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So, here was Matt, enjoying his evening, finishing up dinner and dishes and about to settle down to a good book before bedtime when alas he decides to peak into the Comment Room and realizes the Ask Greg queue closes in mere hours (so he gathers) and he has forgotten to post his 2007 Gathering Journal!!!
So in a mad rush to finish he begins to type. Without further ado...
After barely arranging to get Friday off work and saying the goodbyes to my Jason (the boyfriend who will probably attend G '08 with me) I hit the road around 5 AM CT. It had been a while since I had a nice road trip and there is always that fun feeling about leaving when it is still dark outside. Long (and boring) story short, I arrived in the town of Pigeon Forge at about 3:15 PM ET. My first impression of the town was that it seemed to be brimming with traffic and pancake houses. I was relieved to discover the hotel without incident (aside from the aforementioned traffic) and checked in. I quickly found my room, threw down my stuff and made my way to the convention area. I found it a good sign that right after checking in at the Staff table, I ran back to my room to leave some stuff there and on my way back ran into Greg Weisman himself. I was amazed that Greg seemed to remember me by face alone (or maybe he read my badge, but he seemed like he knew me). I wish I had his talent of face/name recognition. I'd only met him once before briefly in 2002. Anyway, Greg tried to convince me to try out for the Radio Play. I had considered it for months, but I greatly enjoy listening to the production so I opted out. Perhaps next year. I'll think about it. Greg seemed in a hurry for something and I made my way back to the art room/dealer's room area. On the way I ran into Harvester of Eyes. We hadn't met before and chatted about Putt-Putt golf a bit and how he dislikes it and then I finally made it back to the main convention room. As I was looking around the wares, I noticed one space left on the sign up sheet for Mug-A-Guest with Greg and I eagerly signed up. I went to examine the art, which was naturally quite good. There were a few really fun pieces, kudos to those who submitted art. I was happily surprised to see a few sample pages for Issue #5. I felt almost guilty seeing Brook's costume, Dr. Sato and Mary and Finella. Of course, at the time I didn't know that I was going to soon learn much more about Issue #5. Ran into Greg X and chatted about the comics, the Comment Room and other silliness for a bit.
The time for Opening Ceremonies came around and I eagerly found a good seat... of course, not long afterwards I found myself sitting on the floor. It was all very kindergarten story/naptime-esque.
I don't care how many times Greg has been through the Opening Ceremonies stuff, I loved seeing and hearing it all. However, I guess Greg felt that he needed to add something new to the routine, so he proceeded to destroy the hotel podium to the delight and amusement of the con-goers .
After the end of Opening Ceremonies, I was famished and made my way to dinner at Shoney's across the street. I went back to my room and laid on the bed and enjoyed that "I'm on vacation" feeling for a while and then, feeling fat, went swimming to burn off the Shoney's. Exhausted, I went back to the room and passed out.
Slept pretty late. Reveled in the feeling of not waking up to an alarm. Took my time getting ready and went down to the complimentary breakfast. Finding no fruit in sight, I shrugged and gorged on biscuits and gravy like I hadn't done in years. Vacation, right?
I made my way back to the con and attended the "Fan to Pro" panel with Karine (and Samuel). I felt guilty again when Karine accidently let slip Quincy's name, but that was nothing compared to later. Anyway, the panel was great, I really enjoyed listening to Karine and there were some great questions. Even though I'm not much of an artist, it was fun. After that I had the Mug with Greg. This was a lot of fun and it really made me realize why the Gathering is so great. When a group of people can sit in an (ever growing) circle (in person!) and chat about Gargoyles, it makes me feel a great sense of community which is only faintly felt via the internet community. Somehow Greg revealed to us that the Jogger is Billy and Susan's uncle. Not sure how we got that out of him, but I thought it was a neat tidbit.
After the Mug, I decided I needed/wanted a walk so I wandered down to Taco Bell for lunch and ended up counteracting the purpose for the walk there when I got a big ole quesadilla thing... ugh, I ate too much on this trip.
I waddled back to the hotel with enough time to get a great seat for the Radio Play. Wow, that was fun. To have brand new canon material revealed to us as a big group like that was just awesome. Something I haven't felt since I was watching the episodes as the came out 11 years ago with grade school friends and talking about them at school. So much fun. Thom Adcox was hilarious as Brentwood (great casting there, ha!), but I was also impressed by a lot of other people, namely Phoenix-Talon as Elisa. Honestly, I can't read the line "I'm a part of this clan. Nothing will ever change that." without hearing Phoenix-Talon. I should be hearing Salli Richardson, I know, but her Radio Play counterpart deserves a round of applause. Great job.
After the Radio Play I congratulated Greg on a great job and then excused myself to call my friend Ryan (another Gargoyles fan who couldn't attend due to med-school) and told him exactly nothing except that I heard the script for Issue #5. He was good about it, but I couldn't stop gushing about how great it was so I decided to spare him (and spot tempting myself) and just get back to the convention. [On a side note, I happened to witness the most interesting scenario involving a baby duck and a fisherman in the stream behind the hotel during this phone conversation. But that, as they say, is a story for another day...]
I went back and made my way to MGT3K, which was one of my favorite events at G'02. Had a lot of fun making fun of the episodes (and Greg's intros for the eps). I truly do feel, however, that the Goliath Chronicles was made for MGT3K, and hope to see TGC in that (and only that) venue at future Gatherings.
Next came the Blue Mug. Never attended that before and I was not disappointed. Goliath's genitalia, Thom Adcox removing his pants and humping a fan (separate incidents of course), and lots of pornographic Gargoyles art and video clips. And I hear this was a MILD year. Yikes. Lot of fun though. I didn't want to miss a minute of it so I remained even though I was very sleepy. Found myself attempting to flirt with Thom from across the room (can't help it, he's cute) but nothing came of that (truly for the best) and after the Mug broke up, I went back to my room to sleep. Instead, on a whim, I jumped in the pool and swam around until the thought of swimming in the dark had me totally freaked out ( I was actually getting "the shivers" imagining monsters below me in the darkness). Well aware of my exhaustion, I went to my room and slept.
Woke up early and got things packed up. I needed to be on the road asap, cuz I had to get back home for stuff on Monday.
Fortunately, I had time for a quick breakfast at that Rooster pace next door. Finally had some fruit for breakfast, although the restaurant insisted on immersing it in some sort of sugary fruit syrup. Went back to the con and listened to a couple of the open-story stuff. Some people had some pretty good stuff, and the stillness of the room and the singular voice was refreshing after the Blue Mug the night before.
Next attended a panel I'd been waiting for all weekend; Gargoyles Physiology and Culture. Though I certainly disagreed with a lot of the ideas floating around that panel (especially involving Gargate evolution), I had a great time. It was nice to actually be able to have that conversation outside of the Comment Room. And we all agreed, for various reasons, that gargoyle eggs do in fact need to be turned. I felt that this consensus, minor though it was, was a good place for us to move to the culture part of the panel. I was surprised that I ended up enjoying this part of the panel even more. Greg really inspires me when he talks about Gargoyle culture. It really was fascinating and wonderful stuff, and Greg explained his thoughts so well. It made me feel I got a glimpse, for a moment, into that universe Greg is always tapping into.
After the panel, most of us moved on to the "Bad Guys" panel. Turned out that Greg, naturally, wasn't ready to reveal much there and the panel turned into a Marketing seminar. Not much I can say about that that others have not already.
After the so called "Bad Guys" panel ended, I realized I needed to hit the road. I said my goodbyes to Greg and a few others and made my way back home. I arrived in my apartment in St. Louis very very late Sunday night (Monday morning?).
It was a great trip and I'm thrilled that the Gathering next year will be even closer! Hopefully, I'll be able to bring my friend Ryan and boyfriend Jason along next year, but I know I'll be there at least.
Now, I need to get this posted before the queue closes again.
Thanks Greg, Thom, Karine, the entire Gathering Staff and everyone who came! It was a lot of fun!
Thank you, Matt. I'll admit I did cheat and glanced at your nametag, but now I swear I know your face. (It usually takes me a couple of Gatherings to nail a name and face together on anyone.)
I really enjoyed the Phys/Culture panel also. I'm such a science moron, it felt like a great crypto-education. And, as I'm sure ALL of you know by now, I LOVE talking about this stuff.
If a gargoyle saw and herd the spell in City of Stone whould he stay stone at all times.
Yep. He might have a few seconds here and there, but yep.
If Latin and Hebrew are magical becose of thare age and that the spells where originaly righten in them, why dosn't the Emir in "Grief" read the Egyptian spells in Coptic (the Ancient Egyptian language).
Latin and Hebrew are no more magical than modern languages, but many spells were written originally in those languages. Obviously, for whatever reason, the Emir had his spell translated into English. You may ask, why the heck would he do that? And it's a DARN good question, you know? Darn good. Darn. Good. Darn.
Gargoyles #5: Bash
First off I have to say how spectacular the artwork is looking in this issue; usually I have no problem with the art and actually quite like Hedgcock's work - but Karine Chalebois' experience of the characters certainly shines in what has to be the best looking issue to date! It's not perfect, some of the characters look quite stiff at times (a minor, trivial annoyance in comparison), but there are some scenes which literally shine off the page. I love the view Brendan has of the gargoyles fighting, Thailog and Brentwood gliding off from the Eyrie look spectacular, and Delilah really looks gorgeous as she shines out as her own gargoyle. This issue has made me all the more excited for Bad Guys; with artwork like this hopefully the series will blossom.
But let's get back to the Bash - this issue brings an end to the first all new canon 'episode' and nicely wraps up the story in 3, 4 and 5 whilst setting up even more intriguing questions for future issues.
Side points that really shone out:
There's a couple of familiar faces waiting for us outside the lift; seeing Mary and Finella makes me all the more impatient for Timedancer.
Super-goyle: Brooklyn coming out of the elevator like that really made me chuckle - loved it!
The action scenes - this issue was jam packed with action, so much so that I forgot that Thailog's was waiting for Delilah.
Brentwood - Now that was a surprise! I really thought that he would be the one to rebel against his master, but more on that later.
Now onto the story:
One con about getting the comic a week after everyone else is that the internet is a minefield of spoilers. Despite my best efforts to avoid spoiling the story I somehow found out that Delilah didn't choose Thailog and that Thailog's real goal in attacking was to obtain DNA from the gargoyles.
This latter revelation disappointed me before I'd even got the comic- why? When I heard DNA I thought more clones all over again - which didn't make sense. Thailog already had minions which listen to his beck and call why make more? I didn't understand it. I still don't really.
But as I thought about it (after I actually read the story) I became intrigued. What does Thailog actually want with DNA of the clan? What more could Sevarius do with gargoyle DNA that he hasn't done already (aside from Voodoo magic)? And I'm sure Thailog being a member of the Illuminati (which was a shock of sheer genius) complicates the matter even further. I suppose I'll just have to wait for the rest of Clan Building (and hopefully the rest of season 3) for all of this to be answered. But I have to say I'm intrigued, even excited. And as for Shari, well, she's certainly full of surprises - a number 9! Greg you certainly know how to leave us begging for more! So Shari, the mysterious unnamed woman who's been hanging around in the Labyrinth, is now Thailog's new executive assistant and outranks him as a fellow Illuminatus. And what exactly do the Illuminati want with the gargoyles?
Speaking of the Illuminati, we're certainly learning a lot more about them; Duval is actually no. 2 alongside Quincy Hemings. Who is number 1 then? Hmmm…
So the greeting that started off as 36 : 32 and ended as 36 : 9 is actually a ranking system; with thirty-six 36s, thirty-five 35s, all the way up to two 2s and one 1 that leads up to 666 members!
The Illuminati are certainly turning into the big players of this season, with their fingers in almost all the pots; financing the Quarrymen, overviewing the taskforce, a high ranking member is now working for Thailog, and now they're sending Xanatos on secret missions. These guys are really coming out to the forefront dominating the entire scene from behind the curtains.
Enough of secret societies; lets talk clones again.
One interesting thing about Bash is that the clones, especially Delilah, really come out of their shells.
Delilah: One interesting point was Owen finding her standing around in Xanatos' lab. Wonder what she was doing in there.
I was actually surprised by her language skills; they seem to be a lot better than that of the other clones.
"Is that an order, Angela? Or am I truly free to make my own choices?"
I said that I unfortunately knew already from spoilers that Delilah didn't go with Thailog. So when I first read Delilah say "I believe this fighting may cease now" I thought that she was going to spurt something cheesy to Thailog about him attacking her "friends" so she isn't going to go with him. But to my surprise and delight she makes the above retort to Angela. And after that she starts digging into a wounded Goliath.
"You used me!"
Wow! Not only had she been secretly listening to Goliath and Elisa's heart to heart from the previous issue, but she now reproaches Goliath for bringing her to Xanatos' Masque Ball. Her general attitude towards the Manhattan clan seems to be one of a cold unconcerned frigidity; her short responses to Goliath's proposal in "Invitation Only" at first seems as if she is only acting under her 'Obey Thailog' instincts. And throughout "Masque" she seems quiet and unresponsive; she doesn't stand out. It's only in response to seeing her "brothers" in trouble that she comes out of herself. At first I thought her command to stop the fighting was addressed to Thailog, but I'm now starting to think as to whether she was also addressing the Manhattan gargoyles who she feels are attacking her brothers.
Now onto her brothers;
Malibu: Well he's certainly Brooklyn's clone; this green gargoyle's smitten with Delilah and I think the main reason he stopped fighting is because Delilah arrived and suggested leaving for the labyrinth.
Hollywood: Gar-girl (lol!) that's all I'm going to say!
Brentwood: This guy is turning into a real character! Interestingly he takes a passive role in the fighting and just sits on the sidelines watching. From his constant utterances of "free-will" on Maggie's prompting I was thinking that if anyone would leave Thailog to join the side of the Angels, it would be this guy. I'm going to be following his character development with great interest (hopefully it'll involve gaining better diction and vocabulary). "Thailog smart."
"Dude, you're really making me look bad!"
Lex's reaction though is priceless, but still quite shocking. I feel sorry for the clones at times; these poor souls compelled by their master to attack their "parents" who then later shun them making them live in the underground sewers. Lex doesn't seem concerned that his clone is aligning with the "bad guy" but rather that Brentwood's choice plays badly upon himself.
The Manhattan clan wanted nothing to do with their clones originally; but I feel this only helped to bring this band of misfits even closer. And maybe this abandonment helps explain Delilah's coldness to Goliath's clan. Last time they met she was beaten and chained by Angela; her brothers also beaten and then the five of them are taken in by Talon.
Delilah shines out as the more astute and most intellectually developed and as thus stands out as their natural leader. The other clones seem like children in comparison - "Labyrinth good", "Hollywood not fight" - and in turn Delilah seems to have picked up the 'big sister' role. I think this clan's development is going to be interesting.
Thailog and Sevarius interestingly rendezvous at Nightstone. One thing that struck me when Thailog attacked the Labyrinth to collect his "property" - this is the gargoyle that swindled Xanatos of $20 million and tried to kill Demona and Macbeth only to obtain their fortunes, why would his first course of action upon resurfacing be to collect his minions? He had invested millions into Nightstone and I thought his primary goal would have been to recover his company from Demona. Surprisingly (this issue is full of surprises) it seems Thailog doesn't think he needs to take back Nightstone hostilely; it's obviously more profitable to bankroll Sevarius behind Demona's back.
Dr Sato's reappearance was a welcome return. And it seems he's now been thrust into friendship with the gargoyles. Look forward to how this turns out.
Brendan seems to be close to the end with Margot; he's also got another up close view of the gargoyles.
This review's seems to have turned more into a ramble; all I can say is that this issue was spectacular. I thoroughly enjoyed it. 5/5 well done!
Glad you like it. I wouldn't count Margot out as far as Brendan's concerned though...
Hi Greg. With the success of the Transformers movie and the CGI that went with it, if you got an offer to do a Gargoyles movie with the gargoyles being CGI, would you do it? If you did, I would assume that you would want to use the original voice actors for the gargoyles, but what about the humans in the series? Would you use the original actors or bring in new people? Who would you have play the various roles like Elisa, Xanatos, Fox, and Owen?
Of course, I'd be interested. If for no other reason then it would guarantee the release of the rest of the episodes.
As to casting, I'd love to cast Salli, Jonathan and Jeff as their respective characters. As much as I love Laura, though, I'm afraid she doesn't really look anything like Fox. Don't have anyone in mind... because Laura's so vocally wonderful in the part. But the truth is, casting of the humans would depend quite a bit on financing issues. So this hypothetical is really just that.
Oh dear freaking god!!
In all the joyful bouncing I was doing, I totally forgot something.
The KISS! (Once again, this is where the giant pink sparkly heart would go).
Greg, the next time I make it to The Gathering (ha!) I totally owe you a major hug (how about a bum pinch, that ok too?) :D
Let's start with the hug and see where things go... ;)
I can't remember if I sumbitted a review for the last 4 issues, so I made sure to write one up today :D
I wish we could use HTML on this page, as I would write the word LOVE in giant pink letter, maybe with a sparkle effect. Because I truly do love it.
It's so exciting to get new stories, and this one, oh it just keeps getting better and better. Some questions are answered, a heap more asked and the tension kinda went through the roof :)
Brooklyn's costume reveal gave me the giggles, and I can't help but have a little soft spot for Brendan. I'd like to think he was the one who told Dr Sato that there was someone injured out in the courtyard.
Karine and Steph make an excellent art team, I can't wait to see how Karine goes with Bad Guys.
Greg, thank you once again for giving us Gargoyles.
Thank you, Julie, for being there to receive it!
Did Fox know about Owen/Puck before The Gathering. Though she is suprised by the revelation of her mother's identity? She just doesn't appear startled by the existence of purly magical beings (though, she was preoccupied by worry for her child).
I'm not sure she did.
Wow! What an awesome new gargoyles comic! Number 4 & 5 were brilantly written. I also would like to say that Guler is the man, and Lostimolo is coloriffic. When I saw the cover of #5 I was thrilled as well as horriffied (poor goliath). I had to read it twice to get all the refferences stright.
The Illuminati's numbering system seems to indicate that for every number, there is that amount of people involved, is this the same all the way from 1 to 36?
I also feel bad for Lex since he was dressed just like his "future tense" self as a costume, and his clone brentwood chose to stay with Thalog. Could this be an Omen?
O.o Actullay Brooklyn wasn't having a good night either, witnessing all the couples holding each other at the end. I'm beggining to think that "Time Dancer" may play a role in his future (since everyone seems to be taken)Care to elaborate?
*>.<* still can't believe that Brooklyn's clone is going to make it with someone before he does, any chance that Delilah's affinity for Malabu is really because of her feelings for Brook?
I can't wait for the next Issue!
As alway's you ROCK Greg!
Delilah probably isn't quite as shallow as Brooklyn, I'm guessing.
And yes, just as it's described in the issue, you've got the Illuminati number system right.
I really, really hope the other colourists on the comic take note of Stephanie's colours here. One of the big issues in "Awakening" was the colour and beauty of the city and this is the first time that I've felt the comic has really conveyed that to full effect. The colours on the comic have been good so far, and obviously the darker shades are more intuitive for a comic of this nature, but this issue really captures the feel of the series.
Obviously a big part of that is the tag-team with Kanthara's line-art. And I think you really see the benefit of having people on the art who have a long experience with the series, from little things -- check out the moon, just like the series! -- to the real meat of the story: the characters. Odd things like Brooklyn's superhero pose, the Lex/Brentwood panel really nail the essence of the characters, their movements, the way they carry themselves. All the star characters look amazing, the battle sequences, the cityscapes... a real joy. Smashing work by Kanthara and Stephanie.
Greg B mentioned that the 'Gargoyles' and spin-off art teams would be better off switched around and I do tend to agree. Kanthara rocks the core characters but is on the spin-off book charting new territory in the universe. David Hedgecock is the fresh eye but he's in the shadow of the original series which entrenched a very specific vision of these main guys in our mind. It seems counterintuitive. But I rate both artists and I'm really excited by the prospect of seeing their work on alternate months.
Script-wise, I enjoy the focus on a major narrative strand at last. I found #4 highly entertaining but with so many different things happening, no single plot seemed to have something big happening. This issue has much more momentum and while I love the expansive universe, I hope most stories won't have quite so many separate subplots.
- The clones seem to have characteristics of their 'parents' and it's fun to see how a few lines kind of sets them apart from each other. Brentwood has Lexington's appreciation for intelligence and perhaps some of his capacity for hero worship. Hollywood seemed to enjoy 'playing monster' ("ROOOARR") rather than being genuinely villainous; he's also the only clone who specifically says he wants to not fight. Malibu has Brooklyn's weakness for women, and seems to follow Delilah as keenly as Brooklyn briefly followed Demona. Actually the Clone-Trio's stories here remind me a lot of moments from 'Deadly Force'. Lex falls in with the Pack; Brentwood falls in with Thailog. Brooklyn is starstruck by Demona; Malibu by Delilah. Broadway plays with a gun; Hollywood plays monster. Hard to tell much about Burbank except that he seems to have Hudson's love of the home -- he latches onto the idea of the Labyrinth specifically.
- "I wouldn't want to inhibit you, dear boy" -- great line.
- Thailog in the Illuminati will be very interesting. I wonder how fast our four 36es will climb the pyramid... especially Thailog and Xanatos.
- Thailog doesn't want Goliath dead. Which isn't a big surprise thinking about it (even in "Double Jeopardy", the planned murder wasn't the main aim, and he's already seen the benefit in Sevarius), but shows his Xanatosian strategist side is alive and well.
- Picking up some earlier Ask Greg comments by Alex Garg and Greg B, the slight hypocrisy in the clan's treatment of the clones fascinates me. They boss them around, call them "stupid clone!" and "forgery" and "bastard" (admittedly two of these to Thailog where their disgust is quite justified). But the gargoyles are seen to have 'attacked' the city and the people of NY are lashing out at them, calling them monsters, inhuman, without emotions. But outside Goliath croaking Delilah's name, none of the clones are addressed by name, or even shown any warmth or respect. Lex can't even look Brentwood in the eye at the end, he's more worried about his own standing with the clan. They seek tolerance, but don't offer it to the clones in a meaningful way.
- I like the Xanatosian plan-within-a-plan ending but it does mean that, at the end, this story turns out to be a bit of a cue-chalker for Thailog and Xanatos. Where's this going? Suspense!
- In #3, Hacker said that Duval went to a lot of trouble to arrange the meeting at the White House -- but now we find that it's Duval's equal he's talking to. I can see inviting a couple of ex-cons to a White House party might be politically risky, but I wonder if it was more of a comment on the relationship between the two Twos.
A couple of questions:
1. If #3-5 was an episode, which title would it have gone by? It would be nice to have a single name to refer to it (like #1-2's overall title is still "The Journey" to me) as rather than just issue numbers or a bunch of titles. I think "Masque" seems to be the most all-encompassing title, and we start #3 with a mask on the table and end with an unmasking.
2. I'm not really clear what the function of the Clan-Building title is. Can we expect the last story in the arc to provide some form of (what I imagine would be very open-ended) closure for the story elements currently prominent in the comic, or is it just like a banner title for ease of reference (and for selling trades?), e.g. The World Tour.
Anyway, I'm having a blast. Everyone involved with the comic is doing great work.
1. I've answered this, but I also disagree with the premise. #1&2's "overall title" is only "The Journey" because you know what it was adapted from. But that's old news. The title of issue 1 is "Nightwatch". The title of issue #2 is "The Journey". The title of issue #3 is "Invitation Only". And etc. We're in a different medium. It's pointless to attempt to import tv traditions into it.
2. One would hope that it's more than just a banner. You can decide for yourself in a year.
Would Demona keep on trying to kill Goliath and the others, if doing so would ruin her relationship with Angela?
Would she be willing to sacrifice her relationship with Angela if it meant accomplishing her goals?
Demona has a knack for making her own life miserable. Not to mention the lives of those she most cares about. Beyond that, I'll leave these questions to your own imagination.
What would Demona think of Alan Weisman's novel "The World Without Us"?
I have no idea. Haven't read it myself. Never heard of it actually.
Hey Greg! Thought it was high time to enter my review for #5 Bash!!
First off, it's a shame I coudn't make it to this year's Gathering. However, now knowing that there's bound to be some surprises like Issuess 3,4,&5 for the Radio Play have finally given me the motivation to try Chicago (It's closer, so there's hope!)
Second, on my way to get this comic, I just BARELY got the last one. I followed your advice thi time, Greg and I told the clerk that if they keep running short (it was barely noon!) that they should start ordering more. He assured me that they would do so this September!
Anways, here's my thoughts for Bash:
Beautiful shot of the Eyrie Building. Nice to see the Third Quarter Moon too . . . reminder that it's only been about two weeks since Hunter's Moon.
Mary & Finella . . . Greg, you smug mastermind! You just love throwing little surprises like that, huh? :P
Nice to see Dr. Sato again, though I honestly forgot what he looked like since I haven't seen Deadly Force in about six months.
Brooklyn's costume was wonderful, and it was my brother who noticed that his red wings acted like his cape!
I always did love that line of Robbins' in Dying of the Light about Conrete & Leather, so I was glad to see that survive into Canon.
Quincy & Xanatos were quite fun to watch, especially Quincey's line of "Now don't get smart, boy!" Knowing his estamated age, Hemings has every right to call him that!
I noticed how Thailog kept retracting his blades and using new clean ones, and I first wondered, Does he have a Danny Tanner/Jerry Seinfeld complex of having to always be neat and clean? Then it all made sense: He was taking DNA samples. While I enjoyed this revelation, I was kinda surprised that Thailog would use an old tactic again, clearly when the last time resulted in losing the Clones.
However, I then remembered Xanatos telling Goliath that old habits die hard as well as the thought that maybe Thailog is merely using an old tactic for a new means . . . and as some have said below, he and Sevarius are probably planning an army.
The shot of Thailog & Brentwood leaving the Eyrie was spectacular, IMO.
Brooklyn has one of the best lines in this issue, "You gotta be kidding me!", while looking at Delilah & Malibu. Good lord, his luck is terrible . . . for now at least.
Finally, the new girl . . . well, we don't have to call her new girl anymore, now do we? Shari . . . and she's a rank of nine. And Thailog's a Thirty-six!! Wow . . . wonder what they did to earn those spots??
Speaking on the Illuminati Ranks:
It appears that only WE are surprised by Duval's Number with the fact that even Xanatos knows he's Number #2.
666 Members (or possible members) of the most influential people on earth . . . wow.
Who IS One? I guess we'll find out soon enough . . .
Anyways, #6 can't come soon enough! Thanks again for such a great return into the Gargoyles Universe!
You're welcome. Thanks for being there to read it!
Hey! I'm a big fan of SRMTHFG. Too bad the show's over... for now... I also loved the episodes you worked on. So, what do you think is gonna happen? Who's gonna win the battle? What do you think the battle's gonna be like? Did you enjoy your part as Chiro?
I'm afraid I have no inside info on the Monkey Team. I did have fun writing those two scripts, though the end result was somewhat different than what I wrote.
are gargoyles apart of the reptilian species or something else?
Just came around a character called Reynard T. Fox who also happens to be fox. The character is from a comicbook named Fables i was just wondering if your Fox inspired this character or was Fox inspired by this character or was Fox inspired by something completely different? Is there a significance to the Renard name?
Renard meens Fox in French.
hi greg iam wondering why dose't slg have gargoyles#5 yet what is going on
They do. Check again, please.
Is there any special requirement for the learning of magic (besides the obvious time, preparation and practice)? That is, is everyone capable of performing sorcery if they learn how?
Some would have a greater aptitude than others, I would think, but sure.
Is there any specific, ritualized behavior associated with Gargoyle mating habits (as in, different from humans)?
I'm not trying to ask any, um... dirty questions here, but are Gargoyles anatomically equipt the same (or analogous) as humans?
Speaking of which, Gargates are mammals arn't they? What else would breasts be for, if not for suckling young?
Gargates are gargates, which doesn't mean they don't have things in common with mammals, including breasts which are indeed for nursing and genitals. I think at the Gathering we called this convergent evolution or somesuch.
how will brooklyn and fu-dog get allong when the meet how will fu-dog responed to brooklyn what will be brooklyns reaction to fu-dog
You'll have to wait and see, I'm afraid.
ISSUE 5 - BASH
So, we see more of Sir Ian of Oxford, and also…is that Tom's mother and wossername - the lass who was smitten with Constantine? Bah! You're not going to tell if it is, and I can't be the first one to notice that.
So, Morgan doesn't feel too bad about being rejected - glad he was prepared for it.
Hmmm…so, according to this Number 2, there would be…uh-huh…666 members of the Illuminati. Was this intentional?
So, Brooklyn was going to be Supergoyle, not the Scarecrow. Interesting twist.
And you can tell, when Elisa sees one of Bruno's boys, that she knows something wrong.
Thailog's reaction to Angela's exclamation is akin to my own - I'm surprised that Disney let that through.
Yay for the Old Fart. And this scene is a little reminiscent of Hudson's "outing" in TGC: Dying of the Light. From what I understood, that scene was not one of the bits they took from you. Any reason you decided to include this?
It's a bird! It's a plane! It's…SUPERGOYLE!!
"I'm part of this clan…nothing will ever change that!" How sentimental of Elisa.
"So for decades, the leader of the Free World has been…" "shootin' the breeze in my kitchen every night."
This doesn't come as a surprise. It's been said that even the President works for them.
Uh-oh…Brendan's seen the Gargoyles…this looks to be some serious trouble.
So Thailog calls Delilah "Angel"? Interesting… I don't recall him using that pet name for her, or Demona.
"'Delilah can mean nothing to me.' You used me."
Interesting…I hope that Goliath can clear things up with her. I don't want to see bad blood between the two clans.
Mmmm…Goliath agrees with what I said last review. This pleases me.
So…Dr. Sato now gets pulled into "the know." Let's hope he can be trusted.
And you already know my feelings about the resolution of the Goliath-Elisa relationship.
So, Thailog is still working with Sevarius. No big surprise there…as opposed to the sudden revelation about Shari, Illuminatus Rank 9.
So, let's see…so far, we know of…
ILLUMINATI RANK 36
ILLUMINATUS RANK 32
ILLUMINATUS RANK 9
ILLUMINATI RANK 2
The mysterious Mr. Duval.
I have no doubt that we'll be seeing more soon.
Sleep well, Greg. Pleasant dreams.
The Dying of the Light scene was NOT one of mine -- though the long term plan for Jeff to learn Hudson's identity and be okay with it was. But it seemed to me that that one line of dialogue was a fan-favorite... and since there were few of those in the Goliath Chronicles, I thought a nod to one of the times they got things right was a nice tribute to all the hard work that the TGC crew put in, with little thanks or reward.
Written before release of Issue 5
ISSUE 4 - MASQUE
Once again, Greg, you have completely failed to disappoint.
Last issue, when Hudson said that he had a "previous engagement," I had a feeling that he was going to be spending Hallowe'en with Jeffrey. (Hey, it was either that or spend the party night watching Celebrity Hockey, eh?)
I'm assuming that Margot had intended for herself and Brendan to have a "couple's costume". If Brendan was supposed to be Valentino, who was Margot dressed as?
And the Clan is continuing the costume themes: the Trio (now plus Angela) with their "costume over a costume" as someone put it in "Eye" (was it Vinnie?), and Elisa with her Disney Princess motif. I think she makes a good Jas.
I like Angela's reaction to Elisa with a date. She's a "daddy's girl" through and through.
Nice little continuation from the previous issue with Thailog. A follow-up on his "Trick or treat?" line at the start of the "commercial break." Also, his preparation for the assault is another prime example of his Xanatos-like mindset - prepare for anything. And of course, with Thailog alive, it only makes sense that he'd try to reclaim the Clones.
How did Judge Roebling mistake Delilah for Demona? The coloring's all wrong, and when last he saw, she and Goliath were clearly not on pleasant terms.
Poor "G"…heart breaking… and poor Brooklyn, still ever-so-smitten.
You've commented that Alex X. looks old for his age. Am I correct in guessing that this has to do with his heritage - specifically his maternal grandmother?
I notice that, in contrast with his meeting with Agent Hacker, David looks not at all pleased to speak with mister "Two."
So, the Clones are not quite free of Thailog's programming. Makes sense, as it's been three months at the most since they were "liberated" from him.
I hope we finally get to find out what our mysterious goth girl's name is next ish (she looks like an Alex to me, but with Baby X, that might get confusing).
I kind of feel sorry for Morgan. Elisa built up his hopes on this date, and now it looks like he's being let down again.
Yay for more troubles in the G&E romance dept. I feel bad for them, but it makes for good story writing. Speaking of good writing, I hope that things don't end up all better at the end of the "episode," that would seem a little too sitcom-like to me.
"…your penchant for drama always exceeds expectations, Father." Thailog always seems to know how to push Goliath's buttons, doesn't he?
And let's hear a "Good boy, Owen!" He wouldn't be the major-domo he is, if he didn't try to keep the party going well.
And Owen raises a good point: if Delilah is to have free will, she needs the opportunity to make the decision for herself - even if the decision she makes is the "wrong" one.
OOOHH! Cliffhanger! Great place for the commercial break. Can't wait to see what happens in the final act. Will Goliath survive?!
Well, of course he will, as our leading man. But still…
And I leave you with this thought: You said that, in the comics, three issues is the equivalent of one TV episode. If you were to clump issues 3-5 together into an episode, what title would you use?
Either "Masque" or "Bash", but I'm trying not to slip into t.v. habits. We're in a new medium now.
Margot was a flapper of your choice.
Roebling doesn't really think in terms of their being a lot of gargoyles. He saw a female, he thought of the female he knew of. They all look alike to him. Particularly when he's a touch sloshed.
I know you must get hundreds of these questions every month, but I'd heard Gargoyles #5 was out July 18th and So far neither Slavelabor, nor Amazon, nor my local comic store have any information on it. Why so many set backs to getting them published on time (or at all in most cases)? And aside from asking you every month when they'll be out, is there some place that updates regularly on the status? I know you must be frustrated as much as we are about trying to find the comics in stores and on time..
Gargoyles #5 is out and went on sale at comic book stores this past July. I have NO clue why your store has no info. But that really is an issue with YOUR store. Diamond had it available for distribution. As for SLG, you have to understand that it is a VERY small company, and with the San Diego ComicCon taking up much time and energy, the folks there were a bit slow to get it up on their site, but it IS there now. Amazon... well, you got me. I would hope it's up there now.
This is the first time I'm asking a question here, so I'd like to start by saying thank you for keeping such a close relationship to the fans of your work. That's a rare thing nowadays.
I also want to thank you for creating the greatest animated series ever. I absolutely loved the Gargoyles TV show during the time it aired here in Germany and still do. Sadly, there were no re-runs to date. But I managed to get the episodes via some dark pipes of the internet and while doing so, I noticed that, although the german show had very good speakers, the original english version sounds even better. I'd really like to get those DVDs to enjoy the episodes a) in full quality, b) with subtitles for those parts that are a bit hard to understand, and last but not least c) legally, wich would calm my consience. Sadly, there's no way to obtain the show on DVD here. Disney's european partner, Buena Vista International, hasn't released the DVDs here and the american ones have a region code that prevents us europeans from watching them. I don't know why they didn't release them here, apparently the show was very successful in europe. Here in germany, it looked like it didn't recieve quite the attention it could have, because it aired on a channel that had a much younger audience than the one the show was aimed at, but everyone who knew about the show really liked it a lot and I for one knew a lot of people who knew it. And from what I heard, it was an even bigger big hit in france. But still these facts don't seem to be sufficient enough to convince BVI to consider a european DVD release.
So, summarized, it might be bad that there are only 1 and a half seasons out there with the other half of season 2 missing, but for everyone outside of the US it's even worse, for we have nothing at all!
But now there is the comic. Fortunately, paper has no region codes yet. ;-)
Finally I'm able to enjoy my favourite animated series of all time again, I asked my local comic book store if they could import the comic and they confirmed it. I have to catch up a bit now, because when I heard about the existence of the new comic via pure coincidence, the first three episodes were already out. That discovery re-lighted the torch I once carried for the Gargoyles show and I looked around a bit and found out about stuff like the GotG-Con and websites like the Gargoyles-Wiki and this one. It's unbelievably great to see that there are so many others who also love this show as much as I do.
Ok, enough babbling, let's get to my question:
How will the narrative of the Gargoyles comic book series look like in the future? Will we get more or less closed chapters, spread across a few issues but with a defined ending for each story arc? Or will it turn out to be like so many other comic series that seem to have no real endings, because almost every issue ends with another cliffhanger?
I really hope not... Cliffhangers are useful for keeping the reader's anticipation up, but if even the final episode of a story arc hasn't a real ending but introduces the next arc instead, just to be able to place yet another cliffhanger, it becomes very annoying. Especially with 2 or more months waiting time between two issues. I really hope Bad Guys will be a success, so all of the other mini-series can be produced and sold in between the regular series' releases as well. New stories from the Gargoyles universe every month sounds almost too good to be true... Keep up the great work!
Greetings from Germany,
I'm big on open-ended closure. We will have some cliffhangers, of course, but if you've managed to catch up on the issues you've missed, you'll see that both issues 2 and 5 ended small story arcs. The same will be true for issues 6, 9 and especially 12, which will conclude the Clan-Building arc.
Having said that, nothing in Gargoyles truly "ends". So even issue 12 will still leave some aspects unresolved, and in fact will intentionally raise more and new questions.
Gargoyles #7; "The Rock", is it about Pendragon, or Demona, or Hakon?
I'm not revealing any more at this time beyond what is stated in the solicitation blurb, which can be found here: http://gargoyles.dracandros.com/The_Rock
I know all about the drama that involves Season 2 Vol. 2 and getting Disney/BVHE to release them, so I'll spare you that much. However, I would like to know the following: Is there an alternative to purchasing said second half of the season, or has one even exisited in the past? You know, like that big black thing with the magnetic tape called VHS that is going out of style now?
Could you list the following characters in order of natural intelligence?
Sevarius, Xanatos, Fox, Goliath, Angela, Broadway, Hudson, Elisa, Brooklyn, Lexington, Delilah, Demona, Desdemona, Coldstone, Coldsteel, Gabriel, Ophelia, Princess Katherine, Magus, Tom, Titania, Oberon, Halcyon, Puck, Fang, Talon, Claw, Maggie, Finella, Mary.
P.S I know its an odd question but i'm just curious about a lot of hypothetical questions and i think this could clear things up for me. Just some examples of the questions i think could be cleared up by this question.
1)Could Goliath have the same potential for magic as Demona? 2)Could Demona have the same potential for science as Sevarius etc.
I'd assume Hudson and Broadway or Fox and Xanatos would have roughly the same natural intelligence level in cases like that could you list character of the same intelligence in a row.
I didn't include the clones with exception of Delilah because they'd all have the same level of natural intelligence as their counterparts wouldn't they?
Where was Fox during City of stone part 2 til 4?
did she remain in the helicopter whole night during part 2?
did she know what exactly happened during the entire episodes?
She was stone in the helicopter for the night. Then at daybreak, she awoke, and -- I'm sure -- returned to the castle. The situation was probably explained to her, and I would think David would do his best to make sure that by nightfall she was in a secure location.
What is the bionicle story about anway? I've seen the movei's that I have but I still don't understand what it's about. And why Arn't into bionicle any more?
It's been so long...
To answer your second question first, I was -- basically -- fired by Lego (for yawning). It left a bad taste in my mouth, so I don't follow the property anymore.
As to what it's about, it's about a race of robots. Beyond that basic bit of info, I can only recommend reading the comics, checking out the website or the movies.
How did Xanatos tell Fox about what happened to her in the episode eye of the beholder? and what was Fox's reaction?
I'll leave that to your imagination.
i thought angela had a thing for brooklyn why does she end up with broadway
<<<We were never hinting toward Brooklyn/Angela. Quite the reverse. Gary Sperling and I made this decision together when he was working on Turf. But it just felt right. Broadway seemed the guy who was most attentive to Angela as an individual. The person most in touch with his so-called feminine side. Brooklyn was just after any chick with wings, frankly. And I think Lex pursued her because his brothers were and it seemed like the right thing to do. Only Broadway was interested in who Angela was. In my mind, he's clearly the most mature when it comes to this stuff. Brooklyn's a leader. And I love the guy, but he confuses a crush with deep abiding love. He needs a little more emotional maturity before he's ready for this "Gargoyles mate for life" thing.>>>
Or if you prefer:
<<<Angela and Brooklyn were NEVER an "item". NEVER. Brooklyn certainly had a crush on her. But so did Lex and Broadway. And Broadway's feelings for her were deeper almost from the night they met. And if you caught the look they exchanged at the end of "Possessions" you would have seen that the only "item" in works was Angela & Broadway.>>>
Would you say that it was Demona's fault for creating the Hunter, since it was she who mutilated the young boy's face? I've heard that the boy had an inner darkness inside him, but didn't Demona bring it to the surface by attacking him that day?
Blame to go around.
greg do u think if there was a medical procedur to change a human in to a gargoyle,(full blown everthing glowing,eyes'stone skin,ect)
peopel would it do you think most of all the fans would do it. how would you feel about fans turning them selfs in to real gargoyles
would have it done
thanks for your time
Seriously? Tattoos make me squeemish.
How come Hudson doesn't take on a more fatherly role with the Trio? He seemed to with Goliath and to a lesser extent Demona.
I'd argue he does, keeping in mind that he views the three of them as young adults, not children.
how will brooklyn and katana get along when they first meet what will katana be like how will brooklyn feel about her and how will katana feel about brooklyn
Patience is necessary for all concerned.
My Review for #5
The art is beautiful...Karine and Stephanie did a wonderful job. All the characters on model, colors are great. Finally the male gargoyles don't have 200 pound boulder muscles.
-I love that first panel of the eyrie building! That must have been fun to construct...
-Mary and Finella-hm, don't know what to think about them. Why didn't they meet the gargoyles? I guess they're in costumes of...themselves from 1000 years ago? Cuz I really hope Mary hasn't been wearing that rag on her head for 20 years.
-Dr. Sato is on the scene...we know where this is going. Good thing he's there--coincidence?
-I love those altered glass slipper foot coverings on Angela. I don't think we've ever seen gargoyle foot wear. I also like Broadway's full lion body suit, even though he didn't have it on last issue. It's so cute, especially when we see a shot of his back with the tail hehe.
- Oh man, is Thailog mean or what? He slams Goliath headfirst into a wall AFTER he stabs him. Talk about low.
-So Duval's not number one. Hm interesting. There's been some pretty cool theories going around S8. I don't really know enough about Arthurian legend to speculate though.
-hilarious moment when Brooklyn makes his grand entrance as "Super-Goyle." I like how he shows up right after Margot is berating Brendan for his "stupid get-up". It's funny, when people in here were discussing what they thought Brooklyn would show up as and it wasn't the Scarecrow, I predicted he would be a superhero of some sort, but I didn't post my thoughts about it, ah well. I'm phsychic! Not really, cause I was totally wrong about Brentwood, which I'll get to later.
-Angela: "YOU BASTARD!" Mwahahah. Note to self...Angela is not a sweet little angel, don't get on her bad side-well, unless of course you're Thailog, who was able to slash the whole Manhattan clan singlehandedly. I have no doubt he could have killed them all if he had aimed for their necks.
-I figured Robbins knew Hudson was a gargoyle. Though I'm not sure how he equates the smell of "old leather and concrete" to gargoyles if he only heard about them on the news. And does stone skin actually smell like stone? Does Robbins know the gargoyles turn to stone?
Anyway, some nice elements from the TGC ep, "The Dying of the light" which was one of the better ones of that series. I always kind of liked in that episode how Robbins was annoyed at Hudson for assuming he would want nothing to do with Hudson once he found out he was a gargoyle. Robbins seems to be taking it all in stride here though.
-The fight scenes look great. Very dynamic, and I can tell what's going on, which I had trouble with in earlier issues. I especially love that bird's eye shot of the whole clan and the clones.
-Elisa: "I'm a part of this clan." I think here she realizes that she can never have a normal life as she expected to. How many humans are members of gargoyle clans? I'm willing to bet she's the only one.
Thailog comes on to Elisa as he slashes her. He seems to have a creepy attraction to her...eww.
-Xanatos gets his first assignment from the illuminati. I'm betting it has something to do with the gargoyles. This could cause a lot of problems. I love Xanatos'smirk at Quincy when he's a smart aleck with him.
-Owen finds Delilah...in Xanatos' lab...Okay. Delilah struts into the fight and effectively stops it. I had thought she would be this meek defenseless creature, boy was I wrong. She rocks! She really sticks out as one of the most attractive female gargoyles of the series, if not the most attractive. Goliath must have it really bad for Elisa since he hardly looked Delilah's way. She sticks it to Goliath--who deserves it since he was kind of a jerk to her--but she should wait until he's not spilling his guts on the floor.
-Thailog takes Delilah's refusal in stride. I wasn't expecting that. Obviously she isn't the real reason he came to the castle. He's such a nonchalant jerk-I love him!
-Brentwood stays with Thailog. I had thought he would be the one to go back to the labyrinth. Very tricky! I love Lex's reaction to it-seeing his clone's desicion as a bad reflection on him.
-That's such a beautiful image of Thailog and Brentwood leaving the castle-it just sticks out.
-I've heard that Brendan is the one who alerted DR. Sato. So he does have compassion after all. I hope he leaves that witch of a wife.
So DR. Sato saved Elisa's life and now he's saving Goliath's. Nice, they owe that man a lot.
-and then comes my favorite panels of the book, probably of the whole comic series. Goliath and Elisa exchange "I love you"'s and they kiss! SQUEEEEEEE!!! I've been waiting for this for so long, and seeing it in the morning before work literally made my day. I honestly didn't expect them to say IT so soon, so I was pleasantly surprised. And Goliath's smiling even though he's probably in a heapload of pain--Awwww.
(Though I am somewhat surprised that Goliath is still conscious at this point. Though it's harder to tell passage of time in the comic than in the series, so maybe the fight wasn't as long as it seemed.)
-Brooklyn: "Oh, you gotta be kiddin' me..." hehehe. Even his clone gets more tail than him.
-It took my third reading before I realized Thailog was in Nightstone Unlimited. Hmm, interesting. It seems Sevarius still works there. And we find out Thailog's primary objective for picking up the clones and Delilah was really to get DNA from the clan, one of them being Elisa's, hmm. Thailog+Sevarious+Gargoyle DNA= Very Scary!
-And then we have the shocking ending-Thailog is in the Illuminati, and he's working with Shari the "Labyrinth Girl" who's really high up there on the food chain. Hard times are coming for the clan...I wonder if the Illuminati are in on Thailog's clone plans.
Anyway this has been the most awesome issue so far and I can't wait to read where this is heading. Great job everyone!
Would Demona kill Angela if it meant the achievement of her goal, or would that be too much even for her?
What do you think?
Will we see the romance between Delilah and Malibu develop in the comics?
If it does, you will.
Are sales picking up for Gargoyles Season 2, Volume 1 on DVD yet for Disney to release Season 2, Volume 2 of Gargoyles on DVD that I want to get to complete the entire series of Gargoyles on DVD? Thank you and have a nice day.
Jonny, Jonny, Jonny, Jonny, whoops, Jonny, whoops, Jonny, Jonny, Jonny, Jonny...
Yes, in the three weeks since you LAST asked this question the ENTIRE SITUATION has changed! YAY!!! All is solved! All is grand!! No need to spread the word!! Just camp out in your local dvd store! They'll be there tomorrow morning! In fact, they're free! In fact, they'll be delivered straight to your house without even having to order them in advance! In fact, God has decided they will fall from the sky like manna from heaven! At least that's what the Archangel Gabriel just told me over cards last night.
1. Since Mr. Duval isn't the head of the Illuminati as previously thought then who is the true number one? Is he a previously established character?
2. Given that the Illuminati has a membership of 666, I guess they aren't ubiquitous as previously thought, so how much control do they really have over world affairs?
3. When was Thailog recruited by them?
1. I'll tell you right here and right now in this forum. Where else would I reveal it after all? The answer is, that is the identity of #1 is >urk< >ugh< did you have to use the slow-acting poisonous blow-darts, you bastard?! You know how painful they are!!!
2. How much do you want them to have?
3. Prior to issue #5.
This is more a ramble reply to Alex Garg's post, but I definitely think this is a fascinating subject, and could make a great Ask Greg discussion.
Honestly, at this point, I don't think anyone in the Manhattan Clan cares much about any of the clones. Any of them. What was the first thing said when Thailog appeared to perish and the clones had no where to go? "We can't just bring them back to the Clock Tower can we? I mean, they kind of give me the creeps."
Right there, the Manhattan Clan wanted nothing to do with them. Wanted to pretend they didn't exist. Let Talon take them to live in a sewer. Out of sight, out of mind. Not that the reaction is not understandable, it is. I think we'd all be uncomfortable around clones of ourselves made against our will and knowledge. It's a fundamental violation of our individuality.
Did any of the Manhattan Clan go down to see them between "The Reckoning" and "Invitation Only"? I'd be very surprised if the answer is yes. The one time they do go down, they want something. Goliath is following Elisa's request to attempt to date Delilah. Brooklyn... just wants to make a play for the only available female he's aware of. They were down there both for selfish reasons.
So, yeah, all of their talk about free will probably was less for the clones' sake, and more towards the Manhattan Clan's hatred for Thailog. They hate Thailog, so naturally they don't want the clones to be helping him. At this point, do they have any other reason to care?
Lexington's only real concern when Brentwood chooses Thailog is how it makes him [Lexington] look. Not concern for Brentwood's safety, or eventually having to face him as an enemy. Lex thinks it makes *him* look bad.
I know this is a pretty serious indictment of the Manhattan Clan. I love them, they are heroes, there's a lot to admire in each and every one of them. But, they're not saints. Which is fine, they're more interesting this way... if I wanted a group of pure goodie goods, I'd read a Silver Age Justice League of America comic book.
I don't disagree with any of the above, but I would temper it.
Again, I think Angela has an INTEREST in individuality and wouldn't want Delilah blindly following ANYONE. Delilah may have reacted to Angela as if Angela was giving her another order, but I don't think it's hard to see that that was clearly NOT Angela's intent. And if your looking for proof, just check out Angela's relationship with Goliath. She respects him as a leader. As a hero. A legend. She loves him as a father. But check out the World Tour, particularly Sanctuary. She's hardly following G. blindly.
And Goliath... in his slow, deliberate, bleeding-to-death way... had clearly given all this some thought too. He told Thailog that Delilah would not CHOOSE him (i.e. Thailog). He may seem confident of this (perhaps even over-confident), but there's nothing to indicate that Goliath plans to decide FOR her. And he doesn't decide for Brentwood either. There's preference and action. Two different things.
This is something that had I wanted to bring up in the Culture/Biology panel at the Gathering, but we ran out of time. Besides, it feels a little better to be able to ask this question now that "Bash" has broad exposure (although it's still new enough to constitute a SPOILER warning).
Gargoyles and Free Will.
A theme of Gargoyles since the introduction of the clones has been just how much control they have over making their own decisions, particularly given that they were programmed to obey Thailog. This comes to a head in "Masque" and "Bash," where the clones are bombarded with the "Free Will" message to the point where they can finally make their choices, but what's most curious to me is the pressure that they receive from the Manhattan Clan.
It doesn't surprise me that Maggie would bring it up in "Masque" - she was born and raised in a democratic society, so the idea that people have free will and the right to self-determination is ingrained in her psyche - but for Goliath and Lexington, and Angela to a lesser extent, to make the case for it in "Bash" was more surprising.
Goliath and Lexington both come from an era where there was no broadly applied concept of a person's right to self-determination. On the human side was the reign of the Catholic Church (and I'm writing very generally now) which in terms of ethics framed the argument for free will in such a way that while humans have the *capacity* to choose between different courses of action, our *obligation* is to obey God's commands; the fact that they did not was why we were expelled from the Garden of Eden. Therefore, under those circumstances, we don't really have a choice - God's infinite wisdom overrides our mortal judgments. That dogma then went on to inform the monarchies of the day, Scotland not excepting, where kings ruled by Divine Mandate. The idea that a king could be overthrown for unjust rule wasn't introduced until St. Thomas Aquinas, an act which prior to him (and even well after) would have been viewed as taking up arms against the will of God; and even then it was the laws of the Church which would be the standard by which a king would be considered ruling in an unjust manner, not the opinions of his subjects.
The gargoyles' "government" also has no apparent nod to free will or self-determination. Goliath became the leader because Hudson said so, Brooklyn became second-in-command because Goliath said so, and in each case the other gargoyles appear to acquiesce unconditionally to these decisions. Even in mating, you mentioned in the panel that gargoyles aren't necessarily choosing mates as much as they are naturally drawn to one another - even in human rituals it's a subject of debate over just how much "choice" we have in when and with whom we fall in love.
While you've said that gargoyles are free to pursue their own hobbies and curiosities, it doesn't strike me that alone is enough to constitute an understanding of free will in the sense of making determinations about leadership in the way that the clones were being pressured to choose between the Labyrinth and Thailog.
So from what we saw in "Bash," where Lexington demands to know why the clones are choosing to help Thailog, and where Goliath says that "choice must extend to those who choose unwisely" - which is a very different concept than a basic, arbitrary choice between right and wrong - I have to ask: Where have Goliath and Lexington gotten the understanding to ask those questions?
Angela also presents an interesting case, because while she was raised by humans, she was raised by humans for whom it can't be assumed would have had the same understanding of free will as you and I do having grown up in a democratic society as it applies to personal choice, much less in making decisions of leadership. So is her command to Delilah founded more on her hatred of Thailog, or is she also making a case for free will; and if the latter, what informs that for her?
Touching on the same vein: Since 1996 would be the first U.S. election year that the gargoyles have really been exposed to - it seems to me that in 1994 the Manhattan clan was more curious about their new physical surroundings than cultural; and it was a midterm election anyway with much less media hype than a presidential cycle - what do the gargoyles of the Manhattan clan make of democracy, given their less than democratic heritage?
Free will seems essential to any discussion of Abrahamic religions... starting with the Garden of Eden. What God wants does not mean He FORCES you to do it, and I think even 10th century Catholics and Scotsmen got this idea whether or not they could articulate it.
And free will doesn't absolve us of personal debts, religious responsibilities, community obligations and the like. (Not to mention the laws of physics. Just because I have the free will to say I want to fly, doesn't mean I can.) Certainly Gargoyles would understand that. One ignores community contracts (even -- again -- if one cannot articulate these ideas) at the risk of banishment. (Cf. Iago, Demona or Yama.)
As for the articulation itself, well... I think we have demonstrated that Goliath is very well read. And that Lex is a very fast study. As for Angela... well, like her mother, she's not one to deny the right of the individual. I'll leave the rest to your interpretation.
Democracy probably seems to them to be the lesser of evils vis-a-vis humans. But I don't think of Gargoyle society as undemocratic per se. Leadership questions don't seem to vibe with democracy gargoyles-wise, but a good leader is sensitive to the needs of those he leads. Hudson chose Goliath, and as far as we know there was only one real objection to the choice (a clear minority). Goliath chose Demona as his second, with no objections that we know of. Goliath chose Brooklyn as his second with, again, NO objections... even from the two other gargoyles competing for the gig. So... draw your own conclusions. Gargoyles may just be better attuned to each other based on NON-verbal cues... They don't need to name things or spend a fortune on television advertisements to know what there community is looking for in a leader.
Or maybe not. Interesting questions. We should definitely raise these issues again next summer.
My review and observations of issue #5, SPOILER heavy.
Starting with the big picture first, this issue is by far the finest to date. It completes the first new canon arc with great pacing, excellent character interactions, and action! Action is always good. The art, too, is some of the best Gargoyles artwork since the series was on air, but then Karine has been drawing Gargoyles artwork since the series was on the air and Stephanie coloring since that time as well, so I will avoid making comparisons to the other artists who have contributed to the comic as newcomers to the property (to say nothing of my bias towards those artists).
Diving into it…
The cover illustration was probably the most eye-grabbing covers I've seen on my local (…ish) comic book store's shelves in a while. It's been a while since Goliath has been so obviously, severely wounded - other times he's tended to suck it up and stay in the fight, this time he was clearly out.
I will be honest that I did NOT catch Mary and Finella's appearance on the first read. It's just been so long since I've seen them that I passed them over; but once I did recognize them, I was glad to see them again - and took my anticipation of Timedancer up a notch.
I also liked how the Judge's opening line was repeated by Thailog under much different circumstances (and I am blanking on the literary term for this…), much like in "Invitation Only" where Thailog took off of the DJ's opening statement.
Jumping ahead to keep with the conflict, I know you said at the Gathering that Angela was speaking *literally* when she called Thailog a bastard, it still seems to me that Angela, of all the clan, would be the least likely to drop that term - because even as Demona's daughter, it's hard for me to perceive even Demona using terms like that. But then Gargoyles was a show for a younger audience, so only you know what the characters are saying "off-screen."
As for the battle itself, Thailog does seem to be having a grand old time going around and slashing the gargoyles and Elisa, really, unopposed - even Brooklyn doesn't seem to put up much of a fight. More here than at other points he comes off as one sadistic, well, bastard.
Delilah's appearance at the end of the battle raises some very interesting questions - which I ask in a post right behind this one - but what I find particularly interesting is just how dismissive she is of the Manhattan clan in favor of her clan. She shuts Angela down, doesn't hesitate to stick it to Goliath, despite his pain, and she doesn't help Brooklyn to his feet on her entrance but rather Malibu. Granted, she has every right to be mad at Goliath for using her, but she seemed pretty cold to him in "Invitation Only" to begin with; and it's not that I ever thought of Delilah as being a friend of the Manhattan clan's, but I also hadn't pictured her as being quite this cold as well.
That she dismisses Thailog too, then, seems to be perfectly in keeping with her character - or what we know of it to this point. Despite being programmed as the "perfect companion," she does not like to be thought of as other people's property.
And then there's the conclusion of the combat where Brooklyn is shot down once again. It can't be easy being Super-Goyle.
Of course, Brooklyn's grief can't overshadow Elisa and Goliath finally coming to terms with their feelings for each other, but what in my mind does seem to rise to the forefront is how Dr. Sato is feeling at that moment. Not only have gargoyles been revealed to him as more than a good foundation for a costume, but that one of his acquaintances has a deep relationship with one must be a lot to take in.
I almost hope that he's too concentrated on keeping Goliath's vitals up to not pick up on Elisa's relationship to him, but somehow I doubt that.
On the Illuminati arc…
So we learn some more about the structure of the Illuminati; not only in the number of members (I should have expected nothing less than for you to have chosen the mother of all numbers in Western culture, and yet I was still surprised) but that at least the senior membership of the Illuminati does have access to a pretty good health plan.
As I said in my review/observations of "Masque," the personal staffers of powerful people tend to have the best access to said powerful people, so why Quincy's revelation necessarily *impressed* Xanatos rather than made sense to him kind of raised my eyebrow.
Then there's Shari, who I was obviously very wrong about being "third wheel." Really I don't have much else to say except mea culpa, and that Thailog looked slightly less than happy that he might be taking marching orders from her, "executive assistant" or not (whereas she seemed fine with it).
Back to the big picture…
What I like most about this issue is that it brings out everything we had seen in the last two issues - the way characters were behaving and interacting with each other, their motives and thought processes, and it resolves a number of issues from "Invitation Only" and earlier while keeping things open for stories down the road. Combined with the last two issues, it finally feels like we've gotten a new *episode* of Gargoyles out rather than a few interesting stories.
Very well done.
Thanks. That was the intent.
Hi! My name is Rodrigo, I'm 28, from Rio de Janeiro, Brazil. I got to know Gargoyles on TV down here. One of our networks showed the whole series back to back 2 or 3 times, I think, some time after it was already canceled in the US, or about to be. It was dubbed to Portuguese. Years later, with full grasp of the internet, I got to know more about it, and even managed to watch the whole series again, this time in English.
I was very happy when I heard about the series coming to DVD, and later about the new comic series. And even though I'm sad about the packs not progressing because of sales, that's kinda my question. You see, I know I could by the sets through Amazon.com. Thing is, even though I'm completely able to watch and understand them completely in English, it'd still be nice to have the option of the Portuguese dubbing, since it's how I got to know it in the fist place. Also, with dollar rates, the sets are almost twice as expensive to us down here. Of course, Disney considers risky to release the final set as it seems there weren't enough sales of the other 2, but wouldn't it help if they released it in other markets, International markets that may find difficult to acquire the Region 1 set? Do you believe is it possible for Disney to release the series in other regions, or is it your honest opinion that international fans should try their best to acquire the Region 1 sets?
Thank you very much for your time.
It's hard to imagine that Disney would invest it regional and international sets when they've decided that the property is a non-player. So if we don't get sales up on the merchandise they ARE releasing, it's hard to imagine them extending the release and spending money on alternatives.
I can't find issue #5 of the comic book anywhere and I know it was going to be released on July 18. I'm going crazy!!! Can you please tell ne why I can't find it!
Have you tried ordering it online from SLG or Amazon or Midtown Comics?
So, you recently said that "Goliath makes a bargain" on July 19th 1997. What do you mean? What bargain?
Seriously... why would you think I'd answer that now? It's not like I didn't know I was being cryptic.
1.Why did Thailog set the ransom demand in Double Jeopardy for $10,000,000? I mean why not more or why not less.
You pick a number that's the highest possible number you think you can get without causing the ransom-payer to balk -- for any reason. I'm sure Thailog did his research.
This is partially in response to Antiyonder's third question.
Is Brendon really that much of a jerk? I mean, clearly Margot is, but Brendon seems just scared of gargoyles. I mean, in issue #5 I first thought that it was him who informed Dr. Soto that his services were needed. Or was it Owen who called the doctor?
I'll leave that up to your interpretation.
In "A Long Way To Morning," Demona, Hudson and Goliath do not turn to stone until the clouds clear and the sunlight shines through - with the sun clearly well over the horizon, suggesting a bit of time has passed after sunrise. However, in "The Silver Falcon," Broadway turns to stone even though he is in a basement, cut off from the light of the sun, suggesting a circadian rhythm. Was it simply an animation error in "A Long Way To Morning," or is there a reason for this. (I assume it's the animation, but I was curious)
A little from column A, a little from column B.
Read issue 5 today. Looking at the pictures, it really does look like I'm watching/reading the cartoon. Comments and question (though not in that order).
1. Has the Illuminati numbering always been consistent? Or has there been say an occasional 19 "20 ranked members" or 20 "30 ranked members"?
2. I was pretty much expecting Morgan to be the one who finds out about the clan, but Dr. Sato was a good choice as well. Nice to see Robbins figuring out Hudson's secret as well.
3. Nice to see that there isn't any lost love between Brendan and Margot. Though I fear for the fate of the Gargoyle Universe if those two have children. Demona, Thailog, The Space Spawn, even Mab couldn't be that much of a threat to the planet. Just had to say that here.
4. Been meaning to bring this up sooner, but thought I'd ask given Brooklyn's costume choice. Out of any of the Manhattan Clan, which if any do you see enjoying a good comic book.
As far as the absense of voice actors go, at least any mystery theme characters showing up will be more of a challenge to figure out without vocal clues.
Looking forward to #6.
1. Not all slots are always filled.
2. Glad you liked it.
3. Then consider it said.
4. Brooklyn, Lex, Broadway, Hudson, Angela.
"mystery theme characters"...?
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Sevarius completes his involvement with Thailog's project and is paid off. Thailog begins programming his new clones. Meanwhile, Angela and Demona are still debating the latter's behavior. Claw arrives to take over guarding the prisoners for the day shift. Angela elects to sleep as stone in front of her mother's cell.
Skittle Skattle Kittle Kattle Bigtime Bitey Kitty Purrmobile Boy...
Great darn cat.
I am promoting an artist from California by the name of Peter Cimino. He has created a captivating sculpture named 'Goliath'. Goliath is a six foot life size wonder that is kneeling, ready for battle. I am asking if you would be interested in seeing this sculpture in order to promote your wonderful series and comic books. It may even inspire you to create a new character! I will send you photographs if you are interested in seeing this sculpture along with the details of the materials used to create him. Goliath is very unique! Please email me at firstname.lastname@example.org to advise me if you would like me to contact you further and how I may do so. Thank you in advance for considering my request. I feel that 'Goliath' would do a great job for you! I look forward to hearing from you.
Hi Mary Frances,
I'm afraid I do not give out my e-mail address through this site. You can post a link here, and I can go see the pictures that way. I'd love to see the statue -- though I'm at a bit of a loss as to how it can help us promote the comics, etc. Though I'm eager to hear your thoughts.
im a huge fan of your show hope you make new episodes anyways ive been reading on the gargoyles wikipedia that goliath will die by 2198 and his descendant will be samson
any info on who he is cuz ive never heard of him
Check out the Gargoyles 2198 archives. C'mon, gang, please check the archives -- or at least the FAQ -- before asking questions.
a follow up on my other question, are there plans for puck in the comic? if so are there plans for oberon and titania as well (besides the queen mab thing).
I'm sure I've answered -- or NOT answered this -- already. Yes, there are plans for EVERYONE eventually.
So is anything going to happen with Lilian? Are Nigel and Eric going to find out about W.I.T.C.H.? Is there going to be a season three? Please answer these questions for me. W.I.T.C.H. was my altime favorite series of books and when they came out with the series I was so exited, but I was left hanging at the end of the second season.
I'm sorry... we were ALL left hanging. But no, to my knowledge there are no plans to make a third season. So your best bet to find out what happens to Lilian, Nigel and Eric are to check out the comics.
Can gargoyles be born with mental dissablities such as autism (or aspergers)?
P.S. I did have a gathering journal, but my computer froze up and ate the file. I'll try to make a new one
P.P.S. I didn't mind playing Maggie in the radio play. I kinda saw it comming, actually...
I don't know.
I´ve notice Hudson has never called Demona by name when he is speaking directly to her, why is that?
He has trouble pronouncing his "ona" s.
Bought #5 of "Gargoyles" yesterday, though I didn't get around to writing the review for "Ask Greg" until today.
* SPOILERS *
One thing that got my attention on the very first page was that Judge Roebling was talking to two women who bear a striking resemblance to Mary and Finella, not only in appearance, but attire. Coincidence - or something else?
I was also pleasantly surprised to see Dr. Sato return for the first time since "Deadly Force" - and have him being "brought in on the secret" in tending to Goliath's wound.
The revelation of the Illuminati's organizational structure had two eye-openers in it. First, Duval turns out to be not at the very top of the pyramid, but only one of the two Number Twos - which raises the question of who Number One is. Also, when I sat down to do the math of 36 ranks in the Illuminati, each rank having a number of members equal to the number of the rank (as in one Number One, two Number Twos, and 36 Number Thirty-sixes), I discovered that that added up to 666! I definitely hadn't seen that one coming, though at the same time (given how often real conspiracy theories connect the Illuminati to the Devil), I probably should have.
I got a kick out of seeing Brooklyn in his "Super-goyle" costume - complete with using his wings for a cape.
I got a chuckle out of seeing Thailog address Angela as "sis" (and it struck me as perfectly in character for him to do so), and was surprised to see her call him "You bastard!" (But you've got to admit that the word fits him, in more ways than one.)
I liked the scene between Hudson and Jeffrey Robbins. It even incorporated elements from the equivalent scene in the Goliath Chronicles (which was one of the very few moments in that season that worked for me), including the smell of "old leather and concrete".
Back to Xanatos and Quincy Hemings: I was also amused by Hemings' talk about his history at the White House, including the fun with two presidents sharing the surnames of "Roosevelt" and "Johnson". (As a side-note, I find it interesting - though I don't know if it's significant - that the two presidents whom Hemings mentioned both got into the White House through the previous incumbent being assassinated.)
I really liked Delilah's characterization here, including her rebuke to Angela for suggesting that she was not "truly free to make [her] own choices" and to Goliath for taking her along as a date when he had no true feelings for her - but also standing up to Thailog. She's definitely grown into a character.
I was amused that the one clone who sticks with Thailog is Brentwood (are we seeing another twisted fulfillment of "Future Tense" here?), and Lexington's response.
The scene between Goliath and Elisa as Sato gets ready to tend Goliath's wound was a very moving one. I guess that they've realized now that they're stuck with the problem of "how do you handle an inter-species romance", and that trying to turn away from it won't work.
Intriguing that Thailog and Sevarius are meeting at Nightstone Unlimited, since after "The Reckoning", Thailog would obviously be "persona non gratis" with Demona, and there's no sign that she's lost control of the company to him. (I assume that it's a clandestine meeting that Ms. Destine doesn't know about.) Thailog shows again how he takes after Xanatos in revealing the real reason for his attack on the gargoyles at the end - and I'm looking forward to seeing what he and Sevarius are going to do with those DNA samples. (Something tells me that it's going to definitely outdo the Clones in "The Reckoning".)
But the big surprise was at the very end, when we find out that Thailog's now in the Illuminati - and so is Shari! And that she outranks him. This really is getting very interesting.
The art was also very good - my congratulations to Karine Charlebois on it. The best art that we've had in the comic to date.
I'm looking forward to the upcoming issues now. May they continue for a long time.
* SPOILERS END *
May they indeed!
I"m glad the response to issue #5 was so generally positive. After all these years -- particularly after all these years -- I still always get nervous.
"Gargoyles protect." It's fairly straight-forward, but how did this cultural tradition begin? As the credo exists throughout the world, it was obviously some instance that happened very early in the evolutionary history of the Gargate species. Was it a pact made by the original gargoyle clan with a single human or community? Is it a biological urge (doubtful though, i.e. Demona, Thailog)? Or is it a tradition orally passed from generation to generation from the earliest of times by a single, extremely noble gargoyle/clan?
I think it originates with the need to protect the gargoyles' own rookery. Which would, I imagine, be a biological imperative.
I've noticed since first watching the show that most gargoyles do not use weapons. Demona does (which is understandable since she has witnessed- and perhaps taken part in- the development modern technology), as does Thailog (also understandable since he is the polar opposite to Goliath and uber-evil). However, Hudson is the only "old school," shall we say, gargoyle who consistently carries a weapon. What is the history between Hudson and this blade? Is it unusal that he carries it, or have we just not seen enough gargoyles to see others who choose to utilize weapons?
Other gargoyles utilize weapons. Check the Hudson archives for a more detailed explanation of why Hudson uses one.
The Gargoyles universe Illuminati is facinating. Will we learn it's origins anytime soon?
(note: I'm not necessarily asking what they are, I'm sure you don't want to reveal that yet; I'm simply asking if the explanation is coming anytime soon- though, if there is an teaser bits of information you wish to share, bring it on)
We'll continue to learn a bit more as the months roll by...
The Magus refered to the gargoyles as "unnatural creatures;" I find this an interesting sentiment from someone who has spent his life studying magic, which is something that has historically been refered to as unnatural itself. Is there a specific reason for his prejudice?
I went to the Golden Apple at about 2pm and picked up the LAST TWO COPIES (I asked the cashier and apparently they don't stockpile in their backrooms). I pointed out to her the oddity of finding a comic with this particular cover in the "Kids" section (she said it's more of an "all ages" section...), and voiced my hopes that maybe this cover is moving more issues of the comic than usual.
But enough of that...on with the issue itself!
--I noticed "Mary" and "Finella" on page one as well. I doubt it's really them (unless there's more going on in Brooklyn's Timedancing than I suspect), but it's a nice little bit.
--We finally see Dr. Sato again, disguised as...a doctor. Very creative, doc.
--Morgan decides to bow out. He is a real good sport about this whole thing.
--Continuity Nit! Broadway's "Cowardly Lion" costume has changed. In the last issue, he just had the mane and face markings. Now he's wearing a full body costume. It's a bit jarring, unfortunately.
One thing I just noticed on Angela's costume--the modified "ruby slippers". Very fun!
--Thailog is just BRUTAL towards Goliath here. I mean, he uppercuts the guy after gut-stabbing him! He's also switched from "Father" to "Dad" and even refers to his other two parents by first name.
--Speaking of "proud papa David"...the revelation that this White House steward is apparently the same rank as "Mr. Duval" was astonishing! As was the bit that he'd been there since the days of Teddy Roosevelt (which leads to a GREAT comedic bit over which President Johnson he served under--"Now don't get smart, son."). Anybody besides me think Xanatos is REALLY looking forward to those "rejuvenation drugs?" And I am most eager to learn what Xanatos's assignment is.
--As for the reveal that there is a position above the one held by Duval...well, we all have our theories. :-)
--But back to the party. Margot is, as usual, chewing out Brendan--and dragging poor Dr. Sato into it--when Brooklyn makes his grand entrance.
...I'm not sure for how long I was laughing my ass off, but it was a long time. He even has a stylized "G" on his chest, for cryin' out loud! And both his entrance line and his pose..."Super-Garg"! Priceless. (Oddly enough, Brooklyn's pose makes me think of Daffy Duck. Maybe it's his beak.)
Of course, he immediately asks Elisa where Angela and Delilah are...oh, and as an afterthought, his brothers. That's when they notice Bruno walk by.
--Angela calls Thailog a bastard. Now, just having that word said at all in the comic made my eyes go wide. But the fact that it's ANGELA saying it! It's great! And do we need to dwell on how aptly that word describes Thailog (gotta love those archetypes)?
I also love that Thailog called Angela "sister." Creepy.
--Thailog slashing Angela and Broadway (which, oddly enough left me mourning over the damage to their costumes rather than their bodies) prompted me to wonder why Thailog had bothered retracting his wrist dagger in the first place. Of course, the reason is just a few pages away.
--Thailog has an interesting line here--"Gargoyles, protect you master!" Note, that he does not call them clones (or bother to say their names).
I did notice he seemed to wonder where Brooklyn and "the old fart with the beast" were. Kind of shows his opinion of Hudson, that's for sure. And maybe age and old people as well.
--Now we have the scene where Hudson and Jeffery have their chat. It's a nice scene to finally see in the "official Greg Weisman version," to be sure. At the same time, I will admit that it does seem a little sudden to me (and makes this issue the most crowded, yet). Still, it's probably better happening now than having it drawn out. Jeffrey's acceptance is no doubt helped by the fact that he knew Hudson before he knew about gargoyles, but it does seem that he wondered for a while. I will say, this scene was fairly similar to the one that appeared in the "Dying of the Light" episode of TGC. In fact, that "old leather and concrete" bit WAS in the episode. The "never shaking hands until now" bit, however, was a new touch that I really liked.
--The Clan fights the Clones. "Gar-girl"...okay, that's a new one.
I love Thailog's "...why does everyone insist on pitching free will to my minions." I did notice that Thailog slashed Lex when there was no real need to, which did seem a bit odd to me.
Anyway, here comes "Super-garg" to the rescue. "Forgery" seems to be Brooklyn's favorite insult to clones.
--Thailog slashes Elisa (she'll never get her deposit back on that costume), and this is perhaps the most pointless slash of all (it would seem). On my second readthrough, however, I note that Thailog didn't slash Elisa until AFTER she said she was a member of the Clan ("Good to know" he quips).
--I love Brenden's mumbling to himself (it's nice to hear what he really thinks). I wonder what his actions will be in regards to witnessing the fight.
--I like the long shot of the fighting. Lex is fighting Malibu, Hollywood's after Angela, Broadway is wrestling with Burbank over the mace, and Brooklyn (that ballsy son of a gun) is taking on Thailog.
--Hudson and Bronx join the party and Thailog...switches wrist blades to cut Bronx. When I saw that, I realized that Thailog was slashing all of them (or stabbing, in some cases) to collect blood and tissue. I guess he didn't feel like using mosquitoes this time.
--Owen finds Delilah in the lab (did anyone else notice?). I just found it interesting.
--Somehow it doesn't seem fair to me that Brooklyn gets taken out by a Bronx-projectile.
I love how Hudson (after getting cut) parries Thailog's blade with his sword ("old fart" indeed). For that matter, I love how Broadway inadvertently beans Malibu with Burbank's mace.
--Delilah really makes an impression here. She really seems to come into her own and starts speaking for herself (up until now she has just been responding to other people). Actually, it's a bit surprising how quickly and easily it comes to her.
--I love the smile on Malibu's face as Delilah helps him up.
--Apparently, Delilah eavesdropped on Goliath and Elisa's conversation in the last issue (which makes me wish we had seen a frame of her doing so, but oh, well). It doesn't matter that Goliath's bleeding on the ground, she let's him know she didn't appreciate it.
But she doesn't go with Thailog either (I love how she slaps his hand away...and how Thailog is not upset in the slightest about this).
Delilah was happiest in the Labyrinth, and so, it seems, were her "brothers" (I LOVE that she called them that). Actually, Malibu just wants to be with Delilah, and Hollywood's not interested in fighting (and Burbank gives a response that throws me back to "Bride of Frankenstein"--"Friend, good! Fire, bad!").
--Brentwood, however, is the odd one out. He spent the whole issue standing on the sidelines, not fighting, his only line until now being "free...will" and what does he do? He chooses to stick with Thailog because "Thailog smart!" I mean, it is a great "left turn with the right blinker on," if you know what I mean. And the best part: I KNEW IT WOULD HAPPEN! Okay, I thought a second clone would also stick with Thailog, so I was only half right, but somehow I KNEW Brentwood would be the one to "know the power of the Dark Side."
And Lexington's reaction is perfect ("Dude, you're really making me look bad."). I'm still laughing at it.
--"And on that death rattle note..." is my pick for Thailog's most heartless line to date.
--And now Dr. Sato is brought out. I would like to know exactly WHO brought him out (Owen would be my guess at the moment). And his introduction into the world of the gargoyles certainly is abrupt (his dialogue for it is good, though). I will be most interested to see how he'll deal with this new wrinkle in his world.
--Owen mentions an infirmary in the castle. You know, it's a funny thing. I've read several fanfiction series over the years, and they ALL have an infirmary in the castle! Well, I guess that only makes sense, knowing Xanatos and his rather...unique lifestyle.
--Goliath finally says those three little words. And Elisa repeats them. And gives him another kiss.
--Brooklyn, sees this display and is smiling. He looks behind him at Broadway and Angela (standing side-by-side, holding hands) and looks a little sad. He looks to his left at Delilah and Malibu (side by side, her arm around his shoulders, his arm around her waist) and, with a sour look on his face says, "Oh, you *gotta* be kiddin' me..." Yes, I laughed out loud. Poor Brooklyn might as well go to a bar and get drunk now.
--And now we have the "Thailog Tag." Oddly enough, it takes place at Nightstone Unlimited--last seen being run by Dominque Destine (who has Thailog on her "KILL, KILL, KILL!" list). And Thailog reveals that (surprise, surprise) his first priority was obtaining 8 "DNA samples" from the clan. Goliath's suffering and Brentwood's joining were just icing on the cake. This already shows him as different than Xanatos--Xanatos loved outsmarting his opponents, but Thailog gets pleasure from their pain.
--Nice to see Sevarius so soon (and so easy to hear Tim Curry saying his lines!).
--And now the girl from the Labyrinth finally has a name--Shari--and yes, it does seem that she will be the Executive Assistant telling Thailog about Tibet in the next issue. She's also an Illuminatus (the youngest one we've met so far, as well as the first female). And surprise of surprises, Thailog is a member as well (which makes him the first GARGOYLE member we know of)! And he doesn't look very happy at being outranked by this girl (and such a HIGH rank she has for one so (apparently) young). What really surprises me about Thailog being a member is that he just seems to be so much his own person. The idea of him being subservient to anyone seems so against his character. But therein lies the interest.
--I've got to say, the Illuminati is REALLY moving to the forefront this "season." They seem to be everywhere this time.
--The art's great. Everything looks incredible and exactly like the series with great facial expressions. Still, going back and forth between the three issues, the change in art and coloring styles is very...jarring. I'll look forward to seeing next month's artist, though.
BTW, did anyone else notice that the clones are back to having black teeth?
Anyway, it's nice to see the end of the "episode" (although there's still a bit of a cliffhanger as far as the wounded are concerned). I will say that there was a LOT in this issue. Seriously, this thing felt practically bursting at the seems for more pages. I would have loved a bit more with Dr. Sato (both introducing him, and him dealing with Goliath).
Overall, though, it's another great story!
Personally, I'd rather that the stories felt like they were bursting from the pages, than the reverse. We tried to do that in the episodes too. Look at "Vows", for example.
A few questions posed after reading gargoyles comic issue #5:
1)Are there more members in the Illuminati Society ranked below David Xanatos or ranked above David Xanatos? I counted potentially 630 people ranked above. For more members to be ranked below David Xanatos than above would mean there are at least *15* more levels below David Xanatos.
2)Are there always a constant number of people at each rank? In other words, the only way to advance in rank (aside from doing more for the Society) is if somebody higher ranked than you was promoted, demoted, or died.
3)When Matt Bluestone first joined the Society during Revelations, was he at the same rank that he is as of issue #5?
4)On page 1, is that Lady Finella and Mary (the mother of Tom)?
5)Are the 8 dna samples that Thailog collected from the following characters (in order of collection): Goliath, Broadway, Angela, Lexington, Elisa Maza, Brooklyn, Bronx, and Hudson?
6)Did Thailog retreat into Nightstone Unlimited at the end?
6a)If so, does this mean the partnership between Thailog and Demona isn't over?
7)Did Thailog join the Society before Demona and Thailog went back to Manhattan?
1. As the comic stated, 36 is the lowest level.
2. In theory, but I never claimed that every slot is filled at every given moment.
4. I know who Mary is.
5. If you've read the comic carefully, you know the answer.
6a. No comment.
7. No comment.
My review for the comic
I'm getting better at this.
Reading the last page turned made me feel like the gargoyles universe was turned upside down. I'd have to rate the revelation at the end with Thailog being a member of the Illuminati Society as topping Owen being Puck. It took a while for that revelation to really sink in.
I like the nice cameos that you keep coming out with, especially sneaking people in on page 1. It was nice to see Morgan knew what was going on. I really do wonder how you would pull Thailog's action sequences off if you had to live with today's s&p. Good thing you don't. It's nice to know the Illuminati Society isn't racist, with a #2 being black. As Todd 1st commented in the s8 cr, from the top down to Xanatos's level, there are potentially 666 members of the Illumaniti Society. Brooklyn's costume turned out to be interesting. Jeffery Robbins turned out to be a nice guy, especially after figuring out who/what Hudson really was and not rejecting their friendship. I wonder if Hudson will ever get around to telling Robbins some backstory. Xanatos's interaction with Quincy seemed very realistic. I wonder why they dragged Xanatos to the White House to receive his '1st real assignment from the Illuminati'. The action sequences seemed realistic with Thailog, the clones, and the gargoyles. Deliliah's characterization was great and saved the day. Goliath's line "Choice must extend to those who choose unwisely" echoes of the experiences with Talon being duped by Xanatos. Nice to know that somewhere in those floors is a fully fuctional infirmary. Somehow, I doubt that infirmary is open to the general public. It's nice to Goliath and Elisa coming out with the truth. I admit I went to back to count where Thailog got all 8 dna samples. And then we get to the last page. The conversation at the end that seemingly turned the gargoyles universe upside down for me. I can't figure out which rule that page broke that did that for me.
Can't wait for issue #6
What cannot be broken... can be bent.
Gargoyles #5: "Bash"
First of all, I consider myself lucky to even have a copy of the issue right now. Somehow I missed that it was coming out today, so you can imagine my shock when I got online on my lunch break and found it was out! After I got off work I called my local comic store and although they don't usually reserve any comics for customers, the man I spoke to was nice enough to set aside the last copy for me until I could make it down. So. That was exciting, especially as I think this is far and away the best issue to date.
-Is that Mary and Finella I spy on page 1, talking to Dr. Sato? It's beginning to feel a lot like a Timedance....
-Poor, poor Brooklyn. His "Oh, you GOTTA be kiddin' me" was perfect. The irony of Delilah shacking up with Malibu is almost too delicious for words. (I also love his series of expressions over those three panels.) I loved his costume, too; at first it made me blink, but then I realized it's perfect. Brook's life dream is to be the admired, adored hero, be perfect, and get the girl. Is Fox a good judge of character, or what? ;)
-Speaking of Delilah, you GO girl! Calling out Goliath AND Thailog in the space of like thirty seconds. That's cojones, man.
-Brentwood being the only clone to stay with Thailog is very, very interesting. I wonder what makes Thailog's intelligence stand out to him, and also why he values it so much. And, of course, knowing what we know, we have to wonder what Brentwood's decision says about Lex/the future....
-I have to admit, though, I'm unsure if Hollywood/Burbank/Malibu have REALLY grasped the concept of free will, or if Delilah has just become their "alpha" leader. (Although, admittedly, only Malibu--for obvious reasons--clearly defers his decision to Delilah.)
-I like in general the concept that free will must be extended even to those who choose unwisely.
-I have to admit, the Illuminati plot didn't interest me at first, but it's getting better and better.
-Brentwood's right about one thing: Thailog is one smart dude. I wonder how many times the gargs are going to have blood stolen from them and used to create nefarious clones before they figure out to wear like full-body suits or something. It's interesting that he didn't want to kill Goliath/the others, as he certainly could have; you wonder if that's some of Xanatos' pragmatism (don't waste what might in the future be a resource) or some of his own inner arrogance/sadism shining through.
-Man, is Angela her parents' daughter or what? Language AND fury.
-Morgan continues to be an absolutely stand-up guy. I hope he finds someone eventually.
-I wonder why Sevarius is in cahoots with Thailog. There must be more going on there than meets the eye. I also wonder if Thailog knows that Xanatos was not at the party....
-Goliath and Elisa: Awwww. 'Nuff said.
-I love how one of Xanatos' Goon Squad walks through the party bold as brass and Elisa notices.
-Also wonder what Brendan's seeing the battle bodes for him/Margot and the gargs.
-Loved the Hudson/Robbins interaction. Just a ton of love for both characters. I love that Robbins knew but made Hudson say it, and I just, yeah. Love the whole scene.
-Thailog's annoyed "MY minions" remark was great. I can just imagine the indignation in his voice.
-Art: I really liked the art this issue. Stylistically, it's the closest to the show the comic has come, and while it's not totally perfect (what art ever is), I really liked it and now am looking even more forward to seeing Charlebois pencil the BAD GUYS LS.
It's all pretty exciting, isn't it? Good time to be a garg fan, if I do say so myself.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Macbeth's forces are defeated. Thorfinn is killed at Dunsinane, widowing his young wife Ingibjorg. Canmore destroys all of Demona's gargoyles, except her. Canmore pursues Macbeth to Lunfanan, and history will record that Macbeth was killed there. But Macbeth and Demona discover a side effect of the Weird Sisters' spell. They are immortal and forever linked, feeling each other's pain when near. For either to die, one must kill the other. Prince Luach is able to rally his father's forces temporarily. Canmore is driven back. Luach is made High King of Scotland. Macbeth and Demona vanish severally into myth.
Getting caught up on all of the old episodes, I'm even more shocked now then I was when the show originally went off the air that no one has been able to make a feature film out of this property. All of the elements are there for success (especially after seeing the success of Transformers, an admittingly less compelling cartoon property). If someone were to write a superb script, would you push for a Gargoyles movie? Especially now that Disney has seen it can have success with a PG-13 franchise (Pirates)?
I'd love to see this movie made. Frankly, I'd love to be the one who made it -- or at least scripted it.
Just picked up #5 from my LCS today, loved it!
The Clones Vs the Clan was pretty cool.. that sneaky Thailog got his share of genetic samples again. He's really a great character.
Also, the end bit with Brooklyn was funny... if I didn't know about the canon in training stuff I would be feeling extra sorry for the guy.
The Illuminati ranking system is pretty cool... And man.. what a surprise member! You really have to give it to those Gathering people for loyalty and keeping those tidbits under wraps.
Speaking of comics.. have you seen what they are doing to Captain Atom.. err Monarch in Countdown? If everything with him is resolved and he somehow returns to his status quo, would you consider pitching a Captain Atom mini or one-shot?
The era of DC Comics when you wrote for them is probably my favorite.. a lot of great stories being told in the individual books, without all the crossover stuff they try to force on people today.
I've made it very clear to the folks at DC that I would love to do Captain Atom again. Ball's in there court.
Crap! I forgot to ask another question. Would you say Luna is more representative of Fate or Destiny? I bet nothing is exciting to Luna. She usually sounds bored.
How are you defining "Fate" and "Destiny" so that they are significantly different?
To whom it may concern:
I have one question for Greg: Why do you think the "Gargoyles: Season 2, Vol. 1 failed to sell enought DVD's. It seemed like a popular show. Why did it bomb? Was it the fault of the Disney Company? Or the fault of the fans for not getting out to buy it?
Well, first, I wouldn't say "bomb". Just not sufficient.
Second, I'm not sure what the point of assessing blame is. I suppose there's plenty to go around, but I'm not interested in blame.
For better or worse, Disney counted on the hardcore fans to "market" their product, as they did with the first season DVD set. The fans -- myself included, I believe, were somewhat complacent, assuming that everyone who bought the first set would buy the second set. But that didn't happen. Word was not spread sufficiently.
So help us now to SPREAD THE WORD!!
I love the Weird Sisters. Selene cracks me up, shes gets so flustered. I do have a question about them though (I'm sorry). Luna kinda confuses me. I know shes supposed to be the mystical one and symbolizes fate but what exactly is her personality. Is she a little more hot-headed than Pheobe or is she the most analytical? Mystical is kind of a vague description to me. I miss Oberon and Titania =(
Luna is far from hot-headed. Seline (the one with black hair) is the most "hot-headed" of the sisters. Luna (with silver hair) is far-seeing. Always looking ahead.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
With help from Demona and his cousin Thorfinn, Macbeth defeats Duncan's forces at the battle of Bothgoanan, near the town of Elgin in Moray, Scotland. Duncan is killed near Elgin. An unpopular king, he is not mourned by many. Duncan's son Canmore is banished and spirited away to England by Duncan's few remaining supporters. Canmore will become a protégé of Edward the Confessor, a Saxon. But he also becomes the new Hunter. For his own safety, Donald Ban is spirited away to Ireland.
Vinnie visits family.
Where to begin on how great it was? Hmmm... ah, the hell with it.
Vid The Kid and I picked it up at the usual place (where, By the way, we dropped off another set of Gathering 2008 flyers to help 'spread the word' and I was delighted to learn that the 1st set of flyers had all been picked up quickly.), along with a Star Trek comic. I read Gargoyles #5 on the way home and no words in the known English language could accurately describe how much enjoyment I got out of it.
The art was the best I'd seen since issue #1. Wait, no, scratch that. It was the best artwork I'd seen in the comic, period. Smoothly drawn and nicely colored, just as much as the cartoon itself was. I hope we can keep Karine and Stephanie around as artists for future issues!
Story-wise was great, but, then, who can expect any less when you're the one who wrote it? Nice twists at the end, (No, I still won't throw out spoilers b/c the comic just came out today) even though I already knew how it ended from being in the Radio Play, but I still loved them. They were clever, they made sense, and they opened doors for future story ideas. I can't wait to see more Thailog (one of my favorite characters) in action in future issues.
Another nice Hudson/Robbins scene there.
*slight spoiler* I was vaguely surprised that Goliath didn't have a reaction to Lex's costume, but he was preoccupied, so... *shrugs*
Another great issue, Greg. 15/10.
Or should that be 36/2? :P
Nice little bonus at the end. I didn't actually expect to make it into the letters column. Very kickass. :D
Though we never did get that soda... maybe in G2K8...
And maybe I should register for G2K9 as KC. I kind of like the sound of that. :P
Bring on issue #6!!
Issue 6 is pencilled and colored. Just needs to be lettered and it's ready to go!
Do you think there's still a chance that disney might make Team Atlantis?
No. But I'm hardly an insider there.
How come Angela was the only Avalon Garg to want to leave Avalon, don't any of the otheres have that kind of Wanderlust?
Guess not. Maybe she takes after her mum.
Why didn't Thailog just make a clone of Demona? He's not attracted to Elisa, you made it clear Goliath and Elisa was more spiritual. Was he just looking to piss Demona off?
Even assuming that Goliath is not physically attracted to Elisa -- which is NOT something I've "made clear" as I disagree with that premise -- what does that have to do with Thailog?
But, yeah, pissing Demona off was a bonus.
Here's a link to a Spectacular Spider-Man interview I did last week...
Check it out!
Why didn't Demona mate with any other Gargoyles over the past 1000 years? She certainly encountered some, if she really thought her race was going extinct wouldn't she be trying to increase the population?
Cuz after all, she's so easy to get along with...
Gargoyles mate for life. It's not easy for them to shift affections, and Demona never stopped feeling (her definition of) love for Goliath.
But I haven't covered all the 1000 years yet, so I'm not revealing all that did or didn't happen over that time at THIS time.
Will we ever see the biological parents of Demona, Goliath, Lexington or Brooklyn in the comics in Flashbacks?
Sure. But you might not know it, as it's of no moment to these characters. If I hadn't let it slip that Hudson was Broadway's bio-dad, would you have guessed, known or cared?
If Demona had of actually been put under the Magus's spell like the others and they somehow managed to be revived, How exactly do you think she would have reacted? would the clan have accepted her or would they have exiled her? Could she have been saved by Goliath, Do you think she would start her war on humanity in the modern nights too?
I'm not interested in hypotheticals. Feel free to use your own imagination though.
How could Zafiro and Obsidiana mate, anatomically there completely different?
You mean one's a guy and one's a gal?
Does Demona have any interest in any of the Clones? They could have been a new clan for her even Delilah after Thailog was presumed dead why did she abandon them so quickly?
Demona is, ironically, quick to declare things, people, plans, etc. a lost cause.
Do Gargoyles have there own unique appreciation for artistic asthetics? I have noticed that the Manhatten clan has developed a true appreciation for human literature (like SHakespeare), but do they have there own asthetic disposition for other art forms such as music or painting?
I'm sure that, just like with literature, they've learned to enjoy the human endeavors in art. Also, I'm sure that each individual has his or her own opinions when it comes to what they enjoy, just like everyone else, but have the Gargoyles ever (or will they ever) developed an artistic culture of their own? Or do they, in general, have a unique opinion as to what constitutes art? For example, I could imagine that battle styles could be a sort of art form within clans.
I deal in individuals more than species-wide generalities, but probably.
how dose the gargoyles saga comics,movie,cartoon look for heading about 10 years in to the futer?
dose disney still own the rights to gargoyles?
what would have to happen to get the live action movie going?
if the movie got going would you and all the old cast memders from the tv be involved ,would the gargoyles look more cartoonish or real life?
1. I'm not sure I understand the question.
3. They'd have to want to make it. Knowing the property is already a big deal would help.
4. Since no movie's currently in the works, there's no way to answer that at this time.
1.Before humans made contact with gargoyles, did gargoyles have a unique (non-written)language unto themselves?
2.Before gargoyles made contact with humans, did gargoyles have a unique written language unto themselves?
1. We've discussed this before... it might not have been necessary for them... isn't language a process of naming?
This be my con journal for the year:) A bit abbreviated since I don't want to snore anyone out:)
I travel every year I can make it, from Reno, NV to wherever the con happens to be: from Montreal, Canada to my home state to Williamsburg, WV to Fort Worth, TX. Why? Read on:)
I was approached by email by the wonderful Eden asking if I could be on the Con Staff this year. Boy, would I! No, I am not insane:) So I told my husband I was going and got my tickets and travel plans. The Gathering of the Gargoyles 2007 would be in Pigeon Forge, TN. I would fly to Memphis, TN and drive the 6 hours on a mini road trip with three other great people: Admiral Trimm, Beedoo!, and Arno. And that's exactly how it happened. As soon as I got off the plane, I jumped in Trimm's jeep and we were off! It actually took 8 hours, given the dumb construction. Bah. Silly humans.
Arriving at the hotel, which was a lot less than we anticipated it would be --- in size, not price -- I got fed up w/ them and headed over to the main hotel to find the con suite and my fellow staffers (we had been moved to a hotel across the street due to some overbooking or some such nonsense). Got my registration packet, shirt, badge, etc. and headed back for sleep around 12am local time.
Day one was setting up the art show and sitting in the art room for most of the day. This would be the majority of my task while the Art Show Coordinator this year: babysit the art room. No biggie. Most of the Con I am either in a panel or in the art room anyway drawing up a storm. I learned the hard way being the Art Show Coordinator left little room for actually drawing while most of it went to coordinating, lol.
Boy, did we have a lot of new people this Con. So many new hands raised at Opening Ceremonies, it was awesome!! Met some neat new people, too:)
I hosted three panels while at the Con: Gargoyles Physiology and Culture with Greg Weisman and Lynati, Mystery Gargoyle Theater 3000, and an Open Writing session and discussion panel (i won the writing contest this year. Wee!!). It was a blast, despite hassles with elevators and hotel personnel. And me, Beedoo!, Trimm, and Arno finally got a room in the right hotel. Yay!
We basically ignored the bad hotel stuff until it culminated into a bit of a fiasco. The Masquerade and dance is a big event at our Con. Earlier in the day, the women's restroom next door had flooded. The hotel staff was fairly prompt in coming to dry (and not clean) the carpet but it was still a bad event... In the midst of our costumed frolicking and boogying, someone ran in and said they needed volunteers because the art show/dealer's room roof was leaking-- on top of everything in the room! We ushered our decked out behinds up to the art show/dealer's room and lo and behold, the ceiling was leaking! It had rained earlier that day. It being around 10pm local time and the dealers all gone to bed, plus the hotel staff unwilling to send anyone to help us move our stuff, we took matters into our own hands! Hudson coordinating this awesome march, approximately 25 con-goers (and yes I mean fans!) hupped to it and moved all of the dealer's merchandise including thousands of dollars of comic books to the room next door. Bad on top of worse... Though our move occurred in about 10 minutes, we learned that the next room also had a leaky ceiling!! Egads, people! So, improvisation among such brilliant minds as ours isn't hard to find. We took every table stacked the merchandise on one, and put another table over that table to shield it. All but the comic books. Someone brought in their own tarp and someone got some drop cloths to put over the rest of the delicate merchandise. Saved! As for the artwork, the set-up was promptly broken down, the artwork sorted by artist, purchased, auction, etc. and taken to the safe haven of the blessed con suite. All hail the snacks!
Did such dark moments hamper our most awesome Con? Naw:) You cannot believe the aura of goodness from this convention. It is truly the best experience anyone will ever have of a fandom. We pull together like we've known each other for decades, good friends who've known each other face to face forever, and some of us have just met:) It makes fun stories to tell each other afterwards. It really was a great Con despite the ... interesting... hotel. Hanging with the rest of the fans, our wonderful guests, hosting a panel beside Greg Weisman, laughing all night with Arno, Trimm, Beedoo!, and so many others... Oh, and of course the Blue Mug;P You will not find a better group of people drawn together under the banner of fandom and that's the truth. So, join us, won't you? It's a family reunion where you don't hate any of your relatives. It's great and you GOTTA come. That's my soap box:) Gargs forever! And don't forget to get the comic books!!
Thanks, Jade! You did a great job and were always such an enthusiastic presence on the staff!
what will brooklyn be like when he gets back from his timedancer adventures is he more grown up or still the way he was when he left and what will be the clans reaction
Wait and see.
You said Thailog would have insisted on Delilah laying an egg, does he want his own offspring?
Did I say that? Where? When?
hi i was reading gargoyles #4 for the millionth time and i had the raido on when phill colins "one more night" came on when i was at the part
where elise was braking up with golith is was sad :( so it got me thinking that if there was a sad part in the "movie" if it ever comes out
they should use that sog, just a thought what do you think ?
I'm not gonna get that far ahead of things myself, but you are all welcome to score things in your head however you like!
were their plans to use the character puck in more episodes, and if there were proposed plans can you explain them?
Yes. Yes, I could.
i think there should be a movie. With real actors in make up portraying real gargoyles
if they can turn ron pearlman into hellboy why not make do the same with gargoyles
I'm all for it.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Xanatos' programming of Thailog is in full swing.
how can we bring back new episodes of gargoyles. you say we need to see the show but it comes on at 2:30 3:30am central time and whos gonna watch t.v. that late. is there another way to bring back the show
Yes, for the umpteenth time (see the archives if you don't believe that I've answered this ad nauseum) we need to SPEND MONEY. Buy the DVDs. Buy the COMICS. Attend the GATHERING.
And we need to SPREAD THE WORD to THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of people so that some percentage of those people SPEND MONEY. Buy the DVDs. Buy the COMICS. Attend the GATHERING.
How much did Fox know about the thailog project plotted by Xanatos?
As much as she thought to inquire about, I'd guess.
could goliath and elisa have a child naturally with the help of science
Perhaps with a LOT of science... Sevarius-style.
Why can's the Gargoyles episodes be put on the internet where those that wished to could purchase, download, and put them on dvd? That way Disney won't lose any of their precious money on production costs.
I don't know. I'd prefer DVDs myself, but I'm open to other suggestions. But ONCE AGAIN -- IT ISN'T UP TO ME!!!!
With all the direct to dvd movies now a days and the pile of crap Disney puts out direct to dvd. Why won't they consider a line a of direct to dvd Gargoyle movies. It would sure make more money than a lot of the other crappy sequels that they keep putting out.
No, actually, it probably wouldn't -- much as we'd like to think otherwise. MOMS, the main purchasers of these things, are way more likely to buy Cinderella VII or Land Before Time LIX than Gargoyles. That's just a FACT. Now, do I think we could make them some real money on an original DVD? Yes, indeed I do. But it's very difficult to convince them of that when the most recent product they put out sold ... poorly.
And, yes, MARKETING. But their attitude is let's not throw good money after bad. They throw money at Cinderella because they feel confidant they'll get return on that money. The irony is that if Gargoyles sold more, they'd be willing to give it a marketing budget.
Would their have been any hatchling for the Avalon Clan by 2198? I did the math and if the eggs stayed on their island their would eight or so unhatched rookeries and all of the current Avalon gargs would still be in their prime.
I've done the math too. Eggs from Avalon were brought to Queen Florence Island.