or the cells that has been mutated

Duncan Devlin writes...

Someone asked about sources on clothing from 1000 AD so I found these two books and figured that I would post them.

The Book of Costume
-Millia Davenport

What People Wore
-Douglas Gorsline

Blaise writes...

CITY OF STONE PART FOUR
Finally! I've been trying to respond to this for weeks! But due to a hectic schedule (and a testy computer) I've been hampered in my efforts.

Anyway, Bronx saves Elisa--as we all knew he would--and Demona still manages to work around him. I always did find this scene interesting for the same reasons you mentioned. Bronx won't attack Demona if she does not SEEM dangerous. It's a fun scene to watch (especially when Demona still loses her cool when referring to Elisa).

Yeah, I also like the choral music in the flashback battle sequence. Actually, I have an affinity for any music with choral parts ("O Fortuna" or "Ode de Joy" for example).
One of my favorite scenes in the battle--Demona is fighting a human. He's on the ground in front of her, screaming. She brings down her mace hard. The camera quickly closes in on her face, putting the guy and mace action off-screen. We hear the sound of impact and the scream abruptly cut-off. Maybe I'm sick, but it just pleases me that people actually are dying in this battle. More real.

Seeing Demona happy (truly smiling and laughing) in her interaction with Macbeth is another one of those "heartbreaking moments" for me, because I know it won't last. It always gets me how quickly Demona's smile turns to a frown after Macbeth leaves.

While I never believed Macbeth would betray Demona, it is nice to have confirmation of that.
Demona on the other hand, I can't help but feel a bit frustrated with. That she suspects Mac will betray her I can understand, but why not go with Luach, the one who openly and VEHEMENTLY supported her and her clan? Why go over to the guy who wears a mask with a legacy of GARGOYLE KILLING? Just goes to show that Demona believes in hurting her enemies more than the salvation of her kind--at least that's what it shows to me.

You mentioned in PART TWO how Emma Samms' voicework as Gruoch improved noticably over the four eps. You're so right, she's absolutely smoking in this episode, especially when she chews out Demona. But I'm getting ahead of myself.

The ineffectiveness of the boulders dropped from above is something that always sets my brother off. The first time he saw that scene, he couldn't even complete a whole sentence. :D

The confrontation with Canmore (whose wardrobe I really love, BTW). Macbeth still tries to reason with him, something I admire. Canmore on the other hand, stabs Mac in the back. Like Todd, I find this rather despicable and cowardly. I like Canmore even less when he gives his little anti-gargoyle statement. Gruoch has a similar line, but I can't help feeling a bit more sympathetic towards her.
It's another one of those, "I always found it interesting" bits when Demona doesn't kill Gruoch. Very nice character work.
Backtracking a bit, it is good to know that Bodhe may have finally learned that sometimes you must stand and fight.
The Sisters come in and do their thing. While I already figured the spell out, I did like the way it was phrased. Good dialogue.
And Macbeth and Gruoch part. I still find it one of the most touching moments of the series.

Back in the present:
I didn't find the scene between Goliath and Xanatos too feeble. Granted the tapestry bit comes from out of nowhere somewhat, but the mouth of the armor moving is no big problem. I say that because in later airings (like the one I taped) the animation was fixed and the mouth doesn't move anymore.
I love Macbeth's interaction with Demona here. Yes, she's more rational than usual, but I love the look on her face when she realizes that Macbeth WANTS to die. Didn't see that one coming, did she?

You are right that the DUCKTALES pilot had better "fall-away floor" animation, but this one served it's purpose well enough.
Two of my favorite moments occur after falling out of the castle but before falling into the atrium. Goliath tries to stop D and M--they BOTH punch him. Xanatos tries to use his laser, Macbeth just says, "You're not the only one with weapons, laddie" and throws down a small grenade.

The final confrontation with the Sisters. Their revelations to Mac didn't much surprise me, until they mentioned Luach's death. That got me.
After the Sisters put Mac to sleep, I found myself thinking, "This would be the sort of thing Xanatos might like seeing." Immediately after, Xanatos pops up with "Normally, I'd find this all very fascinating, but right now I need that code to save my city." Wonderful touch of character. Two touches counting Xanatos' reference to Manhatten as his city.

And now, the sequence that pretty much left me breathless. The Sisters show Demona how she had been responsible for the Massacre, the Hunter, and Canmore's victory. I had never thought on that until now. And then, "The access code is...'alone'." When she said that, with tears in her eyes...I cannot adequately describe what I felt.

Xanatos jets up and saves the day. And is painfully aware that he has been seen doing that, even if it is the "dog." "What are you looking at?" Such a funny line.
It's also funny to see Demona, now her ol', vindictive self trying to break the grip of the Sisters-as-children and failing. The Sisters' exit left me eagerly anticipating their next appearance.

Then the sky burns. Whatever you guys did, kudos. Xanatos said it best, "Magnificent."

While it might have been nice for the gargoyles to lift Elisa up into the air, the scene still played well, and Xanatos' "You'll forgive me if I just shake your hand" remains humorous.

While I knew that Xanatos wasn't the type of villain to try to "kill the good guys at all costs," it is a nice final interaction he and Goliath have, explaining this.

Let's hope this posts now. With luck, I'll catch up with the next two rambles over the next couple of days.

matt writes...

ramble on "Revelations"-

first of all, the name is perfect for this episode, perfect!

ok, i agree, Tom Wilson is excellant in this episode, you can hear what he's thinking with his tone throughout the episode, both while narrating and not. its Tom's performance here that makes Matt one of my favirote characters.

until your ramble i had no idea that a different person was voicing Chavez, which is wierd cuz i usually notice things like that. oh, well, she did a great job!

when Matt first discovers the stuff in the clocktower i was horrified, "Oh no! He's going to discover the gargs and hate them!!" then i realized i've been wanting for Matt to discover the gargs since "The Edge"

until your recent posts i didn't realize that Mace ended up dying at Hotel Cabal, i figured that eventually the Illuminati came in and saved him. Hacker seemed too casual talking about Mace for me to think he died. actually for the rest of the series i was waiting for Mace to get his revenge on Matt and Goliath... guess not, huh?

this episode definetly had the best turn-to-stone scene in the series, its like Matt said, "Wow..." sometimes i'll watch just this part of the episode, its amazing, especially Bronx, i love his stance, beautiful.

Chavez's line to Elisa and Matt about finding each other is one of my favirotes. they were finally acting like real partners by "The Silver Falcon", now they are friends too. Chavez looks especially pleased with herself at this too, probably remebering Elisa's objections to a partner in "The Edge".

i'm happy Matt got his own episode, not just tagging along with Elisa and dissapearing at the right times, what a good episode too...

Revel writes...

"Your Revelations ramble"

This is probably more a compliment than anything else. Revelations was actually the first episode of the show I ever saw. I happend to flip through as the opening theme was playing and i stopped and started to watch. As you can guess I was in front of the television again the following Friday. (man that was a while ago)
What I did want to ask was did Mace get his tattoo by choice or was it sort of like branding by the society? (ouch)
Thanks

Todd Jensen writes...

A ramble-review on "Revelations".

I quite liked this episode. I'd been curious for some time about Matt's interest in the Illuminati (as I mentioned before, when I first saw Xanatos donning an Illuminati badge in "Vows", my immediate thought was "What would Matt say if he knew about this?") and in the gargoyles. So now we got an episode in which these two pursuits of his intersected.

And I did initially believe that Matt had sold Goliath out to the Illuminati, which shocked me, since I hadn't thought that he'd actually do something like that. I was glad when the truth came out at the end. I very much liked Matt's narration, as well.

(One thing that did occur to me about Elisa's "uniqueness" in being the only human whom the gargoyles considered a friend; actually, she had lost her "unique" status by this point, in light of the gargoyles also making friends with Jeffrey Robbins and Halcyon Renard - but Elisa wasn't there at either of those meetings, so I don't feel bothered by that inconsistency. And I could understand her reluctance in introducing Matt to the gargs for that reason).

Mace Malone and the Hotel Cabal worked for me (I hadn't even known about the Tower of Terror part before now, or suspected it, for that matter). So did the surprise revelation at the end of the episode that Hacker had been "one of them" all along. I was very curious about what would happen now that Matt knew that his former FBI partner was really an Illuminatus who had been hindering his search.

Actually, that brings me to one of the very few regrets that I have about the series as a whole: the fact that we didn't see anything further with the Illuminati for the rest of the season, and the only element involving it for the remainder of your run on "Gargoyles" was Owen's mention of Duval in "The Journey". (The Goliath Chronicles did do an Illuminati episode after you left, but I definitely didn't like the way that they handled the Illuminati there - they reduced them too much to the level of cliched villains as "evil munitions manufacturers who start up wars just to make a profit" - the Illuminati of your run felt much more "greyish" to me, rather than out-and-out villains like, say, the Archmage or Thailog). I hope that if you get to do the series again, we'll get to see the Illuminati thread (and particularly the Matt-and-the-Illuminati thread) developed some more.

Kathy Lowe (AKA The Gatekeeper) writes...

Just my $.02 worth on "Outfoxed". I'll leave the in-depth analysis up to Todd and Aris.

When I saw Preston Vogel for the first time, I honestly thought that is was Owen. All the characters extremely complex; I never thought that it was a copout from an animation standpoint. I went right to wondering what Owen's hidden agenda was. All the other villains had a hidden agenda, why not Owen. His "I've got a secret" attitude was evident from "The Awakening".
By the end of the episode I started having doubts that Vogel was Owen, but I didn't entirely dismiss the idea until I watched "Golem". The amount of care that Vogel had to give to a very sick Renard was more time consuming that even Owen could handle.
While I was expecting a hidden agenda out of this episode, (how could I not, Xanatos was involved via Fox) I never expected it to be Fox's agenda which was her relation to Renard. While I definitely understood what the "Tests" were, my vocabulary is woefully inadequate, so I did not know that Renard meant Fox.
I was not surprised by a pregnant cartoon character. I grew up with the Flintstones; and Wilma being pregnant with Pebbles. Back then, knitting baby booties was the way to indicate that someone was expecting. (The last sentence is for those readers who are half our ages <g> Boy do I feel old)

Kathy Lowe writes...

As I understand it, you wrote the beat sheets in response to an outline or script that was submitted to you. I really enjoy reading the summaries that you wrote; I am curious about the purpose of these summaries. Were you writing down what you interpreted the story to be from the script (thinking out loud on paper)? The way it is presented in the beat sheet, seems (to me at any rate) like most of the episode ideas are coming from you rather than the other way around.

It would be nice to see one of the scripts that you did a beat sheet on, but I can certainly understand if they no longer exist. Just seeing the evolution from Beat Sheet to final episode extremely interesting.

Axem Gold writes...

I know where the Phoenix Gate really came from. It came from the writer's of the Gargoyle Animated Series.

Greg Bishansky writes...

Here's my "High Noon" Ramble

First of all, I like how the "Previously on Gargoyles…" recap was done. I liked Coldstone in his first two appearances and was glad to be seeing him again. Also it didn't give away the involvement of Demona, Macbeth and the Weird Sisters, which shocked the Hell out of me, but I'll get to that later.

First things first. The animation in this episode is breathtaking. I don't think it'd be a stretch to say that this is episode is animated more beautifully than any other… though that is saying a lot.

I like the opening scene with Othello and Desdemona. Also nice touch with the animators drawing real Scottish Heather, I read in a magazine article that the episode's writer (I forget who it is), had to actually fax a picture of Scottish Heather to an artist during production. It shows that more care was put into this show than any other.

Iago comes off quite menacing, even though his actions are out of spite. He can't have Desdemona, so he won't let Othello have any peace with her. When I first saw this I though Iago was dead after "Legion", so it was nice to him back.

Nice continuity with Hudson and Broadway reading, I was glad this was touched on again, most cartoons would just forget about it after one episode, but not this one. Also Elisa is great in this scene, really humble, but yes, she is more of a hero than she wants to be. Also, I liked Hudson's "hit a sack" line, maybe it was late for it, but I liked it and still like it.

Hmm, nice little touches on Lex's computer monitor. "Othello Program", "Desdemona Program", "Iago Program". You have to really look to catch these, and I'm sure I missed some. Were these your idea?

So Macbeth and Demona walk past Elisa in disguise. I have to say that I did not recognize either of them. For on thing the look we got of Demona as a human was so brief, and I wasn't expecting to see them again so soon. I liked the chase scene through the station, and as soon as they got to the Clock Tower I knew something dangerous was up. When it was revealed that that was indeed Macbeth, I thought the woman was Fleance or another mercenary that Macbeth hired. Of course I kicked myself for mistaking Demona for Fleance, considering how much I adore Demona. I guess I just wasn't paying attention to her, and focusing on Macbeth.

I figured that they stole Coldstone of course, since he was going to play a major part in this episode. Also I did like the costume change on Mac & D. I also really like Demona's green eyes as a human… once again, expect a lot of gushing towards her ;)

When Elisa asked how they got Coldstone out of there without being seen, I just assumed that Demona used some kind of cloaking spell on Macbeth's plane. Turned out I was right, though I didn't factor the Grimorum in. I was too busy trying to figure out why they were working together and how they found the Clock Tower.

The animation when Demona changes from her lovely human form into her lovely Gargoyle form is beautiful (though it looks extremely painful), and I was glad to finally find out the truth behind Puck's gift. It confused me for a while, I was expecting to be human in "Vows".

Even when under a spell, Demona and Macbeth still hate each other.

Michael Dorn does a great job with Iago/Coldstone's first two lines. He's a great actor.

Goliath and Elisa share a nice moment here, I like it, can't think of more to say about it.

I like the way the scene changes on the Moon, another really nice touch.

I really like the scene when they enter the mansion, the animation on their reflections in the camera is nice, as is Goliath tapping the camera with his wing. Nice to see that Goliath has learned a lot of the modern world by saying that Macbeth is probably watching them from a control room. I also like how they kick the door open in battle stance and quickly come out of it when they see the room is empty. Also like them using the room to their own advantage.

The Demona-Brooklyn fight is very well done, it moves really fast with Brooklyn not even having time to breathe. Nice show of her warrior skills.

Once again I like the continuity from "Lighthouse" especially with Macbeth and Broadway's lines and staging the fight in a library.

The villains are really smart in this episode. I was really impressed with Iago's cunning here… a shame we never got to see "Dark Ages". The trap was really clever as well.

Demona's "Sex Pot" scene. Well, you probably already know that I love it. I don't think it's out of character at all, someone earlier posted here a good reason for her to do that saying to Elisa "I'm prettier than you". If we get the show back, I hope to see her do more of these ;) I also like seeing her hail a taxi.

Now what I want to know is how did Demona manage to walk through an entire police station in her halter-top and loincloth and not be arrested for indecent exposure? Though there is nothing indecent about it ;) Okay, on to the next scene…

Very nice scene between Elisa and Morgan. I liked how you took a minor background character and turned him into a "real" person. Elisa looks good here also, very nice animation. She looks exhausted.

I still have to say I was not confused by nobody being able to see our villains at Belvedere Castle. I just figured that Demona was using an invisibility spell. Also I have to confess that until I got on the Internet, I never thought that Coldstone was re-animated stone. But now it makes perfect sense to me.

I love that line of the Sisters' "Even shadows must be true to their shade." Also, they have their correct hair colors when they say that line on my copy of the episode.

I love the way Elisa just walks past Demona, Macbeth and Coldstone without even glancing at them. Elisa took a big gamble here. Sure Macbeth has a code of honor, but not Demona. Demona could have just ignored Macbeth and shot her. But now on to one of my favorite scenes…

THE CAT FIGHT- Demona may fight like a rookie at first, but she quickly manages to grab her. I love Iago/Coldstone's line and Macbeth's. On behalf of all male "Gargoyles" fans every where, I thank you for this scene ;) Hmm, I had less to say about this scene than I thought.

Now here, the Sisters' hair is wrong, all blonde. But I still knew it was them, and then when they phase together, Desdemona has black hair. Oh well, this episode is so well animated that I can forgive a few mistakes.

I like the fight between Othello, Desdemona and Iago. Very nicely done. Also nice to see Othello realize that he can't let evil triumph just by his doing nothing.

The fight ended well, ooh, considering where Elisa kicked Demona before slamming her head into a statue… that's gotta hurt. Still was confused to see Macbeth rescue Demona here.

I also like the scene between Coldstone and Elisa. He has a great line before leaving. And nice use of the jogger to.

I actually thought it was out of character to here Demona call Elisa by her first name rather than "Maza" or "the Detective." I also raised an eyebrow when Macbeth mentioned the "primary objective."

When I saw the Grimorum, the Eye, and the Gate all laid out, things began to make sense. Also nice to see I was right that Demona used a cloaking spell earlier, but didn't suspect that she was using the Grimorum. Also liked seeing them asking the same questions I was asking… especially. "WHY ARE WE WORKING TOGETHER!"

The Weird Sister's finally explain everything and it all makes perfect sense. Nice scheme they had. Of course I had to wait about two months to learn what the "coming battle" was. Nice way to keep us in suspense.

Overall, I like this episode. Not one of the best, but still very good. A lot of nice character moments, and a nice epilogue to "City Of Stone", and foreshadowing of things to come. Though the wait was unbearable.

THe bAbBleR writes...

Hey, I know how much you like viewer insight, so here goes:
GARGOYLES ROCKS. period. I didn't get it when I was seven. I missed all those subtleties and nuances that you put in there, but I see so clearly now! I wish that Toon Disney would air Deadly Force, but there all so stupid . "It's too violent" they say. They'll let Goofy fall of a cliff without a scratch and air it, but if they show someone getting shot and (realistically) having to go to the hospital they won't air it. What a bunch of crack heads.
Anyway, about what Titania whispered to Fox. I know what she said. She said, "All good Garg supporters go to The Gathering."
What a motherly message. Too bad Fox is a bad daughter.
* * So until Goliath plays for the Harlem Globe Trotters, I'll luv ya, Greg.

Basilisk writes...

A quick thing about OUTFOXED:

When I saw Vogel, a near-twin of Owen, I chuckled to myself and thought "Oh, there's gonna be something interesting behind that!"

Aaron writes...

My favorite smart ass responses.

<<Demona Taina writes...

1. Where did Demona get those gargoyles from in "City Of Stone"?

Greg responds...

1. Wall-mart.>>

Which was funny enough when I read it as Walmart, but then I realized just what a terrible pun it is...

and...

<<Aaron writes...

Y'know, it's amazing how many of my questions seem to end up in the Smart Ass Responses category.

Greg responds...

It's also amazing how many of my responses end up in that category. I wonder why that is? >>

Sigh.

I haven't asked you about the Magus' given name lately, have I?

demona writes...

hi greg could u go to my chat room the addy is http://www.masquerade.com/main.htl my group sog would be very excited to see u there out meetings are every sunday at 8:00 pm eastern or standerd time i am there as demona there is also a macbeth etc and we all would love 2 see u there !

matt writes...

okay, Dirk, i have to agree with you about Sixth Sense, the movie was awful and i guess people today will forget about an hour and a half of crap if they get mildly surprised in the end, what a dumb movie.

i don't agree with you at all about your dislike of Coldstone and "High Noon". i admit that i think there should have been more time between "High Noon" and "City of Stone" and that viewers had to understand alot to understand this episode, but that doesn't make it a bad episode. one of the best things about "Gargoyles" is that there are so many stories, so many threads and sometimes they are told alone and sometimes those threads can come together to make a great episode. its so interesting when we see the Eye of Odin in "The Edge" and who would of thought we would eventually meet Odin himself, or when Mary and Finella take the Grimorum to hide it who would've thought that they'd meet a timedancing Brooklyn, the story may seem tossed together but its really all a great pattern that makes for a really neat series.

as for Coldstone, i think he is one of the best characters in the show, actually my favirote episode is "Reawakining" where Coldstone is created and most of my other favirote episodes have Coldstone including "High Noon" and "Possesions". Coldstone portrays one of the shows many lessons to learn, that there is good and evil in everyone. Coldstone not only shows this in his behavior, but also very literally in that he has good and evil souls within him. i'm not sure why you think he is silly, he always seemed to be a tortured soul to me, did you ever notice that he has something bad happen to him or a task forced upon him at the end of every episode he is in? i'm amazed that he keeps as good of an attitude as he does sometimes, it probably helps that Desdemona is by his side. the fact that Coldstone and Elisa have the same choice in this episode really gives this episode a good theme and it reminds me of what Goliath says later in "The Hound of Ulster", that being a hero is rarely easy. "High Noon" really shows that our heroes sometimes just don't want to be heroes and don't want to do things that they need to do, but they do it anyway because it is right and the people they care for need them.

i think both Coldstone and "High Noon" were great additons to the series and "Gargoyles" wouldn't be as interesting and fun without them.

Dirk writes...

Musings on High Noon:

Point 1--I hate Coldstone. Quite a bit. He's so silly. I mean yes, Gargoyles is totally littered with silly things (Under Manhatten there is an abandoned industrial complex inhabited by flying electric catmen who are the protectors of the homeless. Silly.), but usually it's a case of silly things done well. The cyborg-undead-Cybil gargoyle is a) over the top. b) takes way too much explanation. and c) really never added much to the story.

Point 2--I hated the Sixth Sense. What a stupid movie. Up until the twist ending it appeared to be crappy storytelling. The pacing and the interaction between Willis and his wife seemed way off. They there is the surprise ending! Surprise! The storytelling was intentionally crappy! We end up with a crappy story with a surprise ending.

Basically, High Noon is the crappy coldstone episode with everybody vaguely off-character and Elisa being real tired.
Macbeth and Demona working together AND them knowing where the clan lives comes off as WOW this is out of character. Annoyingly so.
When they steal coldstone my thought is Huh? If I were going to loot the clock tower, Coldstone is the last thing I'd take.
And then, rather then puzzle over why these magic savy characters would steal a comatose robo-zombie rather than three of the most powerful magical items in the world, I dimiss it as another symptom of the apparent bad writing.
IMPORTANT NOTE: Apparent bad writing is the exact same as bad writing.

Furthermore, the important conflicts in this episode are very flat. Elisa's internal struggle comes off as why are they going out of the way to make her so tired? And after the Flagrant nonsense behavior of D&M, her "crisis of faith" gets lost as a little more bad characterisation.
And Coldstone I don't like. He's uninteresting, and the whole ostridge thing he does here just seems ungargoyle and makes me dislike him more.

Finally, this is a REALLY bad episode to reveal that the Wyrd Sisters aren't as benevolent as they appear. It seems so out of character from the previous movie, it's a slap in the face.

So the rundown is:
Demona: Behaving way out of character because a spell has been cast on her.
Macbeth: Behaving way out of character because a spell has been cast on him.
Elisa: Behaving signifigantly out of character because of sleep deprivation and dramatic necessity.
Othello: Not having the ability to develop his character prior to this episode, he is behaving notably different than how I would want and expect a protagonist gargoyle to behave.
The Weird Sisters: Behaving drastically different than what we had led to belive was their character.

Last negative thing I'm going to say: Putting this episode directly after City of Stone just makes it appear that much worse, and we really should have had some down time with Mac and Demona MIA.

Basically, it was FAR below par for a Gargoyles episode, but actually not all that bad.

Iago & Mac: This is Diverting. You have no Idea.
Big fun!

Morgan is so cool.

The Elisa getting no sleep could have been really neat, but It got lost in this messy episode.

Could you imagine this being your first episode!! To understand this episode you need to understand who and what Coldstone is, You need to have seen City of Stone for Macbeth and Demona's relationship to make any sense as well as to understand the Wyrd Sister's role in this. You need to have seen the mirror to get that Demona becomes human these days. And it would be nice to be familiar with the phoenix gate, eye of odin, and grimorum arcanorum so that the end makes sense. There's a lot going on.

What crawled up Iago's butt, anyways?

I don't know what this means but when watching Gargoyles... When I hear Frakes, I hear Xanatos; When I hear Sirtis, I hear Demona; When I hear Spiner, I hear Puck; But when I hear Dorn, I hear Worf! He's got a great voice, and definitely is the coolest thing about Coldstone, but it's distinct. By the same token, when ever I hear Keith's voice, I immediately hear Goliath. It was amusing hearing Goliath Narrating Jazz.

All and all, 3 out of 10.

I've said my piece.

Isaac Kelley
"All your base are belong to us."

matt writes...

i was reading the development files for the pilot and i noticed in most versios it was written that Hudson was not the trio's babysitter, Goliath is and Hudson wouldn't like it if he was forced to be their babysitter. i understand that Goliath is the clan leader and therefore responsible for all the gargoyles, but Hudson is the trio's last living rookery father, doesn't that give him some responsibility towards them? why would he be insulted to be a parental figure to the trio, afterall Goliath isn't their father, Hudson is...?

Anonymous writes...

Greg;

your response one time was quote, "... who can explain this crazy little thing called love?" (in reference to bronx and boudicah.)

I had a good laugh.

And you thought your smart-ass responses were getting lame!

Greg Bishansky writes...

Here are some of my favorite smart-ass responses

Siren writes...

So Greg, which came first...The gargoyle or the egg?

Greg responds...

I did.

Why did Lex start a business?

Greg responds...

Because it was there.

Finding myself lost in that massive "Old Ask Greg Archive," I stumbled across a mention of a missing World Tour episode featuring Coldstone in the Himalayas. What would've happened there?

Greg responds...

An entire story.

Just thought that I might tell you that I was very amused (LOL), in fact, by your answer to the question about whether pigs can fly in the Gargoyles Universe ("I've got the bacon, do you have the catapult?") - particularly since I'd never imagined firing pigs from a catapult as a means of accomplishing that feat.

Greg responds...

Then you don't watch enough Monty Python.

In the episode the gathering (part 2) what did titania whisper to fox at the end of the episode. I have been wondering this for a long time.

Greg responds...

You and what army?

Oh, yeah. That army. <WAVES> "Hi, guys!"

How do gargoyles view Homosexuality?

Greg responds...

On cable, like the rest of us.

Hey Greg ^_^

I'm a huge E&G fan (Elisa and Goliath, but I'm sure you know that o.O) and I was wondering, in absolutely any way, would Goliath and Elisa EVER have kids? *waits for beating* >;)

Greg responds...

Admit it, for a huge E&G fan, you couldn't be bothered to check either the E or G archive and get your answer immediately. Instead you post a question here and wait over a month for a response that I've already posted MANY times before. Right?

Anyway, "kids" plural?

3. *DO* the other gargs need to shave?

4. If so, what do they shave with, particularly Goliath on the Avalon tour?

Greg responds...

3. Not Angela.

4. Superman checked in periodically, and volunteered his heat-vision.

What is it like for you to have so many people worshiping the ground you walk on?

Greg responds...

Pretty cool most of the time.

And then I get an embarrassing question like this one...

Well, that's enough. Other people had submitted some very good ones as well.

Mary Mack writes...

Dear Greg,

I went through the Smart-Ass Responses Archive and hunted down my favorites. I'm cold, but I'm smiling.

1. The entire "What did Titania whisper to Fox?" controversy.

2. Wing asks, "How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie roll tootsie pop?"
Greg responds, "The world may never know."

3. "Frank Welker" makes the Stone of Destiny special.

4. Catapult + Bacon = Flying Pigs. And Todd Jensen _definetly_ doesn't watch enough Monty Python.

5. Ed asks, "What... could Sevarius possibly cook up next?"
Greg respnds, "Breakfast?"

6. "All cookies are true. Especially peanut butter cookies." One wonders if you've received some message from a peanut butter cookie.

7. The fate of the Pack Helicopter? "They turned it into a planter." Fuschias, right? They'd look pretty.

8. LSZ asks, "What new villains... would appear in Pendragon?"
Greg responds, "There's the amazing NEW GUY. He's terrifying."

9. Puck asks, "Are gargoyles realy real?"
Greg responds, "You misspelled 'really'." He did, he really did.

10. And the ever-popular, "Do gargoyles leave marks on hardwood floors?"
Greg responds, "There's a smart ass answer in here somewhere, but I just can't find it."
Joxter thought the answer was "Doing what?"
I know the real answer. Gargoyles are just like humans in that they leave marks on hardwood floors when they wear high heeled shoes. Ask any good contractor-- Ms. Dominique Destine has gone through several, I'm sure.

Okay, I'm done making a fool of myself for today. You can all go about your business now, nothing to see here.

Jim R. writes...

Greg,

I just thought to let you know, that I enjoy reading your movie reviews. You see way more movies than I do, so reading some of your thoughts about them is interesting to see whether I would agree if I've seen the movie or not, and to see whether if I should. Ebert and you would be a sight to see...

Vanity writes...

In response to Jim R.

Sorry to sound pompous
But our sun is a main sequence star and thus will never supernova. Our sun will as you say in about 6 billion years grow to a red giant and it may ingulf the Earth or it just may push the planets away from itself repsecting the relations ship of mass to gravity. The last stage in our sun's life will be the white dwarf and black dwarf stages and by then all life on earth will likely be dead. Except for Demona and Macbeth if they haven't killed eachother by now. Oberon's children will most likely not die either being that eternal beings don't die.

matt writes...

in response to "The One":

i've been thinking an awful lot about gargoyle genetics and biology lately and i have some theories, not ideas, personal theories.

in evolution, the weak do not survive to pass on genes, and the strong do. among other things this makes most beings of a species very similar in appearence, at least from outside that species. gargoyles are different obviously, even us humans can see major differences among them, like the ones you mentioned. the reason for this, i think, is because they have bypassed evolution by not raising their young individually, but communally. the strong gargs help in raising the weak gargs and vice versa, this means that strong and weak gargs make it to adulthood to have their own children, this also means that weaker traits arn't dying off and any physical mutations that occur are accepted and continue on. generally though, gargoyles are pretty similar if you look at bone structure or DNA, its like dogs, we've selectively breed them to look different or be able to do different things, but a Poodle is virtually identical to a St. Bernard in its DNA. the fact that gargoyles don't keep track of who's kid is who's also means that occasionally two cousin's or second cousin's will mate and this may cause mutations that further vary what the species looks like.

as for the rookery generations, as Greg as said, there are never actually biological brothers and sisters among a generation, the closest relation is cousins, i even did the math and found that an uncle and niece for instance can't be in the same generation. i have another personal theory that gargoyles, to prevent much inbreeding, biologically find gargoyles attractive that are very different looking from themselves. i know alot of people would say, "What about who they love?" and i agree, but don't we all have some biological prefrences?

i have no idea why the London gargs evolved the way they did, i'm anxious to see Greg's answer to that one...

ok, i'm done with my ramble, what do you think Greg?

matt writes...

RAMBLE ON "OUTFOXED"

i'll agree with you that although the animation, sound and flashbacks were really annoying, the story really carries this episode.
i remember first seeing this episode very well and i remember wondering what had ever happened to Cyberbiotics and was glad to see that it wasn't just going to be a throwaway company in the series, its like you always say, what about the reprucussions to the raid on Cyberbiotics?
Vogel really confused me, i said to myself, isn't he alot like Owen? i knew it wasn't a coincidence, but had no idea what it was...
oh, and i'm glad Goliath made a new friend, its sad that he makes more enemies than friends, but i guess thats drama for you...
Fox is pregnant!!! wow!! what a shock! i prayed for the next nine months to fly bye, but looking back, i'm glad it didn't. what suspense... geeez.
finally, the moral of the episode: integrity and responsibility. i whole-heartely agree with both you and Renard. its not easy, its "a daily struggle" and even the noble and strong like Goliath have problems with it.
i sometimes wonder what would've happened if Renaud had seen Demona flying around and captured her... i doubt his speech would've done as much for her! he probably would've turned her over to the "proper authorities" i think, that would have been fun!!! hahaha!!!